Fresh stuff from sukhoi.ru (Discussion) - Page 179

philip.ed · #**1781** 06-07-2012, 04:31 PM

I think producing complicated models will be a lot trickier.

But don't think this will put off potential modders. If they can still create external models, which lack the internal details which may not ever be seen, but still look awesome to the everyday user, people will still happily use them.

And I probably would too. Just like I downloaded the first modded Spit mark 1 when it came out. At the time it was better than nothing.

robtek · #**1782** 06-07-2012, 06:39 PM

The "better than nothing"-approach misfired for 1c/MG big time.

The regular paying customer wants it all and the glacing directly from the beginning.

furbs · #**1783** 06-07-2012, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robtek

The "better than nothing"-approach misfired for 1c/MG big time.

The regular paying customer wants it all and the glacing directly from the beginning.

Not quite, a sim that's not still in alpha after 15 months after release would be a start.

Chivas · #**1784** 06-07-2012, 08:15 PM

The developer never did say exactly when they decided too go with DX instead of OpenGL, but they did say they changed the terrain to incorporate SpeedTree, because the original trees stopped the fps cold. Some people have said the original BOB was going to use the original engine, but thats not the case. BOB was always going to be built on a new game engine as the old engine wasn't capable of doing the things they wanted to accomplish. We never did find out for years if the new engine was going to be OpenGL or DX.

philip.ed · #**1785** 06-07-2012, 08:20 PM

No, the version shown in the Mystic-Puma video was using Open-GL. This was scrapped and a new engine built (as this was using Il-2 engine)

Chivas · #**1786** 06-07-2012, 08:22 PM

We definitely won't be seeing modders build the complex new aircraft models very quickly if at all. I wouldn't mind seeing high quality aircraft like the Lancaster as payware from the developer or 3rd parties. Although I would prefer the developer did it or got paid a decent licencing fee from the 3rd party payware.

Chivas · #**1787** 06-07-2012, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philip.ed

No, the version shown in the Mystic-Puma video was using Open-GL. This was scrapped and a new engine built (as this was using Il-2 engine)

I don't think so, that was rumour started by the forums, not something the developers ever said.

philip.ed · #**1788** 06-07-2012, 10:04 PM

I'm sorry to disagree with you, but I think you are confused.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthr...pen#post113731

The first version (in the DVD video which accompanied 1946) was made on an Open-GL engine, based on Il-2. They then scrapped this and started from fresh.

Oleg himself said:

We initially wanted to make Battle of Britain on the Il-2 engine. However that would be the last thing we could do with it. And then what? The engine was beginning to show its age by that time, despite many revolutionary features which Il-2 brought to the genre in 2001, and which many developers have tried to replicate since. By 2005 we’ve finally realized that we had to build a new engine. First only one person worked on it, then two, all while continuing to work on Il-2 as well. We’ve really switched over to BoB only after all work on Il-2 was completed, i.e. in 2007. So BoB’s only been in development for 2 years now.

But don't let this fool you into thinking the change had happened by 2005. It was most likely 2007 when they scrapped the first build, which was the video we saw on the Il-2 DVD (hence the similarities between the two).

I just had to add this as well (completely unrelated) from the same 2009 interview with Oleg:

Q: Oleg, we have some intel that the next add-on after BoB will be the Mediterranean. Can you let us know how soon that’ll be released? And another even more important question: how soon after BoB can we expect the Eastern Front again, and what are you planning for it?

A: Your intel is nothing but a rumor. Even I myself don’t know whether it’ll be Africa or something else. Everything depends on the success of BoB on the market. Of course, no one has done a comprehensive MTO sim, save for a few unfinished or unsuccessful attempts. Eastern Front or the Pacific will perhaps be the most difficult to develop out of all options. So you should probably not expect to fly Soviet planes immediately after BoB.

Also this:

Q: Let’s go back to BoB maps once again. This is a very exciting topic. How will they be different from Il-2 maps?

A: First of all, they will be more detailed. This means all sorts of small details you will notice in flight, with terrain, buildings, roads, etc. Not exactly on topic of maps, but we’ll also have moving grass. Secondly, we will have dynamic weather. This is actually on topic of maps. Even though the weather is handled by a separate weather module, it’ll be tied into the gameplay maps and affected by topography. Thirdly, we’ll have more detailed coastlines. We’ll now have cliffs, not just flat painted textures, but with real elevation. Next, our roads will have smooth curves of various profiles, which will immediately make the terrain look more realistic. In conjunction with new photorealistic textures, new technologies, new light and shading, all of the above will work together to create something that from the air looks really, really close to reality.

I think this is where the doomed 'promises' arose from. He wasn't far wrong, though. It will get there.

ACE-OF-ACES · #**1789** 06-07-2012, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philip.ed

Oleg himself said:

We initially wanted to make Battle of Britain on the Il-2 engine. However that would be the last thing we could do with it. And then what? The engine was beginning to show its age by that time, despite many revolutionary features which Il-2 brought to the genre in 2001, and which many developers have tried to replicate since. By 2005 we’ve finally realized that we had to build a new engine. First only one person worked on it, then two, all while continuing to work on Il-2 as well. We’ve really switched over to BoB only after all work on Il-2 was completed, i.e. in 2007. So BoB’s only been in development for 2 years now.

Oleg must have been confused when he said that in 03-04-2009..

Becuase that means CoD was only under dev for 4 years before it was released..

5 years if you count the time they have been working on it since it's release..

But..

There are several forum members here stating that CoD has been under dev for 8+ years before it was released!

9 if you count the year they have been working on it since it's release

And god knows they know better than Oleg!

Chivas · #**1790** 06-07-2012, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philip.ed

I'm sorry to disagree with you, but I think you are confused.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthr...pen#post113731

The first version (in the DVD video which accompanied 1946) was made on an Open-GL engine, based on Il-2. They then scrapped this and started from fresh.

Oleg himself said:

We initially wanted to make Battle of Britain on the Il-2 engine. However that would be the last thing we could do with it. And then what? The engine was beginning to show its age by that time, despite many revolutionary features which Il-2 brought to the genre in 2001, and which many developers have tried to replicate since. By 2005 we’ve finally realized that we had to build a new engine. First only one person worked on it, then two, all while continuing to work on Il-2 as well. We’ve really switched over to BoB only after all work on Il-2 was completed, i.e. in 2007. So BoB’s only been in development for 2 years now.

But don't let this fool you into thinking the change had happened by 2005. It was most likely 2007 when they scrapped the first build, which was the video we saw on the Il-2 DVD (hence the similarities between the two).

I just had to add this as well (completely unrelated) from the same 2009 interview with Oleg:

Q: Oleg, we have some intel that the next add-on after BoB will be the Mediterranean. Can you let us know how soon that’ll be released? And another even more important question: how soon after BoB can we expect the Eastern Front again, and what are you planning for it?

A: Your intel is nothing but a rumor. Even I myself don’t know whether it’ll be Africa or something else. Everything depends on the success of BoB on the market. Of course, no one has done a comprehensive MTO sim, save for a few unfinished or unsuccessful attempts. Eastern Front or the Pacific will perhaps be the most difficult to develop out of all options. So you should probably not expect to fly Soviet planes immediately after BoB.

Also this:

Q: Let’s go back to BoB maps once again. This is a very exciting topic. How will they be different from Il-2 maps?

A: First of all, they will be more detailed. This means all sorts of small details you will notice in flight, with terrain, buildings, roads, etc. Not exactly on topic of maps, but we’ll also have moving grass. Secondly, we will have dynamic weather. This is actually on topic of maps. Even though the weather is handled by a separate weather module, it’ll be tied into the gameplay maps and affected by topography. Thirdly, we’ll have more detailed coastlines. We’ll now have cliffs, not just flat painted textures, but with real elevation. Next, our roads will have smooth curves of various profiles, which will immediately make the terrain look more realistic. In conjunction with new photorealistic textures, new technologies, new light and shading, all of the above will work together to create something that from the air looks really, really close to reality.

I think this is where the doomed 'promises' arose from. He wasn't far wrong, though. It will get there.

Yes I know remember the quote of the opengl, DX debate. Oleg first annouced BOB in 2003/2004 for a release at the end of 2005, which I thought he said they would use a new 3d engine. I couldn't find Olegs quotes from that time period, but there was some Oleg quotes in May 2005 which mention the new 3D engine.

------------------------------------------
Tom: The Battle of Britain has been rendered either in whole or as part of quite a few games from CFS1 to EAW to Rowan's and Shockwave / GMX's Battle of Britain. In the IL-2 series you never really concentrated on this aerial battle. What compelled you to look at this battle in particular?

Oleg: In IL-2 series we didn't model it because we were planning to get new 3D engine and new fundamental features before to begin this process. In IL-2 series is too hard to model Cliffs of Dover looking real. As you know me, I like to get such things always looking well and natural.
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http://www.simhq.com/_air6/air_220a.html
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Other SimHQ interviews with Oleg Maddox see bottom of last page.

http://www.simhq.com/_air11/air_341e.html

Quote---------------
But don't let this fool you into thinking the change had happened by 2005. It was most likely 2007 when they scrapped the first build, which was the video we saw on the Il-2 DVD (hence the similarities between the two).
End Quote-------------

You are probably right they thought about building the sim on the old engine in 2004/2005 as we know now they couldn't have built a new game engine for BOBs release by the end of 2005. That said I think they were building the new game engine long before 2007, but the changes you see could be the change to Speedtree, or they were still using the old game engine to build aspects of the sim until the new game engine was more usable.