Give me some "holy sh... did that just happen" ideas

[PeterPanPan]

Originally Posted by Snuff_Pidgeon

... It is always best to keep a cool head and not attack the defenceless ...

I agree, but the point here is that not all the Luftwaffe Operated Red Cross aircraft were defenceless. Some of them abused their position and were armed or simply were not on humanitarian missions - they were providing support to combat missions or on recce flights, all under the guise of the Red Cross.

So the question was, as an allied pilot, what do you do?

Here's the RAF communiqé in full, issued in July 1940:

Enemy aircraft bearing civil markings and marked with the Red Cross have recently flown over British ships at sea and in the vicinity of the British coast, and they are being employed for purposes which His Majesty's Government cannot regard as being consistent with the privileges generally accorded to the Red Cross.

His Majesty's Government desire to accord to ambulance aircraft reasonable facilities for the transportation of the sick and wounded, in accordance with the Red Cross Convention, and aircraft engaged in the direct evacuation of the sick and wounded will be respected, provided that they comply with the relevant provisions of the Convention.

His Majesty's Government are unable, however, to grant immunity to such aircraft flying over areas in which operations are in progress on land or at sea, or approaching British or Allied territory, or territory in British occupation, or British or Allied ships.

Ambulance aircraft which do not comply with the above requirements will do so at their own risk and peril.
1940

So, it seems to me that allied pilots must make their own decisions on whether to shoot or not based on the position and actions of each Red Cross aircraft they see. This could make for some interesting game play.

PPanPan

[Ravenous]

Hey, I don't know wether someone has suggested it already but here it is.
regardless of wether or not we get a 1st person view of the pilot in the cockpit, we could atleast get some visual effects to go with pilot damage...right??

imagine the differance between IL-2 where your screen gets a slight red filter and the controls get a little less effective ( the more damage the worse the effect) and what we could have in SOW where if your pilot gets hit you get some blood-spatter in the cockpit, on the gunsight, instruments, stick, floor and stuff like that depending on the angle and location of the hit

that would ofcourse be alittle much to hope for with the age rating-system the game has to go through and this being mere eyecandy with a bit of realism thrown in..

more in-cockpit damage would be awsome, like smoke from the engine filling the cockpit, fuel from the tanks leaking in the cockpit in the planes that this actually could happen in
glass shattering after dammage because of the stress, cockpit-door/canopy refusing to open because of damage, instrument malfunction and errors.

and lastly if the pilot-DM is complex enaugh it would be cool if the controls one could operate with left arm only would be delayed or non-functional if you take a hit in the left shoulder or arm, and ofcoarse the same would apply to rudderpedals and brakes, and operations one could only use the right arm for

[Wutz]

Well if you had read Olegs posts, you would know that he is not going down that line with blood and gore, as that could in some countries get the game rated as over 18, and so reduce sales. Maybe think what you are wishing for?

[Necrobaron]

I sound like an old record since I've brought this up before, but I don't buy the idea that blood n' guts will reduce sales in any significant way considering there are plenty of violent games that do just fine with an 18+ rating, not to mention the sim-playing demographic tends to be (from what I've seen) over 18 anyways and thus making the rating a moot point. However, as you said, Oleg has stated violence will not feature in SoW and, as much as I disagree with that decision, it is the final word.

Originally Posted by Wutz

Well if you had read Olegs posts, you would know that he is not going down that line with blood and gore, as that could in some countries get the game rated as over 18, and so reduce sales. Maybe think what you are wishing for?

________
Cheap airsoft

[Wutz]

Originally Posted by Necrobaron

I sound like an old record since I've brought this up before, but I don't buy the idea that blood n' guts will reduce sales in any significant way considering there are plenty of violent games that do just fine with an 18+ rating, not to mention the sim-playing demographic tends to be (from what I've seen) over 18 anyways and thus making the rating a moot point. However, as you said, Oleg has stated violence will not feature in SoW and, as much as I disagree with that decision, it is the final word.

Well you might not believe it, but here in Europe a game with lots of blood & gore will be rated as +18 meaning you will not find it in your normal store.That
means only those that know where else it might be available will get it. For your normal users, the game will be next to non existant. Might be differant in your part of the world, but I doubt customers are only sought in one certain region? I think they are aiming at a wide spectrum of users all over the world. That means certain restrictions in various countries have to be taken into account, otherwise its a no go there.

[akdavis]

Haven't read the whole thread, so forgive me if I repeat others' ideas, but I'd like to throw some general ideas out, particularly in regards to those moments that have the greatest potential for excitement: the application of metal and high explosive to targets.

First, for any of these to be "holy sh!t" moments, the developers must first exercise some restraint. If, as in Il-2, every target suffers a catastrophic fate evey time it is destroyed, the potential for surprising moments diminshes with each minute of the game played. Every ship explodes and sinks in a matter of minutes (an exceedingly rare event in real life); every vehicle erupts in a multi-story fireball when straffed; every structure collapses completely when bombed, sometimes when the structure is not even enveloped in the explosion effect of the bomb. Every single target you attack suffers the most dramatic ending possible. The potential for surprise diminishes to zero.

So before I recommend some "oh sh!t" moments, first there needs to be more mundane potential outcomes. Sometimes vehicles should just burn or smoke, not explode. Sometimes structures should only suffer partial damage, perhaps just a hole or a collapsed wall, and there should always be dust/debris, but not necessarily fire. Ships should typically just burn and/or list while slowly sinking over the course of hours.

With that, here are some truly dramatic moments that could occur:

-If a train engine or steamship is struck with AP rounds or penetrating bomb, there should be a chance of a boiler explosion with attendant column of steam rocketing into the air.

-If a steel/concrete bridge is bombed, there should be only a small chance that an entire span will be dropped (when it happens it would be very dramatic).

-If a train car, truck or ship is carrying ammunition, there should be a chance that attack will result in an enormous and very violent explosion (see 0:54 here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekXG_LO1_uM&NR=1

). However, not every vehicle, train car or ship should act as if they are carrying ammunition.

-Likewise, there should be ammo dump or bunker structures with the same potential for catastrophic destruction.

-Flak and other infantry-served weapons on the ground should seldom explode. An explosion should be a surprising event. More typically, flak should simply be supressed (temporarily or permanently abandoned/unmanned).

-If a ship has a torpedo detonate underneath the middle of the hull, there should be a chance for the ship's back to break and split into two.

-A tank should only explode if its ammunition ignites, which should be a violent event with fire shooting out hatches or the turret displacing. Otherwise a tank should simply burn or be abandoned.

-parked aircraft should not have on/off damage models and should not typically explode.

-Not just armor, but most surfaces, including metal aircraft skin, should offer a chance of projectile deflection.

-damage to the bridge of a ship should potentially cause the ship to lose command (stop maneuvering, return fire less effectively); damage to the engine room or propellors should potentially cause loss of propulsion.

-In general, different fusing of bombs/rockets should result in a greater variety of outcomes on the target and "hit point" damage models should be abandoned wherever possible).

[ECV56_Lancelot]

Taking in consideration the observations just made by akdavis, which are absolutely true, my new suggestion would bë:

- Seeing a tank lossing its turret because of the exposion
- Seing a moving tank get its track (i think it the right term) get broken and start turning, until finally stop and be abandoned, if the crew is modeled.
- Seeing vehicles and objects being thrown in to the air due to explosions.
- If a ship explodes, parts of the ship being blown away in to the air.
- Trees being thrown away in radial pattern from the center of an explosion.

[Foo'bar]

@akdavis: very well said!

drafting posted this one some pages before:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKomzCUZZDw

[AdMan]

Not sure if these have been mentioned or if already in the works but a couple ideas - I know vehicles like the tanks have opening doors and hatches, I hope to see these doors get blown open or completely off the hinges when they suffer a critical hit. Also when attacking a moving tank having a track suffer a critical hit and come off, leaving it "riding on rims" so to speak.

people fleeing a building or area as they hear bombs approaching or abandoning stations when coming under fire would add a cool factor

not sure how common brush fires were in Britain the summer of 1940, but coming a across one would add some interesting scenery and should be relatively easy to add in, A fire line being pushed along by the wind with scorched fields in it's wake.


maybe a little extra attention to damage of certain miscellaneous ground structures, It'd be cool to see something like water tower loose it's contents after being "accidentally" shot to pieces, or to shoot off the blades of a windmill.

EDIT: OK, tank ideas were being discussed a couple posts above this one, oops...long thread; didn't read

[334th_Gazoo0]

Originally Posted by Specht

Sudden engine failures even without taking any damage...

I would like this if it was related to the treatment of theaircraft, ie. Improperly warming up aircraft engine results in specific engine damage.