A fighter with no name
 

There’s a company (I shall not say which one) that recently posed problems with the name of their seventy years old products. Apparently it did the same in the past. Just take a look at this old plastic kit from the Fifties... Maybe I’m mistaken, but this anonymous “Navy Assault Plane” reminds me a certain fighter (I shall not say which one).
http://i511.photobucket.com/albums/s...do/ASSAULT.jpg

I just dont understand this.

I, naively, considered any advertising is good advertising.

Clearly, the sim world is forcibly ignored by certain companies.

Perhaps those companies CEO types should be made aware of the situation....?

There was/is a situation with an American company that makes lots of money selling military hardware and services. Read this from a current thread at sim central. In particular the answer given by Oleg I dont blame him for being cagey after what happened :(
[quote=DaveKelly]20mm: Several years ago a hot topic were the efforts of some aircraft and race car manufacturers to reinforce their intellectual property and copyrights. Is this an issue you've had to address, and how have you succeeded overcoming any limitations?

Flexman: This is an on-going issue for us. There was a move to pass a law through the U.S. Senate called the “Military Toy Replica Act HR 607” and it keeps being re-introduced but never being passed. The act was written to “prohibit defense contractors from requiring licenses or fees for use of military likenesses and designations.” So you should write to your senator and ask them to support this act if / when it’s re-introduced which was last in 2008. We're trying to obtain an official license but as a small indie outfit it presents something of a legal challenge.

Oleg: Simply don’t make any problematic branches of simulation. It is one of the ways to resolve the problem if they do not want advertising of their production. Really, they should pay developers for the modeling of their production that makes the company more known and kids begin to respect such companies from a young age. /quote]

Yes, it resembles a certain aircraft operated by a certain country, I dare not say which one. For the sake of argument, lets call it "Canada" and refer to the pilots as "South Canadians"

BTW: Have you noticed that the heavy bombers in the Silent Hunter III series are all Lancasters, instead of their trans-atlantic cousins?

That's the Goodman Hillcut I think.

Hillcut is what the New Zealanders called it :-P

I wonder if the Ho 228 will also become unspeakable as the unmentionables made a scale 1:1 model of it to test its stealth capabilities:

http://channel.nationalgeographic.co...#tab-time-line

Be careful! The enemy listens!:(

Speaking half-seriously, if we (God forgive) do not mention the Av***er’s name, could we have a General Motors built TBM, perhaps with the English name of Tarpon, or with no name at all?

I think that the company whose name we can not say were claiming that its "likeness" even a digital model was subject to copywrite. Strangley an add on for Yankee Air Pirate called Rising Sun has the unmentionable aircraft PLUS ships made by the same company that we NEED for Il-2 :(

This affair always make me think of starting a political career to be able to get to a position where I can axe some proposal to buy expensive crap from:
Northrop Grumman

Yes! I said their filthy name loud... May their products all rust and fall to pieces, or get sunk as artificial reefs somewhere.

/Mazex

Not in Il-2, at least not by TD. As for SoW ... sorry, my crystal ball is down for maintenance. :?

LOL! No! Thats a Grunchman Haircut.

I will boycott ANY product promoting "True to life prop action".
I will NOT be back to this thread. good day sir

I said good DAY sir!

Silent Hunter V is even worse... unlike all other nations in the game, the US only has fantasy planes with generic names. Pretty ridiculous.

LOL ... below is a brief overview of the corporation we are talking about, do not expect anything resembling ethical or moral behavior from them.

Their recent history includes bribes, falsifying test data, deliberately supplying faulty products and even kidnapping Indian guest workers.

NG's reputation is so bad the US Government blocked a move by them in the 1990's to merge with Boeing.


Accountability overview:

http://www.crocodyl.org/wiki/northrop_grumman

The first major scandals in Northrop Grumman’s history came in the early 1970s, when the company, then known as Northrop Corp., was embroiled in controversies over illegal campaign contributions to Richard Nixon’s reelection campaign by company chairman Thomas Jones as well as some $30 million in bribes paid to foreign governments to win orders for fighter jets. A few years later, there were revelations that the company regularly entertained Pentagon officials and members of Congress at a hunting lodge on the eastern shore of Maryland. During the 1980s, Northrop was the subject of numerous investigations relating to alleged mismanagement during its work on the MX Missile and the B-2 Stealth bomber.

In 1989, Northrop was indicted on criminal charges of falsifying test results on cruise missiles for the Air Force and Harrier jets for the Marine Corps. Just as the trial in the case was about to begin in 1990, the company agreed to plead guilty to 34 fraud charges and pay a fine of $17 million. Under the plea agreement, federal prosecutors agreed to end the investigations relating to the MX and the B-2. However, the company agreed in 1992 to pay $4.2 million to settle a whistleblower lawsuit—brought without the involvement of the Justice Department—alleging that the company padded its invoices on MX missile guidance system work.

Grumman Corp., acquired by Northrop in 1994, brought with it a history of controversies on issues such as cost overruns in the production of F-14 Tomcat fighters for the Navy, production of defective municipal buses by its Flxible division (sold in 1983) and a bribery scandal involving Iran and Japan.

In 2000 Northrop Grumman paid $1.4 million to settle a whistleblower case alleging that the company overcharged the Air Force for B-2 bomber instruction and repair manuals. In a case inherited through the acquisition of TRW, Northrop Grumman agreed in 2003 to pay $111 million to settle claims that TRW overcharged the Pentagon for work on several space electronics programs in the early 1990s. Also in 2003, Northrop Grumman agreed to pay a total of $80 million to settle two False Claims Act cases, one involving work by Newport News Shipbuilding before Northrop acquired it in 2001 and the other involving the delivery of allegedly defective aerial target drones.

In 2004, Northrop settled for $1.8 million the remaining individual whistleblower case from the late 1980s involving cruise missiles. The following year it paid $62 million to settle the remaining claims relating to overcharging on the B-2 bomber program.

The false claims allegations continue. In March 2008 a whistleblower brought a lawsuit charging that Northrop Grumman’s Melbourne division with hundreds of millions of dollars of overcharges relating to the Joint STARS radar aircraft program.

Not all of Northrop’s performance problems have been related to overcharging. Soon after the U.S. invasion of Iraq, the company’s Vinnell Corp. subsidiary (acquired as part of the purchase of TRW in 2002) was awarded a $48 million contract “to train the nucleus of a new Iraqi army.” It botched the job so badly that the Jordanian Army had to be brought in to take over.
Labor:

Some 17 percent of Northrop Grumman’s 122,000 employees are covered by collective bargaining agreements. Some of the most contentious labor relations have been at the company’s shipbuilding operations. Northrop inherited these relationships when it acquired Litton Industries and Newport News Shipbuilding in 2001.

There had been a bitter dispute dating back to the early 1990s between Avondale Industries and the New Orleans Metal Trades Council, a group of eight unions which had won a representation election for 5,000 workers. Avondale fought the unions, which in turn launched a major corporate campaign against the company. The confrontation deescalated after Litton took over Avondale in 1999 and signed a neutrality agreement with the unions. In 2002, with Litton now part of Northrop Grumman, the dispute was finally settled.

In 2003, there was nearly a strike at the other Litton shipyard inherited by Northrop—the Ingalls operation in Pascagoula , Mississippi. After a 14-day “cooling-off” period a settlement was reached that was approved by a majority of the 7,000 workers covered. Things did not go so smoothly in 2007. The workers in Pascagoula struck the shipyard for 27 days before accepting a revised contract offer from the company.

Members of United Steelworkers Local 8888 at Northrop’s shipyard in Newport News, Virginia ratified a new 52-month contract in 2004.

In 2007 it was reported that guest workers from India employed by Signal International, a Northrop Grumman subcontractor in Pascagoula, were being held against their will.

OH ME! Could there a "USN torp bomber" out there some where???

Nor-Gru is supposedly getting out of the ship-building business (selling or spinning it off), maybe the Enterprise/Hornet could see the light of day...

Imagine what the F22 pilots must think when they're flying...

Doesn't matter if it's a different company...it's american. :grin:

Thanks Galway, that was most interesting.

The show is available on Youtube.

I know I have seen it there too, just was wondering as the unspeakables have the only existing Ho228 and they did a lot of testing with there 1:1 model wonder if they are going to make a fuss about people using "their" booty plane.

Haha, that was a really good one. Made my day. Navy Assault fighter!!



Oleg said it right . . .

its sad . . .

Companies pay for advertising. Free was taken faster than white on rice.

It used to be that smart executives realized free advertising and having your product in as many places as much was good marketing.

Then the greed took over.

Most efficient way to scoop water isn't with your fists really tight. But if you cup your hand . . .





Grownman's PHGPH Hadeskitty. I think the ones that were important to Israel in the 50's and used by armée de l'air in Indochina were called Sheolcats .

Lotta experts on everything online. Too bad you guys didn't help when this was actually news; with your knowledge of everything you lot could have solved this NGC issue in a millisecond, corrected their business practices, and re-discovered the lost alchemical secrets of turning lead into gold!

What you're doing is venting frustration over being absolutely powerless to correct a situation by quacking, which is human nature but jesus, we went through this same bitchfest years ago and now it's all whipping you into a frenzy AGAIN?! Let it go at some time or other. It happened, it's over. Move on. Stop buying Global Security products from NGC or write them a nasty letter about your simulation conniptions but damnation, why do you open up the old wounds with each other?? Masochism, much?