4.101 RC - List of fixes

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

Who said, that Spitfires will stay the only types with reviewed FM?
So pls stop listing planes, 'that has this and that wrong'...! There is no connection to them.

BTW: My personnel hit counter in Spits shows better results now than before with 4.09m.

[JtD]

Originally Posted by PE_Tihi

You been testing the thing a bit wrongly

Well, I went by what you wrote, you've repeatedly complained about stability. If you don't mean stability at all, your fault. Don't blame me. Anyway, looking at how you dodge anything that involves fact, let me sum it up for you:

- the Spitfires stability is realistic
- the Spitfires stability is in the same league as that of many other planes in game

And now it's the hammerhead which is so awfully wrong. What exactly does a vertical zoom climb with rudder input at 100 km/h in a Fw 190 look like? Or in a P-38? Or a P-39? Wait, they all go up, then out of control. And because the planes are different, they go out of control differently. Holy cow.

Which aerodynamic forces do you think should keep the plane controllable at 0 air speed?

[JtD]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

BTW: My personnel hit counter in Spits shows better results now than before with 4.09m.

Mine's unchanged.

[Fafnir_6]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

Who said, that Spitfires will stay the only types with reviewed FM?

Cool!

Fafnir_6

[PE_Tihi]

Originally Posted by Gadje

Hi Tihi long time.

I agree with much that you say, the Spitfires have been dealt a tougher set of cards in 4.10 but perhaps Oleg the dealer favoured them too much in the past.

It reminds me of a class of misbehaving schoolchildren, the new teacher picks on one, a past favourite, not necessarily the worst and gives him a good thrashing. Some of the kids are pleased, others worried if they are next. Lets face it, there are plenty of aircraft candidates in IL2 that could and perhaps should be next.

I know that you fly all planes and have no side per se. The guys giving you a hard time are likely not so evenhanded. Sigs tell a lot Followers of Red vs Blue mentallity can't quite believe that not everyone is like them. For them it's 'Us vs the Enemy', and calls for fairness are a coverup of an agenda .
The longer I fly this sim the less it seems about a battle between red vs blue and more about pilots who fly only one side vs pilots who fly either. Red and Blue only pilots are interchangable to me. Same words, same agenda, different colour.

Lastly the next poster who suggest you're a red 'Spitwhiner' and need to learn to fly, I suggest you invite him to a 'dance' in a blue plane of his choice. I'd like to see that

Hello Gadje; nice seing you again;

Been really a long time, partly because am mostly on X-Fire lately. I did see your squad-pal Rambo several times; he became a real Experte on his 30 mm armed Anton (the thug..)
Have been flying on the russian servers lately. Many good pilots there, who interestingly for the most part fly LW types - mostly G2, F4, but Antons and Mc205 are popular, too. Would fly mostly red, but blue, too, so it does'nt get boring.
Short time ago I overheard a Russian guy (I understand a bit of the language) cursing the Spit as over-clocked, etc.; and his pal answered: 'You better look at these Russian planes of ours' Indeed, their good fliers avoid the La-s and 185's like pest, considering under their dignity to fly them. I do not know whether anyone could have predicted such a development

The Russian guy was quite right, of course. I do not know how it has been for the Spit in the very wild very early days with really smoking overcloks, but for the last 5 years at least, it has the three main performance factors, speed, climb and turn in quite realistic numbers, I think. Being able to use 5 min WEP for hours is a small favor compared to climbs boosted 70% or turns shortened for 2-3 s.

Knowing the FM's have not been treated in the most even manner, i always used nationally mixed planesets, same for both sides on the server. Some wondered at that, but mostly would get used very quickly.

I have always been more curious how different planes compared with each other (even the one's of the same belligerent) then 'refighting' a war, and a rather nasty one at that. But people, especially younger guys jump into this good/bad, we/them trappings gladly, and game-marketing people with their role-playings and other bs, know that , of course. Feeling Great as a part of the own Great Nation/color/side is one of the vanities main modes of operation. I suspect strongly that 's the reason the vanity exists at all. You 're right, of course,; they are like mirror images of each other, these 'convinced' reds or blues

When I think of the Ubi forum, the 'insult hit-men' are much more benign here. The moderation on the Ubi never gave a damn, these mods here seem even to overdo it in the oposite dierction-a thread of mine has been closed in a bit more than 12 hours a couple of days ago. The good side is, people behave a lot more correct than they used to on the infamous 'Zoo'. I can imagine how some of the big mouths here fly from their comments; of course they mostly imagine the guy who they talking with to be 'ham-fisted',' needing a lower difficulty level' or just as plainly bad as they are

CU in HL

[PE_Tihi]

Originally Posted by JtD

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar
BTW: My personnel hit counter in Spits shows better results now than before with 4.09m.

JtD: Mine's unchanged.

Well the thing s certainly good for spray and pray; and if you after the masses of enemy personnel.. certainly As for the arithmetic, it has got a number that doesn't change when halved

[Birdflu]

I agree!!
Spit its much better on turns if you set propally the joystick.

[PE_Tihi]

Originally Posted by JtD

Well, I went by what you wrote, you've repeatedly complained about stability. If you don't mean stability at all, your fault. Don't blame me. Anyway, looking at how you dodge anything that involves fact, let me sum it up for you:

- the Spitfires stability is realistic
- the Spitfires stability is in the same league as that of many other planes in game

And now it's the hammerhead which is so awfully wrong. What exactly does a vertical zoom climb with rudder input at 100 km/h in a Fw 190 look like? Or in a P-38? Or a P-39? Wait, they all go up, then out of control. And because the planes are different, they go out of control differently. Holy cow.

Which aerodynamic forces do you think should keep the plane controllable at 0 air speed?

If a plane has a low 'reserve' of stabillity, it is in the very slow flight that this deficit shows in a most pronounced manner. Thats where you would ve got the best chance of noticing it; of course if you do not want or cannot, that s another matter.

All other planes including the ones you name can be helped with a kick on the rudder to drop their noses shortly before the steeply climbing plane stalls. It can be done without reducing power.
Spit enters shortly before the stall speed a zone of completely neutral stability, where there is no natural tendency to drop the nose which could be helped. Gyroscopic forces keep the nose pointing upwards, and the controls can do nothing about it. You ll have to cut power if you want the nose to drop, and lose further energy in the strong oscillations which, with the pilot helping, still do not diminish before the plane reaches 160-170 kph. By that time you ll be quite a bit underneath a P40, not to speak of a Bf which is really good at stall fight.

Even at higher speeds, in a dogfight (say 350-250 kph), if you press a pedal to move the aiming point ( do you use the rudder for aiming at all?) it causes easily noticeable oscillations, spiced with precession from the rotating prop, which are practically unnoticeable in the old Spit or any other game plane.
The effect is that you sideslipping mostly as you shoot, making the bullets go where they want.
The people flying this game longer mostly use much more rudder than newer pilots, both in maneouvres or when aiming. Even if you shoot at 400 kmh where the damping is better, as you aim, you ll still be sideslipping enough to miss.

1) I do not know whether the Spit stabillity is reallistic in 4.10- and suspect not. You know it, good for you.
2) I certainly know your second sentence is not true.

If you cannot fly a hammerhead, you have one recipe here. And if you don't want to find out something, but only to prove yourself smart, you can do that without my involvement, either.

[SEE]

Originally Posted by PE_Tihi

........they mostly imagine the guy who they talking to to be 'ham-fisted',' needing a lower difficulty level' ...........

It is disappointing but there have been many sensible and well thought technical arguments regards 4.10. Is it confirmed that TD will tweak some aspects of the current Spit FM?

[PE_Tihi]

Originally Posted by SEE

It is disappointing but there have been many sensible and well thought technical arguments regards 4.10. Is it confirmed that TD will tweak some aspects of the current Spit FM?

I heard from more than one, they are going to apply noticeable changes to the Spit FM.
Cannot confirm that, of course.