Originally Posted by skullblits (Post 103268)

Because who knows ALT plays a part in the planes performance?

Originally Posted by skullblits (Post 103273)

Well, Ive Never known & id say most people wont aswell

Originally Posted by Ancient Seraph (Post 103274)

The problem is that if people will always fly at the optimum altitude for their aircraft you might always be at different altitudes :P. I vote ignorance is bliss on this one.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103270)

Well I do. I mean it's kinda common knowledge to know that the 109 a high altitude fighter, can't do much against a low altitude Yak-3 unless he tries to BnZ, but usually I just get out of their way when that happens.

Originally Posted by FOZ_1983 (Post 103279)

"
Thats a bold statement to make my friend, because not everyone shares the knowledge you do.

Most of the people play IL2 online because they enjoy flying games, and just generally like a change from the likes of COD, HALO etc.

Knowledge plays no part in what they do, they play because they enjoy it. They dont play it it its historically meant to be played because they dont know how the planes performed.

I would say "its not common knowledge that the 109 is a high altitude fighter" but those who do know it (like yourself) can appreciate it more and use your knowledge to your advantage ;)

win win situation on your part.


You get to play the game AND you get your 109 down low for an easy kill.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103267)

And so my question is, because this seems to happen to me every time I fly my Yak-3 against a 109. Why do some people online, think that 5,000ft and below, they can challenge me in a turning and roll fight? Has anyone else gone up against these kinds of people?

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103293)

I don't think it was a bold statement. If you know anything of the 109, you'll know first off that it was built as a high altitude fighter. If you've looked in a 109 book, it will be there. I mean look at a Hurricane and a 109. If the Hurricane tried dogfighting a 109 at a high altitude, you know who will have the better advantage.

Originally Posted by DoubleStandards (Post 103438)

Hey Soviet Ace,
I usually enjoy your posts, and I must say, even this thread has given me some more knowledge to help me online, but I wonder if you realize what kind of elitist jacka** you sound like here. I really hope that this is not what this community is going to turn into.

Not trying to pick a fight with you, just wanted to point it out, maybe you just dont realize how you sounded. ;)

Originally Posted by John192 (Post 103441)

Have you been drinking Soviet Ace cause this "im so great" BS is not like your usuall posting habbits which i realy enjoy and learn lots from

Originally Posted by Ancient Seraph (Post 103443)

The question itself could've been made more into a statement, or advise, but looking at the title of the post he knows what it sounds like ;).
Still, I have to agree with him a bit, since it's a realistic game, people should do a little bit more research or try-outs before jumping into an airplane. One of the downsides of realistic settings :-P.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103267)

I was just playing against my friend, and someone neither of us knew? I was flying of course, my Yak-3, and my friend was flying a 109G6 as well as the other guy. While my friend knows not to come down and take me on, the other guy who had some skills up high, had little to none at lower altitudes.

And so my question is, because this seems to happen to me every time I fly my Yak-3 against a 109. Why do some people online, think that 5,000ft and below, they can challenge me in a turning and roll fight? Has anyone else gone up against these kinds of people?

And to answer the possible question of did I win against him. The simple answer is of course: Yes! :cool:

Originally Posted by Gazz6666 (Post 103423)

Well, I almost always start from altitude and dive down low to do the majority of the fighting. For the last 10-12 games, i've been flying with the 109 series aircraft, and I can outturn Hurricanes and Spitfires on the deck.

Not trying to blow my own trumpet here, but it's not just the plane, it's also the pilot ;)

Originally Posted by ontheborderland (Post 103357)

The simple answer is that not everybody knows as much as you about this subject. It's pretty elitist you calling them "these kinds of people". :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by DoubleStandards (Post 103438)

Hey Soviet Ace,
I usually enjoy your posts, and I must say, even this thread has given me some more knowledge to help me online, but I wonder if you realize what kind of elitist jacka** you sound like here. I really hope that this is not what this community is going to turn into.

Not trying to pick a fight with you, just wanted to point it out, maybe you just dont realize how you sounded. ;)

Originally Posted by John192 (Post 103441)

I have to aggree with this guy.

Have you been drinking Soviet Ace cause this "im so great" BS is not like your usuall posting habbits which i realy enjoy and learn lots from

Originally Posted by TRC Subaru (Post 103449)

I bet it was shots of chilled Stoli...:)

…and it ain’t bragging if you can back it up…

But seriously Ace, unlike the PC version, you will be getting a whole new crowd of “newbie’s” who don’t have a clue to what a WWII fighter is all about. Hell, most weren’t even born until after stealth technology…So I propose, for the good of the game, we help the newcomers understand and enjoy dog fighting so they continue to play BoP, and buy the downloads which will make the game a great success so we will get more planes and there will always be a good group of pilots online to have a challenging and rewarding dogfight with at anytime…and maybe even get those darn German cockpits eventually…:grin:

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103563)

I can understand not knowing about the planes, but maybe now, people will start looking into their planes and seeing where they fit in altitude dogfights?

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103583)

nope, i still dont give a monkeys...i'll try to out turn anybody at any altitude and probably wont even know what it is they are flying anyways...you see, the thing is, when i get shot down, i dont really die.

actually, i do want to learn the manouvers...turning gets a bit boring after a while....but i certainly dont want to know the related performance charateristics of various aircraft at any given altitude...no sir, i dont want to know that at all

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103591)

Well it does give you an advantage over other players, to know what your plane is best at what altitude and such. Just trying to out turn someone over and over again, just turns into a game of who is going to lose speed the fastest, and not be able to recover in time? It's happened.

Originally Posted by mdbuehler (Post 103592)

The fun thing about this game (one of those newbie folks here :) ) is that I'd never even heard of 90% of these planes before I bought it! I'd thought WWII was fought with only Mustangs, Spits, Corsairs, Zeros and some Mescherscmits (sp?). I've found my new love with the LA-7, Russia had some great planes! I've had excellent luck online with this one. I've spent a bit of time reading now about the various aircraft too, lots of interesting history in it.

Our 8 yo son now runs around the house with a die-cast Polikarpov I-16 as his main dogfighting toy, lol :) Never heard of that one either. I'm going to guess most people trying this game don't know what fighter is good for what, especially what optimal altitudes are.

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103597)

yeah i know, thats usually why i get shot down, cos i get bored and try summut else.
anyways, i must be seriously bad at the game, cos i find the spitfire way easier to fly than the 109....
maybe i just find it nicer though...which is why i fly it regardless of what anyone else is flying.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103600)

Well I suggest looking into the Spitfire models in the game, and read some info on them outside the game. You'll get a better aspect of what your up against and what your limitations are etc. online.

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103604)

see, your missing the point....that makes it more like a study task...its a fun game to me and my sort. it really dosnt matter untill i come up against someone like you, and i suspect you would get me regardless of my knowledge of the aircraft.
i think what you need to do, is think of people like me as the rookie with 5hrs flying experiance before put in the front line. that way we can all enjoy the game at the level we choose

Originally Posted by TRC Subaru (Post 103610)

…Actually Ace I really just wanted to know if you drink Stoli because I would like to go drinking with you some time…

…I bet I would learn a lot of great flying secrets once you had a few chilled Stoli’s in you…:)

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103270)

Well I do. I mean it's kinda common knowledge to know that the 109 a high altitude fighter, can't do much against a low altitude Yak-3 unless he tries to BnZ, but usually I just get out of their way when that happens.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103608)

Well if you enjoy the era, and enjoy the planes. You wouldn't think of it as a "study task". It would be beneficial to adding to your knowledge of the era, and the planes. So next time you go to an Airshow, and possibly see a Yak-3 by the name of White 100, you'll know that the White 100 Yak-3 is powered by an Allison rather than the original VK105-PF-2 engine. And also, you'd probably respect them more.

.

Originally Posted by Smidlee (Post 103616)

I've never read or seen anywhere the P-51 handle as badly as it is in the game. You can learn everything there is to know about the P-51 including fly a real one and it still handles like crap in this game. Besides, any knowledge I gain about WW2 planes doesn't help me one bit in real life.
When it comes down to it to some it's just a game. I know I wouldn't use the same tactic in real life as I have in a FPS.

This game especially the PC version does have a very steep learning curve. Because of this I think it's better to stick with one or two planes until you learn how to knock down planes. I totally disagree with you that a novice should try to learn the characteristic of every plane as I have no doubt there some players can take the P-51 and shoot me down. That's one of the things that discourages me from playing online PC IL-2 a few years ago was there were so many good players who has played nothing but IL-2 for years. Some seem to be able to kill the pilot with a few shoots.

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103618)

i so rest my case

Originally Posted by Smidlee (Post 103616)

This game (especially the PC version) has a very steep learning curve. Because of this I think it's better to stick with one or two planes until you learn how to knock down planes. I totally disagree with you that a novice should try to learn the characteristic of every plane as I have no doubt there some players can take the P-51 and shoot me down no matter what I fly.

Originally Posted by Ancient Seraph (Post 103271)

Not a lot of people realise the performance limitations that come with each aircraft. Guess they don't try out a lot of planes. My guess is most people recognize the Spit as an awesome plane, and when they try to fly it they get sick of the wingdrops. So they try the next plane: the 109. This one is pretty easy to fly, so they stick with it. I love it when I'm the only La-7 in a room full of 109's. I'll outturn them anytime. And that with an airplane that is surprisingly easy to fly as well. The Spit IV outturns the La, but is a lot trickier to fly.
I guess people should just try out more different planes, and they'll notice how they fly.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103613)

My preferred beer is either PBR (When I've only got $10 to my name :P) or if I've got more, whatever I can blow it on. LOL Stoli I can handle ;)

Originally Posted by TRC Subaru (Post 103665)

OK...Beer it is…Bar keep, two pints of your finest ale please….:grin:

…and while I’m at it, I want to buy everyone in this thread a round… (These people really need to loosen up a bit)…LOL

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103621)

Since when was learning about something a bad thing? Just increasing your knowledge of a plane or two doesn't hurt anything. But I can tell from you, your not very intelligible? Maybe just looking at pictures would suit you?

Originally Posted by TRC Subaru (Post 103665)

OK...Beer it is…Bar keep, two pints of your finest ale please….:grin:

…and while I’m at it, I want to buy everyone in this thread a round… (These people really need to loosen up a bit)…LOL

Originally Posted by John192 (Post 103776)

Soviet Ace, you may be able to help me here

I have have recently started to fly the Yak-3. I have been flying Spitfires up to this point and have found lots of usefull information online for thembut am struggeling for the Yak.

sites like:

http://members.shaw.ca/soda_p/models.htm
http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/
http://www.simhq.com/_air/acc_library.html#ground

are good for general information and performance info for the very common aircraft but i cannot find any usefull info on the Yak-3.

Many thanks in advance

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103831)

there is nothing wrong with learning, if it interests you...as to the rest, i think you just showed your character for what it is

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace (Post 103858)

See nudger, these are the types of people I want to associate myself with. People willing to learn about planes, and other things. Narrow minded people like yourself, now not all are bad people, but YOU have a serious problem with not knowing things. You can say I showed my character "for what it is", but you don't have a clue about who I am. So either quit trying to talk to me, and let me "enlighten" people to the magic that is WW2 Aerial Combat.

Also John, here is a couple links that should help you out with your Yak-3 interest. (Any anyone else for that matter.)

Yak-3 Site 1
Yak-3 Site 2

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103914)

you just dont realise how funny you are do you?
because i dont have the same level of interest in a particular subject that you have, you call me stupid, when you dont know me or anything about me, and then you accuse me of saying things about you when i do not know you?
In this thread, you were asking why people play in sim mode when they are lacking in knowledge of aircraft performance. I explained why...its not difficult to understand, really it isnt! But ok to you i am stupid, like i would ever care what you think!....to me you are just funny.

Originally Posted by nudger1964 (Post 103914)

you just dont realise how funny you are do you?
because i dont have the same level of interest in a particular subject that you have, you call me stupid, when you dont know me or anything about me, and then you accuse me of saying things about you when i do not know you?
In this thread, you were asking why people play in sim mode when they are lacking in knowledge of aircraft performance. I explained why...its not difficult to understand, really it isnt! But ok to you i am stupid, like i would ever care what you think!....to me you are just funny.