calm down

[FS~looksharp]

as the above title says... calm down...

only a short sighted fool would not see that even in its presant state this sim is and will continue to be the best flight sim on the market...

lets just give the devs all the time they need to make this sim into what we all know its capable of being....

i certainly understand the distress of my fellow pilots, im also chomping at the bit to have the next patch out.... god knows how many times ive chased ghost bombers about in ATAGs server.

as its a forum ive obviously left myself open here for nasty remarks by posting this, but so wot... lets just be a little more laid back

[Volksieg]

I think 10 years ago I would have agreed with you.... but in the current economic climate it is a matter of sink or swim and, let's face it, at this rate it is glug glug glug all the way.

I am getting to the stage where I honestly think they should just release the SDK, forget any silly ideas about sequels and let the modding community have free reign! Let's not forget that IL2 1946, for all its initial brilliance, is only really as loved as it is, to this day, due to the great work of Team Daidalos and the modders behind UP and HSFX!

I don't mean any offence to B6 who is our main representative from the dev team on this forum.... (I've been there, B6! Nothing worse than being the public face of a company having, justifiably furious, customers screaming in your face all day.)... but I have lost ALL faith in the developers. I understand that software development is a difficult profession and I get that unforeseen circumstances can jump up at any moment.... but the nature and tone of updates just come across as having the same credibility as a Nigerian Email scam.

If they prove me wrong then great! I want to be proven wrong! I really do! I just have zero belief that I will be, unfortunately, and I know I'm not alone in feeling that way.

People can have a go, defend the devs, get all shirty as much as they please but that doesn't help anything either way as, when all is said and done, the people complaining aren't just trolls... they are paying customers who just want to get their money's worth be they DX9 users (Spit! Spit! lol), medium range machine owners, minimum requirements chaps or monstrous megacomputer more money than sense obsessives.

I do support your call for calm, mind... not because I see a glimmer of hope but, simply, because there are far more important things out there to get an aneurysm over.... wish I had a crystal ball, mind, as in hindsight I can think of a fair few things I would have spent my money on instead of this farce.

I've had fun on CloD and I am sure I shall have more fun if there is even just a small fix to make it as flyable as it was before the recent beta (Yeah.. I know! roll back! ....... and not be able to fly on the same servers as my squad!) but is that down to 1C? Not in the slightest! It is down to flying with some of the friendliest chaps on the interwebs.

Meanwhile, HSFX 6.0 is downloading.....

(Shout out to the "Mighty if 1C would let them be" JG26 and Osprey's bunch who, for some insane reason, resist the temptation that is the Luftwaffe and insist on flying those hellish Spitfires. lol)

[robtek]

I find this dreaming and the blind faith in the ability of anonymous modders very harebrained.

95% of the mods for the old IL2 were sub-standard, the level for il2-cod is a few steps higher.

The possibility of free mods for IL2-CoD in the level of MG quality is nil.

One should give MG the time to do it right, either they can fix it and most will be happy, or they drop the ball and the immense sum of about 70€ max. must be written of as false investment, which would be sad for all wwii-cfs fans.

[Volksieg]

Originally Posted by robtek

The possibility of free mods for IL2-CoD in the level of MG quality is nil.

THANK THE GODS! My 'harebrained' future kinda involves mods that make the game work properly, not crash to desktop constantly, mention loads of features that vanish all of a sudden and stutter all over the place.

Anyway.. who said anything about anonymous modders? I seem to remember mentioning at least three teams in the above post... one of which are now officially sanctioned as patchers and the other two are much beloved of the simming community. There are also countless games out there that were abandoned as an absolute mess and saved by the modding community.

[robtek]

Originally Posted by Volksieg

THANK THE GODS! My 'harebrained' future kinda involves mods that make the game work properly, not crash to desktop constantly, mention loads of features that vanish all of a sudden and stutter all over the place.

Anyway.. who said anything about anonymous modders? I seem to remember mentioning at least three teams in the above post... one of which are now officially sanctioned as patchers and the other two are much beloved of the simming community. There are also countless games out there that were abandoned as an absolute mess and saved by the modding community.

Do you really believe, that someone not intimately involved with the software, is able to fixe the core-code (crash to desktop), the net-code (stutters) and develope a less demanding weather-system when not even the developers are able to this easily?

Of course there a well known teams, working successful on a more than 10 year old software, but the CoD software is a) new, b) different and c) more complex.

Also the SDK release is already announced, but that still leaves the higher complexity level as a hurdle before something worthwile will come from this direction.

Be it as it may, but please dont anybody gives the modders the same attitude MG is getting here, or there wont be any.

[ems9]

Off-Topic:There are a lot of people with a lot of skills in modding, programming and such.
Making new planes, I bet people will be able to make them to the level of CoD.

Now the community's fixing the game engine, I don't see much hope in that, a game engine is an extremely complicated software, that requires multiple knowledge's.

I don't know how many people the MG team have working on the game engine, but I bet is a fairly big number, and a community couldn't even get a close number working on it!
Let's say the team have 50 programmers working full time, and it takes 6 months to fix, in a community it would take 6 years with a lot of effort!

I don't blame MG's team or anything. They are building a game engine from scratch (This sentence means a LOT LOT LOT of work!)
The only thing I don't understand is in this forum what is the 1c's main forum, the most active forum section is the IL-2 CoD, the Friday update last week in 24hours had 10,000 views, and this forum have all the time 50, 100, 150 members active, and there is a tone load of people that don't even check this forum but care about the game!
What means this game it's still be best seller and the best odd of money investment.
In this kinda of situation, when you have a project that is profitable you should put all of your resources on it! Making the time line smaller, so you sell faster, you sell more, you make your customers happy and you make more money!
More man power = more programmers = less time of development = more costs
But at the end more = profit!
I bet if all the entities related with this project had made the right decisions, the IL-2 name series would never be damaged, and they wouldn't lost tones of costumers, like they did and keep doing!
For us people active on the forum and community's around IL-2 we just hang, watch (some cry and whine xD) and we wait.
But the new people, the new costumers, the ones that didn't even bough the game, now they will not buy it, because it's not prestigious game name anymore, and all world have a bad feedback of it! Their luck it's there is noone on the competition on this game market, because If some business man from microsoft or other big company figure out there is still a big profitable game market. Then 1C and MG's have a big problem.

So if you want or not, if you want a damn good combat flight simulator, you gotta wait! There is nothing else besides IL-2 1946 and IL-2 CoD...for now.

Back on topic:
^^ People need to chill! If you watch the clock every second you will get mad! Don't watch the clock and let the time fly! Nothing you can do! =)

[Flanker35M]

S!

Robtek, the quality of mods varied a lo which I agree with fully. But some surpassed MG work by far, they did what MG said "not possible" etc. And the FM's of Russian planes were done by copy paste by MG! I did some extensive work with them until gave the data someone else to work with as my time was too limited. So there is bad quality on both sides of the fence Anyways a good SDK, even a limited one would do a lot for CoD. Full SDK might be too far reaching to ask, but a limited one might be enough, for example ground elements etc. that require nothing complex...just some thoughts.

[Volksieg]

Originally Posted by robtek

Do you really believe, that someone not intimately involved with the software, is able to fixe the core-code (crash to desktop), the net-code (stutters) and develope a less demanding weather-system when not even the developers are able to this easily?

Fair point considering I'm not even sure anyone intimately involved with the software can do the job either.

Sometimes, though, an outsider can pull off things that those on the inside imagine impossible....

Clutching at straws? Maybe. Wish I didn't have to, mind.

[Volksieg]

Anyhoo.. all that stuff being said...

In many ways I admire 1C Maddox Games' sheer gumption for carrying on (If they actually are carrying on! As I've said there is doubt out there.).

I have noticed, over the time I've been on this forum, that some have said "At least we have this! It may not work but it will one day!" and I understand that attitude.... sometimes, when things are working ok-ish, I even share that view but, sometimes, I think the best thing they could have done (It's way too late now) is made an announcement along the lines of:

"We regret to inform you that, due to unforeseen circumstances, we have had to cancel Storm of War"

People would have kicked and screamed, moaned and complained for a couple of weeks and then got back to flying 1946....

....Meanwhile, they could have beavered away behind the scenes with no pressure whatsoever and, who knows? A few weeks from now? Maybe even months ago? BANG!

There you go, loyal fans! The simulator to end all simulators!

People would have been singing hosannahs from the rooftops.

[ems9]

Originally Posted by Volksieg

Anyhoo.. all that stuff being said...

In many ways I admire 1C Maddox Games' sheer gumption for carrying on (If they actually are carrying on! As I've said there is doubt out there.).

I have noticed, over the time I've been on this forum, that some have said "At least we have this! It may not work but it will one day!" and I understand that attitude.... sometimes, when things are working ok-ish, I even share that view but, sometimes, I think the best thing they could have done (It's way too late now) is made an announcement along the lines of:

"We regret to inform you that, due to unforeseen circumstances, we have had to cancel Storm of War"

People would have kicked and screamed, moaned and complained for a couple of weeks and then got back to flying 1946....

....Meanwhile, they could have beavered away behind the scenes with no pressure whatsoever and, who knows? A few weeks from now? Maybe even months ago? BANG!

There you go, loyal fans! The simulator to end all simulators!

People would have been singing hosannahs from the rooftops.

+1