Whats the best plane for Dog fights?
 

I am playing Pacific fighters at the moment. I am waiting for 1946 to come in the mail.

whats the best fighter plane?

I have been using the F4F-3 1941

I have just been getting the hang of flying and rolls with it and turning , take offs, landings, aiming and shooting.
I am starting to learn how to prevent myself from going into stalls and still be able to maneuver fast and take the plane to its limits without going over them and ending up swimming in the ocean.

But I was just wondering if there are better planes to use for what I am doing.

figured it would be faster to ask then to go through the whole list one mission at a time.

Take a La7 then you can cook anything you want during dogfights/duels.

For beginners, I'd recommend the A6M. If you can, take the A6M3 in the 1942 environment. A6M2 in 1941 and A6M5 later are not really competitive. Also, the Ki-84 in 1944 scenarios is a very a good one.

The US birds are generally the better combat planes, but they aren't really great at turning, and thus not that well suited to less experienced pilots. Of these, the F6F is probably the most fun to fly against all but the Ki-84. It still can't turn with them.

I think you'll find the F4F a reasonable plane to learn to fight with. There are many better-performing aircraft, but they are often a bit of a handful for beginners. The narrow landing gear makes the F4F a bit tempramental to land, but otherwise it is a good compromise between stability and manouvreability. You could also try some of the Japanese fighters - most of them handle fairly well.

Once you have got the hand of the Wildcat, try the F4U Corsairs - faster, better armed, but a bit of a handful - don't try turning dogfights with Zeros though, it can't be done!

I'm not sure which planes are included with Pacific Fighters. If there are P-38s try them out - contrarotating props make the handling much nicer. If you are really struggling with takeoffs and landings, try a Hurricane - nice and stable, with a good view forwards.

Every plane has it's pros and cons. The best plane will allways be the one you are best with. For early war style dogfights, the zero is a very good plane, for later yo-yo fighting, some of the later American machines are good. The Seafire falls somewhere in the middle.

The Martlet is a decent allrounder. It does most thing well, but few things exceptionally. If you like her and are getting her to do what you want, you have found a plane that will serve you well in most circumstances, except against end-of-war superfighters. The guns are not much to write home about, but will do adequately against fighters. If you need to take on something bigger, you'll be better served by something with canons.

C-47 - it gives the dogs enough room to properly get at each other.

That's the good answer. ;)

Answer = The one that's shooting you down.

Try to avoid having a favourite plane for as long as you can; although it's natural to develop preferences, they will stymie your understanding of the other planes, which will be flown by your opponents; the other half of the engagement.

The four aspects that you need to appreciate are: You as fighter; you as target; him as fighter; him as target.

Flying exclusively in 'your' favourite plane will leave you understanding half of the engagement very well at the expense of the other half. Flying your opponents plane types will rob you of some time for your favourite, but gain you understanding of your opponents capabilities first hand.

The latter course of action will be slower, but have the greater headroom for development.

Ki-84 is probably my fav plane to dogfight with in the whole series

Ultra-uber-super-fantastic plane.
On it, you can "play" cats and mices vs even La7 ;-)

But of course, the truth is that "Pilots win dogfights. Not airplanes." (read my signature).

the best plane is the one u stick with.... just choose one and fly that one plane till u never stall it, till you figure out its querks.

getting shot down... shooting others down... thats all irrelevent because all u gotta do is click refly

and because if you have to ask this question then it doesn't matter what plane your in, just choose one, and fly that one plane for a few months/years, till u feel like you can do anything in it...

I've been thinking about this. Is it better to stich with one plane, and learn all its quirks, or get a more general knowledge of everything?

I suspect the (possibly unhelpful) answer is 'both'. Pick a plane, and learn its limits, and what to do when you exceed them (you will), but every so often, try something different. I've just been flying an (unmentionable mod) aerobatic aircraft I've never flown before, and doing ridiculous things with it that no sane real-world pilot would attempt without months of practice - and getting away with it. I can do this because I've got sufficient confidence in flying many different aircraft in IL-2, and know when to spot the limits of what is feasible, and not go (much) beyond it. If you only learn one aircraft, you will never be able to predict what another one wil do, but if you don't gain familiarity with a particular aircraft, you will never get any real familiarity with the edges of the flight envelope.

In summary, I'd pick a plane, heave it around the sky until you are bored, than find something else to play about with for a bit. Unlike real-world pilots, a smoking crater is a learning experience (which is why I've learned so much;) )

yep... thats why i was saying till you feel like u can do anything... and why i said months or years... however long it takes till you feel like u can do anything with it... once you got one plane down, you've got the basics perfected, that are the same in every plane, after that, learning the others is fairly simple.

you can't good wrong with any of the spits the all turn well, good speed and good guns and a plus it easy to fly

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/t...3/m/2111070776

edit: wrong link removed

Die Würger for evil Fritzies, P-51 for allies, its the best prop fighter the game has too.

EDIT: that BOP plane guide - almost none of it applies to IL2, and the armament is not much important at all. Either its insufficient, ok or good, at least to me. BOP has afaik unlimited ammunition even with "full realism", I suppose they just spray and pray.

EDIT2: Imho the aircraft guide coming with the game is much more useful.

- Which is the best prop plane?
(actually there is no such thing as a best, only to to your taste...)

- BOP?

- Which aircraft guide? The internal one, with weakness and strength?

With best, I meant generally best. P-51 is not the best in everything, but it is the best in a few things, and one of the very best in a few other, important factors.

BOP. Your second link is to BOP forums. And yeah, the aircraft guide pdf that comes with 1946 DVD.

Ooops - I just googled the second link and failed to check it.
Thx for pointing this out, link removed.

PS: The ingame .pdf does contains lots of info, unfortunately they have little tactical value(imho)

best plane is
 

the NEW one. New best plane . . .


;)



It depends on you.

Annoyance factor, choose something like the chaika or the oscar. If you like doing turn n burn, zero, or spit/seafire

if you like boom n zoom p-47 or p-38, or the raiden

Gunnery wise, do like chipping away with .50 cals or you can land 30mm cannons and one hit wonder something with the p-39?


Also depends on the quirks of certain planes. For example, the Corsair is great but if you go below a certain speed, it handles funny and your gun accuracy drops . . .


I'm more of a cannon person, so most uS inventory I can hang and fly with but . . .

Why not start with the 109 like the ones here from the il2 demo days... No other plane has that "big brute plane hanging in the prop" feeling like the 109 with the slats out and the stall warning screaming...

After mastering the 109 - the Ki-84 or the La-7 are nice all round late war dog fighters like mentioned earlier here...

The best fighter I flew is the Tempest (altought not being a pure fighter).
Great speed,good handling,nice armament.I like the Ki-61 too.

The F4U's on 25 or 50% fuel are pretty nice. They have decent turn rate and roll pretty well. Plus the F4U 1C has 4 cannons on it w/ enough ammo to sink the entire Japanese fleet. There is also teh Spitfire, any model gives a new meaning to turns on a dime b/c that plane has amazing turn radius, plus it has cannons =D

Just an observation but most SIM matches on BOP are generally set with limited fuel and ammo and there are no a/c icons or padlock features in sim mode.......(have to defend it as I like it!) Time to get me hat and coat me thinks.....:grin:

I suppose you have to ask yourself how do you like to fight.

Do you turn endlessly despite the aircrafts capabilities?

Do you never engage without significant height advantage, and fire only whilst diving, never turning?

Do you prefer sneak attacks or try to get head on shots hoping for the engine kill?

Is your gunnery to the point where you can line up cockpit shots without thinking, or do you prefer machine guns with their bigger ammo load supporting those low percentage long range shots?

Decide these things:

Where do I usually attack from?

Can I hit my target reliably?

Whats my country preference?

Do i like cannons or machine guns?

Do i fly looking rearward or prefer power to make sure things get smaller behind me rather than larger?

Once you've covered those general points, then you'll have a selection of aircraft that will do you well.

srsly...double post...now how did i do that?......

Lolz, the questions are there, I gotta awnser them haha.

Do I turn endlessly? yes....I turn all the time....even when I dont need to really...true story

I attack when I see an enemy....thought I do almost always attack from above....altitude is always a good advantage to have

I try to dive in from above and get on the 6 o clock, drill em and move on.

My gunnery is kinda shotty, mostly b/c the joystick ive got always goes down to the left....even after calibrating it. I prefer close range 0.27-0.10 range shots w/ cannons or 50 cals...thsoe give me the best results haha

I go for 6 o clock

i hit quite a bit, my gunnery is aight I guess

nation? idc what one it is just as long as the plane fits my box haha

20mm cannons, they have good ammo load and give pretty quick result if they hit. 50cals b/c they are easy to hit with and produce pretty effective results only after a litle bit of plinking away at the enemy.

30cals.....worst...guns...EVAR!!!
30-57mm cannons I dont care a whole lot for b/c they dont carry any ammo, kick like a mule resulting in you cant hit the broadside of a Battleship....Surely they are simply devastating and ive put that to good use a time or two but I usually miss b/c the big cannons also fire so slow and the planes fly so fast that they simply miss..one round goes in front of the plane the other right behind its tail and the plane is missed entirely.

At the end of the day the plane I have found I do the best in are the Spitfire.....its I guess a "noob plane" but I think its simply the bomb. It has decent speed, turns on a dime....the only thing I dont like about it is its armarment. Surely it has cannons but it has 4 30cal MGs that arent worth spit in a bucket.
I have also wrecked me many a bot in the P40 M42, that planes is actually quite nice, turns well has good armarment but doesnt climb worth a hoot and its overall kinda slow...
the newest addition is the F4U 1C or 1D on 25 or 50% fuel loads. The 1c is like simply beautiful, its got the firepower I always dreamt of, 4 20mms and a boat load of ammo and with the lower fuel load its only slightly worse in turning and such as the P40. Its pretty bloody fast and it handles extremely well at low speeds 190-220KPH and its a breeze to land. One thing I hate about it is that black cap that is over the top of the cockpit right where you would be looking to check your six....cant see a hot-diggety-dog gone thing one my six in that plane... however, All in all I quite like it...the Only Navy planes ive grown to like at all.

I'm amazed about the fact that noone mentioned Yak-3 and J2M, the best two dogfighters in the sim in my humble opinion.

Mi favourite dogfighters in game are the FW190D9 and FW190A8. Ta152C was better than these previous planes in reality, but not in the sim, is completelly underpowered.

Just fight over 6K and this two beauties are doomed.

Gunkan, the J2M5 is as fast as P47 and p51 at alts above 6000m(or so). ;)

Compared to late war American and German fighters, the Jak-3 is too slow and too limited to low and medium alts, starts to lose engine power quickly after 4000m. J2M to high alts only... Personally I find the VK107 powered Jak-9U much better, ahead of La-7, but still behind P51, P47 and late FW190s.

I would like to see you in an A8 making defensive maneuvers mate.

Just fight below 6K and these two beauties will eat anything alive in an istant.

Plus - J2M5 is the best high altitude fighter in the sim, maybe only Ta 152 C or P-47 could compare with it at high altitudes.

Agreed.

A Fw190 of any type caught in a defensive position by a fighter like a Spitfire IX will almost certainly be destroyed, barring having a lot of altitude to dive away or interference from friendly aircraft.

Not that the Fw190 can't be a very effective fighter, but it bleeds energy very rapidly when forced into defensive manoeuvres, and lacks the energy building potential and low-medium speed manoeuvrability that some of the other top range fighters like the Spitfire IX 25lbs, LA7 or Bf109K4 have.

I would add that it does depend on the position and some other variables... D9s for instance are good accellerators and have the potential to to extend while the Antons at least the later ones are a bit lacking.

Early War Antons are more like the Dora series. They have enough accelleration to get away from Spits.

The last set of planes you posted are what I consider abnormally good planes. Spit 25 and LA7s are a bit on the silly side in terms of performance and render any Anton obsolete. A Dora might have a chance. The regular K4 is a good plane but not on part with the former. I would say the K4 C3 can put up a much better fight though I still say it goes to the Spit 25 and the LA7.

I-16 RATA and I-153. Simple turn and go hth, "cheater" ammunition gives pk 70% times.

Mig ammunition the same, but turns less. "Hyper full mega master power highlander pk ammunition"

I meant to put Bf109K4 C3, like you said the regular K4 is somewhat lower in performance, and since the only assets a late model Bf109 pilot has are top speed, climb rate, acceleration and to a lesser extent low speed handling, you want to have as much of these attributes as possible.

Of course, your right, the Spitfire IX 25lbs, LA7, Bf109K4 C3 and Fw190D9, along with the Ki-84, are very much the best rides in the sim (although mod users like myself have access to some other aircraft I would put in the same category, ie Spitfire XIV, P51-D, Ta152C, Tempest 13lbs etc), and as such you can expect to come across these aircraft very regularly online, so how your chosen ride copes with these aircraft is very important.

... on some servers. If all you are interested in is a furball dogfight, then pick your favourite uber-plane. I got bored with this sort of online experience quite quickly. I'd rather have a limited planeset, and more realistic goals. Flying the 'best plane' is less satisfying than being the 'best pilot', or at least doing the best you can.

I really enjoyed some of the I-16 Type 5 versus G.50 and Cr.42 dogfights that I've jumped into more recently. Those are always a blast and the usual dogfight experience changes considerably.

Best is always determined by what the planeset/time period is and of course the pilots.

Agreed.

The early war scenarios can be at least as much fun ;)
http://img810.imageshack.us/img810/1552/scw1.jpg

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/806/scw2.jpg

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/2779/scw3.jpg

Lol, I tried to dogfight a normal AI who I put in an I16 and couldnt get on his tail for nothing, I had I think my Spitfire....those BI planes turn on a pinhead....they seem to just stop in mid air and flip around.

Mustang 3 and P-51D are the 2 best prop pulled fighters of the game. Stock, unmodded game.

Mustang 3 can outrun any prop plane, and outclimbs all but Bf 109 K-4 C3. It easily outturns all 190s and all 109s but the G2, which turns roughly as well. P-51D is not so impressive, but it still has speed advantage(depending on altitude) against almost anything it has to face, outturns all 190s and most 109s, but has better cockpit visibility and armament over the Mustang 3. They are good 1 vs 1, and many vs. many using proper tactics, its a shooting range against just about anything.

The "dogfight" can be more than turning near the stalling speed at 0 altitude. ;)

Yes they are acrobatic, its difficult to kill if they are aware of you. They are slow and not a threat if you have altitude and wants to run, but do not go head on! Sometimes they fire at very large distances and smoke your engine or gives pk.

I usually dogfight spits with stukas, at low speeds they are evil ehehehe. Problem is the lack of powerfull ammunition. Stuka gunner sucks too.

Of course, otherwise I would have a very low opinion of the Fw190 ;)

I'd forgotten the Mustang III was a stock aircraft, but in any case it does not outclimb the Spitfire IX 25lbs, and the Fw190D9, LA7 and Ki-84 are all very close in performance, and some even outclimb it at certain altitudes.

Sure, its fast and more agile than the late war German fighters, but the armament of 4x.50cals are barely adequate at best, and inadequate to stand any real chance of getting snapshots on the tough Dora 9 and Bf109G-K models.

In the right hands the Mustang III or P51D can be very effective, but its not as overwhelmingly powerful as you have suggested.

For the sake of the P51 pilots its perhaps just as well they don't have to face the Spitfire 25lbs and the even more deadly Spitfire XIV, which I would rate as a superior fighter to any Mustang in either modded or unmodded versions of Il2.

A properly trained WW2 aviator was the "right hands". ;) Or a good il2 pilot who actually thinks about survival, and knows team tactics(further than flying as just a pair). It has only adequate guns yep, but they are more than enough. Flown with some brains, it doesnt have to let anyone in the guns range, unless if bounced at low altitude.

I dont know how "the mods" model the Spitfire XIV, as far as I know, it traded some qualities for the low and medium altitude speed it gained with the Griffon engine...

The Spit IXc 25lbs is crap above medium alts too. HF IXe is usually much more useful.

For me, you are totally wrong mate. FW-190A-8 can be a good fighter at low level in the hand of a good pilot. The key lies in the rolling skill of pilot.

IMHO Spitfire 25lbs

The Mustang does indeed work well when flown in groups, using the proper tactics, and I would agree that a properly trained WWII fighter pilot or experienced Il2 pilot are the "right hands".

However, it is not invulnerable. A couple of years back I flew a Dora 9 as wingman to a friend of mine (I've since gone on to flying first 109s and then Spitfires), and our preferred tactics were to get a good deal of altitude and then go looking for the P51s that fly above dogfights and make diving passes on the dogfighting planes bellow, before using their speed and the cover provided by other Mustangs using the same tactics to avoid retribution.

We in turn would use the same technique to kill the Mustangs, but instead of trying to climb clear after one pass we would keep diving, while looking for other targets, then both leave the fight in a pre-arranged direction so we could cover each other in case one or other had been followed down by a Mustang. Using these tactics we on occasion racked up as many as 10 kills between us in a sortie, while remaining almost invulnerable. None of the dogfighting aircraft or the Mustangs could ever touch us while we were diving, and when one of us was followed down by a Mustang, the pilot generally wasn't expecting to be hit by the other Dora which would be travelling at a huge speed very low to the deck.

The Spitfire XIV as modded performs very much as you would expect the real thing to do. The version modelled is the 18lbs boost version, so it is slightly slower than the later 21lbs version, but it is still about 30mph faster than the HF MkIX at any altitude, which is very useful, while being slightly faster in a climb at most altitudes. Turn rate suffers because of the greater weight, but not so much that it isn't one of the best turning late war fighters. The increased torque makes control at low airspeeds harder, but it is still a pleasant aircraft to fly.

Compared to the Spitfire 25lbs it is only slightly faster at low altitude, so down low the more manoeuvrable IX 25lbs would probably be the better choice, but up high the XIV is hugely superior and remains on par for speed with even the P51, although slower than the Mustang III down low. Having the 21lbs version of the XIV would go someway to making up this speed deficiency.

As far as which is the most usable Spitfire in stock Il2, this in my opinion would be the LF IX. Given that it has the performance figures of an F IX, even down to the different supercharger ratios kicking in at the correct altitude for the Merlin 63 instead of the Merlin 66, it is the best allrounder, and is faster than the HF IX up to 21,000ft. It also comes with a better choice of wing types and armaments.
Did I ever say the Fw190A was not a good low level fighter in the hands of a good pilot?:)

I'm sure you will agree however, that part of being a good pilot of any Fw190 is not getting caught at an E disadvantage by pilots of more manouverable fighters.

Thats what i am not agree with you. You do not need E for fight low level fight. A good pilot knows how to handle that slowcoach plane at low speed. But plus E gives extremely advantages as you said.

J2M and N1K1 looks very nice at dogfight,don´t seem to be troublesome.
I don´t really like dogfighting with the FW-190 and F4U,both can dangerously stall with minimun damage.A single microscopic hole in F4U wings can make it spin wildly.

Mosquito is also a great fighter,even for a two engined plane.You can shoot down Bf-109Es with it.

For earlier planes and biplanes,the best one is CR-42.People say the SAFAT guns are horrible,but it can snap parts of even strong planes like the I-16.
The I-16 is good too,good handling (but doesn´t spin like the FW-190),can endure a good amount of damage and the guns are neat.