*cough*
(looking bewildered)

But IL2 is already a true sim!
What I believe is that Oleg created it,Oleg made the game 90%,TD will reach 102%

Avimimus, '110,

Dudes, with all-seeing AI? Fixing that and adding structural integrity brings our much beloved Sturmi much closer to a true sim, I'm sure we all agree. It's a pity that wind still requires mods, but maybe for future TD work.

Flying Nutcase

TD - 4.10 -money- to Sim or not to Sim
 

So 4.10 will move il21946/4.09 toward a true Sim, that's great ! I guess,
so what is IL2 1946/4.09M not if it is not a Sim? still half PC Game and half Flight Sim?


well what ever, so I'm taking it that we should all conclude from the latest threads that 4.10 is another month or two away from being released.

That's fine just wanted to know.

how many people are on the 4.10 patch team?

You can go through threads on this posting and count individual TD members, because at one time or another they have all posted in this thread.

The patch is very close to release.. in beta now.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=8815

Great.Thought they were still having trouble with the Re 2000 cockpit.

Not really trouble - its just late and not implemented yet. :)
But such additions as adding a cockpit is comparibly easy to do (with quite low chances for producing a bug), as soon as its ready modeling wise.

The cockpit model is shortly before completition, also by the community's help.

There are also other (positive I think) reasons for the delay and the missing updates... which I hope will soon be clearified by the responsible member amongst us. :rolleyes:

EDIT: without having counted them now, I guess, we are ~10 - 15 core members. Some of them do not post in forums or at least, not here. :)

WOW! Good news, maybe another flyable? :D

Two months for test gone! How long will we wait for yet?

Two months for test gone! How long will we wait for?

Aha
 

My wild guess is that the positive reasons for the delay have something to do with SOW.

Am I Wrong ?.

Regards

Hunger.

OMG! That's an exciting idea!

2 weeks. :grin:

.

I should have known, that such information would spread rumors.

No. You are all wrong. :-P

New plane?
New flyable?
New engine change?

Always first obediently wait. Then play;)

Oleg has learned.. Promise absolutely nothing or it will be used against you all over the forums.

Very true. And if you say nothing it will be used against you as well. :cool: Now, take a decision. We can never win. :!: :cool:

Anyway, there will be a development update tomorrow.

:mrgreen:

Say nothing, people here are the top of the cream of the elite of the best of the world champions of nitpicking and bad faith ... except me of course :D.

Insuber

take your time TD!

Alright then...

http://www.gregstevenson.com.au/gall...ing_time_2.jpg

:cool:

Update posted. Check first page.

Thanks for the update. Looking awesome

Looking good TD ~S~ and a very big thank you!!!

http://www.mission4today.com/images/smiles/10.gif

Wow!

Dunno why, but the music selection was <almost> perfect. Just needed a few more moonlight shots in the footage.

Thanks for keeping these little gems under wraps - I really dig getting surprised by the things you have been up to.

Such good news! Good you obtained this agreement :) This reflects the quality of your work. This, and real life, are good reasons for delays. Thanks for your work TD!

Great news DT!! Congratulations!!!!!!
You really deserve it.

PS: airborne radar??? :mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

Not in 4.10. It will be finished and released in a complex scenario which will make it more useful.

For a second there when looking at the change of gun sights on the I-15bis I thought TD were using 6DOF.. But looking at it again it seems looking at a certain angle it's possible to change between the three gun sights..right?
(I'll have to continue dreaming of official 6DOF capability in IL2 I guess *sigh*)

Those are just 3 different predefined camera positions for each gunsight. No 6DOF. I-15bis cockpit was modeled with this feature in mind, so it doesn't have holes and gaps, unlike virtually all pre-4.09 cockpits do. And that is the reason, why 6DOF haven't been yet implemented officially.

Thanks guys, great work!!!
Glad to see some facelift for the Bf110, hope more Bf110 will come.

We have been looking thoroughly into 6DoF capability, but given the current limitations, we will not introduce full 6DoF unless two conditions are met/solved:

1. Cockpit 3D modelling is repaired for those cockpits that are not 6DoF compatible (= huge rework)
2. The 6DoF is enabled for all players, even for those without TrackIR to keep fair situational awarness conditions for everyone.

At the moment 6DoF development is on hold. We may take a second look after 4.10.

Good news!!! This means that you will have more easily for future changes, right? There are many changes in mods encotramos that many of us would like to see in an official patch, 6DOF, new sounds, graphic effects, new texture maps...

+1

That's excellent news, would just like to thank you all and Oleg for making it all possible :D

Congratulations!!!!!! :)
thanks for the update!!! :)

I hope the menus of wide resolution will be fixed in some version ( in the video their arent fixed)

I think you're simply misunderstanding what was posted. Any Daidalos work is still subject to Oleg's aproval (which means no objects touched by the Grumman thingy, no Channel map etc) plus there are a few things which remain highly unlikely (sound - we won't use any of the "soundpacks" out there since we can never be sure there aren't copyright infringements in them, not to mention that we don't know if they 're really compatible with the Il-2 sound engine). And pls read what Martin wrote in regards to 6DOF - it's on hold, we may look into it again but there are two hurdles as high as the Himalaya (cockpit rework, similar system for non-users of TIR). Neither hurdle is easy to overcome so don't get your hopes up.

It seems like you still want to leave some room for the "others" on the basics...

Good!

Another one... could someone explain me why there are still some people thanking the 1C Company staff for the TD´s work?

Salutes.

First, I didn't mean as sounding negative with my comment. I am very very excited and happy for all the work TD is and have been putting out for IL2! :)

I very much understand point no 1. There are alot of glitches in the 3D models from a 6DOF point of view.. Just look back over the tail of a Ki-61 Hei with modded 6DOF.. there is none! ;)
I don't understand point no 2. You must mean ".. is available for all players"? It can't be that you won't release 6DOF capability until all and every one has head tracking as standard equipment.. ! If though that is the intention, then we are already off on the wrong foot; not all have head tracking gear, not all has HOTAS controls, not all has PC hardware to maintain a smooth game play at all levels and detail of grafix.. etc.. It's up to the "user" to make use of features IMO.

This update made my day. Congrats, TD!

Does it mean that you can rework (not repaint) the cockpits models of some early planes like Bf-109 and P-47 which have ugly interiors in the future?

No no... More like there needs to be a way to achieve 6DoF features with mouse for example. This shouldn't be the hard part IMHO.

@Lacrits: Hello, I didn't take it as negative comment, no worries. Just wanted to answer briefly.

Some graphical glitches are minor, some are more serious as you have pointed out. Some may not give you a visual advantage, some may.

As for the second point, in my opinion 6DoF view (in any sim not just IL-2) should be available to everyone through some alternative hardware control - either TrackIR, mouse, keyboard. It should not be only limited to TrackIR 6DoF device. In other words, in case someone doesn't have TIR, he should be able to make the same head movements (though not as easily and comfortably as with TIR) through another input device.

Martin

EDIT: Viikate was faster. :)

Seeing that you replaced the ETC50 rack on the Bf109 appropriately, what are the chances that you extend this effort to further racks, which are lacking in accuracy as well?

Additionally, will you consider adding a rack to the Fw190D series?

i personally would put the labour needed to implement 6DOF in this game in other things....................

+1

Great update DT! Thanks for your hard work.

let me guess, a flyable Bf110C is off limits for IL2 because of SoW , like Spit I, flyable Blenheim, "real" MTO maps, Channel map....................................
even as the Bf110 units, small in numbers, were so important 1941-42 in their groundattack role at the easternfront

Nice work guys, I can't wait.

DT,what exactly of Italy is going to be exclusive to SoW?
Maps,tanks,BR 20,ships?

Future patches could include a HARDCORE level that does not allow pilot adjust joy and had to fly with 100% joy sensitivity for each aircraft, suffering from its vices and advantages.

The problem with that has to do with the vast multitude of controllers out there, each with its own inherent sensitivity and stability.

For my Logetech attack 3 I use 1,4,9,16,25,36,49,64,81,100

For the Saitek AV8R I use the default, 10,20,30...100

The full 100 across the board is not realistic unless your stick is two feet long, bolted to the floor, and requires at least 40 lbs of force to move the handle. Using these inputs on an average flight stick turns your plane into an fly-by-wire F-16, which is far from "hardcore" in a WWII scenario.

A few months ago Oleg answered that some sort of DeviceLink functionality that works online is planned for SoW:BoB and that's very nice... I'll be content with that.

However, regarding the next patches, is anything planned in an official patch that would provide DeviceLink with online capabilities?

I think the Multiple controls and Navigation TD is implementing is a big step towards "simulation" and it will be very well received by the "full switch" members of the community. I was afraid next patches would be only more planes, more skins, more textures...

Congrats and thank you!

té mais
tityus

Now that sounds interesting, and I'm sure it will cause quite a bit of speculation!

So, if player sets 100 across the board, his plane will auto compensate the unwanted slip (plane will center the ball by itself), input will be limited and corrected according to current flight situation (no accelerated stalls, no wing snaps due to over G, no spins)? ;)

Yeah that's exactly what I mean smart-ass.

The insult of the CW-21
 

Including the "CW-21" in 4.10 seems like nothing but an intentional insult.

Less than 100 were ever made and it was barely even a trivial footnote in WW2. Yet there are so many important American built planes that are glaringly absent. Planes that were built by the 1000's and participated in the most notable battles in history.

If Daidalos Team were releasing no new planes at all I could understand. But for them to put energy into creating a CW-21 looks like just a way of saying "We want to prove that we refuse to include American built planes".

For simmers who enjoy the Allied side of the Japan/America conflict, Daidalos Team is clearly running a biased show.

CW-21 is American built plane :lol:

Oh the irony:lol:

Thanks for the update guys. The work you are doing is truely amazing.

And CW-21 was used by two AFs.NEI and China.
Wonder if someone can make a "what if" CW-21 USAAF skin.

The planes I guess Sprain mean might be the P-35 and P-43.

Have you bothered to find out why 'so many important American built planes .... are glaringly absent'? And why just American planes? WE all have our favourite planes we'd like to see added. The only thing that is clear here is your own obnoxious attitude. These guys are doing it for free remember.

Carry on TD. Even if you only release planes I've never heard of from now on, I'll still enjoy flying them.;)

Third party modelers get to do whatever they want to do... Daidalos is just doing us a favour by including some additional community work that is out there.

Enjoyed the video and the update. Thanks team! I love all of the little fixes and updates going into this as well. New bombrack for the 109 is one of those little things but it's really nice to see updated... tweaks to the 110 is great too... that plane sees heavy usage. Great :)

Congrats on the deal, and thanks for another tantalising vid. After a long absence, this sure is a great time to be getting back into Sturmi. :-)

Thanks for the update TD and WTG on the contract. Feels like its almost time to take the new throttle quadrant out of the box :grin:

It's worth noting that you didn't at all disagree with my principle claim. But you did bother to include a personal attack.

I'd say that "nothing but an intentional insult" looks like a personal attack on the TD team. Or have you got any evidence to back this up?

Yes, you claim that "important American built planes ... are glaringly absent", but you give no evidence that they were excluded because they were American. We know that there is a specific issue over Grumman aircraft, but that isn't TD's fault. Beyond this, which aircraft are you suggesting have been intentionally ignored?

In any case, TD are volunteers. They can model whatever they chose, within the limits imposed by the historical context and any contractual constraints they have with 1C:Maddox. It is open to anyone with the appropriate level of expertise to work with them, and I'm sure they will welcome new input.

The CW-21 stands for Curtis Wright US aircraft manufacturer.

There are so many aircraft now for IL2 I am amazed when people keep asking for more.

No one flys the odd-ball aircraft online, and I don't know of many that are interested to fly them in Offline in missions either. The IL2 is an air combat simulation genre, which means everything is about combat and mostly aircraft vs aircraft. In other words, if you fly all the weird stuff people are always asking for... you would be asking to just get shot down all the time.

If we could get an honest poll for online or offline aircraft; the same aircraft choices would probably prevail across the board for most everyone... especially if they want to survive in the missions.

I'd have to disagree, Nearmiss. A section of the online community is content endlessly reenacting the same dogfights, but other IL-2 gamers like to explore new aircraft, new maps, new weapon systems and the rest. All credit to TD for feeding our addictions...

Sprain

The CW-21 is not a Daidalos in-house development but was a 3rd Party Project that just missed the deadline for the Pacific Fighters release and then fell through the floor. DT simply picked up the pieces and finished it as we were given the model. Nothing sinister about that.

Since I don't fly coops I don't see much of that.

csThor, thanks for that - as good a response to Sprain's silliness as we could reasonably expect.

Nearmiss - I think the IL-2 online dogfight community probably underestimate how many people enjoy IL-2 in other ways. They tend to be the most vocal, and the most partisan, but they are very much a minority. The continuing sales of IL-2, and the interest of newcomers on the various forums, seem to indicate that there is still a broad base of interest, and relatively few of the noobs will ever fly online - it is actualy a rather hostile environment for the inexperienced.

As for not flying coops, why not? Even if you don't want to make a serious commitment, dropping in on the Ubizoo Saturday coop once or twice might broaden your horizons - we do this for fun, remember.:-D

Sprain,

Crawl back to your cave and stay there.

Personally I fly IL2 purely for the chance to fly Co-ops and I despair of the kiddies who get a kick out of fly-die-fly-die arenas. I would rather fly one 90 minute co-op and park up on the apron at the end alive than fly 9 ten minute deathmatch missions.

As for flying outmoded aircraft; I can see that trying to sink the Tirpitz with a Swordfish is suicidal in a dogfight server that has 10 FW190s hovering over it but when you are flying a Co-op re-enactment of the attack on Taranto then doing it in a low slow outdated biplane just adds to the experience.

As a way of illustration - there is a New Zealand squad that fly coops almost exclusively, in sorties lasting up to an hour* - and they don't even have a presence on Hyperlobby.

That's a way of enjoying the game that I think the 'online dogfighting community' probably never even knew existed.

*Imagine crashing on takeoff on that sortie.......

+1

I have to admit that I am pretty much done with flying on dogfight servers. This game has always been a simulation for me - so I like to simulate flying, and surviving, a sortie.

Think to those Swordfish pilots who attacked the Scharnhorst, Gneisenau and Prinz Eugen during the Channel Dash, all shot down by FW190s... the leading pilot got a Victoria Cross for the action (posthumous)

:)

it all depends on the missionbuilder, dogfight and coop, if such "crap" planes are usefull or not.

.. And some off us love to fly the cr@p plane (in formation and applying team work) against hot pants opponents like Spits, Mustangs, FW190's or 109's on dogfight servers.

+1
or without team ...
like a Hero :)

Exactly! In our squadron we mostly fly coops. Sometimes it's really cool to have "crap" planes in a Mission. When? An example:

3 players are forced to fly "crap" planes with bombs. Their goal is to bomb an enemy Airbase, which is defended by enemy planes (KI) and AAA. The bombers only have a chance to get to this base, if other players support them. So the missionbuilder builds other player-flights as well:

- 4 players with planes that carry rockets - goal is AAA
- 6 players with agile fighters - goal is clearence of airspace over enemy base

This way the groups have to play as a team (ok teamspeak is a must for this) to fullfill the main goal - destroy the enemy airbase.

Btw: We have many pilots, who WANT to fly the crap planes, because it's a special challenge to fullfill the goal with limited capabilities.

Yes... its all about a challenge! :D

With all IL2 has to offer, and with all the options of playability, it just goes to show that IL2 has something for everyone.

I love how when I have time I can fly a mission built by myself or someone else lasting an hour, or longer and when I feel like just a quick burst I can just set up a simple dogfight in QMB That would proberly only last 5-10 miniutes.

As for cr@p planes, I love 'em. Nothing better than having an all bi-plane dogfight, or a convoy/train busting mission in the Avia, I-153, or the I-16. Another fun one is Ki-27's V Fokker D.XXI ;)

Often it isn't just about winning, but rather losing in style.

Why not give yourself a glimpse of what it was like to go up against the best the Luftwaffe had, in outdated Soviet equipment? Or the hoplessness of a Japanese low level attack into the teeth of a US carrier fleet? There are plenty of other examples of this. It doesn't always have to be bleeding edge late-war types and arcade killing streaks.

Excelent news!
Your work is tremendous!

Keep up the great work.. just get it done!! ;)

I am looking forward to the integrated Zuti with triggers..

This is the only sim that I know of with great FMs, an incredible planeset spanning almost 3 decades.. and graphics that are just stellar.. even if they are getting long in the tooth... This sim is the standard by which all others will be measured for some time... and SoW will do the same.

There was a full real dogfight server that I used to be in almost every night a few years ago that had many differnt eastern front 1941 scenarios where if you flew the Russian side you were at a disadvantage. The best thing about the server was lots of ground targets and there used to be swarms of IL2's all in formation heading to the target and attacking it together, often resulting in being downed by flak, or shot down by fighters. It was great fun. I saved a few tracks but i'm not sure where they are now.

So why is TD working?
Really,I don´t give a sh... to the famous dogfights.FW-190 x P-51 in Normandy,P-47 x tanks in Bulge.
In the world of WWII games (all kinds) nobody want to explore Italy,France or Poland.All you see is Germany x US.It´s the Saving Private Ryan or Medal of Honor Allied Assault syndrome.
If you want to fly the most famous WWII planes,you can play any s#itty WWII sim,because surely you will find them there.Now if you want to fly those and the "other planes",IL2 is the best choice till now.
It´s like having a library.You don´t want just the books from the most notorious authors.You want to fill the library so it can be the most complete of the world.

About the cr@p planes.War doen´t mean hi-tech everytime and in both times.
Even USAAF was considered outdated when the war broke.

The CW21 looks like a very competitive plane, with superb climb, good speed and maneuverability and not to forget the machine guns concentrated in the nose.
It will be a online killing machine if you ask me;)

Thanks TD for adding it!

(oh and a ki44 would be nice too =P)

Mind you the CW-21's climb rate is generally considered to have been doctored (the only sources come from public marketing campaigns for the aircraft). It was still probably a very could climber though.

The bomb jettison is a neat idea - although shouldn't the bombs have a probability of skipping? Right now bombs can skip off runways (or even roads if they land tail first). These are bombs without time delays btw.

A tiny cloud of impact dust might cover up the fact that they vanish on impact.

Its indeed somewhat dangerous for Zero's. Nimble and fast, compared to it.
You can really close-fight it - different than P-40s. Its a fun to fly.
But you better do not get hit.

It is an interesting plane no doubt and I've been looking forward to it since Gibbage first posted on the project. I found that my main problem with the Avia was the low speed and very vulnerable engine (making attacks on bombers incredibly difficult). I assume the situation will be similar?

Just to throw my hat in the ring...

I LOVE the obscure aircraft and I love spending some time flying the stuff that other people have disregarded. For a while a lot of dogfight servers made available the Ki-100 or the Ki-61 and I loved flying the Ki-100 especially against planes like the Spitfire IX +25lb and the La-7 and the Ki-84s that tended to dominate those types of servers. I was often shot down but I had a ton of fun because when I did shoot them down it was in a plane with much more limited performance AND in some rare cases I was able to do things they didn't know I could do or not because in some instances they had never even SEEN a Ki-100 before.

That's just an example. I've flown just about everything the game has to offer and even the obscure types can be a ton of fun in the right instances.

The Fokker D.XXI and the SM.79 are probably some of the most obscure, yet most fun to fly in the Il-2 collection. Spits are boooooring :grin:

Good grief mate, be careful of speaking such blasphemy in public. That kind of talk could get you burned at the stake. ;)

I have always been a proponent of the more obscure aircraft.

Always will be.

That said, one real thing the sim needs for us onliners that fly long missions is a fix for the "Transferring Mission Bug".

It's maddening. Fly for half an hour or 45 minutes on the way to a distant target. Have the bay doors open and skimming the water for a skip bombing run. The flak from the escorting destroyer is bursting around you as you press on. Your finger moves to the bomb release, and...

BOINK!

Dropped to the "Transferring Mission" screen.

Please, can this be fixed?

First step to fixing it is identifying what's causing it - and up to this point any ideas the coders had turned out to be a dead end. You know the saying: "Bad weeds grow tall." :roll:

Which doesn't mean, we give up. ;-)

Thanks for the quick reply Gentlemen.

I know it is a difficult problem. I can't even imagine going through all those lines of code to find the thing that is causing this.

I know that more than a few talented folks in the mod side have beat their heads against the stone wall trying to fix this as well.

All the best to you on all your efforts, from myself, and all the BlitzPigs.

;)