List of objects for WIP maps: 3rd party contributors welcomed

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Sita

looks like some part missing ...

Note the big, circular, swampy depression next to one of the revetments - probably a bomb crater. That means that many of the revetments might have suffered damage during the war and might have missing parts.

I like the look of the 2-part "Y" revetment, but it would also make sense to have a "half-Y" ("zig-zag") revetment object to give airfield designers even more options.

It might also make sense to create "revetment parts" which can be mixed to create a variety of historical revetment types. These objects would all have uniform cross sections and vertical ends so that they could easily be butted together. In that case, the needed revetment objects are:

"V" - shaped, single-engined fighter size & medium bomber/twin-engined fighter sized.
"C" - shaped, single-engined fighter size & medium bomber/twin-engined fighter sized.
"Zig-Zag"/"Half Y" - medium bomber/twin-engined fighter size.
Straight berm - same height as the other objects

Textures for all the objects should be North African desert/sandstone, Italian/limestone or tuff. Possibly also "Italian winter" with limestone/tuff flecked with snow.

[Sita]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

Possibly also "Italian winter" with limestone/tuff flecked with snow.

you mean also need "Winter" texture?

[Pursuivant]

If they haven't been done yet, there are five distinctive tree types which would be highly appropriate for Mediterranean maps. All of these would be simple, relatively low-poly objects. The only trick is getting the textures right:

Lombardy Poplar (Black Poplar) - these are very common along the edges of fields and rural roads in Italy.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...igra-bekes.jpg

A similarly shaped tree is:

Mediterranean Cypress - Maybe just a Lombardy Poplar object with a different texture. These are also commonly found along roads.

http://ericafirpo.com/wp-content/upl...scany-copy.jpg

Olive Tree - fairly common in Italy, rarer in North Africa. (Even better would be a "default" olive orchard texture for some of the "woods".)

http://images.wisegeek.com/olive-tree.jpg

Stone Pine - Another common Mediterranean tree with a distinctive shape. Maybe close enough to the Olive Tree that it could use the same model, but scaled up and with a different texture.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...inus_pinea.jpg

Date Palm - Shorter, with a fatter trunk, and bushier foliage than the existing coconut palm tree object. Very common in North Africa, especially around oases. (For North Africa, default "woods" textures might default to date palm plantations.)

http://static1.squarespace.com/stati...35647/pix1.jpg


It would also be very cool if certain road sections on the Italian maps could have auto-generated poplar or cypress trees along them, since until well after WW2, Italian roads were often lined with trees. Many still are. In addition to looking cool, the trees also present a challenge during strafing missions.

http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/x/tusca...y-24446544.jpg

[_1SMV_Gitano]

Originally Posted by Sita

about C-type ... i still didn't find any photo evidence in internet about that thing and about using fuel barrels in it ... so i have some doubts ...

It might have been done with earht/rubble in some cases. About revetments made of petrol tanks I cite directly "Hurricanes over Malta" book by Brian Cull et all.

"In a matter of weeks, structures appeared in profusion as land was requisitioned around Luqa, Takali and Hal Far. [...] and 84 large pens built for Wellingtons and Marylands, and more than 200 smaller versions for Hurricanes and FAA aircraft, [...]. Initially the pens were made with sandbags and rubble, a method soon superseded by the use of discarded 4-gallon petrol cans, [...]. These wee filled with earth and limestone rubble, and used to create walls up to 14 feet high. It took 60000 such cans to construct three walls to house a Wellington [...]".

check also some pictures of Takali were you can have hints of revetments here and there
http://www.forgottenairfields.com/ma...qali-s390.html
From the few pics availalbe, these were usually square in shape, sometimes with a curved prolongement to cover the open side.

To summarize, my whishlist of MTO revetments is:
- Small V type (stone) - READY by Spudkopf
- Small square type (2 versions: stone or petrol cans or mixed)
- Medium Y type (stone)
- Large C type (internal wall of stone with external earth cover) - WIP by Spudkopf
- Large square (material to be decided)

Having single wall sections would be a plus...

Below I put some pictures of Malta blast pens found on the web

[Spudkopf]

Type 2 (Y shaped Revetment.

I started to draw this based on the post-Husky survey plan, however using the dimensions provided the model was starting to give the Colosseum a run for it's money, not to mention the geometry was coming out all wrong, also if all those drawing are meant to be to the same scale, well then there's something wrong there also.

So plan B.

Using Google maps to roughly measure the length and width of the structure in earlier post (which I rounded to the nearest whole number).





I then cut a screen capture of the same image into Illustrator and proceeded to trace out a vector along the centers of the intact wall, I then thickened this line to ascertain the wall thickness (which I worked to be 800mm).

From this I was then able to build a model in SolidWorks:





I then saved the Solidworks drawing back to Illustrator in 1:100 scale so I could test the fit the revetment with several familiar Axis mediums.



......and all before breakfast.....(well mostly)

[Spudkopf]

Originally Posted by _1SMV_Gitano

To summarize, my whishlist of MTO revetments is:
- Small V type (stone) - READY by Spudkopf
- Small square type (2 versions: stone or petrol cans or mixed)
- Medium Y type (stone)
- Large C type (internal wall of stone with external earth cover) - WIP by Spudkopf
- Large square (material to be decided)

- Small square type (2 versions: stone or petrol cans or mixed), some small square shaped revetments, one constructed of rammed earth with a 200l Oil drum lining, and one just of stone are the next cabs of the rank after the C and Y revetments are completed (the square stone version may even be finished before these).

- Medium Y type (stone) see the above post

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Sita

you mean also need "Winter" texture?

Technically, yes.

But, average winter temperature for Sicily and most of coastal Southern Italy is just above freezing, which means that it's unlikely that those areas ever see really deep snow.

Typically, for a Mediterranean climate, "snow" means a dusting which goes away quickly once the temperature warms up.

http://image.shutterstock.com/z/stoc...e-75500272.jpg

Instead, these regions get rain and MUD! in the winter which could rival the Rasputitsa in its ability to bring military ops to the a standstill.

http://23aa11d28fcf2eb980f2-650f7b39...590.marked.jpg

In the north, and in the mountains, it's a different story. For example, recently, Capracotta, a town in Central Italy, set a world record for one day snowfall!

But, unless TD has a map of Firenze, Milano, or the "Gustav Line" in the works, a "winter" texture for Italian or North African objects means "Mediterranean winter," not "deep winter."

Maybe there should be two winter textures - "light winter" (AKA Spring/Autumn for N. Europe and Russia) with just a bit of snow and "deep winter" with lots of snow.

[nic727]

The only problem is that how do you park in that? In Il2 1946 we can't go backward lol.

[Spudkopf]

Originally Posted by nic727

The only problem is that how do you park in that? In Il2 1946 we can't go backward lol.

Simple solution, just restrict your flying to the Heinkel Lerche

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by _1SMV_Gitano

It might have been done with earht/rubble in some cases. About revetments made of petrol tanks I cite directly "Hurricanes over Malta" book by Brian Cull et all.

Given how "thirsty" most aircraft are, I can believe that 4 gallon petrol cans piled up quick. Since they'd otherwise be waste, I could see why they got converted into improvised sandbags.

The only problem is that a texture that uses 4-gallon petrol cans is necessarily limited to RAF and Commonwealth airfields. To simulate USAAF, Free French AF, Regia Aeronautica, and Luftwaffe bases, a "stone", "sandbag", or even "galvanized corrugated sheet," wall texture would be more generic.

In areas other than Malta, my guess is that it would be much more common to use sandbags, and/or stone, which was cheap, abundant, and could easily be moved around with a bulldozer.

Originally Posted by _1SMV_Gitano

From the few pics availalbe, these were usually square in shape, sometimes with a curved prolongement to cover the open side.

My guess is that there is a pre-war RAF engineering manual which provides specifications for "square" ("[-shaped") revetments. Likewise, there's probably are forgotten Italian and German manuals which lays out specifications for Regia Aeronautica and Luftwaffe airfields. The 1941 USAAF Airfield Engineering manual is online. I can provide a link if there's interest.

Originally Posted by _1SMV_Gitano

To summarize, my whishlist of MTO revetments is:
- Small V type (stone) - READY by Spudkopf
- Small square type (2 versions: stone or petrol cans or mixed)
- Medium Y type (stone)
- Large C type (internal wall of stone with external earth cover) - WIP by Spudkopf
- Large square (material to be decided)

Many of these objects could be created by retexturing existing objects. In particular, the Large Square revetment already exists. Just give it sandstone, tuffo, "Mediterranean Winter/Spring/Autumn", and "Deep Winter" textures and it's ready to go.

In terms of actual 3D, what's needed is Small V, Small Square, Medium Y, Large C, and Large Square, plus "do it yourself" revetment parts.