Super AI

[leadgtr81]

Luthier & Co,

First, thanks for all the hard work in getting this sim to the level it's currently at, and continuing to press on. It's nice being able to cruise around on my humble system and enjoy what the team has done thus far. However, there seem to be some outstanding issues that need addressed. For offliners like myself, it's the AI that presents an issue.

Before the latest patch, it was AI aircraft that were able to perform to the fullest with dropped landing gear, missing control surfaces, fires, large holes, leaking fluids, etc. I know I'm not the only one who's frustrated by this, especially when that heavily damaged AI is able to outmaneuver the player's undamaged and well-managed aircraft at nearly every turn. There's also the unfair boost that the AI seemed to possess. Even bombers were able to outrun & outfly a nimble fighter.

It seems that with the latest patch, the AI opponents have become increasingly superhuman while exhibiting the previous issues. Roll rates on the AI aircraft are insane. It's what I'd expect from a more modern fighter jet, but not from a WWII era prop aircraft - especially since it's seemingly impossible for the player to perform the same maneuvers without serious consequences. Other things I've noted from the AI as of the recent patch:

Problem Notes:

-Consistently climbs and/or performs multiple rolls without energy loss.
-Not subjected to blackouts.
-No evidence of overheating.
-Incredible roll rate at exceedingly high dive speeds.
-Sometimes completely unresponsive even to a long burst of gunfire into direct 6.
-Able to maneuver with dropped gear, missing surfaces, large holes, etc. as though they were undamaged. (Perhaps a case of damage model effects visibly showing, but not working in practice?)
-While aircraft fires work as advertised and damages the aircraft, the AI seems to not notice even large fires and will fight on.
-Same with billowing smoke.
-Fluids seem finite, as I've watched leaking fluids "run out". But AI aircraft are seemingly unaffected in this patch. (Watched AI engines seize up several times in earlier versions)
-Cr.42 continued to fly on after losing entire top wing surface (Old screenshot, likely first beta patch. Have not since been able to reproduce the same damage. All settings on sans CEM & had enabled icons at that time.)

Positive Notes:

-During a QMB engagement (current patch) with a Cr.42, my incendiary rounds managed to light his lower wing on fire. The pilot bailed after leveling out his aircraft.
-Same engagement, witnessed a Cr.42 maneuver too hard and stall. Spiraled 90 degrees nose-down into the channel.

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That's just what I can think of directly off the top of my head. I'm sure that others will continue the list, as will I as more things come to mind.

While I know your plates are full as it is, I hope you're working on the AI issues so that the offliners are able to fully enjoy the sim as well.

Thanks for reading.

[ElAurens]

Very much the old AI routines from IL2.

I wonder if the 109 will spiral climb to sub orbital altitude, then pull it's nose almost straight up and accelerate as well?

Since online is pretty much a non starter I have been forced to play offline much more than normal. I don't see how you guys live with those AI as your only opponents.

It's awful.

[Orpheus]

Supporting this, I've seen some truly outrageous flying by the AI, in particular the roll rate.

[smink1701]

Agree 100 percent. The AI is on steroids. It would be great to have a slider or somthing to lower thier skill level.

[leadgtr81]

Originally Posted by smink1701

Agree 100 percent. The AI is on steroids. It would be great to have a slider or somthing to lower thier skill level.

There is in the FMB. I haven't actually seen too much of a difference, but I'm in the process of testing out various AI slider settings within FMB. If there's any sort of a difference, I'll be sure and share the news.

[baronWastelan]

I want to believe the AI doesn't cheat. Let the devs post up a track showing a human in a Spitfire at 24,000 feet dog-fighting some 109's to put all these allegations to rest once and for all. Without air-start.

[snwkill]

Definitely a +1...

It seems to me the damage is way under-done as far as physical effects on opponent aircraft. I can maybe understand being able to pump some extra rounds in a fuselage, but when you unload your whole arsenal on the engines and it still keeps on chugging along. Seems a bit wacky.

[flyboy4612]

+1 I had an He-111 roll quicker than my Spitfire. I was just in a fight in a 109 against a Hurricane and the AI plane's flaps were deploying and retracting as quickly as the ailerons and elevator were moving. The Hurricane also seemed to have an awesome amount of thrust at certain points and leave me in the dust. And all the AI fighters do the old IL-2 barrel roll in a downward spiral.

[Blue Scorpion]

Sounds like they did go with the IL2 ai model after all, in which case this arcade rubbish is headed for the dustbin. I got sick and tired of this absurd notion of boosting ai performance to cover deficient ai routines in the earlier versions of the series.

There really is no good reason for it, we all know and accept the ai will never be as good as a competent human pilot, which is why players turn to multiplayer when they want that level of challenge. However, single player offers a more structured environment in which to play through specific scenarios, mimicking situations that occurred at the time, which generally would not work well in multiplayer.

Moreover, the number of aircraft involved in the typical single player melee, negate many ai deficiencies through weight of numbers, and the ever changing situation in a three dimensional environment, removing any need for this asinine boosting of performance. The approach of artificially boosting performance and removing physical restrictions from the ai, results in nothing but a farce, and combat situations that never happened in reality, destroying any notion that this title can be considered a simulation of the period's air war.

[reflected]

Agreed. It's the same old shitty barrel rolling über AI from Il2...even more über - in regards of cheating physics. Not so good in regards of flying abilities.