Daidalos Team's Room -QUESTIONS AND REQUESTS ONLY - For 4.11

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

Originally Posted by Tropical Storm

Hi all,

Don't know if this has already been discussed here too, but I would like to know if there will be any improvements on the autopilot system. It's kind of common that my plane breaks formation, do not follow the leader or the waypoints, or even puts nose down straight to the surface when on autopilot...

So far no issues with autopilot has been recognised. It generally follows waypoints (note: it also flies back if you have missed one) and starts attacks on enemy planes.

[Tropical Storm]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

So far no issues with autopilot has been recognised. It generally follows waypoints (note: it also flies back if you have missed one) and starts attacks on enemy planes.

Hum, so maybe the problem is with the allied (I mean, squadron leader) AI. He often takes a different course than the waypoints one and behavior strangely, so my plane on autopilot just follow him... For example: many times playing as a B 25 bomber, the whole squadron dive to bomb, and not level, just like they were diver bombers. If I turn off the autopilot close to the target and level my bomber for myself, they just shout for me to "stay on course"! Other times, playing as an escort fighter, my whole flight fly away from the bombers we were suposed to protect just because we missed a waypoint...

Maybe if the AI had some behavior patterns depending on the type of plane it flyes... like, do not dive if he is a level bomber, or always follow the bombers if he is an escort, regardless of his own waypoints... them maybe my plane and my flight would do what they are suposed to do, even on autopilot.

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by Tropical Storm

Hum, so maybe the problem is with the allied (I mean, squadron leader) AI. He often takes a different course than the waypoints one and behavior strangely, so my plane on autopilot just follow him... For example: many times playing as a B 25 bomber, the whole squadron dive to bomb, and not level, just like they were diver bombers. If I turn off the autopilot close to the target and level my bomber for myself, they just shout for me to "stay on course"! Other times, playing as an escort fighter, my whole flight fly away from the bombers we were suposed to protect just because we missed a waypoint...

Maybe if the AI had some behavior patterns depending on the type of plane it flyes... like, do not dive if he is a level bomber, or always follow the bombers if he is an escort, regardless of his own waypoints... them maybe my plane and my flight would do what they are suposed to do, even on autopilot.

That's not an autopilot problem. That's an AI problem... or rather a limitation.

The B-25 version in-game is a B-25J which operated as both level bomber and strafer using the guns in the nose to attack targets are very low level. The AI is setup on this aircraft for the strafer behavior so that's what it tries to do. At some higher altitude it is supposed to play nice as a level bomber but I'm not sure what that is.

On my wish list is an ability to tell the AI what to do at the attack waypoint depending on what options are available for that aircraft. So that we can have A-20s and B-25s and other types that did double duty doing what they are supposed to do according to mission parameters.

[Pursuivant]

My problem with waypoints is that if you miss a waypoint and then turn on AI, the AI tries to go back to it, rather than going on to the next waypoint or to the nearest waypoint.

Going back to the last known location might be realistic if you're flying over unfamiliar terrain or have limited landmarks and the waypoints are widely separated, but makes no sense if the waypoints have been set up to make planes orbit over a particular location, or if the planes are supposed to rendezvous with some other unit.

In a more perfect world, the FMB would include the following options:

Attack -> Attack type: high level bomb, dive bomb, strafe/rockets, torpedo/skip bomb/kamikaze.

Loiter -> Pattern: Circle, Racetrack, Expanding circle/spiral, square, rectangle, expanding square, expanding rectangle, random with X radius of waypoint. Speed change: +/- X mph/kph. Altitude change: +/- X m/feet.

Missed Waypoint Behavior: Back to last waypoint, go to next waypoint, go to nearest waypoint.

Dogfight behavior: Avoid contact (i.e., keep at least X distance from nearest enemy while still trying to get to next waypoint), Defensive circle (AKA Lufberry Circle), Escort/air cover (i.e., don't go beyond X distance from Y unit/location - close vs. loose escort set by distance), Ignore (i.e., don't dogfight or maneuver at all - very realistic for level bombers at IP point), Cautious (i.e., dogfight if attacked but don't pursue if enemy breaks off), Aggressive (i.e., normal dogfight behavior), Scatter (i.e., similar to what happens when bomber formations are badly shaken up, but logical initial behavior for unarmed formations), Flee/Retreat (i.e., avoid contact with enemy and got to another waypoint if enemy sighted), Scatter & Flee (combines the two options above - formation scatters, individual planes try to make it to another waypoint individually).

Escort Behavior (Can be assigned with other commands, no other flights need be present to get search patterns along a particular path): straight flight, weave (i.e., a sinusoidal path), zig-zag (i.e., 45 degree left and right turns every X meters), racetrack (i.e., oval loops - like current fighter escort behavior), orbit (i.e., circular loops), random.

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

'Go to next waypoint' has always been available and it works for you own planes autopilot too.

[Tropical Storm]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

'Go to next waypoint' has always been available and it works for you own planes autopilot too.

Yes, but if Im not a flight group (or squadron) leader it will not work for the entire flight, right? I mean, the leader will still try to go back to the missed waypoint (what the AI is programmed to do, I supose), and if I go to the next by myself, I'll break formation...

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

Originally Posted by Tropical Storm

Yes, but if Im not a flight group (or squadron) leader it will not work for the entire flight, right? I mean, the leader will still try to go back to the missed waypoint (what the AI is programmed to do, I supose), and if I go to the next by myself, I'll break formation...

If you not the flight leader, you probably won't miss any waypoint. There is no reason to leave your flight, is there? Thats the point of being NOT the flight leader. However, there have some good suggestions beside this and we read them all.

[Tropical Storm]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

My problem with waypoints is that if you miss a waypoint and then turn on AI, the AI tries to go back to it, rather than going on to the next waypoint or to the nearest waypoint.

Going back to the last known location might be realistic if you're flying over unfamiliar terrain or have limited landmarks and the waypoints are widely separated, but makes no sense if the waypoints have been set up to make planes orbit over a particular location, or if the planes are supposed to rendezvous with some other unit.

In a more perfect world, the FMB would include the following options:

Attack -> Attack type: high level bomb, dive bomb, strafe/rockets, torpedo/skip bomb/kamikaze.

Loiter -> Pattern: Circle, Racetrack, Expanding circle/spiral, square, rectangle, expanding square, expanding rectangle, random with X radius of waypoint. Speed change: +/- X mph/kph. Altitude change: +/- X m/feet.

Missed Waypoint Behavior: Back to last waypoint, go to next waypoint, go to nearest waypoint.

Dogfight behavior: Avoid contact (i.e., keep at least X distance from nearest enemy while still trying to get to next waypoint), Defensive circle (AKA Lufberry Circle), Escort/air cover (i.e., don't go beyond X distance from Y unit/location - close vs. loose escort set by distance), Ignore (i.e., don't dogfight or maneuver at all - very realistic for level bombers at IP point), Cautious (i.e., dogfight if attacked but don't pursue if enemy breaks off), Aggressive (i.e., normal dogfight behavior), Scatter (i.e., similar to what happens when bomber formations are badly shaken up, but logical initial behavior for unarmed formations), Flee/Retreat (i.e., avoid contact with enemy and got to another waypoint if enemy sighted), Scatter & Flee (combines the two options above - formation scatters, individual planes try to make it to another waypoint individually).

Escort Behavior (Can be assigned with other commands, no other flights need be present to get search patterns along a particular path): straight flight, weave (i.e., a sinusoidal path), zig-zag (i.e., 45 degree left and right turns every X meters), racetrack (i.e., oval loops - like current fighter escort behavior), orbit (i.e., circular loops), random.

That would be perfect! I was talking exactly about that when I mentioned "flight patterns". But I understand that it would be very difficult and time consuming for TD to make such changes for this patch, but maybe it stays on the wishlist for the next...

[OREL_Erichos]

Hi guys, my question is about support 6DOF mode for freetrack/IRtrack in 4.11 update, will this feature be in this update or not?

[Bolelas]

Originally Posted by OREL_Erichos

Hi guys, my question is about support 6DOF mode for freetrack/IRtrack in 4.11 update, will this feature be in this update or not?

This was mentioned many times before. NO, because some older planes are not designed to suport this feature in their 3D design, and some parts would become transparent. It would be ugly to do official patch with such fails (that permited some sort of "cheat"). So basicaly, if you want 6DOF, fly with MODs.