Was she...?
 

As I take off, retracts my gears, and turn my head to see where my wingie is going I notice a girl on a bicycle with flowing blond hair and billowing skirt waving to me as she pedals along the country road.
Going out of sight under my wing, and never, never to be seen again.

Viking

And the next thing you see, after staring at the girl, is hangar H. Then, nothing... :-P

Then nothing?

Then a shinning light at the end of a dark tunnel!. Or maybe some guys with red skin, goat legs, little horns in the head, and a trident on their hand.

Or maybe just the Station doc and a hot nurse :mrgreen:

That's way better than the shinning light! :D

Surprise!
 

The fun things would be the happenings that are trigged to happen just once in ten thousand.
Like you have a “Hun” on your six blowing holes in your kite and you decide it’s time to leave the “office” but as you press Ctrl+E: instead of the regular dangling in the Shute scene there is a: “YOUR FOOT IS STUCK!” and then in; one-two-three-four seconds your whole life passes in front of you. Youarebornyoucanwalkyoucanbicycleooopsyoustartscho olyuograduateyourfirstgirlyoujoinRAFyourfirstsolof light and the POFF! You are floating underneath the canopy of your Shute as you see your Spit spiraling downwards to the ground.
Scary stuff!

Regards

Viking

You mean the RoF dev's ?

:grin:

Life is too short to read through all 14 pages to make sure it has not already been suggested. Here goes:

1. Friendly fire (bomber gunners being jumpy, being bounced by friendly hurricanes/109/110's and more).
2. Undisciplined wingmen go off chasing enemy.
3. Pilots trying to show off, doing stunts, flying too close perhaps etc. Consequence ranging from commander (angry) interruption, nothing at all, or actually crashing. Happened in the real war (109's stunting over POW camps holding airmen - British doing victory rolls over their airfield when coming back from sortie but having damaged airframes they did not know about).
4. Pilot or crew unable to get themselves extracted from their plane when trying to bail (heart breaking panicking heard over radio). Can include those stuck in burning cockpits.
5. Accidents pertaining to ground crew & vehicles & aircraft. Including fuel ignited by someone smoking, severely fatigued pilots veering off left on take off (109's especially) heading straight into the crew barracks (happened).
6. Landing gear not coming down on some aircraft when about to land. Sometimes pilots unaware. Sometimes someone telling the pilot (also if player) that their gear isn't fully down.
7. Blacked out pilots (can be due to injury, G-loc or altitude poisoning) causing the plane to do erratic flight behaviour (including loops, or leveling out from dives into crazy zooms) - and the other pilots who see it voice their reactions on radio "wake up!" "pull up!" "jump!" etc.
8. Pilots & Crew voicing brief shocked reactions to seeing own side bomber/plane get shot down in brutal ways (explode, crash into ground, split in half etc).
9. Unintentional crew-strikes (replace bird with air crew). Not very likely but still :p
10. Pieces of aircraft striking own aircraft (oil/coolant over the hood, aircraft parts causing damage, even severe damage to own plane). Falling debris is dangerous.
11. Smoke in cockpit.
12. Own canopy will not jettison or open - stuck! Better find some way of ditching it somehow.. And if on fire, well...
13. Knocked unconcious temporarily on bail out.
14. British airbase crew running/scattering like crazy when they see bombs falling towards them (I have seen similar in a mod showing AA crew abandoning their gun when scared, and soldiers jumping off and running from their transport trucks - amazing stuff)
15. Civilian motor vehicles doing funny things if scared (fly towards them low level from the front and they drive into the ditch)
16. People on the ground being seen ducking down when aircraft flies low over them.
17. Pilots trying to join enemy formation - thinking they are friendly (but realizing at some point that they are enemy - when alongside or when still trying to approach).
18. People on ground running towards any crashed/ditched aircraft, including failed landings.
19. Armed civilians (hunters with shotguns or rifles) as well as soldiers shooting at any 'target of opportunity' passing by. Not a big risk, but they could get real lucky (bye bye coolant/glass cockpit window etc).

"Good... afternoon."

"Good afternoon my arse, you bosche bastard!"

:mrgreen:

I would be interesting to hear at least once Polish guys saying "Repeat Please!" over the radio :-P

Moments like this, but obviously with german or british aircrafts! :)

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_jcNQzBZlLiE/SY..._b29_crash.jpg

1. People bolwn off the ship when a bomb explodes on it (dramatic, like in Pearl Harbor).
2. Germans shooting at british parachuters, sometimes at own pilots when mistook.
3. Pilots crashlanding due to be scared by enemy fighters diving behind them.
4. AAA shooting at own planes.
5. You see a fighter is escaping to cloud, and a moment later you see it and another plane, both falling in flames from this cloud.
6. German fighters not shooting when target covers bomber formations.
7. Dying, but not dead bomber pilots, who make maneuvers of death.
8. Pilot doing his last dive when desperately tries to evade enemy, but is on too low altitude...
9. Seeing a chuter whose parachute didn't open.
10. Seeing guts of rearshooter you just killed going out of belly.

@Alien

i think you need a therapy.

Why? I just gave some ideas of sights showing brutality and nonsense of war.

Well if the maturity rating is the same as IL2 1946, there will be no "gore=1" for SoW

The blood was turned off for dead gunners and pilots.

i think we shouldn't "overinterprete" the "Simulation" - Part ;-D

I agree Alien but I've already made similar suggestions and apparently wanting realistic violence in something that simulates real events means you are a demented sadist. :rolleyes:
________
LovelyWendie

Explosions of this calibre, From Key targets,with the possibility of dense smoke visible for 60miles. Collateral damage from these explosions should express the energy within the fuel or munitions load being triggered.
eg: This explosion during wwI here in Canada.
http://museum.gov.ns.ca/mma/AtoZ/halexpl.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Explosion

Re - Holy shi...
 

Yes a great thread that we've all been wanting, and great ideas -

My 2 penneth -

I like the idea of rescue mission triggers and photo recon triggers - easy to do and very similar -

Recon - fly over target trigger at X altitude and/or X speed to complete mission

Rescue - fly over target trigger at X altitude to rescue pilot/ship's crew - if flying a campaign that pilot then returns to his Sqdn roster.I've been reading a few BoB books and this happened many times- pilots would land and then take off to look for a downed Sqdn member.( maybe another trigger for this - you land and as you taxi in you are ordered straight back up again to search?)

Talking of Sqdn rosters - in a campaign it would be nice to see how every pilot is doing - maybe a more interactive Squadron menu inbetween missions - Pilot bio, messages from Sqdn leader, aircraft available etc..
, hints, tips...

Another good idea was a random trigger - in the FMB you pick the triggers to be included and the % chance of it happening.


I also really like the idea of triggers for .wav files - fly within distance of another friendly aeroplane (or object- such as control tower) and a famous Ace/another pilot/controller speaks over the radio to you - something funny / rude / or a flying tip - a good wow factor but you would need at least 30-50 clips to keep it fresh - but if we also had the option to add our own .wav files for this trigger in the FMB....endless Wow!

In the BoB books i'm reading often a Sqdn would be given new targets while in the air and re-directed to chase the enemy.

Pilots bailing out, when you shoot down an enemy - lets have lots of ways the enemy pilot can react - parachute not opening, chute on fire, chute gets caught on tail plane ( Douglas Bader had nightmares about a Do17 crewman who's chute got caught and went down with the plane that Bader had shot down... ) this would give a good Wow factor as it wouldn't happen that often.

Also many RAF piots were stunned and wowed by the sheer size of enemy formations - I hope we can look forward to more aircraft in the sky - 64 Vs 64 limit of IL2 was VERY limiting for us campaign designers, lets have 256 Vs 256 - PCs must be 4X more powerful since IL2 was launched !!!! ( yes I know - BoB will also be 4X as complex...)

Keep'm coming!

Stiboo

ps - a release date would make US all say Holy Shi....!!!!!!!!!

It would be sweet if every now and then, if an AI pilot did very well on a mission, he would do a victory roll when returning to his airfield.

The idea of a pilot or crewman bailing out of a plane only for his chute to not open is a good one. Also if the chute got caught on the plane, or the chute/pilot or crewman on fire if the plane is on fire would get some wow's from me. All of this could happen in a margin of 1 in 50, or 1 in 100 bailouts.

Rescue missions are also a nice idea and would add a differnt perspective to the combat.

Hearing your voice while giving orders is a start.

One thing I miss is to answer the calls. An option to say "Roger", "Negative" and so on would be nice.

Got the idea from MBot's post. It would be neat to have the AI to ask you for permission to beat up the field or something, and say Yes or No to him :mrgreen:

I apologize in advance if the following was mentioned already. I just could not read through 23 pages!

I would like to see more real carnage on the ground when doing GA.

1. When you bomb a group of vehicles and the bomb(500lb+) lands right beside them It not only destroys the vehicle but throws into the air or rolls it over as well as other vehicles in a close proximity to such a large explosion.

2. Bombing the control tower of the airfield might break off one of the lower supports and the tower slowly falls over and crashes across the runway blocking it from use.

3. A fuel tank cathes fires due to straffing but does not explode. Then several minutes later it Blevees and takes out everything around it. (As an added feature, the fuel could initially be running out of the tank and fire burns down the stream of fuel)

4. (Bomber gunners): Have them stop firing from time to time due to ammo reload, hot gun or malfuntions.

Thanks,

Probably more than that.....bailing out in WWII was a damn risky business. Many pilots did not survive. +1 on pilot rescue.

how bout something really cool like... for instance a FW gets a spit on its six, the spit takes out the FW's engine and instead of breaking off the spit sticks with the FW and ends up overshooting it, meanwhile the FW saved just enough energy to pull up its nose and get a pot shot off at the spit, taking the spits wing off with the last ditch effort... and both planes crash...


happened to me yesterday on RCAF_FB :P

RAF Scrambles
 

Hi,

Regarding 'briefings' for missions:

For the Battle of Britain, standard il2-style (or the improved BOB version) pre-flight briefings setting out the target for the mission will be ok and accurate for the German and Italian side, but for an RAF fighter pilot at the height of the battle it won't be realistic (unless they are flying planned 'patrols' over some sector - eg "patrol Dover at 15,000 feet")

RAF fighters should have A LOT of scramble missions to reflect the historical reality - with a ONE-WORD briefing - "SCRAMBLE!" , or even better, a jump-cut directly into the game - pilots charging for their aircraft as someone shouts "Squadron scramble!" (or if the animations aren't available, just starting in the cockpit of your plane)

More information would be passed to the pilot in flight - ie heading, altitude, estimated number of enemy aircraft.

[Edit: this obviously applies more to the 'campaign' generation of missions]

If there is dynamic weather, could it be possible to simulate historical weather using bureau of meteorology records?

So, perhaps Saturday 20th July 1940 started out out as a very pleasant day with only light scattered cumulus and a top temperature recorded at RAF Hornchurch of 24 C at 2PM, but a cold front was approaching from the SW, which entered the English Channel area at 4PM. Temps dropped quickly and after the front of storm cells passed through it was around 16 C with a solid overcast at 1000 feet and rain squalls.....

.....and overnight, the bad weather cleared out to the east leaving a beautiful crystal clear morning for Sunday...

Hi!!

I would like give more realism whit:

There is the option for order: take of ,or landing 2 or 3 planes at the same time.

Thx

Hi,
If you could model the visual effect of rain (and possibly oil and/or fuel, coolant, and blood?) upon the cockpit glass this would be something of a shock when encountered.
I'm currently doing some research on the FW190, not in BOB I know! But he British noted that although it's canopy provided great all round visibility, it's visibility was poor in the rain. This was further complicated by the fact that the 190's canopy could not be opened in flight.
In BOB, Spitfires and Hurricanes would have some visibility when landing in the rain because they could open their cockpit, the 109 had sliding side windows, which would give some visibility to the pilot but would make landings even more difficult than usual.
Flying inside the glass dome of He111 in heavy rain would also be be pretty impressive visually. If the sound of the raindrops crashing into the planes glass could be added it would be even more amazing and immersive. What German gunners would see from a glass canopy in the rain,would be minimal, I'd have thought.
There must have been occasions when fighting over the Channel in the rain, it would have been very disorientating for attackers as well as defenders. I'm no programmer so do not know if this would be difficult to implement. There were a few missions fought in thunderstorms in IL2 but visibility was always good enough to allow game play. With BOB being the next generation simulator, having to return on instruments to base because of the weather visibility would be novel, don't you think. The weather over the channel can change very quickly from sunshine to rain and back, especially in summer! I know, I live here!
Also 109 wing slats that bang loudly when they open in combat would also add to the tension/terror when dogfighting!
Best Wishes
jameson

Yeah, jameson, that would be absolutely stunning. Hope something like this is being implemented but it would be terribly cpu/gpu intensive to run as well. Maybe include an option to turn weather/raindrops off, or have three different weather realism settings.

I was in a 14 min. chase b4 without getting shot down by 5 planes that were on my tail. I shot down 4 of the 5 but after i turned the tables on the last plane he turned the tables back and shot me down.

Interesting comment on rain effects, hopefully something the dev team can use.

On the fly weather changes programmed through the FMB as I recall are planned.

As far as visibility probably won't make a difference, if you can program changes in FMB.

When you get into combat the weather could slack off, whereas now in IL2 you are stuck with the same weather start to finish.

As I recall the weather thing was planned quite awhile back, including clouds and such.

Anyway, doesn't hurt to renew the subject. Something alot of people are interested to know about.

No doubt this must have been covered before.
How about those hair-raising secondary explosions we see in guncam footage of strafing attacks on rail cars or trucks.
Strafe the wrong rail car and a great load of metal, ammo and debris shoots up several hundred feet right in front of you !
I've seen many guncam clips of this that make it seem impossible that the pilot flew thru all the junk and lived.

That'll put the fear of god in you.

This already happens in IL-2. I've learned the hard way that it is a lot safer to strafe trains side-on than head-on, simply because of the tendency for a hit to set off a chain reaction that catches you as you over-fly the target. Side-on, the obvious attack method tends to encourage an end-to end strafing sweep, which only needs to be continued to avoid any overflight. It would be nice to see a good steam-train blowup though - I think I once saw guncam footage of half the boiler hurling skywards. Not something you'd want to run into...

I quite like straffing oil trains, you do have to break off so you don't overfly the explosions. The thing is, or maybe used to be, if you attack from the rear, the flak truck behind the tender will hit the oil waggon closest to it, and you don't get the kills for the waggons that go off after that. I haven't seen it in a while, but I don't attack oil trains from the rear any more.

No holy sh*t moments but there are a number of general things that would help immersion that would be nice to see introduced. Sorry if some of this has been mentioned already.

1. Pilot careers, where you start off as a rookie that goes up with someone more experienced who can give you some general advice, such as how to carry out an attack, attack from direction of sun, keep an eye on mirror. Then as you go through the missions you move further up the command structure and take control of squadrons yourself. Better develop the characters of those you are flying with as well so you care about them more, rather than just being numbers.
2. Better pilot chatter. More of the pilot lingo that was used such as "bandits at 8" and that kind of stuff. Also, pilots screaming as their plane goes down in flames. Would be nice to hear yourself giving orders as well.
3. Better sounds. It is impossible to get the graphics perfect right now but it should be possible to get a very good approximation of the sounds that would be heard in the cockpit of these old planes.

... copied from my other post ...

Here are 3 things which occurred to me today whilst reading Al Deere's Nine Lives. I reckon they would make great additions to SOW.

I wonder if you agree and if anyone knows if any of these will be modelled in SOW?

1. Anti-landing posts - these were wooden posts stuck into fields in southern England to stop German gliders landing. They also proved to be obstacles for stricken RAF pilots making crash landings on home ground during the BoB. Pretty easy to add to SOW I would have thought?

2. De Wilde Ammunition - initially available in short supply in the early stages of the BoB, this ammunition had no tracer smoke but instead flashed on impact. Pilots found this extremely useful as a visual guide to see if their shots were on target. Of course, not having tracer also meant this was a more stealthy way of attacking from the rear. Again, I would assume not too tricky to implement in SOW.

3. Automatic Fire Tenders - no doubt more tricky to implement, but how cool would it be if a fire tender and associated vehicles/personnel automatically rushed over to a crash landed aircraft that made it back to a friendly airfield. Hauling an injured pilot out of the cockpit would be nice too!

PPanPan

If u in arcade and being chased by like 4 guys that outmanoeuver u. There's nothing you can do but use your speed and do wild crazy manoeuvers to try and shake them off as best you can do.

Forgive me if any of these ideas have been posted before, but i would like to see the following for single player/campaign.

1. I would like to be able to change the names in the pilot roster for my squadron, I know it sounds a little bit daft, but if you can put names in of people you know then you do hope they make it back in one piece, rather than just red 2 being shot down. does that make sense?

2. I would also like to see an attachment to my aircraft, for example if i take a couple of hits in a mission it would be nice to visibly see in the next mission that it as been patched up, you really would want to get the old girl home if you'd done 20 sorties in her.

3. I would also like to see my kills painted on my aircraft after each sortie.

Love all 3 of your suggestions Tree_UK
PPanPan

HI!!!

I think the following ideas, that are:

- Show the weight when you config. your plane, by example: when i get the default 109 G-6 its weight xxxxx, but I added MK108 gun his weight is xxxx (diferent). The weight would change and SHOW whit the config load and litters in gas tank.

- I read in several pilots WW2 boook that when they were hitted in any surface control the stick jumped and shaking out control during a bit time. It would be modeled. :)

Thx.

Some people seem to misunderstand what this topic is about.

Instructions, from the first post of the topic:

Gesture
 

See your wingman telling something to you with hand gestures from his cockpit, ( or maby only say hello, even enemy sometimes ) while radio silence. This would be really funny and inmersive thing, eh!, the guy of the other plane is really alive !

lots of good ideas...here is a couple of mine.

when your plane gets hit it would be good to see...

Gycol(maybe smearing affect on the goggles)

smoke entering the cockpit(clearing a bit if you open the hood)

fire effects in the cockpit(that would make you bail more quickly)

bits of glass or cockpit instruments shattering(hit affects)

cheers

Like flying an I-16 type 6 at 80% throttle , jerk up the stick too fast and the carb gets starved for fuel and the engine dies just after making a straffing run on an IJA tank or supply convoy.... now what the xxxx do I do ? it wont restart as the fuel has now vapor locked and I am at 200 meters doing 250 kph and over heated .... and now theres a Ki-26 on my tail , no radio to call for help and the ground is closing fast " type of thing ?????
1)can't bail out so do I keep trying to restart or
2)throw my hands up in the air and hope the dude in Ki can see me surrender,
3)l hit my landing gear and flaps and try to land or ??????
4)Die.

SoW Dynamic Campaign, July 1940.

Another damned convoy patrol! Rotten weather too. You've been flying the default campaign from the beginning. Determined to follow it as closely as possible to real events. Trouble is, you're getting to be as browned off as the real pilots were. There is a big fight coming and you know it. You just want to get on with it and to Hell with all this damned mucking about.

*************************

Too late again... As you arrive over the convoy you can see that they've just taken a beating. One merchantman is listing badly and falling behind. An armed trawler is still blazing away at something which has already fled into the mist towards France. Ahead of the convoy, a parachute decends slowly. In the weak sunlight you can see the blue of the pilot's uniform, contrasting against the grey-green of the water.

As you circle, you continue to watch the parachute. It's getting much lower now. One ship has changed course slightly to meet it.

Neat. I wonder if it will stop to pick him up?

Suddenly you see something else. Low down and moving fast, a 109 streaks through the convoy running flat out for home. As you fumble with the saftey catch and reflector sight, you take your eye off it for a moment. When you look again you see that it's altered course slightly and is heading straight for the parachute. If he doesn't look out he... My God!

The 109 fires into the parachutist with everything it's got. The pilot is knocked sideways with the force of it and a moment later the chute folds. Whats left begins to fall much, much faster.

The 109 banks slightly. In a moment it disappears into the mist on the other side of the convoy before ships guns can even track it. It's gone... Hopeless for you to follow.

You are shocked. Absolutely shaken by what you just saw. This was supposed to be a game. You've played these dynamic campaigns for years, but never, ever have you seen something as cold blooded as that. That was more like murder than anything else. The 109 pilot went out of his way to kill him.

For the first time, you find yourself thinking of the AI pilots as individuals. You wonder who the RAF bloke was. A moment later, you wonder who the Luftwaffe pilot was too. Oh yes. You'd really like to know who he was. If you see bastard again...

A glance at the petrol gauge. Time to go.

There is a big fight coming and you know it. This is not a game anymore...

Well done Feathered.

S!

I think the best thing to do is to leave OUT parachute kills, at least by AI. Players do it all the time and it did happen in reality too, but much less than supposed. It was condemned by both RAF and Luftwaffe strongly. Feathered wrote a nice story but that parachute episode just was..well, like from all the comics of "evil nazis do this and I have to revenge" ;)

Oh it happened, if not on a regular basis, it did happen more than once.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8LVlYJ5eJU

This is Bud Peterson talking about events that happened while he was flying a P-51: clearly not during the Battle of Britain. Such incidents almost certainly became more common as the war progressed.

In any case, 'it happened' is hardly a justification for reenacting it in a computer simulation.

Probably, but we don't know that. If it happened in 1943-1944 it could just as well have happened in 1940. A jerk flying a plane in 1940 is still a jerk in 1944. If they went by your reasoning there, 'it happened' would hardly have been a justification for basing a simulation on BoB.

Mine also!
I think it is advisable to suppress those distasteful details as long as they are not important for the game!

Don't misunderstand me. I certainly do not suggest that AI pilots of either side strafe chutes as a matter of routine. Rather, that it be a rare occurrence dependant on the individuals AI's setting.

Several years ago I'd written about AI settings in the old ORR. I thought AI should be on a slider. Four sliders actually. Skill, Aggessiveness, Stamina and Morale. Combinations of those would produce a host of unique pilot behaviors. Aggressive rookies, tired aces, fanatical veterans, heroes and cowards.

The subject of shooting a pilot in their parachute was one central to the history and conduct of the Battle of Britain. Both among pilots and at higher levels. Indeed, it was the first time in the history of aerial warfare that the practice came into close consideration. Post-war pilot and historical accounts rarely fail to mention it.

Johnny Kent, commander of 303 Sqn during the Battle of Britain instructed his pilots to kill all German airmen who parachuted to saftey. Four of his pilots even went so far as to destroy a crippled Ju87 that was attempting to force land at 303's own aerodrome.

One of the Few. Gp.Capt J.A. Kent. Published by Corgi, 1971

It would be a great feature, because it would give the single-player pilot incentives to go on revenge trips and fuel virtual rivalries. For example, imagine getting sufficient rank to be allowed lone-wolfing, or maybe drawing up your own freijagd/rhubarb missions amidst the campaign generated ones. You would go over your guncam films and try to pinpoint the unit, raid their airfield and provoke the other guy to come up and meet you until you could exact revenge, cinematographic things like that.

It would be a so-so feature if you needed to replay an epic mission where you got 4 kills before running out of ammo, chewed up the tail off the 5th kill with your prop and then bailed out, before meeting a sadistic AI pilot that kills your ingame character, forcing you to replay the sortie or lose your campaign.

It would also be an awful feature because of the rants it would cause. I give it less than a month from release before people start openly debating the frequency of sadist AI appearances per nationality, and we all know this would probably end up in a big case of "nazis only did it" vs "everyone did it to an extent" vs "allies never did it" vs "everyone except my country's noble fighters did it" :lol:

Never the less, Feathered always comes up with good ideas gameplay-wise, i just don't see it making the release because of the reasons stated in the previous paragraph. Maybe we could work on this theme of revenge and personal investment without being too "politically incorrect" and come up with something else?

Also, the expanded AI attributes idea is simply brilliant.

No need to add such feature, people already do that online! :rolleyes:

I agree with Feathered IV. It could be implemented as a very rare occurance, and alot of pilots may never see it as well, in single player. Knowing that it could happen, even very rarely, would provide the game with more immersion and edge. I don't think any WW2 pilot felt safe hanging from their chute, especially when they had bogeys nearby.

What I would really like to see is point deduction for any human player that does it, I have seen alot of jerks around that does it just for the hell of it and that takes away alot of the sportsmanship I enjoy in IL-2. There are also alot more chute-killers in the game than there was in WW2. Just look at all the <gunstat commands going on. Alot of point-whores online and a point deduction would probably make the vast majority of them to quit doing it.

If cruelty in the game would be such a big deal to everyone, I suggest that they also swap out the real guns and make us shoot flowers at eachother instead. Maybe even Mario could be your wingman.

S!

Adolf Hitler himself ordered his pilots NOT to shoot pilots in chutes. They were far more valuable alive for information than as a dead lump. And Hermann Göring and Adolf Galland had a discussion about this as well, neither accepted it. And most of pilots did not regard chute shooting acceptable, both RAF and Luftwaffe. Sure there were those individuals that did it during BoB and later, but I think over 90% of them did not even remotely thinking so.

I read somewhere that 8th Air Force FG commanders, some of them, had ordered their pilots to kill Germans in their chutes "to prevent them from fighting another day". If I do not recall wrong it was 352nd FS or something and one unit was where Chuck Yeager flew, his commander did order this. Most of pilots did not follow this order, but many did. Heinz Knoke mentions after bailout his wingman was shot to pieces by a P38, his chute landed in time and hid in bushes to avoid being strafed.

Reference: In his 1986 memoirs he(Chuck Yeager) noted with disgust that "atrocities were committed by both sides" and went on to recount going on a mission with orders from the Eighth Air Force to "strafe anything that moved". During the mission briefing he whispered to Major Donald H. Boschkay; "If we are going to do things like this, we sure as hell better make sure we are on the winning side". He further noted "I’m certainly not proud of that particular strafing mission against civilians. But it is there, on the record and in my memory."

But not to raise hell, my opinion is that shooting chute should be omitted altogether and made impossible for player too. The chute would just represent a bailed pilot without being destroyable. Seen enough of this arsehattery online already.

Sorry to kick over a hornets nest. I certainly do not glory in the bloody details of war. Though to see it sanitised and turned into a jolly fun game for ages eight and over is an obscenity in itself too.

I have to agree with this.

Also, the idea as conceived by Feathered in his writeup certainly fits well within the concept of this thread and would in any event be something like a 1 in a 1000 occurrence. It would also give the player a moment of anxiety while hanging in his chute in a single-player campaign mission if some AI enemy aircraft came close - of course, 999 times out of 1000 they would waggle their wings and fly off ( as happened ).

i think czech and polish pilots had a bit of a reputation for firing on parachutes, from what i recall of various accounts. they had more reason than most in the RAF to do so. to fire on a helpless pilot takes a certain level of hatred, something that due to the early stages of the war few RAF pilots had. there was a certain amount of surprise expressed that the luftwaffe did not fire on RAF pilots on chutes as a matter of course though, as they were a legitimate target if over our sceptered isle - if uninjured they'd be back in the air again tomorrow. that's not to say there weren't accounts of RAF pilots, as well as luftwaffe pilots, being found riddled with machine gun bullets.

feathered's idea was certainly an emotive one. if that happened in game i'd be stunned and outraged. which is pretty much the purpose of this thread - things that would jolt you with surprise and immerse you fully in the game and the period.

Flanker, you seem to want a sterilised version where parachutes have no collision model. that would be horrendous if you could simply fly through them, rather than have to dodge them to avoid damage to your aircraft.

"I certainly do not glory in the bloody details of war. Though to see it sanitised and turned into a jolly fun game for ages eight and over is an obscenity in itself too. " is perfectly put.

if some of the details of reality are disturbing then perhaps playing a game that replicates them is not advisable for such temprements.

S!

Titus. The chute could be made collidable too, but if you collide on a human at speeds of 400-500km/h the wing will be heavily damaged so a loss of plane would be likely. That would make the wannabe chute killer to think first, is the chute kill worth losing own plane.

There is an account of Finnish Fokker D.XXI shooting down a SB-2 bomber and the pilot bailed out suddenly when the Fokker was about 30-50m behind the left wing of the SB-2 peppering the engine. Now the bailing pilot hit the Fokker so that the wing machine gun pierced his middle torso and he was cut in half and wing was covered in blood etc. The wing itself was also damaged quite extensively, but plane could land. And this was with less speed difference than ramming a hanging parachute. Gives an idea that ramming a chute is not good.

Sure the war was cruel and all kind of stuff happened. But IMO we do not need pilot killing in chute. A useless feature. IF included sure then make it penalized both off and online as these online scoremonger azzhats need to get in check ;)

For offline play, the ability to change aircraft mid mission, or if shot down the ability to take another pilots seat and continue the mission without having to restart.

For each mission the option to generate random flights to fill up the airspace and make every mission slightly different. Also Search and Rescue flights or Rescue boats automatically launched if a pilot goes into the sea.

It is a little odd that people would be so against a 1 in 500 chance of an AI aircraft shooting a another AI or player in their parachute. Especially so, when for almost ten years now they have been playing a sim where ground defences and ships routinely (and improbably) slaughter every parachutist within range. :-|


Think about it though. What if you could also choose the moment you pulled the ripcord? Both on and offline, this would introduce a tactical element and increase your chances of survival against both human and AI opponents.

What about if you could call on Air/Sea rescue for downed pilots in single player? (seriously Oleg, you need to consider this stuff) Just knowing that they are not immune to attack, you'd want to stick around if there are enemy in the vicinity. Imagine trying to ward off some predatory fighter. One eye on your fuel level as you wait for that MTB or floatplane to arrive...

again, i've read quotes where pilots were advised to drop as much as they could from the fight before opening their parachute. this minimised the chances of some bloodthirsty blighter hacking you to bits whilst you dangle, but also got you out of the cross fire of the more "innocent" pilot-perforating kind. possibly having a set "floor" altitude where the chute opens automatically and safely?

If it was 1:5,000, I still wouldn't like it much but I could accept it, however the reason I don't want it at all is that if it's in, it will be in with a 1:50 or less chance of occurring, other wise the code wouldn't be used enough to be worth the cost of coding and debugging it. Marketting would insist that every player saw it, which would again mean 1:50 or less. If it was in, it would probably be any flyer in the single player game who was a potential target, including the player, and that would be hugely frustrating, enough to put me off buying a game that threatened to do that to me. I have put in enough hours on IL*2 that at if it had been 1:5,000 I'd have seen it dozens of times by now, and that would make it boring, let alone the hundreds of times I'd have seen it when it turned up at 1:50.

I agree that the ground guns shouldn't do it, but it's a bug that I've come to accept as part of IL*2, despite it's tendancy to break immersion.

So long as the floor is +100m above the local ground surface (counting the tops of trees as the surface), fine.

Thinking about it, it would be quite cool if, in SoW, one could bale out (in a first person view) and free fall until you press a key which would open the parachute - taking it a bit further, there could be keys for slight manoevering during descent (I think that one could do this in a limited way with WWII-era parachutes?). I definitely prefer the first person view for a bale-out - was it with European Air War that one would have that view (with a slight spinning sensation as the parachute did a bit of its "own thing).
Just my thoughts on the subject - probably too late for Oleg and team to consider if they haven't already done so.

Bumpimg this thread with a new request.
In DCS-Black shark you can set a radio frequency and hear the radio station transmiting on that frequency. Well, it would be cool to have that, and also have tha posibility to create your own audio files to be "transmitted" by that specific frequency.
This would be great for two things:
1- First you can hear the music you want, by creating the audio file, while you are flying.
2- If you can make the possibility to "attach" or "link" the transmission to a trigger, you can make that if you set the right frequency you will hear an specific transmission with important information to fulfill the mission. Like a coded message, secret message, coordinates of a specific target, and so on.

If i´m not mistaken, something similar, but not equal, to this was requested. :)

Thanks!

One cool mission would be you have a breifing for an escort mission or any other kind of mission and when you get out of the breifing (or appear in your aircraft "a la" iL2) you find yourself in the middle of an airfield raid and you have to take off and hope for the best...

Asheshouse, your idea would lead to even lazier flying habits than we have now, would you change seats through an entire squad as you were repeatedly shot down?

Lancelot, the only music I hope to hear is that of the Merlin or the DB601, besides you'll be too busy in Bob to be listening to Vera Lynn, lol!

If you want music just run a 3rd party program in windows while playing, i don't see any reason why music should be on in any way, since it would just be a distraction.

But from time to time, people might just like to put on authentic music or heavy metal/rock or something totally badass and kick some ass :), but
this is all done client-sided with our own tools/programs, nothing that should be apart of the product in anyway (my opinion).

I just hope they use Vera Lynn in the title track.

It's really the only thing that is appropriate.

My 1 pence...
 

More historical immersion:

1. The view from the cockpit to be a view with using eye glasses - I mean glasses and oxygen mask restricting your view from the cockpit. We see in Il2 that the pilot is wearing glasses and oxygen mask when flying up to 3000 meters altitude, but the view is not restricted anyway in Il2.

2. Possibility to jump safely from taxiing aircraft when attacked on the airfield.

3. To walk over Your one aircraft - walking on the wings, walking on the motor, going around the aircraft on the field, and looking at the holes at the fuselage after the air combat.

4. Ability to control the pilot on the ground by the joystick - lay down, jump, run - left - run right, walk, etc.

5. Dolphines and orcas in to the ocean.

6. Flyable Fw-200 Condor!!!

7. Ability to make nice photos with your personal camera in to the cockpit - black and white of course for your personal album!

~S!

If you think your view isn't restricted enough in front of your monitor, think again!

This is already available in IL-2 (or any other air combat sim) - buy yourself a pair of goggles!

I have already 'said in my previous posts maybe I have but I ignored a clear idea of how the simulator must have one.

the war is based on the numbers on the mathematical numbers:

and mathematically each airport must have a fair amount of reconnaissance and fighter-bombers and carriers the number of these resources continues the same as the airport the airport needs to fuel weapons food men and equipment.

the airport must have a hospital network of roads and rail links for refueling.

the airport must have a good defense.

I'm just talking about a cell of a united whole through logical and mathematical processes with the right criteria.

the cell in question and the airport before moving to a port in a city 'an entire nation around a region in order mathematically it all together as if there were a consequence of the events and happenings concatenated.


if I have an unlimited number of planes at random without even understand the value and cost of a plane and its mortgage MAINTENANCE whole game will be unrealistic.

Not sure if already mentioned as have not read all 28 pages, but when you are returning from a mission and your aircraft has been heavily damaged over hostile territory and you are loosing altitude it would be good to be able to dump weight. Maybe excess fuel, guns, ammo etc.

WW II bombers would sometimes dump weapons, ammo, and anything else they could in such situations. I don't think they could dump fuel. In a fighter, there isn't much you can do, beyond getting rid of external stores - and you can do that already in IL-2.

Id like to see a random explosion like this one (specifically at 3:07!!) when you hit a vessel carrying ordinance or fuel etc

Check out this explosion @3:07 from machine gun fire on a small vessel : (u may have click the link above the video)

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c01_1274825409


holy sh..did that just happen?!

Maybe cargo ships could have selectable loads.
While carrying ammo, or high octane fuel, they could show some of those very big explosions. I don't expect a cargo of beef to go blowing out...

The same thing for factories or airfields. Straffing ammo boxes or fuel depots could bring one of those big explosions.

Straffed fuel tanks may caught fire, that just don't stay near the tank,.It expands around the tank, destroying other tanks, or causing ammo or other planes to blow up. Fire fighters if available could be part of this. Lots of people in panic would be also desirable.

On il-2 I like to put moving trucks at some places, specially those likely to be straffed, so that when someone go over there, people start running out of the tracks. This could be set on home bases with density of running people selectable. The same for industrial areas.

Ships could explode and break in the middle, instead of just sinking wholly.

Fast moving vehicles, could loose control and collide with trees, or other vehicles while straffed or bombs near misses. They could also fall into a bomb crater.

On the not so much holly shit about it, radio voices must be a lot better than in il2. AI in il2 are almost allways dead.
Gunners, navigators and else, allways have something to say during flight. Bomber pilots actually sleep during long distance missions, so snoring is not that impossible. When things get hot, the inside chanels of a plane will become extremely noisy!

Sending some kind of rescue, being a floatplane or a ship to downed pilots on the channel, could be a paralel mission on itself. Because if it is near the middle, a pilot could be just caught by the other side, or there could be a minor fight in between coastal vessels trying to capture/rescue the fallen pilot.

Trigers will add most of this holly shit things, but we don't know if they will be available on SOW.

:idea:What if airplanes can not be identified immediately, as they are very far away?
An example: It would be realistic if somebody would say: "Attention! Planes at 10 o'clock. Lets go look who they are."

friendly fire seems to be the biggest issue.

perhaps we could have situations where there's blue on blue, be it ground to air, air to air, or whatever.

something to consider.

My two cents
 

A bit late I guess but after reading most of these pages I'll add my two cents of, hopefully, practical suggestions and not pie in the sky stuff.......

For SP;
1. As mentioned, random mechanical problems forcing a return to base, a forced pause at base(e.g. you are forced to sit in your aircraft [for 60 seconds or more?]until you get a message that your plane is fixed), then being allowed to take off again to try to catch up, locate your mates and finish your mission. The point being if you have to RTB early, then what?
2a. Airfield "life". It doesn't have to be human characters walking around (although that would certainly be nice) but some vehicles moving around or planes being towed and airfield/hangar ambient sounds/noise beyond just birds singing etc. I always try to liven up the home base for my co-op group so that it seems that activity is going on around you and we're not the only ones there. A 'wounded' aircraft from a previous mission crash landing while I wait for takeoff. My point being that little things like that add to the immersion. An empty and sterile base where you and the other planes are the only "active" things is kinda dull. Not much point in having a ton of ground objects/people on your airfield (or any airfield) that don't DO anything. A little bit of eye/ear candy can make a big difference IMHO.
2b. Along the same lines, if coming back to base all shot up and making a tense landing or crash landing, hearing or seeing an ambulance and fire truck heading my way would add some immersion too.
3. Adaptive or updating radio chatter on enemy activity/location. This has been mentioned before on these pages so I won't belabour the point. Il2 1946 radio chatter will respond (sometimes) if you ask for a vector etc but it would be nice if you didn't always have to ask so to speak.
4. Taxiiing for takeoff instead of the neat line astern takeoff routine (I believe you've already addressed that from beta videos I've seen).
5. An AI "witness" to a kill in the post-mission debrief. Guncams weren't available early in the BoB so witnesses were very important for claims.
6. Crater damage to the runway that takes a while to repair and can damage your aircraft (I believe this is also part of your sim already but thought I'd mention it).
7. While I assume a lot of "briefings" would/should be along the lines of... "211 SQUADRON SCRAMBLE!!!!" followed by a radio update in the air en route to your intercept, more deliberate briefings should allow for the insertion of recce photos if applicable or even a recce film (that's stretching things at this late stage, I know, LOL). Perhaps in a later iteration of SOW.
8. I agree with the comments on the bailout sequence/animation/routine. A first person view would be preferred - being able to look around, check your canopy, right up to the thud/grunt of hitting the ground. Some steering of the chute would be cool to try and avoid landing in a river or whatever.(i.e. simulate the pulling on one of the risers).
9. As I'm sure has been mentioned elsewhere, the ground control radio traffic should be looked at, if it hasn't already. The IL2 1946 ground control radio traffic, specifically in the landing process, for example is incredibly repetitive and boring to the point that I simply switch off the AI chatter (especially online).

starting mission for save pilot in the sea after launch whit parachute.

mission of recoinnicance misson for take photo of target.

the pilot obiective is return to home after one mission.
return to home whit your plane
return to home whit dammage plane and after repair.
return to home in al type of mode.
return to home walking
return to home whit a car or veicle or ship or animal horse or whit a coloum of
friendly tanks.
stollen enemy airplane.
the pilot killing in the sea for enemy airplane gore gore blood in the sea.
the pilot captured for enemy soldiers.
thee pilot lauch radio signals online sistem all friendly pilot send help signals.
mission ended when pilot RETURN TO HOME.
yes important work

R E T U R N TO H O M E.

http://www.principalspage.com/theblo...tbulb_idea.jpg

one idea. If i am the pilot ofr a Ju88 anf i am the leader of the formation of four, and my objetive is a target in the canal, but in the middle of the mission, i see a Vickers Wellington, i want give the order to attack the english bomber. wish this can happens!!!
look:

http://www.aviationart.com.ar/galeri...n%202%20BR.jpg

after all ,the maximum speed of a Vickers Wellington are 378 km/h and the Junkers Ju 88 are over 500kmh

and don't forget the night missions

http://www.aviationart.com.ar/galeri..._Spitfires.jpg

I don't feel very confident that any of this stuff will be taken into consideration by Oleg and his gang. I expect no thought will be given to what gives real soul to a game. Oleg understands how to construct a game, sure. But does not have our game playing experience.

In 29 pages they have not bothered to respond to any suggestions. I wonder if after asking, they even bothered to read them...

No matter how good a simulator is, It's up to the players to put 'soul' into the game. The developers can create an atmosphere in which we play but it won't stop the hour long chat wars between team members complaining about shoulder shooting!

Hmm theres an idea! Maybe we need an officers mess where disgruntled players can meet after a mission and kick each others butts!

Not sure if I got the idea of the thread,but infantry would be good.
Having just tanks and other vehicle don´t really gives the feeling that is having a battle down there.

Aircraft carriers could also have real holes (not only graphical) on the deck when a bomb hit them,and that could make the planes that were going to take off to crash.Large holes on the hull would be awesome too.

I would like to see a failure cascade when a aircraft takes crippling damage. For example the loss of a strut causing other components to loosen and break on a targetted plane over the next 10-30 seconds. Damage exacerbated if the aircraft maneuvers heavily.

Heat-of-battle psychology: Maybe pilots who bail from perfectly good aircraft when there's an enemy on their six due to the fear and panic. Also, it would be nice if pilots had some kind of a morale level dependent on how many of them are involved in the dogfight compared with the number of enemies. A bomber formation that encounters a large interceptor force might just ditch bombs and turn for home. The last few outnumbered fighters in a dogfight may try to disengage - focusing on defensive maneuvers while they head homewards.

Some of this psychology stuff is less important in BOB than in other SOW releases, perhaps? It'd be nice to get it into the game early though.

Another related idea is to have some missions give a bonus to pilot morale. The briefing could have a "This mission MUST succeed" element. A flag is set that gives the pilots greater moral strength and willingness to take on the odds. The mission objective is vital, so Bombers will be more likely to press on into danger. Fighter pilots will be more willing to fly into massive formations of bombers and escorts. To a certain extent this mission flag will be a given when the mission is "Homeland Defence", so the RAF in BoB (and also the Polish Airforce in 1939 and the Luftwaffe of 1944, given other scenarios) will be given the aggression their role requires. Apart from the odd LMF of course. :)

T.

To much to filter through it all, but some simple stuff that might make you go Geez, did that really just happen.

Since its going to take place far more often over the water, how about better ditching effects. Rooster tails up over the hood and wings with occasional flips and cartwheels, canopies being ripped away, cockpits flooding in a mass of churning bubbles, that sort of stuff.

An occasional tire blow out on a hard landing that can throw a little rubber or the whole wheel into your wingy if landing in formation. Might give him a scare with blown out tire or dirt chunks flying toward his face.

It makes visually inspecting each other for combat damages a must if loose panels and fluids leaking can damage or impact others in a formation. Fly formation wrong with a fluid streaming wingy and your undamaged plane gets an oil slick canopy type of thing.

Hot brakes and wheel fires resulting if you ride and over abuse them, an overheated wheel blowing off like a rocket once in a while on the parking ramp.

Hung ordinance, can't get rid of it due to combat damage, or over stressing the racks, occasionally the arming mechanism malfunctions and it's hot, you've got decisions to make.

Foamed runways or fire trucks upon radio request, to douse you with fire suppressant. They can save your butt and plane if you play it cool, follow their instructions, when and where. Perhaps limited it to major bases with major support facilities.

Detailed night lighting at airbases, can set it to various degrees depending on how the war is going, weather, or mission requirements. Lights upon radio request type of thing, if in the mission orders for that sector.

Wet runways lose friction accordingly, and if very fast, planes can hydroplane giving a nasty surprise especially with crosswind effects.

Early oxygen systems were highly susceptible to freezing, beware those warm wet humid rainy days, with rapid climbs to freezing altitudes.

Radios that quit with a bullet hit, no more wingmen interaction once they separate visually.

Sea mine sweeper and sower capable aircraft preforming their missions in the sea lanes and coasts.

Check out this video about the Westland Lysander:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REZXvuULHMM

I hope the aircraft will make it into the sim

I recently finished reading of the adventures of the SOE and OSS in Europe, and I can't wait to be able to play my part as an intrepid RAF pilot assigned to support these important activities. I'll wait for SOW though, as I want to taste the adrenaline as I do forth into the unknown, in a fassion only a master like Oleg Maddox can provide.

I never fail to wonder at just how awful FSX looks.

Oh,and how's that DM?

Oh, that's right, it doesn't have one.

:roll:

Constantly amazed that people actually buy 3D models that have no use in what is really a flight proceedure simulator.

To each their own I guess.

I'll try to answer this one.

The fact that FSX has a lot of shortcomings (even in certain FMs) and is not a combat sim, doesn't detract from the fact that it has a few features a combat sim would benefit from, like for example the ability to actually model proper operating limits. This is not a procedure, it's just operating an aircraft in a semi-realistic manner.

A procedure is following certain rules during flight, from taxi to landing, like for example VFR/IFR flight plans. And yes, even during WWII they did follow procedures to an extent. How else would they recover a few dozens of aircraft (a lot of them damaged) after a big sortie and make sure they wouldn't crash into each other? They did all those nifty stuff like peeling off the formation at predetermined intervals to add some spacing before coming in to land, giving priority to damaged birds and so on. It's still a landing procedure, they just didn't have to fly a radio navigation assisted arc to land because they didn't have the means to do so (if they would they probably would), but they still didn't just barge in and drop the plane on the nearest available piece of open ground like we do when flying online.

What i'm trying to say is, don't confuse the scheduling, computer systems programming and mostly hands-off computer assisted flying of an airliner flight with the flying of a vintage warbird, or even a small general aviation prop driven aircraft by hand, it's two completely different worlds. I've had a 10-hour FSX flight in a Catalina over the carribean sea on a friend's PC (we took turns flying it during the course of a couple of evenings, since you can save mid-flight in FSX) and there was enough stuff to keep me sufficiently busy that i was not bored in the slightest. No autopilot, fancy electronics or strict flight plan restrictions, just VOR to VOR navigation with a GPS for backup (not precise enough to navigate by,just a "how longer to the next waypoint" device), manual flying through varying weather conditions (turbulence, clouds, etc) and engines that will overheat and seize (or worse) if you go over 120 knots. Yes, your car can probably go faster than a Catalina :grin:
That's when i first thought "it would be so cool if i had to monitor a few things this way in SoW, it would give me something to do and think about during the transit parts of each sortie and help form an attachment to my virtual ride, especially if weathering and aircraft stress accumulates over multiple sorties.".

Even if things don't go boom in FSX it's still interesting to see how complicated these things were to operate if you wanted to be a threat to your enemy and not yourself, which lends an extra layer of appreciation for the dangers of WWII air combat. Namely, the dangers of screwing oneself up beyond the point of RTB capability, but without receiving a single bullet hit. I like this challenge for a next-gen combat flight sim (as well as the workload that will help fill the time during cruise to and from the target area) but as you said to each his own, that's what difficulty settings are for.

I'm really happy that the inclusion of such features in SoW has been more or less confirmed in the check-six.fr interview, because we're finally going to start seeing an evolution of flying styles and tactics that has been missing from vintage era combat flight sims. People who don't like it will be able to turn it off anyway. As for those who like it, it will be so much fun to see something resembling an aviation film or even actual footage from WWII, people will be flying that way because the added complexity will make it a necessity to do so.

Today this necessity is missing. I mean, think of all those awesome IL2 movies that we've seen over the years with formations, attack profiles and aircraft that accelerate before attacking (because they were not at full throttle all the time during cruise to begin with). How often does one have an actual incentive to fly that way on our PC? Most of the times it's staged and flown this way to create a movie that resembles what we see in guncam archive films, but nobody would ever fly that way online. The reason?

In IL2 some things are so easy to sidestep and carry no penalty whatsoever that you actually gain an advantage by doing the non-realistic thing. If engines don't seize and burn by keeping them at full boost indefinitely (courtesy of the resettable overheat timer mechanic), then it's no wonder that people will keep the throttles firewalled and just cut back once every few minutes to reset the timer. However, if the simulation is complex enough the evolution will come naturally, because people will have to fly in a way that helps them manage the workload involved. This is not a cheap shot at IL2, because IL2 is friggin excellent for a title that's running on a 10 year old engine. However, a next gen combat flight sim that models these things the way IL2 does will not be excellent, it will be lacking. It's a matter of relative timing and release dates compared to available technology.

To put it in perspective, a lot of people who fly warbirds in FSX can't stop thinking "man, i wish i had these extra features on an IL2 FM/DM in a combat setting" most of the time.
This is why people buy expensive 3D models of warbirds for FSX, because there's not yet a single simulator that does the whole package. Hopefully this will change with SoW.

Currently, IL2 models the aerodynamics and DM that FSX doesn't do that well (or completely lacks in the case of DM), while FSX models the mechanical workings of the airframe that IL2 doesn't do in depth. It's just like it has happened in the past, in European Air War i only needed a throttle since pitch and mixture was automatic in all aircraft, then IL2 came along and suddenly i had prop pitch and mixture to read, learn and think about...and i thought "wow, nice". This is what i hope will happen in SoW as well, when i'll see the FM/DM excellency coupled with a new ingredient, the mechanical inner workings of my virtual aircraft. If SoW does this well, then i guess a lot fewer people will be buying warbird add-ons for FSX ;)

I've actually flown the P-40E add on when I had FSX installed.

It was a nice plane, but after 30 minutes of flying around my home town and Toledo Ohio, I was left wondering what else there was to do with it.

Not knocking the model, just it's application. To me FSX is about as exciting as watching paint dry. Another time I was online with another of the BlitzPigs and we flew CF-18s around his neck of the woods, Vancouver BC. After looking at the scenery for 45 min. or so we both said almost simultaneously on comms... "Now what?" Ummmm... "Land?"

I guess it's just not for me. To each their own though.

I do have to admit that if armed aircraft were possible in FSX it would be fun to shoot down an airliner or two on one of those uptight air traffic control online sessions, just to hear the wailing on comms. Now that would be fun.

Lot's of great ideas in this thread.

When a pilot bail over enemy territory,a cutscene appears where he is being arrested by enemy ground forces.

I dreamed one day that I bailed a plane on IL2 and I got on first person view from the pilot and I was holding a gun!Started shooting the tanks that were near me and planes passing by...

+1 No interest in FSX whatsoever.