4.11 - AI debugging

[FC99]

Originally Posted by BadAim

One little foible I did notice is that I had my wingman crash right next to me as I landed at missions end when I forgot to give him the "go home" order, just like they've always done. If you have time this might be something to look at.

My reply might sound patronizing but I assure that that is not my intention, I'll use your post just as an example and try to provoke some thoughts.

In above situation first error was one made by human pilot, in fact AI pilots done what many of the real WWII pilots would do, they followed their leader.
This leads to the next point. Being a leader is not easy, not everybody can be a leader in RL. Leadership brings responsibility, leader have to take care about his subordinates and adjust his actions to match ability of his team.

IMO players should try to get into this leadership role more, great leaders are those who can get the most out of their team, overcame its weaknesses and exploit its strengths. As AI improves and become more human-like, role of the leader becomes more and more important and players are missing a lot of fun if they don't dug deeper into Leader role.

My point being, do what your team can do, don't try to force them to do what they can't do.

Now back to the bug report. You are right, that happens. I made new maneuver for low level flying ( you can now lead your flight few meters above the ground, try it but just don't make descent too steep) and I build mechanism that was supposed to take care about situations like you described.
Obviously it's not sufficient and I'll make some adjustments. Thanks for report and ,please, don't take my post personally, it was just used to ilustrate my POV about the leadership in games in general.

[Lagarto]

The problem is that if you fly in No 2 position (leader's wingman) and the leader gets shot down, the rest of the flight (Nos 3 and 4) will formate on you. It happened to me last night. I couldn't communicate with them, and the moment I was about to touch down, they both slammed into the ground.

[[URU]BlackFox]

Originally Posted by Lagarto

The problem is that if you fly in No 2 position (leader's wingman) and the leader gets shot down, the rest of the flight (Nos 3 and 4) will formate on you. It happened to me last night. I couldn't communicate with them, and the moment I was about to touch down, they both slammed into the ground.

Some nice thing to implement would be that the leadership of the flight gets transferred when the leader gets shot down. That way the AI can always have a commander (another AI or a human, according to circumstances).I saw this in a 4.09 mod, together with new formations and other stuff, but it was incompatible with newer versions.

Again, I know that it's a massive work, so take it just as a suggestion for future versions of the game.

[Blackjack]

Originally Posted by Lagarto

The problem is that if you fly in No 2 position (leader's wingman) and the leader gets shot down, the rest of the flight (Nos 3 and 4) will formate on you. It happened to me last night. I couldn't communicate with them, and the moment I was about to touch down, they both slammed into the ground.

That mostly happens to me if I "request backup" from base , so they sort of latch onto me (sometimes the lead of the flight too!), maybe some sort of that behavour happens when you send "clear my 6" on the radio, I really dont know

[FC99]

Originally Posted by Lagarto

The problem is that if you fly in No 2 position (leader's wingman) and the leader gets shot down, the rest of the flight (Nos 3 and 4) will formate on you. It happened to me last night. I couldn't communicate with them, and the moment I was about to touch down, they both slammed into the ground.

Damn, this is something we must improve. While we are at it, what do you think about giving the human player an option to inform his flight about nearby bandits even when he is not flight leader?

[fruitbat]

Originally Posted by FC99

Damn, this is something we must improve. While we are at it, what do you think about giving the human player an option to inform his flight about nearby bandits even when he is not flight leader?

I think thats a good idea, you would irl.

Awesome work your doing with the AI, really impressive

[Fenrir]

Can I add to this that the AI call bandits when the player is flight leader; currently they just break off and engage leaving the oblivious player unaware of their departure!

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

Hm? Your AI friends are calling bandits for you and as long as you tell them to fly in formation, they also will not departure if they are not attacked.

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by Fenrir

Can I add to this that the AI call bandits when the player is flight leader; currently they just break off and engage leaving the oblivious player unaware of their departure!

All you need to do is use your Wingman/Flight 'Rejoin' command and they will get right back into formation....even if they 'see' nearby enemy planes.

Aviar

[Lagarto]

Aviar, the problem, as I understand it, is of different nature. I don't want my AI wingmen to stay in formation, just the opposite. I don't mind them leading me to enemy aircraft they 'spotted' - provided they're kind enough to inform me that they're breaking off formation to engage something!
My AI wingmen are usually better than me in locating enemy in the sky (they don't have to strain their eyes; being computer-controlled, they just 'know' that something's coming), so being a flight leader I rely on them in that matter. All I want is that they call out the 'bandits' instead of just flying away on their own, the way they do now.