Quote:
Originally Posted by JtD
BlackBerry, I think what you're saying about Tempest vs. P-51C is about right, even if your sources are vague and not always the right ones (you're quoting a comparison between Tempest and Typhoon, for instance). A direct test between the P-51C and the Tempest V revealed that the "Tempest tends to pull away" - which is a marginal advantage for the Tempest. You've tested a marginal advantage for the P-51.
Given the average accuracy of the flight models, which was aiming at a 5%, this is something that simply may happen between individual planes, it is no indication that the general algorithm is wrong.
Mach effects are modelled, not extensive enough for accurate high speed performance imho, but they are there.
The differences in initial acceleration between individual planes is there, if you fly them properly. Some of the acceleration differences you see as simple statements "this one is better" has a lot to do with engine management. If say an Fw 190 and a P-47 cruise side by side and then go into a full power dive, the guy in the 190 slams the throttle forward and off he goes, while the guy in the P-47 adjusts mixture, then rpm and then the throttle and then starts to accelerate. Gives the 190 a two second head start. But even without considering this, if you compare a 190A-4FR with a P-47D-22 at medium altitude in 4.11, you'll be getting something similar to the test you quoted.
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JTD, I'll make clear that I am not saying the il2 FM is wrong, on the contrary, I believe il2 is the best simulation of WII a/c, especially 4.11m has achieved "structute failure" at high G manoeuver. Well done Daidalos Team! And many of us just hope il2 go further to become PERFECT.
In il2 FM, the wing drag coeffiecent is a constant, since most a/c fly below 0.8 Mach, the result is very accurate. However, there is small flaw in high speed diving. See picture below:
1.JPG
Even the best prop diver---Tempest MKV can hardly reach 0.8 Mach in diving----maximum permissible airspeeds 540m.p.h. IAS below 10000 ft, but the airsrew==a twisted and rotating "wing" could exceed 0.8 Mach with its "tip" in a high speed dive.
As long as we could simulate "the balance of propeller power", il2 will be nearly perfect. Don't forget those exhaust tubes just behind airscrew! Exhaust boost!
IMG_0830.jpg
In WWII, US had NACA-16 series airfoil(eg. 4-blade Hamilton), UK had ARA-D airfoil, German had Gottingen airfoil.
I just suspect that those engineers of Hamilton or Rotol intently designed very big 4-blade airscrews in order to optimise high mach performance at high speed.
P51D----Hamilton Standard, four-blade, hydraulic, constant speed, 11 feet 2 inches, non-feathering
Bf109----The propeller is a V.D.M.9 - 12087. Three bladed metal constant-speed with electric pitch change, hand controlled or automatic. Diam. 9' 10" Max. blade width 11 5/8".
Tempest MKV----All versions of the Sabre drove four-bladed, 14 ft (4.267 m) diameter de Havilland Hydromatic or Rotol propellers.
Fw190A9----Three types of propeller were authorised for use on the A-9: the VDM 9-112176A wooden propeller, 3.5 m (11 ft 6 in) in diameter, was the preferred option, however, many A-9s were fitted with the standard VDM 9-12067A metal propeller and some had a VDM 9-12153A metal propeller with external, bolt on balance weights.
P47D----The P-47D-16, D-20, D-22 and D-23 were similar to the P-47D-15 with minor improvements in the fuel system, engine subsystems, a jettisonable canopy, and a bulletproof windshield. Beginning with the block 22 aircraft, the original narrow-chorded Curtiss propeller was replaced by propellers with larger blades, the Evansville plant switching to a new Curtiss propeller with a diameter of 13 ft (3.96 m) and the Long Island plant using a Hamilton Standard propeller with a diameter of 13 ft 2 in (4.01 m). With the bigger propellers having barely 6 in (152 mm) of ground clearance, Thunderbolt pilots had to learn to be careful on takeoffs to keep the tail down until they obtained adequate ground clearance, and on landings to flare the aircraft properly.
Last but not least, I believe the high-speed dive and zoom advantage of P51P47Tempest is their most important tactic in combat, and is the most amazing aspect of their flight characters.
If they can outzoom from high-speed against opponent for 300 metres higher; if they can outdive rival for more kinetic energy(sth. equals to 300 metres Potential Energy ). What will happen?
As we all known, Bf109s are very good at climbing(low speed,max climb), usually, in low-medium altitude, Bf109 has 1000ft/minute climbing advantage to their opponents.
Bf109's Energy fight: When finding enemy at rear, same energy, 700-800m away , 109 will probably climb, after 2 minutes(Be patient! Be careful about the 3rd one!), 109 will establish 600 meters higher advantage over the opponent who follows the 109. And then, 109 will fight back by using this 600 meters "extra" energy. This kind of story takes place again and again and again in most il2 servers.
P51P47Tempest could also "E-fight" in different style: diving and zooming. If a P51 find a 109 at rear, same energy, 700-800m away, P51 can dive to 650km/h IAS ( by split S), if 109 follows, he will find P51 is gaining on him, that is, P51 is quite faster than him, and the distant between them has been enlarged to 1000 m, and then, P51 will zoom at 60 degree (Be patient! Be careful about the 3rd one!), of course 109 will cut the coner, but P51 has zoom advantage so that 109 could not get close to shooting range during zooming period. Roughly P51 will find himself 600 m higher than 109, and this is the time to fight back.
1v1 is quite funny, teamwork of E-fighting will be more attractive, believe it or not. If you have some advantage, be good at using it, don't waste it, don't spoil it, be patient.