Fw 190 - numbers for A-8 and A-9
 

The FW-190A9 was most common of the Antons in 1945.

Heres a breakdown on the numbers and dates produced (930 A9's in total). Looks to me that they were producing A8's and A9's in the last 3 months of '44, with A9 production lasting just 1 month longer, before it was all switched to Doras.

More A8's were made during there concurrent production runs than A9's.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y29...ps013f751f.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y29...psbc55b4e9.jpg

Of course, in 45 the production shifted mainly to the Dora ,

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y29...ps10397094.jpg

Fruitbat,

Just about all the aircraft produced in contracted block to be on the production line in November and December 1944 were being OPERATED in January 1945.

In otherwords, most of the FW-190A9 production is in use in 1945.

That is typical for all production aircraft.

White 1 for example, rolled off the production line at NDW, went through a week of acceptance flights to ensure contract compliance before being transferred to the Luftwaffe, then went to a distribution node where it sat for 3 weeks before being issued to JG5.

The last aircraft in White 1's production block rolled off the assembly line on the 20th June. The contract block was from May to June 44. After being assembled, White 1 spent until the 13th of July in test and acceptance flights before becoming part of the Luftwaffe inventory.

It was then shipped to the depot in Anklam where it was finally issued to JG5 in mid-August 1944.

Any production block that you see means a lag of ~30-60 days to Operational use.

I know you don't deal with reality very much in airplanes so reading the production block dates mistaking them for operational dates is expected. It is very rare that anything is "poofed" into existence operationally. There is always some lag time.

:)

Crump read the production dates for the A8 again.

I completely understand the fact about production dates being different to operational dates, its bloody obvious, don't be so patronising.

The simple fact is more A8's were produced during the A9's production run than A9's, its in black and white for you to read if you weren't so obtuse.

Therefore your claim that the A9 was the most prevalent is clearly not true, as these A8's would be coming into service at the same time, as they were made at the same time. Its not rocket science, i'm not sure what you don't understand, except what you choose not to.

Can production tell what was flown? They didn't have gas for all that were made before the end and there were losses on ground as well as in the air.

I guess I should be happy that as many records survived as did.

It certainly is true. More FW-190A9's were built than FW-190A3's!

It was not until December that we see the production started in October reaching operational units. Even then, it was in trickles.

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg301.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg301.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bstjg301.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg1.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg2.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biiijg2.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bivjg3.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg6.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg6.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg11.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg26.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg26.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg54.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg54.html

http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bivjg54.html


The FW-190A9 using 1.78ata @ 2700U/min in the first gear supercharger is the 1945 variant of the Anton series, that is a fact.

So Fruitbat, what is your theory on the 900 examples of the FW-190A9 delivered to the Luftwaffe as to when they were used if it is not 1945?

He's saying they were used in 1945, side by side with the 2500 A-8's that were built in parallel to the 900 A-9's.

There is no need to guess or read into the documents as per the usual suspects.


It is clear the FW190A9 is the replacement Anton for the FW-190A8.

Are we really having this discussion?

You also do not have the production details for the blocks. Almost all the FW-190A8's produced in the later part of 1944 are all weather variants or assault ships.

Oskar Bösch went thru 13 FW190A8's during his time with IV/JG3 Sturm. His unit had a 500% casualty rate.

Both are specialized variants for specific units and neither is designed as an air superiority variant.

What do A3's have to do with 1945, answer nothing.

Again you have reading comprehension problems. No where have i said they weren't used in 1945. I'm afraid if you can't read properly thats your own problem, not mine.

Exactly.

Simply fact is that in 1945 more A8's were used than A9's, because over two and a half times as many were made during the same time. No amount of trying to twist or ignore the facts can change this.

Are yes, ignore any inconvenient information, seems oh so familiar.

Doesn't change the fact that they were in existence, and that they were Fw190 A8's does it. Still more A8's flying in 45 than A9's.

Whilst irrelevant to the numbers of A8's vs A9's, this is at least interesting, source please.


Oh, and while we're at it, here is the reason why they were produced concurrently,

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y29...ps3429ef67.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y29...ps7cd6c91f.jpg

The reason they didn't completely switch to the A9, was because they simply didn't have enough of the engines that were used in the A9, hence why A8 production carried on.

I fail to see how the obscure clippings from a second hand or third hand source have to do with Focke Wulf's original documents.

I have some old magazine clippings I can post too. Like yours, not necessarily factual, but read well.

Looking at Focke Wulf's production quotas by variant, this is not correct for fighters. It applies to airframes but not the type used to replace the FW-190A8's in the Day fighter units for tangling with allied fighters.

All weather fighters are made for IFR flight, not much dog fighting going on so it is ok to load the type down with the navigation, de-icing, and automation that makes flight under such conditions workable.

Assault ships also are not designed to fight allied fighters, they are bomber killers designed to get close and give the pilot a reasonable change at survival. In this case, the airframe is expendable with the goal of achieving the destruction of a bomber and saving our pilot to fly again.
Both of these variants have much higher wastage rates than normal fighter variants. Does it make sense that at a normal logistical reserve rate you would need to produce much more of these types?
You do realize that just one of the Sturm units could consume an entire months production of FW-190A8 airframes?
You also don't seem to realize that NDW, Fiessler, and Ago are almost exclusively turning out assault ships.

NDW for example, only produced 40 FW-190A8 normal fighters during the entire war! That is the entire run of FW-190A8 fighters from them.

The other 530 FW-190A8's produced by NDW were assault ship variants.

The 1270 airframes produced by Fiessler were mostly assault ships...

Now let’s get an idea of how many airplanes we need to replace our losses. It does not have to be complicated, we only need reach a general conclusion.

In every quarter of the war, the Jadgwaffe experienced a 100% wastage rate. That is a fact. Every four months, every single engine fighter in the Jadgwaffe was replaced. Some pilots might not have to replace their individual aircraft but others had their aircraft replaced multiple times during that four month period. Statistically, it comes out to a 100% wastage rate per quarter. War is expensive.

Let's do some simple math to grasp the scale of the logistics required to maintain FW-190A8's as the main single engine fighter in 1945. First let’s look at the number of airframe available!

Let's use that rather inflated claim of 2500 airframes and Focke Wulf's ratio of all weather fighters as well as assault ships.

2500 * .85 = 375 Normal fighter Variant FW-190A8's...

About maybe 5 weeks give or take a week or two. ;)

Conclusion, there is not enough normal fighter variants to meet wastage rates for more than one, maybe two months before FW-190A8 normal fighter variants become extinct.
Now let's look at the FW-190A9 and FW-190D9 production:

FW-190A9 normal fighter variants ~870
FW-190D9 normal fighter variants ~1700

That is 2570 airframes. The Jadgwaffe maintained an average strength of roughly 1760 fighters of which one third is FW-190's. Just a reasonable assumption made based on RLM dictates.

1760 * .3 = 528 FW-190 fighter variants in the force

2570 total FW-190 fighter variants produced / 528 FW190 fighter variants required = 4.86 months worth of fighter variants to experience a 100% loss rate per quarter. Wow, that takes us to the last few weeks of the war!!

So, the logistical math works out and we have enough FW-190 normal fighter variants to conclude that the FW-190A9 was the predominate Anton normal fighter variant in 1945 especially considering production of FW-190A8's switched almost exclusively to assault ship and all weather fighter production in the last quarter of 1944.

Works out pretty good especially considering a small number of both FW-190A9's and FW-190D9 were built as all weather fighters.


It is more than interesting; it is the reason for my statement that the FW-190A9 is more prevalent in 1945 as a normal fighter variant.

It is also based on original documentation from the source.

So we can bin your claim that the A-9 was the most numerous 190A of 1945.

However, as already requested by Fruitbat and ignored by you, it would be interesting to see some evidence that supports your new claim.

Rodeike states that most of the A-9 built by Focke Wulf in Cottbus were R11 all weather variants, as were some built in Wismar. Additionally the Erfurt production possibly were A-8, designations vary. Since you are so picky to rule out any A-8 that does not come as the standard fighter variant, we might want to do the same with the A-9 and end up, conservatively, at 110 A-9's produced in standard fighter configuration. That's about the same ratio you chose for the A-8. Now as you are contradicting Rodeike's accepted research, it would be nice to see some source that shows for instance how no Cottbus built A-9's came as R11.

I think you need a new calculator.

I don't have trouble with your reasoning but you should check your math before clicking 'post'.

I also see the usual pattern of two people arguing different things. It is like circles on a map.. how to tell what the overlaps mean when the circles have different criteria.

Maybe A-8's as air superiority fighters were fewer than total A-8's but when did that become the comparison? I was reading A-8's, not A-8 sub-types.

FB, A-8 production for all of 1944... when did A-9 production get into swing that year? I see A-8's in the hundreds from II/44 and wonder how many were still in use 9 months later? Ditto for early A-9's.

Aren't there people with unit strength figures or is that too incomplete?

If it's about what was more used, I don't think that should control player choice. Show that the type was in short supply or that certain units only had them (should not be hard, then the player can pick the unit).

If it's about what was more used, that would be good to know in mission design what AI's to place and the tasks they are assigned. But when in IL2 will players encounter A-8's without massed B-17's coming right around the corner? Last sim I could run that could have even a taste of that was EAW.

Come to think about it.. on the newer decked-out PC's, might there be enough power to fill the skies with AI bombers and escorts? 4.4?

the following is from a graphic I have of Fw190A production:

A-8 - A-9

Mar 82 - 0
Apr 347 - 2
May 492 - 15
Jun 430 - 21
Jul 502 - 70
Aug 648 - 30
Sep 465 - 122
Oct 293 - 14
Nov 482 - 99
Dec ? - ?
Jan 328 - ?

total 4060 - 373

This does not include the numbers for the R8 and R11 versions for the A-8 and A-9.


A-8/R11(/R2) - A-9/R11

Jun (103)
Jul (180)
Aug (202)
Sep 14 (159) - 56
Oct 79 (123) - 80
Nov 33 (80) - 58
Dec ? (?) - ?
Jan 73 (51) - ?

total 199 (898 ) - 194

Only about 15% of the a8's produced concurrently with the a9 were normal fighter variants. The 375 is the approximate number of a8 normal fighters and the way I wrote it is confusing.

The math adds up. I just did not include the step of subtracting the all weather and assault ship production from the total.

The point being an unit flying FW190A's normal fighters in 1945 was more likely to be operating A9's.

A large portion of FW190a8 production fed the grist mill of the sturm units and to a lesser extent, the all weather units.

The subtype makes all the difference max guns. Normal fighters are not going to be using assault ships or all weather fighters.

Assault ships are not suitable for defense against enemy fighters and all weather aircraft are not ideal.

Both subtypes are specialized aircraft built for specific missions. They went to special units to perform those missions.

Both mission experienced a significantly higher than normal wastage rate in comparison to normal fighter. It is not surprising the production numbers.

As of March 19 1945

Stab J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
I./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
II./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
III./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11

http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/oob.htm

/R11 is for all weather

Very interested to see your answer and even more so, some actual evidence to support it for once as i have seen none so far at all but claims, particularly regarding JtDs post quoted above Crump, as both him and Milo have shown A9's in R11 configurations as well in roughly the same ratio as A8's.:!:

Good to see you abandoned your initial claim as well, that the A9 was the most common Anton in 45, and changed your claim to now be most common 'normal fighter'. As Milos and JtD's posts show, this may well be questionable as well unfortunately for you.

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/1...losses1945.jpg

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/683...osses19452.jpg

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6...osses19453.jpg

http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/7...osses19454.jpg

:rolleyes:

The last FW-190A8 lost to air combat was on 25 Febuary. They were not the most prevelent Anton in JG301 at that time.

The sole FW-190A8 lost in March crashed on the transfer flight back to the depot. That last part of 1945 is kind of hard to read. There is only FW-190A8 listed and it is the one that crashed on the transfer flight.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showpos...5&postcount=18

From Page 2, that is the one you are talking about as not being a true statement, right friutbat??

;)

Prove these comments with some properly sourced info - seeing as you claim to have the production records its up to you to post them; showing the loss records of one Jagdgeschwader simply shows that that one unit was equipped with A-9s, nothing more.

Keep reading the thread...you are included in the usual suspects! Your question is already answered, Kaiser Söze.

:rolleyes:

So Crumpp. JG301 was only one of many units flying the Fw190A.

I already posted that JG301, an all weather unit, was flying Fw190A-9/R11s.

As of March 19 1945

Stab J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
I./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
II./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11
III./J.G. 301 FW 190 A-9/R11

http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/oob.htm

Deliveries from Aug 1944

Aug-44 FW 190A 8 Fw 367
Aug-44 FW 190A 8 Ago 220
Aug-44 FW 190A 8/R2 Fieseler 202
Aug-44 FW 190A 8 Arb.G. 61
Aug-44 FW 190A 9 Arb.G. 30

Sep-44 FW 190A 8 Fw 140
Sep-44 FW 190A 8 R11 Fw 14
Sep-44 FW 190A 8 Ago 252
Sep-44 FW 190A 8 R2 Fieseler 159
Sep-44 FW 190A 8 Dornier 10
Sep-44 FW 190A 8 Arb.Gem. 63
Sep-44 FW 190A 9 Arb.Gem. 47
Sep-44 FW 190A 9 Fw 75
Sep-44 FW 190A 9 R11 Fw 55

Oct-44 FW 190A 8 Fw 4
Oct-44 FW 190A 8 R11 Fw 79
Oct-44 FW 190A 8 Ago 205
Oct-44 FW 190A 8 R2 GFW 123
Oct-44 FW 190A 8 NDW 28
Oct-44 FW 190A 9 NDW 6
Oct-44 FW 190A 8 Arb.Gem.W. 56
Oct-44 FW 190A 9 Arb.Gem.W. 8
Oct-44 FW 190A 9 R11 Fw 80

Nov-44 FW 190A 8 Fw 37
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 R11 Fw 33
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 Ago 263
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 HWO 80
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 Arb.Gem.W. 61
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 GFW 19
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 R2 GFW 88
Nov-44 FW 190A 8 NDW 72
Nov-44 FW 190A 9 NDW 2
Nov-44 FW 190A 9 HWO 20
Nov-44 FW 190A 9 Arb.Gem.W. 27
Nov-44 FW 190A 9 R11 Fw 58

Dec-44 DOCUMENT NOT YET FOUND

Jan-45 FW 190A-8 FW 8
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 Ar.Parow 4
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 HWO 53
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 Do.P'berg 120
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 Con.Aslau 10
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 Ago 186
Jan-45 FW 190A-8 R2 GFW 51
Jan-45 FW 190A-9 Ago 7
Jan-45 FW 190A-9 Do.P'berg 32
Jan-45 FW 190A-9 HWO 20
Jan-45 FW 190A9 R11 FW 73
Jan-45 FW 190A-9 Ar.Parow 8
Jan-45 FW 190A-9 FW 6

Feb-45 DOCUMENT NOT YET FOUND

Mar-45 DOCUMENT NOT YET FOUND

Apr-45 ONLY PARTIALLY DOCUMENTED - NOT YET FOUND
.................................................. ....................................

As can be seen, even in Jan 1945 (delivery of pure fighters) there was 308 more A-8s delivered than A-9s. (381-73 = 308 )

Discuss the subject, but keep the personal stuff out of your replies please.

:rolleyes:

The first month out of the year....

Of course, we see the same thing in JG301 but that does not matter, does it?? The rest of the year does not count, only the first month!!!

Got it.

Well it is hard to give the deliveries if there is no documentaion.

to quote the author
You have the missing documentation for Dec 1944, Feb 1945, March 1945 and April 1945 Crumpp, so the blank months can be filled in?

IVJG 3,
II JG 4,
II JG 6,
II JG 11,
STAB JG 51,
II JG 54,
and II JG 300 were all flying Fw190As at wars end.

Were are the loss lists for these units? Could it be you are being selective in what you post Crumpp because the above units had Fw190A-8 losses right up to the last days?

Of course JG301 was the only unit flying antons,

got it.

Oh wait, thats not true........

Well done, you have proved that JG301 was flying A9's, as has already been posted by Milo earlier. Of course you ignore that they were flying all weather, which apparently doesn't count for A8's, but is OK to count for A9's.

Still waiting for some actual evidence, but we know it will never actually come, you have used the same excuse many times before.

adding to this list a little bit, just a cursory look through

http://www.ww2.dk/

(I got as far as JG11, and had laughed enough by then)

JG1, II Gruppe
JG2, I Gruppe, II Gruppe, III Gruppe
JG11, I Gruppe.

These all flew exclusively Antons to the end or disbandment @ march 45

This doesn't even include the units that were flying a mix of Doras and Antons.

It gives the right appearence so who cares what the facts are as long you are right, fruitbat.

:cool:

http://www.ww2.dk/

Like all the data posted so far for OOB besides the JG301 I posted, it is only for the first month of 1945 or very incomplete.

I would say you have proven your case!!

:rolleyes:

Then why keep posting nonsense?

Oh yeah, you are not doing it to prove a point in a discussion, you are doing it to prove me wrong.

You don't need facts, just a perception. It is the internet!!

seems you have problems navigating through the different parts of the site,

http://www.ww2.dk/air/jagd/jg2.htm

for example, so what were JG2 flying to the end of march 45 then......

not a real surprise.

Still waiting for some actual evidence to support your claim.

So different units had different jobs.

I thought that it was 109's they sent to attack escorts.

If it is nonsense, then what do you call what you have posted Crumpp?

One and the same.

So you don't have the delivery reports ask for to fill in the blank months. How then can you make the statement you did with regard to the number of Fw190A-9s in service?

And you Crumpp have posted facts?

Keep it civil! Last warning!
---
MiloMorai, what's the source for the production figures you posted? Is it available online? Sorry if I missed it.

Obviously you have not followed those links you keep posting. There is no type specific data for orders of battle beyond December 1944 on that website, fruit bat.

Find something else instead of parroting the same non- relevant information.


Wait a minute, you can't. All you can do is antagonize in the hopes the thread gets shut down.

It is a fact that all the available detailed data for 1945 shows the Fw-190A9 normal fighter replacing the Fw-190A8 normal fighter in Geschwaders operating Anton fighters.

Weird that fact conforms to Focke Wulf, GmbH stated plans and why they even built an Fw-190A9.

Crazy world, huh!

Considering the improved performance of the A-9 over the A-8 at least as portrayed in IL-2 now, why wouldn't they switch over?

Buuuuuut when it comes to shooting down bombers, perhaps the extra armor on the A-8 is worth more. It's not like the bombers were outrunning and outmanuevering them.

I don't expect the Germans to have done the smartest things with their fighter production given how they never had an equivalent to fighter command (as Galland asked for) and spent more time avoiding Hitler's wrath than getting things right. There was also "Buddy" Milsch sabotaging development in favor of ground forces and I dunno how many little intrigues that held up the real air advances that were eventually seen in the 262 but too little and too late.

I asked crumppp to post the production records he claims to have proving that all-weather A-8/R11s predominated over ordinary A-8 day fighters and all he can come up with is this nonsense AND he can't even get this one right - its Keyser Söze. :lol:

You haven't posted any detailed data to support your claim Crumpp.

He (or somebody) actually posted this years ago ;)

From Six Months to Oblivion by Werner Girbig.

units flying Fw190As at the time of surrender

IV./JG3 - A-8s and A-9s
II./JG4 - A-8s and A-9s
III./JG5 - G-14s and A-8s
II./JG6 - A-8s and D-9s
III./JG11 - A-8s
Stab JG51 - A-8s
II./JG54 - A-8s
II./JG300 - A-8s and A-9s
I./JG301 - A-8s, A-9s and D-9s
III./JG301 - A-8s and A-9s

Three units were flying exclusively A-8s.
Four units flew a mix of A-8s and A-9s.
Two unit flew a mix of A-8s and other a/c.
One unit flew a mix of A-8s, A-9s and D-9s.

The limiting factor of R11 production was either the radio or (more likely) the autopilot (I doubt it was the windscreen) and, like the A9 with it's engines, there likely would have been more made if more components were available. And there is no reason at all that the R11 wouldn't have been used on normal daylight missions with other "normal" fighters. All we're talking about (physical difference) is a larger radio and an autopilot. This opinion (and that's all it is, frankly) is based on my research on all-weather 109 numbers and use.

Quick infos from me:

JG1 'Oesau' losses of Fw 190 A-8 in only 1945: 52 (Jan: 39 | Feb: 10 | Mart: 3)
JG1 'Oesau' losses of Fw 190 A-9 in only 1945: 15 (Jan: 10 | Feb: 4 | Mart: 1)
JG1 'Oesau' losses of Fw 190 D-9 in only 1945: 2 (Jan: 2 | Feb: 0 | Mart: 0)

19x A-8 and NO Fw 190 A-9 of JG1 were shot down during operation 'Bodenplatte', the majority of all other went down during combat with fighters.

In 1944 its even much more evident, that Fw 190 A-8 was the mainly used type in JG1.
I can count the numbers, if anyone needs it, but its much more than in 1945, naturally.

EDIT: In 1945, JG1 flew also mainly Bf 109 G-14 (14 lost), very rarly Bf 109 G-6 (2 lost), K-4 (2 lost) ... and He162 (11 lost).

Thanks Caspar, good info.

Would it be possible to post the monthly losses for the A-8s and A-9s?

So right zipper, especially considering the weather conditions over Europe at that time of year.

here little about bodenplatte on russian, but, if i'm not mistaken, from not-russian books - personally i counted 27 a-9 from 1446 planes in total...

I edited my post and added monthly losses (and took Bf 109 G-10 type out, that was a misreading).

Thanks Caspar.

Would it be safe to assume that the A-8s were the more numerous Fw190 in JG1?

Over view

http://www.ww2.dk/air/jagd/jg1.htm


JGI
http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bijg1.html

JGII
http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg1.html

Unfortunately Alpha the first link does not give the model number. The other 2 links end in Dec 1944.

It does not help prove or disprove this quote from Post #1:
Also, the WNr in Post #1 add up to 930 Fw190A-9s. During this same time period (beginning IX 1944), some 2980 Fw190A-8s were produced. A ratio of 3.2:1 (A-8 : A-9)

Who's referring to the first post in the thread, I was replying to your assumption about JG1 FW's in the first quote.

Personally i don't see what the problem is, if it flew historically add in in to the game......

The quibble over exact production dates and A8 or A9 quantities is neither here nor there,
I'm sure that late 44-45 putting bums on seats was more the priority than what the seat was attached to and the job it had to do.

:)

And the links are useless for 1945.

Alpha, do try to clue in as this thread has nothing to do with the game but about history.

This is the original discussion, another moderator split the discussion into two threads, it was originally about the game but as this discussions hit rock bottom
I thought I would give some original thread starting input.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=38866

Accurate aircraft production/losses/availability around these times 1944-45 must be at best unreliable with holes in some of the data,
because of the many changes made to units who merged or were replaced to concentrate their fighter units capabilities.
The state of flux probably meant they flew what ever was serviceable at the time regardless of what was produced and sent to serviceable units.

Perhaps if some one actually has 1945 data pertinent to the A9 to share, with the source, it might make interesting viewing,
but not essential as its not important to the game.

:)

This may have already been posted but you can view for info regarding not all being R/11's or unidentified variants.

The Focke-Wulf 190 A-9 Listing Part I
Focke-Wulf 190 A-9s built by Focke-Wulf at Cottbus, PartI

http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/a-9.htm

FW 190 A-9 Listing

W.Nr Stkz. Date Unit Code Remarks
202 170 4./J.G.301 Typo? Crashed after combat 01.01.45 W. Stendal, pilot Uffz. Benno Berkler killed
202 242 1./J.G.301 Crashed at Einbeckhausen after combat 26.11.44, pilot Lt. Fritz Brinkmann killed
202 319 2./J.G.301 Typo for 202 391? Crashed at Röhrensee after combat 21.11.44, pilot Uffz. Willy Peterreit killed
202 360
202 361 3./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Pohle, pilot Ofw. Erich Meyer killed
202 362 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Pretzen, pilot Uffz. Ernst Peiz killed
202 362 4./J.G.301 'Yellow 1 + -' Crashed after combat 05.12.44, location unknown, pilot Lt. Max Kreil killed
202 363
202 364
202 365 5./J.G.301 'White 17 + -' Missing location unknown 08.02.45, pilot Uffz. Heinz Fürste missing
202 366 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Hameln, pilot Uffz. Walter Kircheiss killed
202 367
202 368
202 369
202 370 4./J.G.301 A-9/R11, force-landing after combat 26.11.44 at Niendorf, pilot Uffz. Gottfried Hellriegel wounded
202 371 2./J.G.301 Missing 02.03.45 location unknown, pilot Ofw. Hans Schäfer missing
202 372 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 27.11.44 location unknown, pilot Obfhr. Gerhard Golze wounded
202 373 3./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Hessisch-Oldendorf, pilot Fw. Erwin Seifert killed
202 374 1./J.G.301 Crash-landing after combat at Stendal 21.11.44, pilot Fw. Herbert Böwer wounded
202 375 1./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 27.11.44 at Wetteborn, pilot Uffz. Hans Zaren FSA killed
202 376
202 377 4./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Völksen, pilot Uffz. Anton Schmidt killed
202 378 7./J.G.301 'Yellow 10 + -' Recorded as 208 378, crashed after combat 14.02.45 location unknown, pilot Ofw. Helmut Stöber killed
202 379 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat at Bökau 21.11.44, pilot Uffz. Klaus Jacobi killed
202 380
202 381
202 382
202 383
202 384 1./J.G.301 Crashed during training at Stendal 19.11.44, pilot Fw. Franz Modrow killed
202 385
202 386 4./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 27.11.44 at Hörsum, pilot Uffz. Alfred Bokr killed
202 387 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 05.12.44 at Fürstensee, pilot Fw. Ernst Leyer killed
202 388
202 389
202 390
202 391
202 392
202 393
202 394 1./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 27.11.44 at Göttingen, pilot Uffz. Artur Appelt killed
202 395
202 396
202 397
202 398 1./J.G.301 Crashed at Fl.Pl. Salzwedel 16.10.44, pilot Fw. Georg Scharein killed
202 399
202 400
202 401
202 402 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 20.01.45 at Taucha, pilot Uffz. Josef Idstein killed
202 403 3./J.G.301 Crashed 04.02.45 E. Oder/Neisse, pilot Fw. Franz Domhöfer killed
202 404 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 05.12.44 at Göttingen, pilot Obfhr. Gerhard Golze wounded
202 405
202 406 3./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Nettelrede, pilot Ofw. Josef Löffler killed
202 407
202 408 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 27.03.45 at Salzwedel, pilot Fw. Herbert Müller killed
202 409
202 410
202 411
202 412
202 413
202 414
202 415 7./J.G.301 'Yellow 17 + -' Force-landing at Meerdorf 26.11.44, pilot Uffz. Heinz Schulze wounded
202 416
202 417
202 418 2./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 27.11.44 at Küllstedt, pilot Uffz. Gustav Wimmer killed
202 419 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat at Langensalza 21.11.44, pilot Fw. Viktor Gstrein killed
202 420
202 421 3./J.G.301 'Yellow 15 + ' Crashed after combat at Jena 21.11.44, pilot Obgefr. Franz Harrer killed
202 422
202 423
202 424 6./J.G.301 'Red 7 + -' Crashed after combat 21.11.44 at Könitz, pilot Ofw. Hans Wagler killed
202 425
202 426
202 427 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 25.02.45 at Fl.Pl. Salzwedel, pilot Fw. Gerhard Schmidt killed
202 428 4./J.G.301 Crashed after combat at Rotenburg 31.12.44, pilot Uffz. Manfred Hillert wounded
202 429 7./J.G.301 'Yellow 5 + -' A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Bledeln/Sarstedt, Uffz. Paul Stargardt wounded
202 430 5./J.G.301 'White 4 + -' A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Gronow, pilot Fw. Otto-Georg Müller wounded
202 431
202 432
202 433 7./J.G.301 'Yellow 4 + -' A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Peine, pilot Fw. Friedrich Röglsperger wounded
202 434 3./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 21.11.44 at Langensalza, pilot Lt. Klaus Pagel killed
202 435 1./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 21.11.44 at Gross Möhring, pilot Gefr. Johann Meindl wounded
202 436
202 437
202 438
202 439
202 440
202 441
202 442
202 443 1./J.G.301 Damaged in combat 05.12.44 at Neustrelitz, pilot Fw. Gerhard Koch wounded
202 444 3./J.G.301 Crashed after combat at Possneck 21.11.44, pilot Lt. Hermann Engelhardt wounded
202 445
202 446
202 447 7./J.G.301 'Yellow 8 + -' A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Hestenbeck, pilot Lt. Heinz-Ludwig Günther killed
202 448 3./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 21.11.44 at Klein-Lochmar, pilot and Staffelkapitän Oblt. Heinz Weise FSA and wounded
202 449
202 450
202 565 4./J.G.301 A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Bückeburg 26.11.44, pilot Fw. Emil Schubert killed
202 590 3./J.G.301 Typo? A-9/R11, crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Hessisch-Oldendorf, pilot Uffz. Willi Kuke killed
203 386 4./J.G.301 Typo? Crash-landing after combat 14.01.45 at Kyritz, pilot Fw. Emil Schubert wounded

205 001
205 002
205 003
205 004
205 005
205 006
205 007
205 008
205 009
205 010 1./J.G.301 Damaged during ground-attack mission 25.01.45 at Posen, pilot Fhnr. Gunter Hoffmann wounded
205 011
205 012
205 013
205 014
205 015
205 016
205 017
205 018
205 019
205 020
205 021
205 022
205 023
205 024
205 025
205 026
205 027
205 028 Stab J.G.1 'Green 7 + ' Crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Lewfreda, pilot Gefr. Ernst Nikoleizak killed
205 029
205 030
205 031
205 032 Stab J.G.1 'Green 14 + ' Landing accident 17.12.44 at Fl.Pl. Twente, pilot Uffz. Alfred Podszuweit
205 033 Stab J.G.11 'Black 4 + ' Crashed in Holland or Belgium 01.01.45, pilot and Geschwaderkommodore Oberstleutnant Gunther Specht missing
205 034
205 035
205 036
205 037
205 038
205 039
205 040
205 041
205 042
205 043
205 044
205 045
205 046
205 047
205 048
205 049
205 050
205 051
205 052
205 053
205 054
205 055
205 056
205 057
205 058
205 059
205 060 8./J.G.301 'Blue 6 + -' Crashed after combat 31.12.44 at Eichholz, pilot Uffz. Franz Leeb FSA and wounded
205 061
205 062
205 063
205 064
205 065
205 066
205 067 6./J.G.301 'Red 12 + -' Crashed due to anti-aircraft fire 01.02.45, pilot Lt. Hermann Helm killed
205 068 2./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 14.01.45 at Barenthin, pilot Fw. Otto Sturm killed
205 069
205 070
205 071
205 072
205 073
205 074
205 075
205 076
205 077
205 078
205 079
205 080
205 081
205 082
205 083 5./J.G.301 'White 17 + -' Crashed 19.11.44 at Fl.Pl. Sachau, pilot Uffz. Anton Obermaier killed
205 084
205 085
205 086
205 087
205 088
205 089 4./J.G.301 Crashed after combat 20.01.45 at Dreihaken, pilot Uffz. Gottfried Hellriegel killed
205 090
205 091
205 092
205 093
205 094
205 095
205 096
205 097
205 098
205 099
205 100
205 118 15./J.G.54 'Yellow 1 + ' Force-landing 14.01.45 at Broxten, pilot and Staffelführer Lt. Karl Resch killed

205 180
205 181
205 182
205 183
205 184
205 185
205 186 7./J.G.1 'Yellow 15 + ' Crashed after combat 26.11.44 at Fl.Pl. Stendal, pilot and Staffelführer Lt. Otto Bach killed
205 187
205 188
205 189
205 190
205 191
205 192
205 193
205 194
205 195
205 196 09.44 Fl.Ü.G.1 Crashed due to technical problems 16.09.44 at Nummeltitz, pilot Uffz. Richard Hartmann unwounded
205 197
205 198
205 199
205 200
205 201
205 202
205 203
205 204 16./J.G.54 Crashed after combat 25.12.44 in the St. Vith area, pilot Fhr. Erwin Schomert mising
205 205 II./J.G.1 Crashed at Wiezen after combat 05.02.45
205 206 4./J.G.26 'Blue 6 + ' Landing accident Fl.Pl. Greven 04.11.44, pilot Lt. Heinz Kemethmüller wounded
205 207
205 208
205 209
205 210
205 211
205 212
205 213
205 214
205 215
205 216
205 217
205 218
205 219
205 220
205 221
205 222
205 223
205 224
205 225
205 226 4./J.G.1 'Red 4 + ' Crashed after combat 14.01.45 at Fl.Pl. Twente, pilot Uffz. Wolfgang Kindhauser wounded
205 227
205 228 14./J.G.54 'Black 11 + ' Crashed after combat 17.12.44 in Düren area, pilot Obfhr. Werner Timpe missing
205 229
205 230
205 231
205 232
205 233 09.44 2./J.G.54 'Black 13 + ' Crashed 30.10.44 after combat 12 km N.W. Vainoda, pilot Fw Hugo Welsch missing
205 233 09.44 Fl.Ü.G.1 Crashed at Bronkow near Finsterwalde 25.09.44, pilot Fw. Günther Dallinger killed
205 234
205 235 1./J.G.54 'White 5 + ' Crashed 30.10.44 after combat W. Schruden, pilot Uffz. Gerhard Meinecke wounded
205 236
205 237 1./J.G.54 'White 16 + ' Engine damaged in combat 30.10.44 in Autz area, pilot Uffz. Walter Köpp FSA and killed
205 238
205 239
205 240
205 241
205 242 15./J.G.54 'Yellow 13 + ' Crashed after combat 25.12.44 at Herrschbach, pilot Uffz. Hans Mai killed
205 243
205 244
205 245
205 246 Stab J.G.3 'Red 22 + ' Missing after combat 02.12.44, pilot Fw. Heinz Losch missing
205 247
205 248
205 249 1./J.G.26 'White 2 + ' Crashed due to anti-aircraft fire 21.10.44 at Wesel, pilot Ofw. Heinrich Teilken killed
205 250
205 251
205 252
205 253
205 254
205 255
205 256
205 257
205 258
205 259
205 260
205 261
205 262
205 263
205 264
205 265 13.(Sturm)/J.G.3 'White 6 + ' Crashed after combat 24.12.44 in Luik area, pilot and Staffelkapitän Hptm. Wolfgang Kosse missing
205 266
205 267
205 268
205 269
205 270
205 271
205 272
205 273
205 274
205 275
205 276
205 277
205 278
205 279 6.(Sturm)/J.G.300 'Green 3 + -' Crashed after combat 24.03.45 at Göttingen, pilot Fw. Ewald Preis killed
205 280 4./J.G.26 'Blue 8 + ' Crashed after combat 10.12.44 at Neurath/Grevenbroich, pilot Gefr. Reinhard Anselment killed
205 281
205 282
205 283
205 284
205 285
205 286
205 287
205 288
205 289 1./J.G.26 'White 7 + ' Landing accident at Fl.Pl. Krefeld 15.10.44, pilot Obgefr. Josef Leder killed
205 290
205 291
205 292
205 293
205 294
205 295
205 296
205 297
205 298
205 299
205 300

It would appear that most A-9 production was not 'pure' fighters but all weather fighters.

Source: "Focke-Wulf Jagdflugzeug 190A, Fw190D, Ta152" by Rodeike [Struve-Druck, 1998]

Fw190A-9
Focke-Wulf, Cottbus

WNr.202360 to WNr.202450 - 09.44 to 09.44 - up to 90 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)
WNr.205001 to WNr.205100 - 09.44 to 09.44 - up to 100 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)
WNr.205180 to WNr.205300 - 09.44 to 10.44 - up to 120 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)
WNr.205901 to WNr.205999 - 10.44 to 11.44 - up to 100 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)
WNr.206031 to WNr.206200 - 11.44 to 12.44 - up to 170 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)
WNr.207160 to WNr.207240 - 12.44 to 01.45 - up to 80 examples (mainly Fw190A-9/R11)

Focke-Wulf, Aslau

WNr.490020 to WNr.490050 - 12.44 to 01.45 - up to 30 examples

Unknown

WNr.560020 to WNr.560030 - 02.45 to 02.45 - 10 examples

Mimetall, Erfurt

WNr.750070 to WNr.750160 - 08.44 to 09.44 - up to 90 examples

Norddeutsche Dornier, Wismar

WNr.980150 to WNr.980230 - 12.44 to 01.45 - up to 50 examples
WNr.980360 to WNr.380380 - 01.45 to 01.45 - up to 20 examples
WNr.980540 to WNr.980590 - 01.45 to 02.45 - up to 50 examples (many to Fw190A-9/R11)

Someone has said he has the data and has been asked several times to post the data. This refusal to post the data leads to the conclusion this person does not have the data.

Again, this thread has nothing to do with the game.

If Bundesarchive document material is published here its probably worth looking at, but as far as a discussion goes its null and void as most that's posted here is some one else's research and it all looks regurgitated into another form from the same source, including mine.

The rest of the threads aimed at debunking Crumpps original unfounded post of course,
at best it was made from the same unofficial material everyone else has quoted and interpreted to suit what ever opinion felt that day.

:)

While searching the Inet for something else came across this posted on the Ubi Il-2 board:

Kettenhunde (aka Crump) 12-10-2009

:shock: :shock: :shock: :oops: