Son of a . . .

I'm hoping, I'm really hoping that this isn't true.

While Multi-Player is going to be what keeps me the most interested for the longest time, I do enjoy a Single-Player campaign with a bit of a story as well. RAF is all fine and dandy, but I was looking forward to seeing what they were going to do with the German campaign.

At least the modders can make a Single Player German campaign we can play (assumign they are allowed access to the big map). Just have to wait a few months or so.

Well, I don't know if it's real or not...
but I hope it is a true leak !!

About Ubi, I think I read somewhere that they officially dropped their stupid DRM... At least Assassin's Creed 2 has had a patch so you "only" have to be connected at the launch, and not while playing (it's still too much for me to buy it but it's better)

My question exactly.

Until we officially hear from Oleg or a publisher i'm not holding my breath in any case, but if this is legit then i hope Ubi has learned from their DRM mistakes with Assassin's Creed II and Silent Hunter V.

It's been hinted that the new title will feature an integrated server browser/matchmaking service, so i don't see why a permanent connection would be required. If they tie use of the multiplayer to a proof of purchase that's protection enough.

Up till now, the most trouble free online protection i've seen is in Starcraft 2 and that's because you can still play if your internet access is down and it doesn't use any external applications (like Steam for example), apart from needing a web browser to initially create a user account and input your cd-key details. In fact, you only need to connect once if you only want to play against the AI.
There are other issues with Blizzard /Activision, but as far as this particular strategy game is concerned the copy protection doesn't trouble the legitimate user.

The way it works is you make a free account for their online matchmaking service, then you log into its website and input the game's CD-key to tie that account to your legitimate game purchase. This flags your account as a legitimate owner of the game, it also enables you to download the installation files if you misplace your original DVD or you want to play from another PC, but the game still ships in a nice little box.
To activate the installed game all one needs to do is log in with a valid account ONCE (ie, an account with a valid starcraft 2 cd-key tied to it). No limited activations/deactivations, none of that hassle. Just log in with a valid account once and you are good to go.

However, it doesn't need a constant internet connection.
After the game has been activated, as long as you are connected to the internet you will be asked to log in every time you launch the game. However, if for any reason your internet access is down, an already activated installation of the game offers you the option to launch it in offline mode. The game simply detects if there is working internet access before demanding it, which is good enough for me. You can also "fool" the game by resetting your router as it's loading and it will not demand that you log in, which is exactly why Blizzard provided a way to save us even that little trouble: even if you are connected and the game demands a log in, you can press the "go offline" button on the main screen after you log in and that's it.

It's simple, clean, offers both digital and physical distribution and most importantly, you can still play against the AI if your internet connection is down, both the single player campaign and custom missions. You can't do that in Silent Hunter 5, you can only do it for half the single player game modes in RoF (quick mission builder and static campaigns only) and that's why i didn't buy any of these two but i bought Starcraft 2.

You can even switch between different accounts by logging in and out on the same installation, for example if people take turns on a single PC during a LAN party/tournament and they want to tie their match results to their personal statistics.


On another note

I'd like to know about that as well :-P

Re: 'Why isn't there a 1c log on the box?'

- there is, on the images on the previous page.

Oh well then the Spit manual will be just fancy toilet paper......
But I most likely will go for the standard version, don´t need no collectors version. Have enough things that collect dust, don´t need no big boxes to add.

really just a standard sized box
image has 2 views of the same single box

Is this real??????

It isn't on all images, and on some it looks like it was added later. I am not holding my breath.

Isn't the Spitfire Manual a manual for a real Spitfire. It has nothing to do with the game. It's a historic treat kind of thing.



http://www.amazon.ca/Spitfire-Manual...4929060&sr=8-2

A couple of things, why would there be fake box shots on several online retailers wich are conducting serious business? Also, this game isn't really Gears of War 3, Portal 2 or the new Bioshock game, what's the point of making a fake box-art picture of such a small and unknown title as IL-2? LOL! some of you guys take the brand TOO serious, this is IL-2, NOT Uncharted or any such triple-A title. One more thing, collectors edition is MINE!:grin:

Looks like Marc deleted his post ;)

"So, und jetzt lösche ich mein Posting wieder da ich eigentlich nichts gesagt habe"

So absolutely not fake? :)

I'm quite certain it is absolutely not a fake (almost).

It looks like they have exaggerated the size of the box. If it is to contain one 'silk' map and two book it doesn't need to be much bigger than the DVD box in dimnsions, just a bit deeper.

The two versions of the box (with IL2 logo and without ) have a few other differences too.

The planes have slightly different attitudes. Gun flashes. Less Heinkels. Colour is more distinct too in the one with the logo.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...of-Dover02.jpghttp://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...of-Dover01.jpg

LOL, and he's over at SimHQ trying to get sympathy :D

S!

Will buy the Collector's Edition for sure, if there would be one with Bf109 manual :)

As I said in my Squad. forum
http://www.bioxd.com/wp-content/uplo...ter_lg_2_4.jpg

Spitfire has a spinner too.

And diferent RAF roundels

Understand German Flanker?

http://109lair.hobbyvista.com/techre...ls/manuals.htm

S!

Sure do ;) Nice manuals :)

planemanual would be only interesting for me IF it would describe how the plane behaves in game and not if its "only" a realtime manual that has few influence of the ingame plane.....

but i would looking forward to such a printed huge map of the ingame map :) , again IF its showes the ingame one............. :D

Wow!
11 pages in 17 hours.
This has really stirred people up. :)
I wonder where this "photo" originated from?

Why would one put old shots with very WIP effects on the box.
That's plain stupid.

Temporally placeholders to let the retailers at least have a decent image? Instead of a big question mark, anyway, if this were to be a hoax, it's still good for the promoting of CoD/SoW/BoB !

Yepp all that is missing is DIY http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...very-happy.gif

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...y_spitfire.jpg

if that's the contents i'll be putting my name down for a pre-order.

No German campaign! Did not expect that, comes probably as add on.

That's not what we thus far know of their plans, they're planning on releasing the Korea war as the first next add on, but who knows? ( They better do make a german one, otherwise I'll bend this tin can here and throw it in the garbage bin!:grin:)

But I think you can make your own campaigns anyway, and there's some real talent out there!

As long as the planes are flyable the lack of a campaign is not that big a deal, because we would still be able to fly user made German campaigns and also multiplayer (i still wonder what the rumored new MP mode is going to be). I would expect them to release new theaters (maps and new aircraft) as payware add-ons, with smaller improvements and bug fixes as part of the regular patching process.

In that sense, i expect that the German dynamic campaign will probably come as part of a post-release patch and not as a totally separate expansion, since it is part of the same theater.

Well, we'll see how it goes.

Maddox games are working on the German Campaign. I would have thought it would make the initial release. If not it will probably be a free addon, not long after the initial release. This will have nothing to do with when the third party Korean war addon is released..

Why would they make a super realistic sim (yes, I think it will be super-realistic with a good gameplay) with a planes that don't react like it's real life counterpart as it should be perfectly doable?

Like if you get the best performance on the climb from x-y thousand meters with manofiold pressure Z and prop pitch Q then it should not be rocket science to replicate that to the sim either as there normally is plenty of manuals and pilot notes available.

Or if you should lower the gears over X mph then that should be the limit.

Manuals and operational handbooks should be the starting point for modelling planes if a real one is not availeble to model from.

And you are so sure of that because of?

Otherwise I would be a Spit only sim, lol.

I wonder how that Su-26 campaign is coming along...

:)

Oleg said in this forums a few days ago that they are still working on the German campaign. He didn't say wether or not the campaign will be in the initial release or released later. I would imagine he would want to have the campaign complete before the initial release, but shite happens.

What caught my eye was someone who posted text read from the back of the box screenshots.

Something along the lines of "online ongoing war, can last for weeks".

This sounded AMAZING to me and has been something I have been dreaming of for years in flight sims.

I hope its real. I really do think there is so much info yet to be released about this sim that will blow our minds.

I have serious misgivings when I see a Spit manual only, and incomplete Axis feature's.

It might be fun to scoff at the German stuff being seen as not important but it will drive the divide between "fair play" and historical accuracy once again to the fore front as the two sides are seen not as important as each other.

The old adage "well we won the war" wears very thin these days, from the Allied pilots who use it to cast off any Axis gripes.

I hope its held back until its a completed package and the distribution is intercontinental and not staggered as it has been in the past causing piracy over the 4-6 week difference in distribution.

If a German software house created this sim what would you be thinking if it was called Operation Sealion and the manual was only a bf109 and there's no allied campaign on release, it will be added at a later date ?


just a different way to look at it.
Have fun.

Not to worry Alpha. The german campaign will be in the Cliffs of Dover in the initial release or shortly after.

Nice call!:cool:

"IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs Of Dover

The name is for real. Just got that confirmed. I'm going to change the name of the forum."



From goud at SimHQ (hope he dont mind)



P.S. Its now officially "IL2 Sturmovik: Cliffs Of Dover" over at SimHQ. May "BoB: Storm of War" rest in peace. (kind of liked "SoW" myselfe)

Didn't you know it's coming? ;)
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/2370/boxbobv9.jpg

Its a march 24th release, but we all know that has good possiblity of being delayed.

You're with the wrong flight sim then ;)

Falcon 4 has evolved to the point where you can do just that ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falcon_4.0
http://multiviper.com/

It's staggering to think that this Sim which has been around since 98 is still going.

That's true. Long experience has shown us that the publishers date and the developers dates never, ever match.

Gawd.... I hope we DON'T have a leaked beta.

WTF! I rarely go into conspiracy theories but now this pisses me so much that I would like to go. However NO GERMAN campaigns can mean less pilots in Axis side. Even if it would not be so, it is just plain unfair there is no Axis campaign. Fix please, Oleg.


Edit: Fix also please historical and other inaccuracies in the box, if the box was real WIP project. Best redo the box completely. The picture is confusing. There are clouds and white cliffs, but which are what? The box doesn't need to represent chaos of combat flight in that way. Fix please even if it would mean later release day.

And don't nag about my wishes people because I don't care.

Try reading the thread again. There is a german campaign, we are just not sure if it will be in the intial release or put in as an update.

For all the bad press that got heaped on Rise of Flight when the distributors forced an early release, it is ironic that the same situation is being forced on Cliffs of Dover.

Guys relax. I'm sure that's not the FINAL box. I'm sure they just want to cover all their bases and not promise anything that's not in the game but on the box (TBF Avenger in PF anyone?)

If Oleg gets the German campaign done before the game goes gold whenever, I'm sure they will put it on the box...if not I'm sure it will be available in an update shortly after the release.

Never, in the field of human bullpoop, has so much been written by so many about so little... ;)

Where does it say March 24th Chivas?

On most e-shops.

To prove to my friend Tree that I'm not a Butt Smoocher, I really don't like the DVD box art at all. I think the big collector box is cool but I think the plastic DVD box looks dull sleepy and boring. Nothing like the 2001 IL-2 box. They should scrap that painting and go for a smoother realistic look.

Impossible it is to please 100% of all users.

(That's not a shot at anyone, it is a fact)

Well I am wondering with the name "Cliffs of Dover CoD" if they are not going to get a lashing by the makers of "Call of Duty CoD" :rolleyes:

No German campaigns? This is not a deal breaker...the German aeroplanes are still flyable, and it will not be long before some talented community member makes some dam fine Luftwaffe missions. Besides, I'm sure that their are some people that would find "Nazi missions to destroy England" to be in bad taste.

The lack of a BF109 manual in the "deluxe" box is also, not a deal breaker...anything "EXTRA" that they throw into a deluxe package is cool...maps, manuals, whatever.

Actually if CoD really lacks any kind of german campaign (which I somehow doubt since it doesn't make sense at all) it would be a dealbreaker for me. I have zero interest in the RAF part and find online totally overrated (with the massive egos and whining that's found online; I have enough kindergarten feeling at work, don't need this in my freetime as well) it wouldn't give me anything substantial.

However, I consider this "information" a mere misunderstanding or miscommunication. The official announcement should clear up any questions.

A great way to put it.

Ahh, nice - so they got my email saying they'd better get it done before my birthday (march 25:th) or else...

Hey mazex mine is the 27th of March. We'll have to remember each others lol

Just of curiosity; would you see online flying as a opportunity if you found servers that contained the proper level of intellect?

It saddens me when I hear virtual pilots don´t get the opportunity to experience the magnificent world of online flying just due to some air quake idiots. :(

I have the same feeling. Anyone who treats a new online flier badly is doing IL-2 a disservice. I think I've seen a pic of cs Thor in a 109 once and it was an extremely tight fit. Was that you cs Thor?

For me getting in a tangle with another aeroplane that's being controlled by another living person is so much fun and such a big rush that my hands start to shake if it's a hard fight. So to ruin that for a new comer who wants to try online flying just seems cruel.

I actually sat in the rebuilt Bf 109 G-2 of the Messerschmitt Stiftung back in 2000 or 2001 (but I don't think I ever posted a photo of this :mrgreen: ).

Regardless I am not a "newbie" when it comes to online flying - I've done this from 2000 to something 2006 or 2007 but quite frankly my interests are focused on aerial warfare as opposed to the fighter-centered gangbang that is predominant on most servers. I also have very high standards for what is believable and what not (which is why I never got into SEOW or similar wars, I have massive issues with the supply systems in them) and I am an ardent believer in strictly historical planesets.
But I have learned that such interests aren't present online or - which is also true - that projects approaching my ideal make compromises (to cater to certain factions) which I cannot agree with. Which is why I stay offline and "do my own thing".

You have been flying on the wrong servers mate. ;)

Once DBS gets back together I'll send you an invite to one of our Dedicated Missions. Strictly historical, recreation of famous battles, each plane wearing a proper skin, squadrons you name it...

Thx, but no thx. I'm all comfy and cuddly in my little world ... offline. :mrgreen:

csThor: you should try in servers like Spits vs 109 with some mates in TeamSpeak

It's getting a bit too OT so I guess we should go BTT now. ;)

like CsThor i've flown online(upto about 2005) and the reasons for no longer doing so are similar(ego driven jerks etc etc.)
yep i could enjoy some servers that were sometimes fun but for me they declined to the point they were rare, so i stopped 'banging my head against a brickwall' and carried on flying offline and actually enjoying myself:-P

What i find 'saddening' is the constant attempts by a vocal minority (20% fly online is one estimate http://www.simhq.com/_commentary/all_106e.html) to 'convert' offliners to their 'superior' way of playing. you create a sense an 'other'
CUI BONO?:confused:

imho enthusiasm is good, zealotry is bad;)


.... and now back to our usual transmission......

If Oleg doesnt appear today, there's nothing to say!

except that he still may be on holiday........

Rofl certainly I have better things to do than read this IL-2 Sturmovik Falls of Niagara thread again.

And I really don't care if there is 1000 German campaigns if none of them is included in initial release. I see you don't care either. However I am not a fanatical flight simmer. No German campaign means no IL-2 Sturmovik Falls of Niagara in my home 99% probability. I suck in flight sims enough to not fly online only as a free kill in Bf 109, not to speak how I see online furball circuses about as interesting as sniffing infantry grunt's socks after 40km march.

S!

Placed a pre-order of Collector's Edition on local game store. They will get it for me when released :) So now just sit and wait..

I have missed that. It would be weird Oleg releasing a BoB without a german campaign and patching it in. One would assume that building a campaign would not be the most time consuming task of the project.

If a person wanted to do some serious flying online that's where I would say to go also..Spits VS 109s. There aren't many idiots on that server.

Oh I prefer ZvsW to Spits VS 109s anytime.....you have next to never any early war maps there. It is all just late war orgies.....well who ever enjoys that.
And the nice thing there are next to no dweebfires on Zekes vs Wildcats

I love North Africa and 109F4s. I would be miserable in ZvsW , but some people think the desert is boring. Everyone is different. With an F4 you have a chance to be a real dogfighter :)

Well in 75% of the cases you will find me there in a Betty, one of my favorite planes. As with me planes have to have two engines, only exception is the George.

Warclouds 24/7 online server works very well for me. Each side has multiple ground target areas to destroy to win the map. You have a mixture of ground pounders, ground pounder cover, and high flyers. All good flyers communicating and coordinating tasks on teamspeak. Noobs are welcomed and helped. Jerks soon find another place to fly wether they like it or not..

He he, but ego driven jerks add to the realism! How many of those 30 year old colonels and generals wearing iron crosses with all the extra bling where NOT ego driven jerks? Really? ;)

But pilots flying with them did not have a choise ;) As opposite in this game.


Edit: And if they died, you never heard or saw them anymore - as opposite in this game. So lets not talk about realism regarding pilots :lol:

any form of 'lineshooting' was also rather frowned on in the RAF ;)

add to that my job often involves dealing with EDJ's and it's a facet of human behaviour i'd rather not have to deal with while having fun.
my choice, not trying to impose it on anyone else

now back to more conspiracy theories about what COD really stands for:-P

little to early for April Fools, good thing Oleg cleared that up last update

Bully for you. It's not what you do, its who you do it with. If you try and get "realism" offline then you're doomed to fail.

Climb down off your high horse for a while.

Hood

It's simple: isn't an "online vs offline" question, is an "Perfect A.I vs Poor A.I." question.

In ANY flight sim A.I. isn't near good. The best is to have human controlled aircraft. Today we have great internet connections and computers to handle multiple human-controlled aircrafts.

So, it's the "ideal" A.I.. Just need to gather the right people. A.I. in IL2? I pass: I want to come UNSEEN sometimes, see enemies doing UNEXPECTED maneuvers and work TOGHETER with teammates.

Offline? We just don't have it. It's a poor overall experience.

Isn't a matter of discussion, it's plain obvious: human controlled aircraft give much better experience and challenge than a bunch of predictable A.I. I can destroy easily 4 109's in an early Spit if they are flow by the better A.I. in IL-2, but if you put ONE human in the cockpit of one one of them, the world comes upside-down!

The future in combat flight sims is MP. Even more for the hardcore simmers.

Ahemmm

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=18091

:)

Actually, IL2's AI is very advanced in some regards (at least for when it was released), but the problem for me has always been that they don't act believable and go off on their own too much. For example, the moment they see enemies they break off and attack even if i'm the flight leader.

In European Air War everything was much simpler than IL2, but the AI did exactly as they were told and didn't do anything on their own unless absolutely necessary to ensure their survival. They would evade an enemy attack or take a snap-shot if they could, but for the most part they were glued to your wing unless you told them they are free to break off and do their own thing.

In this sense, while the AI is certainly not on par human intelligence i'm sure it can be made to act in a believable way.

This is the Achilles' heel of single player flying.

The Achilles' heel of multiplayer however is different. Human players rarely stick to how an operation is supposed to be flown, unless you spend time to find like minded fellows that will stick to the rules. Since i don't have the time to fly in organized squads, online wars or large scale coops this means that i have to bear with seeing solitary four engined heavies, some of them making a break for the target at tree top height and skip bombing, instead of flying properly in formations and bombing on command of the lead ship.

For me, human intelligence that liberally takes shortcuts detracts from the immersion factor just as much as an overly rigid and predictable AI, but it can't be helped.
We all have limited time to spend on this hobby and we all want to maximize our fun in this limited timeframe, so we're bound to see people taking off from taxiways and stealing a four engined heavy by coming in from dead six and getting their own engined damaged in the process, one that another player has been busy working on properly by making slashing high speed, high deflection attacks for an entire 5 minutes and yes, it happens even on objective driven, high difficulty servers as well.

The truth is that unless you have the time to fly coops or online wars with an organized group (not necessarily a virtual squad, but you do need a small group of people to regularly fly with) you will inevitably see such behavior and even long time and respected members of the community will do it from time to time, not out of spite but because they only have half an hour of flying time to squeeze between picking up the groceries, managing the house bills and putting the kids to bed. I don't condone it but i don't criticize it either as long as it's not a de facto modus operandi of the guy who does it. However, the bottom line is that despite his superior intellect in comparison to the AI, a human player that takes shortcuts to maximize his time spent in combat can be as disruptive to immersion as an AI aircraft that doesn't know how to fly scissors properly.

Long story short, if you want challenging fights at the expense of taking liberties with other factors (because if everyone does it, at some point i might do it as well to even the playing field) then multiplayer is just fine.
If you want to fly the proper mission profile at the expense of dummy opponents compared to real life ones, then it's single player.

In fact, a scripted single player campaign with carefully planned missions and custom briefings is much more immersive in regards to what surrounds the life of a combat pilot than a dynamic one or a multiplayer session. In multiplayer, the immersion is mostly found in the actual fight, the rest of the sortie however usually feels pretty bland with everyone doing more or less their own thing.

Limited available time also results in scaled down maps and ahistorical distances, which greatly upsets the historical flow of a mission. A 1/2 scale map means i can take half the fuel in exchange for a gain in climb rate, maneuverability or load out weight, or i can take full fuel and laugh at combat damage and fuel leaks because i'm always going to be within gliding distance of a friendly base.

I can fly a Pony with 25% fuel or a 190 with 50% fuel which makes me harder to catch, yet i have enough loiter time to cruise around the map a few times and still have enough left for a hasty retreat back to the safety of friendly flak at full throttle if things are going bad for me.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not dissing it. It's just fine and entertaining none the less, plus it's a necessary compromise due to real life constraints.

However, it is neither historical nor immersive when compared to flying a fully laden Pony 3 hours away from the nearest friendly base and knowing that the slightest damage could mean a not so glorious descent to a German farm due to fuel leaks or a long, arduous and vulnerable trip back home, or flying a 190 that needs external fuel tanks in order to use high throttle settings to get to the bomber's altitude as fast as possible during a ground controlled interception. However, this is something that you easily can experience in single player without even having to fly for hours on end, because you can timeskip to the relevant points of the mission. It's like placing yourself in the particular point of interest in the mission, but with the historical range, fuel and weight considerations plus the potential for trouble that your chosen mission profile implies.
Unless there's a way for all players to use time compression in multiplayer simultaneously, or for AI flights to be set up to depart on a schedule and then get taken over by the players at an appropriate waypoint, there's no way to experience this in multiplayer short of gathering a minority of people that feel fine flying 6 hours to and from Berlin in their Mustangs and B17s, while the other team sits twiddling their thumbs for the first 3 hours in their 190s until it's time to scramble.

The only case where everything works out is multiplayer with a special selection of like-minded individuals, but this also comes with its own drawback, the time required for the particular gameplay style.

I have flown online on and off but after some connectivity issues i haven't done so in a while. I did have fun and i learned a lot of things that i wouldn't pick up if i was fighting the AI (for example, just hanging back and following an experienced player through his maneuvers to cover his six improves your own handling of your aircraft tremendously). However, all three cases come with their own inherent set of drawbacks, to the point where i definitely can't crown one of them the king of gameplay. It's more like a question of what i'm in the mood for, not what is better or more "hardcore", because while superficially similar the small differences between gameplay modes have a big impact on the net result.

I really hope we'll get the rumored new multiplayer mode, with ongoing dynamic mini campaigns flown online with some sort of MDS support for AI units (possibly even being able to set up a flight as AI and spawn into it later, so you could fly bomber missions at the historical distances and conditions without having to take an entire day off work), because that would be a good enough mix of the above modes.

People who like fast thrills can just go on short range, cross channel free hunting and rhubarb missions in small groups, people who like fighting for an objective can do organized fighter sweeps, strikes and escort, bombers will be there as AI in proper formations and players will be able to join into the raid if they want, etc. It would all tie into a bigger picture with campaign objectives and stat tracking for the purpose of calculating available supplies, airframes, pilots and AI ground forces for each side, leaving the players to decide how to best achieve the campaign goals for their team, designing and flying their own ad hoc missions in a persistent online environment.

That way, one day i could be mixing it up in a 109 in a furball over the channel just 10 minutes after taking off, while the next day i could be flying a 2 hour round trip to occupied Europe in a mosquito, doing photo recon work for an upcoming raid by a dedicated virtual bomber squadron. The way it is today however, i can't seriously say that MP or SP is superior than the other. In fact, where each one is lacking the other one usually has its strongest points.

+ 1 to blackdog
in most posts you make very well thoughts and you always impress me, nice also to see someone from my same country.
what you say IMHO is absolutely right. Teh fact is to find teh best compromise and i think that is more plausible to have smaller maps on multiplayer, mayeb keep the 1:1 scale but in restricted area. I hardly see a multiplayer that goes through planning. Even squadrons some tiems plan on teh go but what they have is order. My best period online was flying with some of 4S, maybe some Veltro and a Freccia. I didnt have time for a squadroon but i could hardly get those 2 non stop hours of game as i had also school. Although i played very little, now im over 1 year offline as when i install il 1946 , it hapens that some .dll get lost....
I would think taht for best immersion in the scenario is the Solo, but both Solo and multi are achieving. I learn to fly very well online, and i sticked also for bombing quite often, especially on desert missions. Teh best was however flying that little time with 4s , i remember when we jjust flew on bf 109 s on 3 one close to another and when we spotted a poor La-7 we hit and zoom one by one( hit, take altitude turn around and let the 2nd attack and so on) or when chatting and calling for help they tried to to find and help you.
maybe il2 offered me the best multiplayer experience

in addition what i know find to be really helpful is that more paleyr can be in the same plane, and i see it as a great step forward learning, even mroe with that instructing plane.
i hope to get the collectors with teh map as now im doing well in geography and start seeing my skills for navigation

Back OT (although I agree with Blackdog and hope for bigger organised on-line scenarios) I won't bother with the £50 'collectors' edition. The extra £15 (43% !) isn't worth:

- A unique 50 *50 cm cloth pilot escape map showing The Battle of Britain strategic locations
- A exclusive official replica of the Pilot’s Notes on the Spitfire I Aeroplane, provided to RAF pilots during The Battle of Britain and reprinted from the RAF Museum original document
- An in-game 120-page ring binder pilot instructions

I can live without the escape map, I can get the pilots notes for six quid, I don't know what the pilot instructions contain that you won't get on soft copy with the game and I don't have shelf space anyway. But the package will probably be worth about.... errmmm.... £50 in genre auctions in 50 years time.

I am thinking the same thing myself.Get box,take DVD out of box and put in drive.Throw box on shelf never to be seen again! :)

+1 on that! As I got an original map from my dad which he picked up as a kid from a downed plane, and the spit manual I do not need as I do not fly that bird, never have in IL2 and don´t plan on changing that in CoD. Would have been a differant thing if they had brought out a German collectors box. But main thing is the game and not the gimics. Looking forward to good online flying.

Hmm, probably a matter of taste this one. I always liked how the older simulators like European Air War and Red Baron 2 had decent manuals in a hard copy format and a big box. Even so, i still want to have a physical disc and even today i have never bought a single game in digital download format, everything i own is in a physical format even if it's the usual nowadays slim DVD case.

I guess this is similar to music, some people buy music CDs and rip them to MP3 right away onto their iPods and such, others play the actual CD on their stereo set while flipping through the booklet, or even go for a vynil version. It's just a matter of taste and i'm in the "gimme shiny stuff to look at" camp :-P

The way i see it, it's not that the collector's edition is cheap. In fact, most collector's editions regardless of genre today contain stuff that was more or less standard back in the day (ironic how as our PCs and games get better the packaging and bonus materials get more slim).
What's making me lean towards the collector's edition is that the basic version is expensive enough that if i skimp on a mere 20 euros and miss the extra goodies i will probably regret it big time.

If it was a situation of 35-40 Euros versus 75-80 then yes, i'd probably get the regular one, but whatever listings i could find had the digital download version (aka the "no box at all, no packaging cost" version) priced at 50 Euros and the collector's at 70. Essentially, it's the high cost of the basic version that's pushing me to think "sod it, i'll pay a little more and actually get a display package worthy of the game's potential".

I think i'm going to go for it, just waiting to find out a few more things about it so i don't jump the gun :grin:

Only 15 quid extra for that sounds like good value to me - the Spit book retails for 9.99, and the 120 page manual is definitely something I want.

I'm with Blackdog on this one.

Found the collectors edition for 65€ on this Finnish site http://www.puolenkuunpelit.com/kaupp...ducts_id=49941
Also it says the release date is the 3/3!! That must be a typo or I'm a very lucky guy :grin:

Oh! Found another retailer that also states 3/3 as the release date! http://www.gamehouse.fi/index.php?la...ta=ALL&hae=Hae

March 3 is definitely a mistake.

Ok, too bad. Weird that two different retailers got the same wrong date though, don't retailers usually get their info from the publishers or something?