Well.. if no one else wants to do it I can hurd the cats! ;)

Ill start a group PM this weekend.. We can discuss our goals and work from there. S!

No...you did not read the link.

Once a fuel is blended, it is considered consumed just I told you before. I just pointed out the error in fact you are making.

My personal belief is the RAF operated 16 squadrons on the fuel as that is what our facts say. No need to build a house of cards based on crude, one-dimensional, speculation and factual error.

Here is a PPT presentation on the tax issues of gasoline production. The important take away is the Terminal does the blending from Gasoline stocks(see page 8 ). Now there are different types of gasoline stocks. You don't use car gasoline stock to produce 100LL aviation fuel. Just like 100 grade aviation fuel used during WWII, 100LL has its own blend-stock but like all gasoline products it must be blended at the terminal just before delivery to the customer to make the finished product.

http://www.api.org/meetings/topics/t...ar_Garza-2.pdf

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Sure Eugene, that is why this paper says 'weekly issues' instead of the word 'weekly consumption'.

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.o...-100octane.jpg

Lots of gum flapping without listing those 16 squadrons.

Which is exactly what you're doing, and you will clearly stick to your core belief come hell or high water. Not a problem. ;)

If you want to continue to believe that for some obscure reason the RAF issued 62,000 tons of 100 Octane fuel, then consumed 52,000 gallons, while only needing some 16,000 tons to fly every sortie flown between July 10 and October 6 then okay, that's your pigeon. :cool:

If you want to stick to the story that the RAF only allowed 16 squadrons to use the fuel, based on an abbreviated, pre-war transcript of what was probably a lengthy discussion - go ahead. :cool:

If you honestly believe that modern peacetime practices equate to 1940s wartime conditions when, as I will repeat - because you can't seem to grasp this tiny issue - the RAF was fighting off a full scale air assault, hey go for it! :rolleyes:

Alec Harvey-Bailey, The Merlin in Perspective, (Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust, Derby, 1983)
http://www.spitfireperformance.com/r...yce-100oct.jpg

W.G. Dudek and D. R. Winans, excerpt from AIAA Paper No. 69-779, Milestones in Aviation Fuels, (Esso Research and Engineering Company, New York 1969.)
http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.o...-42363-319.jpg

A. R. Ogston, excerpt from History of Aircraft Lubricants (Society of Automotive Enginees, Inc. Warrendale, PA USA), p. 12.
http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.o...cants-pg12.jpg

Just explain to everyone why it is that people far more qualified than you say the fuel was blended at the refineries, then shipped to Britain as 100 Octane fuel? (Not forgetting, either, that 100 octane was also blended in Britain, which is why some of the Beaconhill fuel was set aside as a sample.) And please explain why people, who are far more qualified than you, tell us that the switchover to 100 Octane for all Spitfires and Hurricanes was in March 1940?

And please explain why the same rules don't apply to other grades of aviation fuel? Why is it that you accept entirely the proposition that the RAF can issue and consume 87 Octane fuel, which is also blended, in large quantities and you have no similar objections? Hmmm? Why apply this logic ONLY to 100 Octane fuel?

You are of course free to believe what you like but you cannot claim any facts, for instance.

a) You do not know which squadrons
b) You do not know which stations
c) You do not know how it was to be distributed
d) You do know the roll out schedule,
e) You do not even know if the schedule was kept at 16 fighter squadrons as the last para states that this is subject to change.

Now if you can prove any of the above, you might have a case as without any proof you do not have any facts

Can you list the facts you do have.

Indeed. The 16+2 squadrons were planed, and we don't have a document that proofs that the numbers of the plan were reached, not reached or even exceeded.
Of course we have the combat reports that show way more squadrons. Remains the "rotation theory" but this is clearly wrong. There are combat reports of 41 Squadron that proof the use of 100 octane fuel during their time in Hornchurch (11 Group) and few days later when they were back in Catterick (13 Group).

Now, now Banks stop providing facts that will be ignored by Eugene. He has ignored them before, so why do you think he will not ignore them again.

Well, this thread is both quite interesting and yet also rather demented in its last 50 pages or so.

From all the arguments and counter-arguments posted, it seems clear that the following can be derived :
100 octane fuel was used by ( a substantial number of/a lot of/quite a few ) Fighter Squadrons.
87 octane may have been used by ( a few/some ) Squadrons as well.

Therefore the ideal solution would be for the Devs to model both and allow Mission-builders to determine airfield availability.

Isn't this what most (all ? ) of us would prefer to see ?

Demented? :rolleyes: Considering that those with little or no evidence to prove their case -
ie: that the RAF only allowed 1/3rd to 1/2 of the frontline fighter squadrons (Hurricane, Spitfire, Defiant) to use 100 Octane fuel -
were hiding their lack of evidence behind a smokescreen of bluster, red-herrings and diversions "...a tale told by an Idiot, full of Sound and Fury Signifying Nothing."

while demanding 100% iron-clad proof, down to the last crossed t and dotted i, that the RAF allowed all front-line fighter units to use 100 Octane fuel throughout the B of B - things got a little...demented. ;)

Apart from anything else the amount of 100 Octane fuel issued and consumed, versus the amount needed to accomplish all of the frontline daylight sorties carried out by Fighter Command from July through October 1940, should be enough on its own to show that the probability that all front-line Hurricanes, Spitfires and Defiants used 100 Octane fuel throughout the battle, is extremely high.

"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?

Arthur Conan Doyle