You've good points be sure, but IL2 is an example of a word which has lost its primary meaning in the customers feeling, first of all for the western customers and if Ubi has decided for it, we are not so few as we could think.
In Russia, IL2 is an aircraft with a particular meaning (the same is for the SU-25), but for the others is only a "Red Star" that does remember them the best sim they have had for 10 years, and 10 years are really a lot for a product.

But what you say about new customers is correct.

I think this is one of the best options...
Or:

STORM OF WAR
Battle of Britain
The new sim from Oleg Maddox Team, the makers of IL-2

How about..

IL-2 Sturmovik Presents
Battle of Britain: Their Finest Hour

oh no, no problem, i commented as i thought it a nice touch to have the tail bars as part of the marking layer, gives it the fully marked up "captured" look
all the mud movers will not thank you for that!
you've built up the reputation to allow you to trade on your name i'd say. il2, 10 years on, is the gold standard for combat flight sims. anyone else made a game that is still, 10 years on, held up as an example of how things should be done?
concur
best option tbh. it may sound daft to forum regulars, but there will be people who have played il2 and have no idea that BoB is an upcoming release. but when they see it on the box...

For me, "Storm of War :" sounds great as the series title, then *insert here* for particular instalment. As has been previously mentioned, IL-2 vets will buy this no matter what, they are already sold. It's the newbies and those curious about WWII combat flight sims you need to attract.

Nothing wrong with including something like "from the makers of IL-2:Sturmovik" as a sub header either, probably a good idea. Its a quality brand and many of those who are not flight sim nuts have heard of it.....In the same way that those who know nothing about American football or Ice Hockey have heard of Dan Marino and Wayne Gretzsky! :grin:

Its win win all the way, no matter what you call it this will be a success, be sure. ;)

Doesn't look too bad either. :)

Doesnt look bad at all JAMF, not bad at all:grin:

Whenever I see a movie being released that says..." from the makers of...."
or " from the director of...." I always think that the new film must stink as they wouldn't bother saying that otherwise !!!!


keep it simple -

Battle Of Britain, The flight sim - by 1c/Maddox games

Battle Of The Med, The flight sim - " " "

Battle Of Korea, The flight sim - " " "




ps - by the way Oleg what's the release date?

!!!!!! THATS it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IL2 is the brand recognized worldwide.

Doesn't make sense to change the branding after over 10 years of very positive success with it. Changing it would just confuse people and possibly help competitors.

IL2 is terrific... a 3 letter brand associated with the highest quality air combat flight simulator.

Nope, I say keep the gal you brought to the dance. You'll not regret it.

Look at MSFT and others they all try to create identity for their brands into a few letters...

Halo, WoW, MoH, EAW, etc.

I still think ---- Auntie's Outhouse has a nice ring to it, and it can translate to AOH.

Hehe :D

I think Storm of War, if possible, is better than Maddox Simulations. Purely because it gives an idea of the game genre, it works well for all subsequent combat-flight-sims, and also it's catchy.

Maddox Simulations sounds very professional, but in a title as such may sound a bit too vein? For example, "Infinity Ward: Modern Warfare_"
The Infinity Ward name may come into the title, but usually only to present the game: "Infinity Ward presents", and with JAMF's example we already have: "The Creators of Il-2 Sturmovik Present..."
If Maddox Simulations was to be in the title, I don't think it should be part of the main-title in this way.
Just my 2P ;)

Il-2 is out, the airplane isn't in the Battle of Britain.

War Birds: Battle of Britain
Birds of War: Battle of Britain

Everybody knows what a War Bird is.

I think Storm of War: .... is a really good choice, it's new. There are a lot of suggestions made already that there will be more than flight addons, you can man already AAA, so in future addons you can possibly also man cars, tanks etc.
I don't think choosing il2 as a name for SoW is a good idea since the name is already being used by others with their il2 sturmovik :Bids of Prey :confused:.
Il2 is a plane so that would be a strange name for a tank simulator. And SoW uses a new engine, so that's another reason to call it different.
And maybe it's becomming a little bit confusing. People can say CoD 7 etc, but can we say il2.7? I don't think so.
If SOW will be called il2 sturmovik there will be:
il2 sturmovik
il2 sturmovik: forgotten battles
il2 sturmovik: pasific fighters
il2 sturmovik: 1946
il2 sturmovik: birds of prey (by different creators, it's no simulator and lacks a lot of things (good damage models, mission builder etc))
il2 sturmovik: wings of prey (also not by Oleg Maddox Games)
il2 sturmovik: battle of britain (by Oleg Maddox Games, new engine, simulator)
il2 sturmovik: Battle for Moscow
il2 sturmovik: Korean Theater Ops
il2 sturmovik: aarg! too much!

I'd say keep the "Storm Of War" title.
Is already very well known everywhere. People talked about it for few good years already. That's many years of "advertisment" you should not loose.
A lot of people that don't follow this forums, already know what SoW is going to bring to the table. Don't lose them as potential customers by introducing a new title they never heared about. Your game, with a new title, could be on the shelves and many people could still be waiting for Storms of War.

You should definitely add "from the creator of Il-2" in some form or another.:)

+1, well said ;)

Well, DCS is still LOMAC and it still is Flanker . Still the name changed every time the Engine changed. Albeit last time becouse of who else, yes Ubishit, er soft... Still Everybody know DCS is LOMAC but with a better engine. The link being the ED logo on all af their product, just as 1C and Maddox Games logo will be on SoW series.

The same way I feell its onlly logical to change the name of the series to Strom Of War, becouse of the new engine that will include evereithing good from Il-2 But a lot, lot more...

my HUMBLE opinion.

when i talk to my friends it goes always somehting like this

"hye guys a new update of SOW is out"

"sow?"

"yeah, the new il2"

"ahhh, show me! show me!"


neverthelesse, this just mainly becosue in my langiuage SOW when read soudns rather awfull and hard to understnad while IL2 is catchy.
o nthe other end, calling il2 to the new sim would be pointless and sord of a lie.

"il2: battle of britain" - but you cant fly il2 tough.

keep it SOW. and more inportant than that, its going to stay BOB, becosue no matter our opinion, the name has been decided even before i started playing il2 the first place.

You forgot

IL-2 Sturmovik: Battle For North Africa or Battle For The Mediterranean

with of course appropriate fonts and text sizes and colours

I thinks short and snappy will appeal to the market.







,

:) "The Creators of Il-2 Sturmovik Present..." I took from one of your previous posts.

Maddox Simulations I took from mr. Maddox mentioning they had suggested "Oleg Maddox Combat Simulations", but removing 'combat' leaves room for 'non-combat sims' and makes the name short, snappy and all business.

Text fonts and size just make it look nice. Verdana for the top and Times for the bottom. :cool:


[EDIT] If SoW is still an option, it has preference. It already has a presence here and been with us some time, so from marketing point of view it has a base/foundation.

I definitely think Maddox Simulations should have a part. For non-combat games, as you say, it will work really well.
I really hope SoW is an option, because for me it's such a great name ;)

Oh I like this. You could just change where "The Battle Of Britain" is in the title each time and add on came out. This is the best idea yet in my opinion.

you should thinking "market"...
if i'm a newbee who bought il2 surmovik : battle of britain and who like it...
if in shop i see IL2 sturmovik: 1946, i surely buy it thinking it's the sequel...


for me, i do not care the name, and i hope the question of naming is not delay the release

il2 sturmovik: battle of britain is the same confusion than il2 sturmovik : pacific fighters
and it did not prevent release it

Absolutely the new sim should be introduced, for example on the DVD cover and advertising, with a reference to IL2 and Oleg, but not in the actual *title*. The title itself should just be "Storm of War"; short and meaningful. Something like:

Oleg Maddox and the creators of the award-winning IL2 Sturmovik series present...
Storm of War: Battle of Britain

name
 

in my opinion a new name is a good idea, but to make other remember of its roots to il2 maybe put something liek a signature tehy wrote thanking us in il1946 cover.:

-------------from the creators of the Il2 ( sturmovik series)
----------------------- ''The name of the series''

this to show
the expansion-----------''Battle of Britain'' although this might be the title itself
or
---------------------------Battle of moscow


and here or up the main title : From the creators of the [successful] ( legendary) Il2 series
so u have a new name of the series, you remember the il2 series
and you put other names below for the pack like BoB
thanks
PS i do not prefer something that says oleg maddox( but ok the maddox games), not for not respect, in the contrary i admire his dedication, as he is not alone in the dev, there is a team and i think all of it has to be recognized

name?
 

if we are speaking about the evolution of il2 series, then the perfect name should be:

IL3: Batle of ....

trulu

Yes!
And the sequels might be IL4,IL5,IL6...
Very clever!:rolleyes:

I remember how much of a kick I got out of the box art from "Pacific Fighters". It was a great box and also for once in a blue moon a Zero wins a fight in a advertisement for some product sold in North America.


Box

http://uk2.shopto.net/boxart/PCPA00SG.jpg

There has to be room for non-combat add-ons. Therefore '...War' is not suitable.

If there is eventually to be a tank add-on, and civlian aircraft, then the name shouldn't exclude these.

Maddox Simms flight simulator(MSFS)?
...arrgghhhhh, it has already been done :-(


xxx...Simulations is the best option , I think.

1C sims
One See sims
ONE SIM
Maddox sims
Oleg Maddox sims
OM sims
Sim Storm
Banana sims
etc.

I think that SoW is a very strong title name. to not mention War/Combat in the title would seem like throwing away all the hard work on the DM. Microsoft make 'Simulators' and nothing says nerd like the word Simulator. Want to appeal to new audiences then Storm of War is the kind of name that would have people picking the box up who wouldn't normally pick a flight sim box up.

I think that IL-2 is a strong brand and having a logo that says 'IL-2 Studios' or something similar (like the 1c games logo), maybe a good way to keep the IL-2 name on the box without confusing things.

Then you could also introduce other series but have them all under the IL-2 Studios name.. We need to see that Red Star somewhere!

1c reads too much like One Cent. It makes any associated product sound like a no-frills, low quality offering. Makes me think more of capsule toys or vending machines.

That's a good thought, Feathered. 1C could be misconstrued that way in the West. Having said that, the best argument IMO is having the name identified somehow with Oleg Maddox's reputation.

Guys and girls, please don't forget that 1C already have an existing product line called "Theater of War".

Looking good 1C! 1st day buyer here. Q:Will the german aircraft have the hekenkreuz on the tail in the campaign?

1 c games


http://www.1cpublishing.eu/games

I agree, this is perfect.

Using the name Oleg Maddox in the main title doesn't seem approriate to me, for reasons already stated, among others.

Maddox Games would be alright IMO, ie. 'Maddox Games Presents'.

I think IL-2 in the main title should be avoided, for varying reasons, but should definitely be included around the main title, ie. 'From the creators of the award-winning IL-2 Sturmovik Series'.

It could be a combination of both, but for the main title, I think it should either be purely descriptive and functional, or purely creative and enigmatic. That is, it should just tell you straight up what's in the box, or it should make you wonder what is.

'Storm of War' does neither of these things for me, and has a lot of negatives in other regards too.

As for aiming the main title at casual game-players, it may catch a few new customers but could easily result in too much of a compromise of the other elements the title should have, and I personally have little time or respect for such forms of advertizing.

I've come up with a few typical sounding titles that I myself think are alright, and which I could even attempt to justify in various ways, but I doubt they'd be considered, and again, I'm not really interested in any of those Air/Sky/Cloud/Fighter/War type variations, it's been done to death IMO.

Going off on a different tangent, the latest one I've been thinking of is - AVSIM+

This is obviously one of the more purely functional titles. It does have something of an enigmatic aspect to it as well though. People in the know will understand it's an AViation SIMulation, but most people wouldn't. And those who get the AVSIM bit, won't know just by the title what the PLUS or + bit means, and so may be drawn to find out. What that plus refers to of course is the combat aspect that is lacking in general aviation sims, and it could also refer to the non-flying combat elements that this new series has the potential to include (and will include to some limited extent right from the start).

Anyway, at the end of the day, I'm not really into marketing (obviously) and I don't care too much what it's called. I can say though, there's no variation on 'Storm of War' that I'll be able to talk out loud about with anyone in the general populace. 'Storm of War' or 'S.O.W' or 'sow' (ffs) just sound embarrasing to me when I actually say them out loud. But that's just me, people can try that for themselves and make up their own minds about that.

P.S.

The first installment inthe series doesn't have to be call 'Battle of Britain' either, it could just be called 'Britain 1940'.

So, you'd have something like this (with or without the first two lines)-



:grin:

This title would be too neutered and watered down. It doesn't really grab you.
"Battle of Brittain" tells you exactly what it's about.
"Brittain 1940" could be an old travel report.

And AvSim+ sounds like a nutritional supplement. ;)

The great George Carlin had it right:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNk_k...AB13C6&index=5

Try to abbreviate: Maddox Simulations = MS (M$?) :-P To some people this combination of letters is like curse word.

Not only the name must be good, but abbreviation too, because abbreviation is what is used 90% of time.

I think with the above title and some fantastic box art we'll have them hooked

From the creators of Il2
Storm of War - Battle of Britain

It has been talked about since November 2006 and now suddenly a need for a name change?
Have I missed something? :)

Ah hah

I love it Immermann. I'm here filling out my time card for work and I'm chuckling all the way threw it....Thanks for putting this up.

We can't really have WWII as a heading to stick with each release, since it doesn't apply to campaigns like Korea.

I like the look of this, but using 'part one, part two' etc would only work for me if the series was released in chronological order. If part three was korea, then part four was the pacific it would seem odd to me.

Surely any 'add-on' will be part of the theatre of war, otherwise it won't be an add-on. You can't have someone popping over to Paris in their Cesna suddenly seeing a squadron of 109s heading towards them.

It was ok for Sid Meier, and Oleg's name is similarly linked with a quality genre.

I understand your point about the title being either descriptive or creative, and I think it Battle of Britain is included with Storm of War then it is descriptive. When future releases are made, the name Storm of War will be known, so it will already be descriptive regardless of which release it is.

'sow' is awful, but then we all know better than to talk to the general populace about the geeky flight sim we play. If you're going to tell a non geek about the game, you don't use the title. I never told anyone about 'IL2', I just said a WWII flight sim. AvSim+ wouldn't be any better in that respect (although I have nothing against the name).

Good point.

Indeed :) This is just right to me, and most people in this thread seem to go along with this basic idea.

Because, if ubi is involved,it sounds like they want to call it il2...

Mmm, wel the first half was good, but it seems he stopped thinking and just started spouting drivle by the end. A bit OT though.

It's 1C-Softclub that wanted to call it "IL-2", not Ubi, as far as we know.

Perfect - keep it nice and simple!!

(OMG was obviously a joke, but hey, it could work :) )

1CiL-2SoWBoB......simple.

With appropriate text and graphics and a lovely picture blah blah blah. Inspiration taken from the Pacific Fighters box art. the Storm of War bit is to build brand awareness if that's what they want to do.

replace The Battle of Britain with Kämpfen um dem Scheißekanal for the German version.


Hood

lol

By the way, Oleg threatened to lay out (today) this Friday video from presentation
Oleg, au-uuu...

Sorry,what do you mean? He did say there may not be an update as they are really busy.

That was last week.

"Next week probably we will be unable to post anything, but after next week - will try to post some new video and shots. But don't ask for each week video! That procedure takes some time that we haven't really!" - 29.10.2010 ;) : http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showpos...84&postcount=1

"after next week" - today :)

Oleg had videos for the presentation, so hopefully these will be put up for us to enjoy in HD.

allright, I never heard of that one :eek:

You're kidding :)

http://s158.photobucket.com/albums/t...nt=Igotyou.mp4


If Storm Of War continues on to North Africa I can't wait to see that F4 and the desert :)

I noticed the Bf 110 with RAF markings in the Igromir video also had British brown and green camo. Nice touch!

Dude, I think you're confused, I said AvSim PLUS. AvSim PLUS. This is the new improved formula, perfectly designed to supplement your flight-simming intake. With regular use it will enhance your virtual aviation skills and general manliness like nothing before. Trust me, it will make you go harder longer than anything you might be using now. If you're interested, I can get you hooked up for wholesale prices, straight out of Hong Kong, any currency, just let me know ok...

Seriously though, whatever you think of the title I suggested, and I'm not saying it's great either (and I'm not trying defend it or 'sell' it here) , I think the logic and concept behind it is sound.

I agree it doesn't really 'grab you' in the same sense that other less descriptive titles might, but I don't think it should be criticized for being too generic either. It's meant to be the overall name for a series of flight sims, not just one set in a particular kind of aircraft, or in the Battle of Britain, or even in WW2 (we already have a Korean War add-on announced). How is a more specific name going to look when the series gets as fleshed out as it probably will (rhetorical question)? Even something as generic as 'Combat Flight Simulator' might end up being too exclusive of the content that eventually gets included.

BTW, it looked to me like the inclusion of that George Carlin video in your post was there to suggest AvSim+ is a more euphemistic title than 'Storm of War'. The thing is, AvSim+ isn't meant to describe the content of the sim, it's simply saying what the overall product is, it's an aviation sim. The plus bit could be considered euphemistic if you take it to refer only to the combat aspect of the content, but that's just one interpretation. The phrase 'storm of war' could actually be considered more euphemistic, even in the context of the original speech from which it was taken (ie. don't worry, those aren't bombs landing on your head, you're just in a storm of war...).

Incidentally, I wouldn't call myself a fan, but I've watched a lot of George Carlin's video's in the past (including the one you posted) and agree with a lot of the things he said. Are you familiar with Bill Hicks' work, he had some strong things to say about advertizing (and other things) as well, in a similar sort of vein.

Going to let this subject go now, have spent way too much time thinking about it.

:shock: I hadn't realised that. We can't have that! :grin:

lol!! Hehe!! :lol:

Thanks for posting the pics! (Great Vid by Igromir, btw!)
..needless to say, my expression would've been a lot different and I woulda brought my Lunch, Dinner, Flying Helmet and scarf! :D

Idea
 

I work in marketing and brand building and after 10 years as a virtual fighter pilot would do something like this:

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_HmCTvvlEYvg/TN...a-BoB-Oleg.jpg

Illustration by Wiek Luijken http://www.luijken.com/

;)

wow that looks inviting. Good Job.

Good job.
I'd suggest making the Storm-of-War text larger (and also move it to the left), and also make more out of the fact that this came from the creators of Il-2 (e.g, make this bolder too).
I think the 'Air combat simulation by Maddox Games' should be slightly smaller as well ;)
I love the work though

Bravo! Looks great!

I don't know. Too many Ubisoft logos for my taste...

+1

Exactly, One is one too much. :)

Nice job.

Since the Battle of Britain was about British fighters defending the country from German bombers, it would be nice if the main graphic had a Spit shooting at a German bomber.

The illustration is just an idea, not the main thing, I just tried to recreate the order of the phrases and concepts and their importance.

Of course, the image must be a composition that represents an air battle over the channel, so there is no confusion of ideas. ;)

My thoughts exactly!

Here you can find some nice images too:
http://www.google.nl/imgres?imgurl=h...26tbs%3Disch:1

I really do not understand well ... :confused: Where more than one Ubisoft logos?

I only see a Ubisoft logo. Please look at the website of Ubisoft boxes of their games and make a comparison. :rolleyes:

I have only used the logos to be put: the PEGI (mandatory), the Ubisoft (center) and + 1C Maddox Games, "where too many logos? ;)

It is possible that you refer to: "Bull or Buffalo of Maddox Games icon but I have added this element to make it clear that it is a combat flight simulator that is being developed by Maddox Games

S!

We don't like Ubisoft, especially in context with a serious and high quality game made by THE Oleg Maddox.

agree, Ubisucks , I hope not be DRM in Storm of War and other sims of OM

That box art is gorgeous!
________
HERBAL VAPORIZER

This is one of the better use of phrases and concepts I have seen so far. The problem with the other critics is a case of Viva Yo!

I like it reguardless of the ubisoft logos. No one knows right now who the publisher will be. So thier reaction is not toward your work. At least I hope not. Bravo!

Sorry for the confusion - as people have explained, Ubisoft is not the most popular company with some people here, me included. At the moment it's still unclear what the western publisher will be, and with any luck Ubi won't be involved anymore. None of that however has anything to do with your nice artwork, so just ignore that ;)

Ian_Guerrero,

That art work is fantastic! I could definitely see something like that as the official release cover.

Thanks!

i think both a 109 and a spit would be better on the cover

Bingo, I love the UP2.01 intro Screen - should be something like that.

i was referring exactly to it! ;)

Fantastic Ian

A Spitfire and the Union Jack...beautiful


I would change the wording a little - at the top should read " from Maddox Games.."

and bottom just "..from the creators of IL2."


Prehaps you can do some cover designs for my future campaigns?!!

Great job

cheers

Simon













ps - Oleg, when is the release date?!

Being reluctant to scan the 69 pages of this thread, could someone tell me if there are any news or statements by Oleg on "SoW: Battle for Moscow"?

Will it be the next release after "SoW: Battle of Britain"?

There has been no release related info posted since Igromir, neither about SoW nor Battle for Moscow. The latter is supposed to be one of two add-ons currently under development (the other one hasn't been disclosed yet; it may be the Korea sim that was announced some time ago or something completely new). A release timeframe hasn't been mentioned either, but some comments indicated that work is already going on for a while so let's hope it won't take years to get it ;)

WOW!!!

It's an amazing job!