The P-51 B (Mustang Mk.III if you prefer) has been acurrately modeled?

[Mr.Blonde]

First of all I don't know if this has been discused, but I couldn't find it searching the forum, so here I go.

I think the 3d mesh of the Mustang B (the one used by the RAF at the game in the sicilian campaign) in the game is not completely acurrate. I don't know if this is 100% correct, but I always thought that no Merlin powered mustang had that small scoop at the engine hood. As far as I know, that little air intake was for the Allison carburetor used in the P-51A (The Allison powered Tomahawks have this scoop as well), so a P-51B shouldn't have this at the top of the nose, am I wrong?

Besides, I realised that the plane's guns are quite long, so long that the gun barrels extend beyond the leading edge. The P-51D had six 0.50 (12.7mm) machine guns and had no problems with the gun lenght (100% located inside the wing). All the pics I've found of P-51B had the guns instaled like the P-51D, but I found pictures of Mustangs with gun barrels exceding the wing, although these were pictures of P-51A (Mustang Ia for the RAF, the first Mustangs received by the brittons), which were equiped with 20mm cannons instead.


Notice the scoop and the cannons in this early Allison powered Mustang (oddly enough, with USAAC markings)


I know it's nothing serious, but I want to confirm if some P-51 with these features existed or it's reasonable to think that there has been some confusion between Mustangs.

[Swagger7]

Originally Posted by Mr.Blonde

First of all I don't know if this has been discused, but I couldn't find it searching the forum, so here I go.

I think the 3d mesh of the Mustang B (the one used by the RAF at the game in the sicilian campaign) in the game is not completely acurrate. I don't know if this is 100% correct, but I always thought that no Merlin powered mustang had that small scoop at the engine hood. As far as I know, that little air intake was for the Allison carburetor used in the P-51A (The Allison powered Tomahawks have this scoop as well), so a P-51B shouldn't have this at the top of the nose, am I wrong?

Besides, I realised that the plane's guns are quite long, so long that the gun barrels extend beyond the leading edge. The P-51D had six 0.50 (12.7mm) machine guns and had no problems with the gun lenght (100% located inside the wing). All the pics I've found of P-51B had the guns instaled like the P-51D, but I found pictures of Mustangs with gun barrels exceding the wing, although these were pictures of P-51A (Mustang Ia for the RAF, the first Mustangs received by the brittons), which were equiped with 20mm cannons instead.


Notice the scoop and the cannons in this early Allison powered Mustang (oddly enough, with USAAC markings)


I know it's nothing serious, but I want to confirm if some P-51 with these features existed or it's reasonable to think that there has been some confusion between Mustangs.

I think you're right. The game model is an Allison engined P-51A with 4 20mm guns (hence the large size), but they gave it the performance & armament of a P-51B for some reason.

Here's another pic of the P-51A, by the way. You can see the cannons better:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File-51A.jpg

Edit: It replaced part of the file name with a frikkin smiley! Just go to the main P-51 article here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-51_Mustang

and scroll down a little.

[sir70]

It's a P51-A/Mustang II
Allison engine, 3 blade prop, 4 .50 cal guns(the wings on the A model were too thin to fit the guns inside, D's were redsigned).

Both Mustang I and IA were just P-51 to the U.S.


source, mybigcoffeetablebookofalltheworldsaeroplanes1945/6

[mondo]

The P51 with the 20mm's from the wings is the A36 Apache. The RAF called it the 1A.

The Mustang MkIII is the RAF's designation for the P51C. The Mustang MKIII's used a different fuel from the P51C and had higher performance due to this.

[Vierzinger]

Sources:
"P-51 Mustang"
- William Newby Grant
"The Encyclopedia of Aircraft of WWIII"
- Paul Eden

First of all. The mustang on your picture are a P-51-NA, Allison engine and with 4x20mm. The US ordered "...150 Mustang IAs with their quadruple 20mm M-2 cannons as P-51-NAs in September 1941,...." - William Newby Grant
I guess that explains the US markings on a british model.

Same as the British Mk. IA.
BTW, the early IA had 2x.50in in each wing and .3in two mounted below the engine.

The A-36A "Apache"
did not have 20mm cannons but two .5in MG in each wing.
The where Allison engined as well.

But the real question are the difference in IL-2, between the Mustang Mk. III and the P-51 B/C models.

First of all, the B/C does not differ.
It is a stupid american distinguishing between the plane build on different factories. It was later changed.

In the game, the "C" version have a british Malcom hood. This was not standard. But a retrofit which only happende at some USAF sqd based in England. If the maintenace crews could get it from the british.

The Mustang Mk. III and the P-51C should be identical in the game. Both are merlin engined, but I think I have read somewhere that the Mk.III are a suped up (tuned) version.
Which is historical but where only done if they sqd's in question was assigned to intercept V-1 rockets (cruisemissiles).

[David603]

Mustang Mk.III is just an RAF version of the P-51B/C. However the RAF converted some Mk.III's to run on 150 octane fuel (normal was 130 octane fuel), which gave a sea level top speed of 390mph (compared to 360mph normal). Speed at altitude remains similar but the boosted 'Stangs were very successful in RAF sevice, both in shooting down V-1s and also intercepting low level raiders, and once the V-1 threat had been resolved they were very successful against other German aircraft.

The Mustang Mk.III in Il2 1946 is the 150 octane version.

Other aircraft to benefit from 150 octane fuel improving their low altitude performance were the Spitfire IX/XVI(335-358mph at sea level), the Griffon engined Spitfire XIV(359-366mph), and the Tempest V(372-386mph).

[Robotic Pope]

ZOMBIE THREAD!



Vierzinger, this thread was about the console game IL2: Birds of prey. not il2 1946. Mustang mkIa was mistakenly named P51B and given the wrong guns in BoP, this was corrected in the PC version: Wings of Prey.

There is no real P51B, P51C or Mustang III in BoP or WoP.

[bobbysocks]

and to me...DEVELOPERS ( although i know you could give a rats @$$ what i think and know you gave up on this issue ) is the biggest disappointment in this game. yeah i know...how many times can we dead (pope's ZOMBIE) horse AGAIN! the planes that should have been in the top 80 to 100% performancewise...are total POS. they should have been on par with 109s any alt...( the 51s & 190s) less than a spit at low alt (my dad bounced a spit coming home over dover at low alt...got his ass handed to him )...the 190 ( any version) is totally sad, the Ta152, a crime....it should have been king $#!T to beat....that one would have been a true pilots duel in a 51 or a later spit (in the eto). guys...i dont want to hear how YOU can fly these planes and make them work....the point it ANYONE should be able to fly them and have an equal or better chance....another futile rant....sorry!