Thread: Spit1a > SpitII
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Old 05-29-2011, 02:04 PM
winny winny is offline
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Originally Posted by Kurfürst View Post
Nope, it says the "The Units concerned" are now stocked. It means some, but now all. Otherwise the distinction is about the 'units concerned' makes no sense.
Probably the same 16+2 Squadrons that were discussed earlier.

The units concerned are all frontline Spitfire and Hurricane units.


And, if you read the preceeding documents, not just the ones you find on the site, you will notice that bomber units concerned (3 stations) had priority.



That's nice and valid evidence for about half a dozen Squadrons out of about 50-60 participating the Battle.

I counted 30 squadrons combat reports that mention +12lb between May and July , how do you explain that?



The problem is that it was fighter stations that were stocked with fuel, not "Squadrons". A Squadron is just a bunch of men and planes. It can't store fuel. Airfields and Stations can.

As usual you apprear to be focusing on symantics, playing with words.


Now as it goes a number of Stations were supplied with high octane fuel. The Squadrons stationed there could use it. But the Squadrons themselves continously rotated amongst stations, so its difficult to say how many Squadrons had access to it at a time. You appear to have no problem making assumptions from this, why can't I?

For example, No 41 Sqn was at Catterick in May, but transferred to Hornchurch on 28 May, then back to Catterick on 8 June, then again back to Hornchurch on the 25 July, then beck to Catterick again until 2 September, and then again Hornchurch. OK, what's your point? A lot of stations were supplied with smaller ammounts of 100 octane because they understood that not every Aircraft would return to it's own base to refuel.


Besides the use of 100 octane fuel appears to be already covered by an Australian researcher. We had a discussion about it a good while ago on Butch2k's board.

This is from a researcher, researching another subject (Dutch East Indies Fuel levels prior to the Japanese Invasion) at the Australian War Memorial Archives, from a document, copied to the Australian Military Commission in England in February 1941, by Roll Royce to Lord Beaverbrook outlining past, current and proposed changes to the Merlin; and factors that affect it's performance. It was a collection of lose-leaf typed pages, included as an addendum in a report titled Fuel Supplies to The British Empire And It's Commonwealth; Outlook, Ramifications and Projections For The Prosecution Of The War.

The reason why it is included amongst AWM papers was because the Australian Government at that time was protesting vigoriously about the continued supply of lower grade 87 octane fuel when it too wanted 100 octane for the RAAF. McFarland, Pugh, Hart, Perret, Lumsden and even Churchill have all quoted parts from the report.

"The first bulk shipment of 100 octane fuel had arrived in Britain in June 1939 from the Esso refinery in Aruba. This and subsequent tanker shipments from Aruba, Curacao and the USA were stockpiled while the RAF continued to operate on 87 octane petrol. Having secured what were considered reasonably sufficient quantities of 100 octane, Fighter Command began converting its engines to this standard in March 1940, allowing boost (manifold) pressures to be raised without the risk of detonation in the cylinders. This initial increase in maximum boost from 6 lb to 9 lb delivered a useful power growth of around 130hp at the rated altitude.

By the time of the invasion of the Low Countries by Germany in May 1940 the RAF had converted approximately 25 % of it's total fighter force to 100 octane fuel use. The subsequent escalation in air activity and demands placed upon Fighter Command over the next two months put great strain on both the 100 octane fuel stockpiles and aircraft modified to use the fuel. Against the backdrop of total war the RAF found that it's reserves of 100 octane fuel was well below the level considered necessary for widespread use, for any sustained length of time.

Two actions were immediately undertaken by the British War Cabinet in May to resolve the looming crisis. Firstly 87 octane fuel was deemed the primary fuel source to be used until further supplies could be discovered and delivered in sufficient quantities to allow the Merlin conversions to again take place.
Those existing fighters already so converted (approximately 125) would continue to use what supplies of 100 octane were available, but all other fighters that had not been modified to continue with the use of 87 octane (of which there was more than adequate supply). The second action was for the British Government to contract the Shell Oil Refining Company to assist the British-controlled Iraqi Petroleum Company at Kirkuk to produce 100 octane fuel. This arrangement proved quite successful as production was quickly converted to 100 octane fuel.

The first Middle East shipment of 100 octane fuel arrived in Portsmouth on 12th August, with a further two deliveries in September and four in October. Although too late to allow widespread conversion for the use of the fuel the deliveries did ensure that from this point on Britain would not be lacking in 100 octane fuel levels. With the newfound supply RAF Fighter Command again embarked upon a Merlin II and III conversion to 100 octane use from late September, finally achieving 100% conversion of it's fighter force by the end of November in 1940.
OK so the first Middle east (Iraq?) was 12th August, what about all the 100 Octane we got from America in '38, '39' '40?



Source for the type of fuel used in Rechlin please. Oh, wait - Mike William's lying article in which he simply made this up, amongst a dozen other things..?
Can you prove this? And no I didn't get the info from Mike Williams. You're reaction 'Lying article' says more about this..


Besides the Germans had access to captured British/French 100 octane (unimportant - it was all American import) which on occasion they even used in their own aircraft to add salt into the Dunkeque wound, and their own 100 octane fuel of course which I believe at this point was actually better than British 100 octane.
Hang on, you can just say something like 'I believe German 100 octane was better" without anything to support it. Double standards.

The RAF painted '100' on the engine cowling of converted Spitfires. Obviously they would only need to do this whilst there were 2 types of fuel being used at the same time to ensure the correct fuel was used. I can't find a picture any later than July 1940 where '100' is on there. If they got rid of that then that must mean the conversion was complete?

Consumption of 100 octane fuel during the Battle of Britain was 58,000 tons
I ton of fuel is just over 14 barrels, 35 gallons in a barrel. 1 ton of fuel = 490 gallons. That is 28 million gallons. So by your number of 125 converted aircraft that would mean average use per Aircraft of 227,000 gallons in 12 weeks. What? Where did it all go?

Last edited by winny; 05-29-2011 at 02:14 PM.
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