Not all the Mods involve changed FMs for "stock" aircraft, infact many of the bigger mod communities forbid this, and insist that if you want to alter the FM of one of the aircraft that come in the non-modded version of the game then you must make a new-slot version of it with the new FM, allowing users to choose between the modded and unmodded versions of the plane when setting up maps for play on and offline.

Hello David603,
I know very well what I'm talking about,and I bet you do too.
There's no reason to play blind here.

Sry but for many years developer didn;t listening these community. 1C leave these game some time ago but old bugs were still alive. For my online player the FM and historical performacne of these planes are the most important thing in these game. Now we have possibility to check these old things and correct them in more right way, way which dont follow 1C team.

I still dont happy with actual situation with all these mods story for these game beacuse it divided and spoiled online playing. But until now there were not other option for correct many things. I still think that these things should be made for offical patches not in mods way but as i said there were not other option for now.

Yes it is true. Thats why these P-51 case is only some example of 1C errors.

I made many performance corrections for mosty western fronts planes ( both side) which would be relased as a new sloted planes ( stock ones was not touched) not only for P-51 but also for Fw 190 A series ( e.x. corrected 1C poor acceleration for these planes), Spitfires and 109s. Base for these corrections were original German, British and other documents not russian books. I saw many people were are very happy with these changes from both sides. They love new acceleration of Fw190A, performacne differences between Spifire MK1 and 109 E and many other things.

These is untrue statment. All Fm's data are coming from original game for stock planes. So these is not possible that e.x P-51 lenght error is coming from mods. Mods have nothing to do here. And as You said there are many other errors in these game. So really dont dump all guilt for mods. I think that we should rather thanks for it developer's ignorance.

I hope so thats why im here and reported whats is wrong.


Sry these is my fault i just used my country common sense of these "error"

Here is little explanation of these "common use" pharaphase

http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=687074


I hope TD would make these game better and try to achive more historical and obcjetive performance of these all beautifull planes then 1C did.

I wish You all the best.

303_Kwiatek

Yes, I know that it is possible to modify the FMs, DMs and anything else you want to modify in Il2 for your own benefit, though most of these mods fall foul of the CRT2, but most of the bigger mod communities are as keen to avoid cheating as I believe you are yourself, indeed, on one of the main multiplayer mod sites it is a bannable offence to talk about modifying the FMs of stock aircraft.

Kwiatek,

I didn't know the expression "czech error", but to all good willing people who want to "correct" DM and FM "mistakes", I can tell another figure of speech:

you are throwing out the baby with the bath water.


http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/...the+bath+water


Regards,
Insuber

I don't see how correcting an ahistorical handling trait by fixing a typo in an FM is "throwing the baby out with the bath water". :confused:

so, what we get is flying a broken miserable flying plane, with a nice skin, or a decent flying machine with a nice skin...

without the fix these planes are worthless,,, and the people that are pissed are the people who fly the enemy side of the war, because they lost the advantage of having a plane that wasn't porked, stomping the crap out of the plane that was always porked..

booo hooo, shed me a tear..

thanx to some good people these injustices are being being resolved and corrected..

@Kwiatek,
I see your motives and understand them,I cannot question them but I also believe that some of the actions you took are wrong.
Anyway,we at DT do know very well what in this game is in need of correction and it's not only the flight;damage;weapon models.Far more things beyond the "modder" knowledge have to be corrected/updated in IL-2.
My advice to the whole modding community is to restrict their attempts to "fix" the "hard code" things like the flight model (for example).You cannot calculate the polars,so basically you're doing nothing.Leave the things as they are,because this way you're bringing more harm than help here.
I will repeat that DT knows better than anyone,what has to be done and we have the best data to back up our actions.If you want something to be fixed,report it to us and do not fix it by yourselves.
This is the correct way for something to be "fixed" in IL-2,if it can be called that way.

@David603,

I see that this type of things are not clear to you,I'll be more than happy to enlight you for some of them via PM or e-mail,but this topic is not the place for this type of discussions.

I wonder if the people raving about the "fix" for the P-51 (FM and API) really understand the impact such changes to 1 plane does to the gameplay as a whole?

All thats left is the wing sheere in high speed manouvers and we will have a real clown wagon in the game. (Lerches new cousin maby?)

I met lots of P-51 online who doesnt seem to have any problems whatsoever, flown correctly blue side cant even tuch it.


Im not saying the changes isnt needed but if one changes 1 ac all the rest needs to be fixed to, and i do mean ALL.

All the "faults" are there for a reason, at least thats what i think.


Easy fix: Change the visibillity of 50 cal tracers and include a readme on joystick settings and 99% will think P-51 is completly reworked.



Keep up the good work DT and see u soon in SoW. :)

May be it´s not clear that nothing has been fixed or replaced but FM have been "corrected" and named different.
In Ultrapack we still have the stock FM by Oleg and additionally the "corrected" versions by Kwiatek.

I personally think that Kwiatek has done an excellent job on the Focke Wulfs and the Spit MkI and Bf109 E1, E3, and E4. as far as I can comare them to historical data and IL2 compare.

However, if you have substantial and maybe even constructive critics, I invite you over to Ultrapack forum to discuss what went wrong with Kwiateks reworking.
There is a thread in the FM topic where you can see the data in IL2 compare.

Best regards,
Emil