I don't blame you guys for not posting anything. You are right about that. There will always be people here that will complain about anything. Even when BoB is finished there will STILL be folks who will complain about something. You can never please everyone all of the time.
And you have said what I have been saying all along...it will be ready when it's ready.

Agreed...its kind of embarrassing.

Some of the people posting comments here are showing a lack of "class"...their are ways of asking questions, and expressing feelings without being rude or disrespectful.

If I had people picking apart every bit of information I released, I might think twice before posting any updates... or visiting.

Its interesting how some people perceive the "business man" to "consumer" relationship and how they feel it differs from a "normal" person to person dynamic... Some consumers of the "IL2" products feel that their purchase of the game "entitles" them special treatment. One comment you hear time and time again is "I bought all the IL2 games, and I plan on buying BoB SoW so Oleg owes me an explanation... he promised me an explanation...he broke his promise."

In the normal world you would be nice to people you wanted to hear from, but some people feel that because they bought the game that they no longer have to treat Oleg like a normal human being... they feel that their purchase means that they can talk to Oleg in any way that they want to.

Interesting...

All of us here are posting on an official fan site and would not be doing so unless we had a great interest in sims and SOW in particular. We all have a right to vent and give our opinions positive or negative.

If someone makes a negative post or questions the powers at be, so be it and move along or comment...you will probably get a comment back. It also goes the other way, blindly agreeing with info that is kinda separated from reality will be questioned by someone. Be it programming time, FW 190 windscreens, ammo loads, FM's, choice of flyable aircraft, lack of cockpit info, copyright issues, etc.

If you want to follow lock step and believe the company line, fine. But don't get upset when some of us will not follow so quietly and try to question everything!!:)

Not really what I'm talking about...

It seems as though there are those that feel that because they bought the product (Il2) from Oleg, they can "push" him around and demand that they are the ones giving him a paycheck, and that if he wants another paycheck (ie BoB) he had better hurry up, do it THEIR way, or they won't buy it. What few people post here ( in relation to total sales ) won't make any difference in the grand scheme of things if they choose not to buy BoB.
The fact that Oleg has received money for the copy ( or ten copies ) of Il2 that we have purchased does not make us the boss. If that were true, then we would have a classic case of too may chiefs and not enough indians, if you know what I mean.
Even in the latest update, many are speculating about this and about that..."Why is Oleg even working on this aircraft...What a waste of time" For all those who are skeptical, I wish you would keep your comments to yourselves. It is things like this that keeps Oleg and Ilya away, and this is not the first time someone has said this. Even Ilya has said himself that no "good" updates will be made for a while until things are "perfect" as there will be those that will whine and complain knowing full well that these are work in progress shots, not the final release.
Ilya almost came right out and said it. They are tired of the whining and complaining around here from some of you...This isn't right, that's not right...Even when patches were released for Il2 there were many complaints, about every single patch. It is true that there were some legitimate issues, and Oleg fixed them, but many were foundless.
Oleg is a good man with the same passion for WW2 aircraft that I have, and I am so glad that someone like him has taken so much of his time to make such a great work of art like Il2. But even that wasn't enough for Oleg. I am not sure what Oleg's motivations are ( but I am so glad he has them) but he had to do even better and start making SoW:BoB. I have been really impressed with this man in the past, and he has earned my trust as I am sure he has with many of you. I know that he is working hard and when the day comes that BoB has come to fruition, I will be overwhelmed to see how much was put into it.

Oleg, Luthier, et al.

Know that for every troll and mouthbreather lurking about these assorted forums, there are many of us who have likely invested far more time (and money!) in the series patiently (and quietly) waiting on the sidelines for our chance to jump back in to the game. We know that no matter how long it takes, SoW will be truly great and have every confidence in the progress we've seen in development so far.

Take care,
Alan

Maybe the people who sow the seeds of discontent are working secretly for some unknown (yet unannounced) flight-combat sim... maybe they are trying to undermine the community or trick Oleg into divulging "secret" features that he is developing for BoB SoW (LOL!!) :) :)

Yeah and peiople wonder why Oleg stopped coming to UBI..

Too true. And it will be the same folks who have whined for the last 7 years.


How was the B 17 ride at MAAM? Boy was it hot this year.

Listen guys, you don't have to apologise or explain anything. I understand exactly how you feel. There's been a break in communication, so this is a natural development. We need to work better on communicating with you guys. It takes a while to (re)-establish rapport. I can't speak for Oleg, but I personally will try to communicate more, and hopefully after a while we'll all be on the same page.

And to explain to everyone who I am exactly and what my relationship is with Oleg, we've been working together since I think 1999. First I just helped him in my spare time, starting from the very early pre-Il-2 days. Then after a while I figured this could be a full time thing for me, so I started RRG, which is basically an extension of 1C:MG. We work together as basically two offices of the same company (Oleg is in Moscow and my team is mainly in Kiev). We had this symbiotic relationship on Pacific Fighters and 1946 - I was the design lead on one end, Oleg was on the other, my guys built most of the content, and his guys put it all together.

The relationship continues today in exactly the same way. I'm building my own thing for Korea, and also doing thing for BoB (two games on the Storm of War engine). With BoB, RRG guys under my command are building some 3D models to be used in Battle of Britain, and I'm also doing things like radio comms, training mission, dynamic campaigns, GUI design, and generally participating in high-level design of the sim as a sort of an added brain. In short, RRG and MG have a highly intertwined relationship that's really hard to describe in a paragraph or two.

PS To nip a potential conspiracy theory in the bud, RRG is doing work on BoB, but MG is doing no work on Korea. Korea has no bearing on any BoB schedules.

Well done luthier
 

Your post should put a damper on all the conspiracy theories - obviously there is a lot of hard work going on with both your team and Oleg's, the end result will be the best flight sim on the market again. As you said earlier the big word is 'patience' - both BOB SOW and your Korean Air War will be 'really' worth the wait.
DFLion

a grain of salt
 

So many people wanting information...some are to vocal and rude, but this is found through out life :-P

@ Luthier
 

Thanks for the clarification Luthier.
Any chance of an update on your home page; http://rrgstudios.com ? It’s almost a year since the last.

Regards
Viking

Sad but probably true.

At least I could understand it and I'm sorry the lack of active moderators here makes the UBIZOO look like a petting zoo compared to what some people make out of this forum. :mad:

Thanks for your patience with us, luthier and thanks so much for the insights into what is going on behind the scenes. Considering how many talented people are working on both titles, I'm sure the outcome will be more than worth the wait.

One question to both sims:
I see that both are based on the SoW-Engine. Does that mean that we can merge installations?
I was just thinking, that this would open the possibility for your team to work back through time adding content and MG to move forward, which would mean an awesome couple of years ahead for SoW and for us SIMers. :cool:

+1

Great minds think alike... (but you said it a little better then I did) :)

Jesus guys, you really need to get out more, i haven't found any of the posts in here to be rude or insulting I've seen some frustration a little bit of disbelief and a lot of questioning but nothing that would not happen on a day to day basis in any commercial business. All of these so called insults have done nothing but good, even Luthier has understood that there has been a break down in communication which he hopes to rectify over the coming months, so a big round of applause to all those people who have got the bollocks to ask questions to query statements and not to blindly go along with everything said, we could always start a new forum for all those people who want to sit and nod heads, cheer and agree - we could get president Bush to be a moderator!

P.S. Thanks for the last post Luthier keeping good comms is a definite step forward.

I can tell you that we are thinking about such feature. Howevere I think that MG will move forward with WWII, but Korea - also will move forward to the jet era. This is one of variants in future. Another - WWI. But we at MG will stay long enough with WWII. At least I hope so.

Probably will be possible not to merge Korea with BoB, but move aircacft from one to another with the limit for online gemeplay using theses planes. Mian programmer didn't confirm me that, but I should also check it with marketing guys..... I think you know what I mean

The BoB basic engine we are making for the series of sims and this development based on the experience with Il-2 on the market. We put there many features, that we will use even later, after BoB, but not yet in BoB.... Its normal if you want long life for you kid.

That sounds really, really great!

I took from the comments posted before that SoW will be able to simulate a great variety of objects and even avionics in great detail, but this really surpasses my highest hopes and I can understand even better why it takes so long and so hard work to get the SoW-engine done.

So, a few years into the future we *might* have one awesome realistic simulation covering almost all eras of flight, with the possibility of interchangeable objects and planes, probably spanning across half the globe.

Maybe this will enlighten some people about the magnitude of this project and of what lies ahead of us. :cool:


Thanks you, Oleg, luthier and your teams for your hard work!

Please don't take one or two reactions as representative of the general opinion.

I welcome anything that comes along. I understand that showing us in-game shots of imperfect terrain etc. would only produce huge dissapointment here. That is better left until the whole thing is finished. Having said that I see the BoP trailer as being an indication of the sort of thing we might get (only we will have it even better), and that is VERY interesting.

B.T.W The trailer was extremely well presented. Very proffessionally done.

Welcome to forum Oleg
 

Good to see you again and get some more development insights.
Firstly I hope you stick with WWII aerial history and gradually work your way back through an update of IL2 to the new SOW engine - updated aircraft, maps etc. (I would be personally very happy if you can do this)

Secondly being a complete 'aeroplane enthusiast' it would be great if you could step back into the WW1 era (where it all started - I watched the "Blue Max" the other night on DVD - great film) and also forward into the 'jet era' starting with the Korean war - I think we are all fascinated by the way the aeroplanes developed (more power/speed/weight etc).
Moving aircraft between Korea and BOB with 'the limit of online gameplay' would be interesting, though I am personally very big on historical accuracy.

Finally it is good to see you are building in to the SOW engine "long life for your kid" with a lot more exciting surprise features.

You can see the community was getting 'very jittery' with no communications. I hope this previous 'long break in your silence' now shows you that there are many very dedicated fans of the flight sim that need communication to keep 'the ball' rolling along.

DFLion

Hi leit'!
I think the Gladiator is at least in part included for balance. There has to be something to dual with the Italian Biplane (I forget the name), not least for online gaming. It will also widen the appeal of the game.

The comments about rudeness where mostly posted in response to "someone" calling Luthier a liar (a comment that Luthier took "great offense" from). You will not find the offending comment anymore because it was changed...

I'm not really sure what taking offense from these personal attacks has to do with "blindly going along with everything said"... but I'm sure it makes sense to you (somehow).

I ask questions all the time (and I have had some of them answered by Oleg), but I do it without calling people liars, or getting people worked up with wild conspiracy theory's...

And speaking of wild conspiracy theory's, Luthier has stated that the "negativity, accusations and criticism" that you are so fond of is one of the reasons why we DON'T see "alpha game" screen shots...and its because Oleg and crew know that 2 seconds after the "alpha shots" are posted that people will be flooding the forum with negative comments about all the unfinished details.

If you think that the "so called insults" have done nothing but good then I really hope the moderators start taking a more active role in the forums because your attitude will be opening a floodgate of unruly behavior...


p.s. Oleg thanks for dropping in and answering that question, its nice to hear from you again (so soon)... :) :) :)

Logic dictates that the next expansion to the sim will be the Mediteranian theatre of war. The release of a taster plane for that theatre seems in order?
Maybe as in the past it might be a bonus for the online crowd giving them a complete planeset of the Mediterainian theatre /battle for Crete, Greece, Malta etc.
He has supplied the Italian planes so why not include all the planes needed to simulate parts of the early mediteranian conflict. This is a first, someone complaining about too many planes :grin:
I suspect the me108 like the tigermoth are intended as either online trainers or as part of a historically acurate training phaze in the Dynamic or scripted campaigns.
Imagine the joy of actually completing a simulation of the genuine Luftwaffe or RAF pilot training program. Even if it is scripted or only as part of the tutorials it would be awesome.

Proton, you have consistently called anyone that has asked for more updates or questioned the current status of SOW a whiner, how is that being constructive? You obviously have little or 'no' understanding of the word 'debate'. According to yourself and others its ok to ask questions as long has we dont mention anything to do with completion or release dates. I really dont think either Ilya or Oleg are that 'thin skinned'. You should give them far more credit, and stop trying to protect them, i am most certain they are more than capable of doing that for themselves.

Thanks for the update, it is much appreciated.

Everything I’m reading sounds fantastic. We’ll be getting two incredibly detailed simulators. One will begin with the Battle of Britain and progress to other Theaters. Then at around the same time, we’ll be headed to Korea and the birth of the jet age. What is there not to like.

I’m as anxious as anyone to get my hands on both of these, but I’m willing to wait until it’s done right.

Welcome to the club of bada$$es who really think that this whining leads to nothing, Proton45.

Tree_UK, the persons who really just asked about the status or updates are rare and why do you think they have an even thinner skin than Proton45 and myself that they can't take the truth and the hint that there is a) a search function that would reveal about 30-40 likewise threads and b) a number of stickies and other threads explaining the current problems?

Infact, why would you call it a debate anyway, if they were merely asking for updates? :confused:

Best post so far!

You have just sent my mind racing with the possibilities of the training program. Two seater planes able to have two players inside one aircraft, one a trainer the other a new player, doing an historical flight program of each nation. This is how I will get my friends interested in this game to play with me!

I don`t :)

The 108 and the Anson were used very successfully as training-aircraft. The 108 saw action in many areas, the Anson was even used for bombing-missions and sold to many countries. Besides that, in wartime both machines were used as courier planes, for transporting passengers and recon-operations in various theaters of war, which is exactly what a lot of IL2-fans wanted for years.

It wouldn't be impossible to make the Anson flyable if a third party was interested. The information needed is (nearly?) all here in this simHQ thread, collected for the model we see in the recent update:

http://www.simhq.com/forum/ubbthread...39#Post2388039

True. I've been posting this a lot of times before: The partially open structure will probably make a lot of AI-planes flyables within a matter of weeks or month, because the community will deliver high-quality-pits quickly.

So announcing AI-planes for BoB makes me quite looking forward to a great variety of planes in the end.

It would be nice if you are right but I doubt it will be an easy task to create a cockpit for SoW models. At least if you want to maintain the standard of the original game. Did Ilya say 6 or 12 month for the Anson? And that would be a professional working full time.

On the other hand there are teams like slowakia, OFF or MAW who could probably pull that off. But even then I don't expect more than a handfull of planes added by non-commercial developers.

IIRC a lot of high-quality-pits for IL2 were also done by fans in a matter of weeks or few month with a lot of hard work. I agree that the level of detail will be higher, but sometimes it's easier to model something more complex with plenty of polygons than having to cut down a lot of aspects to meet specifications.

Depending on how the implementation works, I guess I'll be back into the modeling-business myself. ;)

I don't think the mere ability to use a 3D modelling tool is the issue here - it's the "produce a 3D model which is technically compatible to the specifications". IIRC that was the major roadblock for a lot of modellers in the "history" of Il-2 ... and SoW increases the details by a huge margin.

As always in moddable games we will see a lot of good and even more bad things. Experience in the CFS community (MAW, OFF etc etc) show that most of the stuff is "so-so", and some few guys (2 or 3 max) are really good. In FSX it's not so much different...just more people around.

That is true. Likely more so with the complexity of next gen models.
What I am looking forward to is proffessional 3rd party paid addons. When the likes of Shockwave start releasing aircraft for SoW, it will be something else. :)

Ouh Yea baby!:grin: You see that Fw 187 and the HE 115...

+1! Let's hope that happens!

Yep or others....Lago etc...Open cokpit making etc is a whole new playground for commercial add-on makers.

Anything I said about Ilya or Oleg came from a post that was made under "Luthier". I'm not speculating about anyones "feelings"...I'm just listening to what people are saying.

From Luthier post:

and


If you think he is being "thinned skinned" then maybe you a should bring it up with him or Oleg...

I think enough has been said now, and I'm on to other things. :) :)


I hope your ok with things and hold no ill-will (I don't)...anyone I may have called a whiner (more or less) asked for it by posting their comments in a provocative manor, and you know it. I never called anyone a whiner who was sincere about their comments.

Well, I was sincere about my comments, and we got some updates from Oleg and Ilya. That's all that was asked. I hope the line of communication will remain open.

Thank you Oleg and Ilya, for your patience and understanding.

+1

Can't wait for Cant's, Caproni's, Fiat's, Macchi's, Breda's etc. etc!!!!!

Keep up the good fight Oleg and Luthier...looking forward to more communication with the community:grin:

Luthier

Check PM, pls

Lets forget the unpleasantness and focus on this:

:D imagine ...BoB alpha...

You better can wait... a bit more. :-P

I imagined it would be beta by now, but at least it's been worked on. Alpha after 5 years, it must be either a very bad managed project or a very groundbreaking and extraordinary one... Hope is the second. :cool:

From all the things we do know about BoB, it will be groundbreaking...and what about all the stuff we don't know about? That is what gets me so anxious, just thinking about all the surprises that will be in store for us.

Really encouraging about what was said about moving forward through WWII, I hope he makes it back to the Pacific

Thanks for the up-date. I'm really excited about Project Galba. The mix of late WW II equipment and early jets will add a whole new dimension to the sim. I hope you guys plan carrier ops. Skyraiders and Cougars off a carrier will be GREAT! (Not to mention Sea Furies and Corsairs...).

It would make sense to me to enable the merging or at least the ability to import/export aircraft and objects from one to the other. It would seem to me that this would cut down on the amount of labor the development team would have to put in on modeling. The ability to take a truck, for instance, and simply import it from SOW into Galba, instead of having to model it over again. Not to mention that several of the aircraft which should appear in Galba will eventually appear in SOW, assuming that it expands into the Pacific theater in WW II.

Korea.... Korea..... BoB is dead to me.. Give me Korea.:cool:

Yeah im ok and there is no ill will here. S!

Too burned out from years of hoping and wishing and seeing naught. Finding it too hard to summon even a modicum of enthusiasm for more blue-screen wip's. Couldn't even bring myself to bother saving these ones to my hard drive. And to think I used to be so enthusiastic about SoW....:(

@feathered

you might have been enthusiastic but your endurance seems way too low. :-) :-) :-)

+1 :grin:

Get it up is one thing, keep it up another. ;)

LOL

That is exactly my experience... many of us are rivetcounters buit in fact have no clue at all. me included.:grin:

but i will still be counting rivets in the future, cound on that !
:cool:

For all else: thank you, thank you thank you.

it doesnt need your petulant remarks to stir up the dust after the issue has already been settled by the relevant parties, and btw the post in question not say "liar, liar, pants on fire", neither was the word liar used.

what was said, is something like "i dont believe you" (that it was a coincidence we get some new screenshots within 24 hrs of the proverbial hitting the fan when we suddenly find out il2/bob has gone to consoles, while previously for 3 months there is no update in this forum but we have been told "something big is being worked on").

and yep with hindsight the overall tone in the initial msg was maybe stronger then needed (as somebody pointed out diplomatically at the time, after which it was edited), but it was written at the hight of the great "BoB console crisis" of 2008, when tempers were getting a little frayed. and all those events came and went, completely without your involvement or participation.

with people like you its as if we are in a monty python movie "the life of brian", and anytime something said by the messiah is questioned, the response from the brown tongues is as if somebody in the crowd yelled "jehova".

About this comment:

frome here:

http://www.freewebs.com/heinkill/stormofwarnews.htm


I'm of course thinking of the Invader, which is a must for a Korea sim, but also very interesting for late WWII scenarios.

Thanks for the heads up. Great collection, but all these "Q&A" are collected single statements from this very forum ;)