New planes requests (from other threads/please pin it)

[Pursuivant]

There's a whole airport's worth of UK and British Commonwealth aircraft that aren't in the game. Along with an equally large airport's worth of French aircraft.

But, +1 to the 1940 Hurricane Mk. I.

It would be an easy addition, for the reasons Gaunt said.

It was more numerous and got more kills in the Battle of Britain (although the more kills thing might be because Hurricanes were detailed to attack bombers, while Spits dealt with the Bf 109s).

Hurricane squadrons were actually sent to France in 1940 as part of the BEF.

[Verdun1916]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

There's a whole airport's worth of UK and British Commonwealth aircraft that aren't in the game. Along with an equally large airport's worth of French aircraft.

But, +1 to the 1940 Hurricane Mk. I.

It would be an easy addition, for the reasons Gaunt said.

It was more numerous and got more kills in the Battle of Britain (although the more kills thing might be because Hurricanes were detailed to attack bombers, while Spits dealt with the Bf 109s).

Hurricane squadrons were actually sent to France in 1940 as part of the BEF.

I agree about the French aswell! I've been hopeing for years that the M.S. 406 and the 410 would be made flyable and a bit larger generic western/central Europe map for some Phony War and Battle of France action. The Hawk 75 was a great addition but te M.S. made flyable would be awesome aswell since they will be just as useable for the Finnish front.
Off course the D.520 would be nice to!

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Verdun1916

I agree about the French aswell! I've been hopeing for years that the M.S. 406 and the 410 would be made flyable and a bit larger generic western/central Europe map for some Phony War and Battle of France action. The Hawk 75 was a great addition but te M.S. made flyable would be awesome aswell since they will be just as useable for the Finnish front. Off course the D.520 would be nice to!

The channel map under construction actually covers a fair bit of the area that was fought over during the "Battle of France". It cover the area which was fought over at the culmination of Fall Gelbe, and the eastern portions of action during Fall Rot.

A flyable MS.406/410 is on my short wish list, too.

It would also be nice if the French had at least one bomber type. I've always assumed that turning the A-20C Havoc into a French DB7A would be the simplest route, since there isn't that much 3D work needed. But given that cockpits and crew stations would have to be extensively reworked, I'm not sure it would be that much of a time savings.

[Verdun1916]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

The channel map under construction actually covers a fair bit of the area that was fought over during the "Battle of France". It cover the area which was fought over at the culmination of Fall Gelbe, and the eastern portions of action during Fall Rot.

A flyable MS.406/410 is on my short wish list, too.

It would also be nice if the French had at least one bomber type. I've always assumed that turning the A-20C Havoc into a French DB7A would be the simplest route, since there isn't that much 3D work needed. But given that cockpits and crew stations would have to be extensively reworked, I'm not sure it would be that much of a time savings.

Yeah, your right! But it would be very nice to have an area that could be used as the French-German border area so it could be used for th Phony War scenarios or Campaign just as much as late 1944, early 1945 ones aswell. And if generic It could off course be used for other scenarios in other areas aswell. THe stock game has one such map but I feel it's just a tad to small haha

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Verdun1916

Yeah, your right! But it would be very nice to have an area that could be used as the French-German border area so it could be used for th Phony War scenarios or Campaign just as much as late 1944, early 1945 ones as well.

The only problem is that the area you describe didn't see that much aerial action - either tactical or strategic.

In 1939, both sides flew occasional patrols along the French-German border, but there wasn't that much action. There's a good reason why the period on the Western Front from September 1939 to May 1940 gets called "The Phoney War."

The Colmar Pocket (in the Vosges Mountains, just west of the Rhine) was a scene of intense action during 1944-45, but due to the weather, tactical air ops were limited. Same for the capture of the Saarland in 1945.

A potentially more useful map would be one that follows the Belgian-French border from approximately Saarbrucken to Lille and Nancy to Amiens. (Or, perhaps 2-3 maps, depending on actual population density.) Ignoring its potential to be modded as a WW I map, this area saw a plenty of action both in 1940 and in 1944-45.

In 1940, the map covers both the Sedan bridgehead, and the middle phases of Fall Gelbe. In 1944-45, it covers Western Allied Tac Air Ops during the Lorraine campaign and the liberation of Northern France.

This map also more or less follows a line from southeast England to southern Bavaria, which literally makes it "flyover country" for USAAF or RAF strategic bombing raids aimed at Augsburg, Munich, Regensburg or Stuttgart.

[Pursuivant]

The announcement of the English Channel map and discussions on this thread got me wondering about what a decent order of battle would look like for the Armee de l'Air in May 1940.

Note that this post is not a request, since it would take a massive amount of effort to even produce a stripped-down selection of French aircraft!

Anyhow, here's my list of which French aircraft were used in significant numbers during the Battle of France. Note that it doesn't take into account the fact that some types were obsolete and were quickly withdrawn from the combat zone.

Starred entries represent particularly important aircraft. Numbers in parentheses represent number of aircraft in service at the start of the campaign - more or less.

Attack: Breguet Bre.693 AB.2 (~200)* (Also used by Vichy France and Italy)

Bomber, Medium: Amiot 354 (86), Amiot 143 (138 ), Bloch MB.200 (200) (also used by Vichy France, Bulgaria, Luftwaffe), Bloch MB.210Bn (257), Liore et Olivier LeO 451* (~373)(also used by Italy, Luftwaffe), Martin 167 (<200) (also used by South Africa, UK, Vichy France).

Bomber, Light/Recon: ANF Les Mureaux 115 R2B2 (119), Bloch MB.131RB4 (121), Bloch MB.174A.3 (56), Breguet Bre.270, Douglas DB-7 B-3 (64), Potez 63.11* (730+) (also used by Greece, Italy, Romania, Vichy France, Yugoslavia, Luftwaffe)

Dive Bomber: Latecoere Late 298D (<121)*, Liore Nieuport LN.411 (45), Vought V-156 (40)

Fighter: Bloch MB.152 (482) (also used by Greece, Romania, Vichy France, Luftwaffe trainer), Caudron C.714 (~90) (also used by Finland, Free Polish), Curtiss H75-C1 (316), Dewoitine D.520 C1 (~900) (also used by Bulgaria, Italy, Vichy France, Luftwaffe), Koolhoven F.K.58A (11), Morane-Saulnier MS.406* (~1,000) (also used by Finland, Italy, Switzerland, Luftwaffe)

Fighter, Heavy: Potez 630 (85) (also used by Vichy France), Potez 631.01* (206) (also used by Greece, Vichy France, Luftwaffe), Potez 633 (63)

Liaison: Caudron C.270 Luciole (>700)*, Caudron C.635M Simoun (489), Hanriot H.182 (346)

Patrol: Liore 130 M (125)

Trainer: Hanriot H.436 (50), Hanriot H.230 (35) (also used by Finland), Mauboussin M.123 (65), Morane-Saulnier MS.230 (~1,000)(also used by many other nations), Morane-Saulnier MS.315 (350), Nardi FN.305A, Nieuport-Delage NiD 629 (50), North American NA-57 (also used by Vichy France, Luftwaffe), Romano R-82 (177)

Transport: Dewoitine D.338 (30) (also used by Lufthansa),

Utility: Caudron C.445M Goeland (404) (also used by Belgium, Bulgaria, Slovakia, Luftwaffe)

In my arrogant opinion, there's a good case to be made for adding any of the following aircraft to the game, either because of numbers of aircraft involved, subsequent use in other theaters of war, or both:

Breguet Bre.693 AB.2, Caudron C.270 Luciole, Latecoere Late 298D, Liore et Olivier LeO 451, Morane-Saulnier MS.406 (flyable), Potez 631.01, Potez 63.11.

Arguably:

Douglas DB-7 B-3 (could converted to Havoc Mk. I or Mk. II without too much trouble), Dewoitine D.520, Liore Nieuport LN.411 (dive-bomber float plane, major plane of Aeronavale during the campaign, and very effective), Martin 167 (AKA Martin Maryland), Vought V-156 (AKA Vought Vindicator - could be more or less easily modified to USN standard).

[Pursuivant]

Continuing my list of common 1939-40 aircraft

RAF British Expeditionary Force

Light Bomber: Fairey Battle Mk II

Medium Bomber: Blenheim Mk. I, Blenheim Mk. IV

Fighters:

Hurricane Mk I Early (1,029 HP Merlin II engine, 2-bladed wooden Watts Propeller, 87 octane fuel, fabric-covered wings, no armor glass, no armor or self-sealing fuel tanks, "rod" radio antenna mast, ring and bead sight)

Hurricane Mk I 6-Lb. Boost (Merlin II engine, 100 Octane fuel reserve, GM2 reflector gunsight, otherwise as Mk. I)

Hurricane Mk I 12-Lb. Boost (Merlin III engine, 3-bladed constant speed metal propeller, 100 Octane fuel, metal-covered wings, armor-glass windshield, head and back armor, "Linatex" fuselage fuel tanks, tapered radio antenna mast, revised engine exhausts)

Hurricane Mk. IIA Series 1 (Merlin XX engine, revised wing - blisters for cannon breaches, 4 20mm Hispano Mk. II cannons. Actually not involved in Battle of France, but did appear in September 1940)

Liaison: Westland Lysander Mk. II, De Havilland Tiger Moth


Royal Belgian Air Force

Light Bomber: Fairey Battle Mk. I (18 ), Fairey Fox II (43).

Fighter: Fairey Fox IIIC (48 ), Fiat CR.42 (24 or 27), SABCA Hurricane Mk. I (As for Hurricane Mk. I early, but 4 12.7mm FN-Browning MG instead of .303 Browning MG) (~12).

Reconnaissance: Fairey Fox VIR (24)

Liaison/Coop: Renard R.31 (20)

[Verdun1916]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

The only problem is that the area you describe didn't see that much aerial action - either tactical or strategic.

In 1939, both sides flew occasional patrols along the French-German border, but there wasn't that much action. There's a good reason why the period on the Western Front from September 1939 to May 1940 gets called "The Phoney War."

The Colmar Pocket (in the Vosges Mountains, just west of the Rhine) was a scene of intense action during 1944-45, but due to the weather, tactical air ops were limited. Same for the capture of the Saarland in 1945.

A potentially more useful map would be one that follows the Belgian-French border from approximately Saarbrucken to Lille and Nancy to Amiens. (Or, perhaps 2-3 maps, depending on actual population density.) Ignoring its potential to be modded as a WW I map, this area saw a plenty of action both in 1940 and in 1944-45.

In 1940, the map covers both the Sedan bridgehead, and the middle phases of Fall Gelbe. In 1944-45, it covers Western Allied Tac Air Ops during the Lorraine campaign and the liberation of Northern France.

This map also more or less follows a line from southeast England to southern Bavaria, which literally makes it "flyover country" for USAAF or RAF strategic bombing raids aimed at Augsburg, Munich, Regensburg or Stuttgart.

That's why I said I wanted a GENERIC Northwest Europe map a bit bigger than the one already present in the stock game. And that it COULD be used for Phony War missions or Campaigns, not that it had to. A generic map like that can stand in for any number of areas for any number of types of missions and campaings, historical or fictional. The key bit here is generic and a bit bigger! That's what I'm after since the already present one is so tiny.

And besides a Phoney War Campaign in the area Lorraine-Alsace and into the Eastern side of the Franco-German border would be a perfect campaing from a training point of view. Relative little action and enemy encounters that then finally escalates into the Batte of France is perfect for that. The inexperienced pilot will get time to learn before he gets to the real action.

[Janosch]

With 389 flyable planes, perhaps aesthetics should be the one and only deciding factor. And by golly, does the Fairy Fox look cute or what! Another beautiful plane I didn't know that existed.

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Verdun1916

That's why I said I wanted a GENERIC Northwest Europe map a bit bigger than the one already present in the stock game.

Due to the way that maps are created, it's actually easier to create a map of real area of the world as to create a fictional map.

Most fictional maps in the game are probably maps of real parts of the world but scaled up or down. The exceptions are things like the online islands or the online mountains maps. But, they're probably very small because it takes time to create an original map rather than just importing satellite data.

Sadly, the fact that it's easiest to import STRM data, but hard to create maps "from scratch" or from historical documents means that some existing maps have errors in them, since there has been 70+ years of development, as well as changes to coastlines, river courses, and forest boundaries.

In particular, development and changes in physical geography make it impossible to make accurate period maps of places like China, the Netherlands, Indonesia, Hawaii, Philippines, or Rabaul.