4.11: Some Missions Locking-Up

[IceFire]

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

Just to clarify, I did not say this happens 'often' to me.

As I mentioned earlier, I pretty much detailed everything in my first post. I know it is a little long but if it is read closely, the info is in there.

As I stated, these seem to be a combination of 'big' maps and 'big' missions. The Solomons map(s) are just about the biggest maps in IL-2. So when you load even the blank map, your computer is already being taxed. If you combine that with a very busy (big) mission.....well you see that could eventually be an issue. (Again, I stated that I have 'smaller' missions on the Solomons map that work just fine in 4.11.)

Over the years, I have seen many posts that a certain individual could not load a particular map or mission....usually because of RAM issues. This is not unusual. Even the best and fastest computers have a physical limit.

***The strange part of my issue is that the same missions that are locking up in 4.11 are playing perfectly fine in 4.10.1....on the same computer.***

So, my common sense is telling me that my computer is fine and there may be an issue with 4.11. Does that make sense to you?

* Maybe all the new calculations for FM, AI, head tracking, moving plane parts online, etc. are stressing the IL-2 code? Too much info?

Aviar

[IceFire]

Definitely makes sense.

Yes the Solomons map does appear to be quite taxing. We tried to use it for a scenario on Battlefields1 and while the map ran fine for most players we had to pull it because some players weren't able to load past 90-92% and others would load but had missing textures on the ground or on planes. It's too bad because it's a beautiful map but some machines I guess are not quite up to the task.

I would agree with you that it is some sort of game related issue. In particular because the lockup does not affect the hardware. The game does lock up but you can alt-tab out and shut down the IL2 process without difficulty or loss of stability... and given that it happens on more than one system it's not likely to be a system specific problem either.

So big map and big missions...I'll have to have a look. See if I can recreate the same issues on other mission examples.

[Aviar]

Just for fun, I decided to create a '4.11 Stress Test' mission. I thought it might be a good idea if we were going to do some more testing on this issue.

So of course I used the Solomoms 1944 map. Then I placed a lot more planes than I had in the mission I posted here earlier...the one that was locking up.

In this mission, I currently have:

64 B-29

32 B-25

16 P-38

48 Ki-61

16 H8k1

Now that's a lot of planes. Also, all the gunners in the bombers have their own AI and so that puts a lot of additional stress in terms of calculations into the mission.

So I tried one of the more simple tests. I loaded the mission into the FMB and chose Play. I then set the Autopilot on the Player aircraft. Then I accelerated the game to 4x and just watched.

Nothing happened. The mission did not lock up. So what might we learn from this? Some thoughts:

1. The first thing that came to mind was....the first mission was created in 4.10 and this stress mission was created in 4.11. Now, on the surface, that should not make a difference. One reason being is that I made the stress mission very 'generic', meaning that I could easily install it in 4.10 and it would play. (This is because I did not use any of the new 4.11 features or planes.)

So, could this be a possible answer? (Certain missions created BEFORE 4.11 may cause the game to lock up during the mission, if played in 4.11.)

That's an interesting thought. The first thing that then comes to mind is....why not go into 4.10.1 and rebuild the stress mission from scratch. Then take THAT mission and test it in 4.11. If the 4.10.1 stress test mission were to lock up in 4.11, that certainly would be interesting information.

What do you think?


2.Ok, the second thought was that although the stress mission was 'bigger' than the coop mision (we'll call it the Torikina mission from now on), it was different in that in many ways it was 'simplier'.

What I mean is this. The stress mission was made as a test, so I just had all the planes start in mid-air. They all had just 2 waypoints. So basically they all just flew from point A to point B. This will still stress a computer, but remember, we are trying to find some differences. (I later added 16 Ki-61's which attacked certain bomber flights, so there WAS a good amount of combat action...which increases the stress factor.)

The Torikina coop was a 'real' mission. It had takeoffs, landings, more waypoints, attack waypoints, flights with delayed spawning, etc.

Could some of these differences be the answer to why the 4.11 stress mission did not lock up? I don't know.

The obvious answer is to try and build a brand new big 'real' mission on the Solomons map and see what happens. I mean, if that mission would still lock up then that question would be answered.

Does that make sense?

So there are 2 points of thought right there. Does anyone have more?

**I have also attached the 4.11 Stress Test mission in case somebody wants to mess around with it.

EDIT: One interesting fact I forgot to mention. I tested the Stress Mission in both 4.11 and 4.10.1. Although the mission played fine in both versions, there was a difference between the two.

After I played the mission from the 4.11 FMB at 4x speed, after about 30 minutes (in-game time) I decided to end the mission. After I hit Escape, clicked Quit Mission and then clicked on Done, the game locked up. It would not reload the mission back into the FMB. So again, does this seem to indicate some sort of memory-type issue in 4.11?

When I did the same test in 4.10.1, there was no lock-up at all. I tested the mission, quit the mission and then the mission reloaded right back into the FMB. So again, there seems to be a reproducable difference between 4.11 and 4.10.1.


Aviar

[IceFire]

Total conjecture... you had one or two vehicles (groups?) traveling between one side of the island and the other. There were a significant number of way points. I'm not sure if vehicle AI has been altered in any way but it's worth factoring in.

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Total conjecture... you had one or two vehicles (groups?) traveling between one side of the island and the other. There were a significant number of way points. I'm not sure if vehicle AI has been altered in any way but it's worth factoring in.

It's only 2 vehicles....one Red and one Blue. If 2 vehicles can cause a mission to lock up something is horribly wrong.

However, I just went in and deleted those 2 vehicles. I then ran my usual test. The mission still locked up about 2 minutes into it at 4x speed.

Aviar

[Robert]

Just for confirmation, the mission locked up after several minutes of 4X playback. I'm using 4.11, and I didn't occupy a cockpit - strictly play back.

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by Robert

Just for confirmation, the mission locked up after several minutes of 4X playback. I'm using 4.11, and I didn't occupy a cockpit - strictly play back.

Thank you so much for testing. I assume you are talking about the Torikina mission and not the Stress Test mission.

If you still have a working version of 4.10.1 to test it in that would be great. You see, the main issue we are trying to resolve is why these missions work fine in 4.10.1 but lock up in 4.11.

That means we now have 5 people (including myself) who have reported testing the mission and 4 of them had the mission lock up in 4.11.

Aviar

[Robert]

Yes Aviar, it was the Torikina mission. I don't have 4101 on my machine ATM so I can't be of service there. Nor do I run mods when I did run 4.101 (which is of no concern regarding 4.11, obviously).

I ALSO tried running the mission while occupying a Japanese fighter and it froze on loading. Never got past the flash screen.

I subsequently went back to flying my WSBS mission. It's an old campaign based on the AVG fighter squadron in Burma made by " the former Chuck Older." I'm about 16 - 18 missions into it an haven't had a single freeze, slow down or crash. The first time I tried flying post installation of the Torikina mission it did just that until it froze completely and I had to CTRL/ALT/DELETE to exit out of the program.

I deleted the Torikina mission and plan on trying the campaign again, probably tomorrow. It's late here. I will post back and let you know if I still have issues. What this means I have no idea. I am posting so you or others may have a wider group and that hopefully a common thread can be seen amongst the reports so the issue can be narrowed down and corrected.

WSBS was created for 4.09. BTW.

[Robert]

UPDATE Aviar:

I reflew the last mission that froze in White Star /Blue Skies, and had no issues - no freezes, no jitters, nada. This was after deleting the Torikina mission you posted last night.

Again, WSBS is a 4.09 created mission, and I'm flying it in IL2 1946 4.11.