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-   IL-2 Sturmovik (http://forum.fulqrumpublishing.com/forumdisplay.php?f=98)
-   -   Been a while.... (http://forum.fulqrumpublishing.com/showthread.php?t=5793)

SaQSoN 01-01-2009 10:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEXX (Post 63912)
so hold back the gamer insults and share your knowledge.
I do not insult gamers, unless, or more, then they try to insult me. If you think otherwise, point me where I did it, please.

As for sharing my knowledge about the game mechanics and such - I am not able to do so for an obvious reason.

And regarding the official mods support. Though, it was said many times before, I'll repeat it once again:

It is NOT possible to make IL-2 modding open, while preserving online game integrity and avoiding Oleg's intellectual property violation by mods distribution, without seriously rebuilding the game engine structure.
The later IS possible, but costs labor. Labor costs money. In the case of IL-2, it would pure waste of them in a business (or any other, including common) sense.

So, why some of you still think, Oleg should do this?

LEXX 01-01-2009 10:47 PM
That makes good sense Saqs. Too late now to open the sim. I'd rather see Oleg open the sim years ago instead of the hack.

Quote:
As for sharing my knowledge about the game mechanics and such - I am not able to do so for an obvious reason.
Understood. Then the modders can only do the best they can without official help.

SaQSoN 01-02-2009 05:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEXX (Post 63918)
I'd rather see Oleg open the sim years ago instead of the hack.
The task of rebuilding the game engine in the way, I described above, is virtually equal to creating a new game engine from scratch.
Looking at things realistically, doing this was not an option for Oleg's team from the very beginning (original IL-2 release).

They did their best to support user's creativity by adding 3rd party models into the game for free themselves. But now, it's over, as every thing in this world ends, sooner, or later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LEXX (Post 63918)
Understood. Then the modders can only do the best they can without official help.
While doing so, they should understand and remember, that when distributing their "mods", they, in the most cases, redistribute a part of original game without permission of it's original author. Which, by all international and most national laws is a violation of Oleg's intellectual property, no matter what the modders may think, or say about it.

Obviously, it is doubtful, that anyone would be prosecuted for this, but in my opinion, distribution of mods (in the said above regard) means showing disrespect to Oleg, his team and their work. So, I don't see any reason, why Oleg, or anyone from his team should show respect to the modders. Particularly, when their work is way far from quality standards, we choose for ourselves. ;)

SlipBall 01-02-2009 08:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaQSoN (Post 63939)
The task of rebuilding the game engine in the way, I described above, is virtually equal to creating a new game engine from scratch.
Looking at things realistically, doing this was not an option for Oleg's team from the very beginning (original IL-2 release).

They did their best to support user's creativity by adding 3rd party models into the game for free themselves. But now, it's over, as every thing in this world ends, sooner, or later.



While doing so, they should understand and remember, that when distributing their "mods", they, in the most cases, redistribute a part of original game without permission of it's original author. Which, by all international and most national laws is a violation of Oleg's intellectual property, no matter what the modders may think, or say about it.

Obviously, it is doubtful, that anyone would be prosecuted for this, but in my opinion, distribution of mods (in the said above regard) means showing disrespect to Oleg, his team and their work. So, I don't see any reason, why Oleg, or anyone from his team should show respect to the modders. Particularly, when their work is way far from quality standards, we choose for ourselves. ;)



This for me is the biggest reason why I dislike the whole mod issue. It is stealing, and is a show of total disrespect for Oleg and his crew. It's like he has to watch people with dull scalpel's, doing surgery on his child

311thCopperhead 01-02-2009 08:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEXX (Post 63912)
I use some Frankenplane methods in StrikeFighters, but generally for myself only. SF and FB/PF are *very* lite sims in air warfare simulation, so I'm not worried about techie 3D model details that these games' air warfare programming and features fail to match.


SaQSoN::
That's the idea, and how it works on the street. They don't have official support, so hold back the gamer insults and share your knowledge. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d1...eys/thumbs.gif


lol yeah. on the street. on the street you can aslo buy crack cocaine..but hey...to each there own.

not for me thanks.

Wolf_Rider 01-02-2009 01:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearcat (Post 63860)
Man.... hush up... You don't know what you are talking about.

What makes you think that because I use mods I have pushed the developer aside? I bought several copies of 46 in 2008 alone... How many did you buy? Developer support is more than just lip service. If you have given more than that then good on you, but you are in absolutely no position whatsoever to pass judgment on anything I have done in this sim as far as supporting 1C.

You don't know what you are talking about.

I have supported this sim and it's development team from day one and will continue to do so as long as they are putting out products of this quality.


Well I guess that says it all... except justification of pushing the developer to one side...

"I bought many copies", so does that mean you now own the rights to il2?

Sorry bud but when the come back is "Hush, man" and "you don't know what you are talking about", it only indicates you know you are wrong in your stance.

:-?

robtek 01-02-2009 03:14 PM
I also fear for this community to become divided, not only "vanilla" vs "Mods/hACKs"
but als Macks vs different Macks.
But what i also wanted to say is: The reason for all this is that the developer doesn´t develop anymore for IL2.
If there would have been still support to remove the kinks and add missing planes by OM or someone named by him, i mean offically, as a pay-add-on so the workers could be paid, we wouldn´t be in the situation we are right now.
Maybe someone, who has OM´s ear, could indicate to him to Quality-control the Macks and sell the packet, if the Builders at i.e. AAA agree, as a pay-add-on where the price shoul be affordable as only the QC must be paid for.
That would be good for the community and good PR for OM and his future projects (that we buy anyway)
My 2 cents

carguy_ 01-02-2009 03:21 PM
Thanks for your input, SaQSoN.

SaQSoN 01-02-2009 06:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtek (Post 63977)
But what i also wanted to say is: The reason for all this is that the developer doesn´t develop anymore for IL2.
Do you think, the developers had no serious reason for dropping IL-2 support?

Quote:
Originally Posted by robtek (Post 63977)
If there would have been still support to remove the kinks and add missing planes by OM or someone named by him, i mean offically, as a pay-add-on so the workers could be paid, we wouldn´t be in the situation we are right now.
You'd be surprised, how few people would actually buy such addon and how expensive it would be in development. Sorry, but that not going to work. No add-on for IL-2 (except for some mission/campaign packs, may be) can be profitable at the moment.

IL-2 is dead as a commercial enterprise. Get on with that. :(

Bandit Bill 01-02-2009 06:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaQSoN (Post 63986)
Do you think, the developers had no serious reason for dropping IL-2 support?
Yeah, something about a vague BOB vaporware supposedly coming out at about the same time as Duke Nukem Forever.. :rolleyes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaQSoN (Post 63986)
IL-2 is dead as a commercial enterprise. Get on with that. :(
Which is why the modders took over, where Oleg et al had left off, with massive holes in the IL2 content.. Get over that.


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