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La-7 FM issues and its versions
2 Attachment(s)
There are several issues with La7.
1. The 3 cannon version should be moved to 1945 It went into production only in March of 1945: Quote:
Looks like a reliable source, lots of references in the back of the book, mostly Russian so they probably know what they are talking about. 2. La7s top speed is too high According to il2 compare it sits at ~682km/h @6000m (with boost). Its in game performance is based on the prototype, not on the production units. From the same book is in above example: Quote:
This apparently triggered an official inquiry/tests in August-September of 1944, and test pilots concluded the production model demonstrated unsatisfactory performance - slower speed, +55C in the cockpit, engine overheating while climbing. Quote:
This is a OCRed version, much easier to read than the scanned (I also found that on the Internet and can provide a copy if need) More reports attached. Comparing these reports with Il2 compare figures we can see the that maximum speeds in the game are higher at sea level and 6000m, but sometimes lower than the real thing in between. 3. WEP/supercharger effects. As we can see in these reports WEP power is never used above 2000m because probably the supercharger can't provide enough air anyway. In il2 compare we can see the effects of WEP throughout the whole range of altitudes. BTW this also applies to German planes such as FW and maybe others as well. 4. La7 44/45 differences. As you can see from the attached tables, the 655km/h @ 6000m is actually quite a good figure for a 1944 La7. For example the La-7 #45210150 initially showed only 640km/h. Once they tuned it, enhanced the surface, installed a prototype propeller etc. the top speed figure has substantially improved - 674km/h but this is definitely not a production unit, it is very much "aftermarket tuned" if you know what I mean :) In the 2nd report we can see that in 1945 La7s performance significantly improved - the 2 cannon version reached 677km/h and the 3 cannon one - 661km/h. 5. Turn performance @1000m The 1944 2 cannon La7 shows 20-21sec and in il2 Compare it is 18-18.5sec. This is closer to the 1945 La7 figures of 18-19.5sec. Although it is only 1sec - this is still a ~5% difference and can be quite significant. Not nearly as important as top speeds but still. May I suggest to have 3 versions of La7 instead of current 2? We would have: 1. a 2 cannon 1944 version with top speed about 660 @6k and turn time of 20s @1000m 2. a 2 cannon 1945 version with top speed about 677 @6k and turn time ~19s 3. a 3 cannon 1945 version with top speed ~ 665 @6k and turn time 18s. |
Alternatively if the 2 cannon version differences are deemed insignificant to warrant a new plane entry I suggest we use the
- 1944 2 cannon version for the La7 1944 , - 1945 3 cannon version for the La7 3x20mm 1945 |
Good to see that documentation about russian fighters is showing up. I'm not in for nerfing russians, but I want them to be as real as possible, just as the rest of nationalities are getting.
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Excellent! This again shows that on some aircrafts, FM is based on prototypes. Btw, can you find some detailed info about LaGG-3 and VK-105 powered Yaks? Then we can continue this in the other thread about soviet fighters.
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Solid start Z1024! This is definitely the beginning of some excellent research on such aircraft where you've gone out and dug up some serious resources on it. Rather than just stating it's wrong...you've got some great information. Maybe it can be put to some good use?
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I repeat: Interesting stuff here! Be assured, that it had been recognised.
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and other test - Quote:
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sometimes you are right, but you and all need to understand what this is really mean... about special "доработка" of all aircrafts with defects (like first la-7 from tests) - Quote:
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PS sorry for quoting and my bad english... |
and about "Военная Приемка", author - начальник Главного артиллерийского управления (ГАУ) и член Военного совета артиллерии Советской Армии (here GAU VP, but no matter) -
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so...
in game la-7 mix of good and bad... and if talking about speed next, la-7 too slow at SL - only 605 km/h (prototype have 635-640 km/h at SL) - in RL this basically first series of la-7 with quality problems (this is "norma" for all new soviet models), but after "доработка"... in fact 1/2 or 2/3 of all aircrafts (in end'44 for sure) was la-7s with 580 (nominal) and 612-616 km/h at SL (forsazh), and some planes can be little better, 620-625 km/h at SL... and i think we need (for ALL situations and online wars, and this all JUST SAMPLE) - 1 la-7 with 2xshvak, 605 km/h at SL and 665 at 6000 - 19.5-20 seconds at 1000 - 5.0 min(nominal power) and 4.8 min(forsazh)/5000 km - 3275 kg... 2 la-7 2xshvak, 615/674 - 18.5/1000 - 4.8 and 4.6/5000 - 3234 kg... 3 la-7 2xshvak, 625/680 - 18/1000 - 4.6 and 4.4/5000 - 3232 (faster, at SL, than original la-7, climb little< than original, weight little<than original)... 4 la-7 with 3xb-20, 610/670 - 19/1000 - 4.9 and 4.7/5000 - 3317 kg... 5 la-7 3xb-20, 616/675 - 18.5/1000 - 4.7 and 4.5/5000 - 3315 kg... in game this can look like how "ла-7 тип 45 серия 1" for first la-7 and etc... |
other words about "Военная Приемка" from good "ЛИНИЯ СУДЬБЫ" (about yak-3) -
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and from "Рождение Ла-5 или развитие и доводка мотора М-82 в годы ВОВ" - Quote:
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i think, only different planes="series" without any new mechanism for il-2 46 it's not bad... i mean, free right of choice for player - it's good... |
1984 These are all just your (or somebody else's) opinions, not graphs or figures/tables that can be traced to a more or less reliable sources, so their value from the FM perspective is... somewhat questionable, to put it mildly.
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