Inaccurate performance data for BOB fighters in COD comparing to RL data

[Osprey]

What exactly would make you happy Kurfurst?

[TomcatViP]

A 100° British lager ?

[Kurfürst]

Originally Posted by Osprey

What exactly would make you happy Kurfurst?

How about even a decision or plan after the spring of 1940 (when this paper states that select squadrons are to be issued with 100 octane, so we can know for quite certain that at this point, it was meant for some and not all) that all Fighter Squadrons are to switch over to 100 octane? Even a plan, a draft..? Apparently, people who have been quite desperate to find such evidence for years could find none, even though I am quite sure they looked under every rock and grow rather frustrated in the process.

I am quite certain that if the British took such pain to note and discuss at such high levels that some Squadrons will use 100 octane from - was it March? - there should be ample discussion and record about extending the avgas issues to other Squadrons.

The lack of such evidence makes it quite likely that such sudden, overnight changeover simply didn't happen until after the Battle.

[Kurfürst]

Originally Posted by TomcatViP

A 100° British lager ?

The suggestion is worthwhile for further consideration.. and an experimenting with.

[Al Schlageter]

This is in line with Pips summary of the Australian paper, which notes that Fighter Command only switched completely over to 100 octane in the late automn 1940.

LOL, this mysterious paper that only one person has ever seen.

So tell me Barbi, which fighter squadrons that were based on airfields on the CloD map were only using 87 octane fuel.

[Kurfürst]

Originally Posted by Al Schlageter

So tell me Barbi, which fighter squadrons that were based on airfields on the CloD map were only using 87 octane fuel.

Well I guess http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showpos...8&postcount=43 already covered that question.

"Based on the current evidence (feel free to add new sources showing 100 octane at the said airfield during the Battle and I'll update the list) shows that 100 octane aviation spirit was supplied to

8 out of 19 Sector Airfields
9 out of 32 Fighter Airfields (however 7 of the 32 functioning as satellite airfield for rotation etc., with no Sqn permanently based there)."

Which follows that appearantly 11 Sector Airfields and 23 Fighter airfields show no evidence at all that they have been supplied by anything else but the standard 87 octane. Of course even in the rest of the airfields its rather difficult to find out from what time is there any evidence to 100 octane fuel supply - for some airfields we have for example combat reports from October 1940, and they may or may not have been supplied with 100 octane earlier.

In 11 Group, 87 octane airfields apparently include, at the current level of evidence

RAF Debden.

RAF Debden was home to the Debden Sector Operations Room and Staff, and the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 85 Squadron from 22 May 1940
No 17 Squadron from 19 June 1940
No 257 Squadron from 15 August 1940
No 601 Squadron from 19 August 1940
No 111 Squadron from 19 August 1940
No 17 Squadron from 2 September 1940
No 25 Squadron from 8 October 1940

RAF Detling.

Detling was one of the 11 Group satellite airfields used by units on a day-to-day basis as required, often flights or squadrons would detach to such an airfield in the morning and return to their main operating and maintenance base in the evening.

RAF Eastchurch.

RAF Eastchurch was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 266 Squadron from 12 August 1940

RAF Ford.

RAF Ford was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 23 Squadron from 12 September 1940

RAF Gosport.

Gosport was, along with Lee-on-Solent, one of the Royal Navy's airfields used in the defence of Southampton and Portsmouth. Royal Navy fighters were permanently based there, and occasionally RAF units were detached, using the airfield in the same way as a satellite or relief landing ground.

RAF Hendon.

RAF Hendon was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 257 Squadron from 17 May 1940
No 504 Squadron from 5 September 1940

RAF Lee on Solent.

Lee on Solent was, along with Gosport, one of the Royal Navy's airfields used in the defence of Southampton and Portsmouth. Royal Navy fighters were permanently based there, and occasionally RAF units were detached, using the airfield in the same way as a satellite or relief landing ground.

RAF Lympne.

Lympne was one of the 11 Group satellite airfields used by units on a day-to-day basis as required, often flights or squadrons would detach to such an airfield in the morning and return to their main operating and maintenance base in the evening. Due to the extreme forward position of this site it was under constant threat of attack and was not permanently manned during the Battle by any one Squadron.

RAF Manston.

RAF Manston was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 604 Squadron from 15 May 1940
No 600 Squadron from 20 June 1940

RAF Martlesham.

RAF Martlesham was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 25 Squadron from 19 June 1940
No 257 Squadron from 5 September 1940
No 17 Squadron from 8 October 1940

RAF Stapleford.

RAF Stapleford was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 151 Squadron from 29 August 1940
No 46 Squadron from 1 September 1940

RAF Thorney Island.

RAF Thorney Island was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 236 Squadron from 4 July 1940


RAF West Malling.

RAF West Malling was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 141 Squadron from 12 July 1940
No 66 Squadron from 30 October 1940


In 10 Group, 87 octane airfields apparently include, at the current level of evidence>

RAF Filton.

RAF Filton was home to the Filton Sector Operations Room and Staff, and the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 504 Squadron from 26 September 1940


RAF Boscombe Down.

RAF Boscombe Down was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 249 Squadron from 14 August 1940
No 56 Squadron from 1 September 1940

RAF Colerne.

RAF Colerne was used as a satellite and relief airfield for Middle Wallop during the Battle, units rotated in and out of the station on a daily basis.

RAF Exeter.

RAF Exeter was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 213 Squadron from 18 June 1940
No 87 Squadron from 5 July 1940
No 601 Squadron from 7 September 1940

RAF Pembrey.

RAF Pembrey was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 92 Squadron from 18 June 1940
No 79 Squadron from 8 September 1940

RAF Roborough.

RAF Roborough was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 247 Squadron from 1 August 1940

RAF St Eval.

RAF St Eval was home to the following Squadrons during the Battle:

No 222 Squadron from 18 June 1940
No 236 Squadron from 8 August 1940
No 238 Squadron from 14 August 1940
No 222 Squadron from 11 September 1940

[Al Schlageter]

I see you didn't update.

11 Group

RAF Detling
No. 85 Squadron May 1940

RAF Ford
23 Squadron flew the Bristol Blenheim which you yourself said used 100 octane fuel

RAF Manston
600 (City of London) Squadron - Bristol Blenheim and Bristol Beaufighter
604 (County of Middlesex) Squadron - Bristol Blenheim and Bristol Beaufighter

RAF Martlesham
25 Squadron - Bristol Blenheim and Bristol Beaufighter
17 Squadron May 1940

RAF Stapleford
56 (Punjab) Squadron May 1940

RAF Thorney Island
236 Squadron - Bristol Blenheim

RAF West Malling
66 Squadron 6 Sept 1940

12 and 13 Groups are irrelevant.

[Al Schlageter]

10 Group

RAF Boscombe Down
249 (Gold Coast) Squadron 6 Sept 1940
56 (Punjab) Squadron May 1940

RAF Exeter (not on the CloD map)
87 (United Provinces) Squadron May 1940

RAF Pembrey (not on the CloD map)
92 (East India) Squadron pre BoB
79 (Madras Presidency) Squadron May 1940

RAF St Eval (not on the CloD map)
236 Squadron - Bristol Blenheim

[Osprey]

Originally Posted by Kurfürst

How about even a decision or plan after the spring of 1940 (when this paper states that select squadrons are to be issued with 100 octane, so we can know for quite certain that at this point, it was meant for some and not all) that all Fighter Squadrons are to switch over to 100 octane? Even a plan, a draft..? Apparently, people who have been quite desperate to find such evidence for years could find none, even though I am quite sure they looked under every rock and grow rather frustrated in the process.

I am quite certain that if the British took such pain to note and discuss at such high levels that some Squadrons will use 100 octane from - was it March? - there should be ample discussion and record about extending the avgas issues to other Squadrons.

The lack of such evidence makes it quite likely that such sudden, overnight changeover simply didn't happen until after the Battle.

No Kurfurst. You are not even an honest man. What would make you happy is if everyone agreed with your rhetoric wholeheartedly, that 100 octane was never used. This way you could be a bigger ace online.
Over time you have been forced into changing that view to admit it was used by at least some, but that is a battle lost as part of a wider war.

Let me put this other prosecutive angle on your theory for you (I made up a new word). You believe in the 109, you see it as superior and dislike the thought that it was matched, or worse, bettered. So you seek to discredit your foe as much as you can and display an enormous bias to the impartial viewer. Let us say that you are wholly correct and the 109 was as superior as you make out - in that case can you explain how the Luftwaffe was so decisively beaten? I can draw a conclusion given the superiority of the 109 in your world that the Luftwaffe pilots must've been rubbish. It can't be tactics, the RAF were hugely outnumbered and only had 300 Spitfires out of the 900 fighters, and the tactics only changed when Goering started to panic.

So what is your agenda? Are you just a bad virtual pilot or something?

[41Sqn_Banks]

RAF Manston certainly had 100 octane fuel on 29th July 1940.

41 Squadron took off from Manston of on this day and one of it's pilots used 12 boost during this sortie.

http://www.oldrafrecords.com/records/424/4240182.gif
http://www.oldrafrecords.com/records/424/4240191.gif
http://www.oldrafrecords.com/records/424/4240192.gif

http://www.spitfireperformance.com/Webster-29july40.jpg