Unofficial plane list.

[David603]

Okay, I was a bit bored, so I made a list of all the planes in the trailers, screenshots and any other available sources.

Here it is,

Allied Fighters,
Hurricane II
I-16
LA-5FN
LA-7
P47D*
P51A
P51D
Spitfire II
Spitfire IX
Spitfire XVI
Yak 1
Yak 3

Axis Fighters,
Bf109E3
Bf109F4
Bf109G2
Bf109G10
Bf109K4
Bf110C
Fw190D9
Fw190A5
He162
MC.202
Me163
Me262
Ta152H*

Allied Bombers/Ground Attack,
A20G
B17G
Blenhiem IV
Il2
Il4
Il10
U2VS

Axis Bombers/Ground Attack,
He111H6
Ju87B2
AR234

*DLC only

As you can see, that is only 35 planes when Anton has promised over 40, and that includes two planes we know are DLC only, so this isn't a complete list and there must be some aircraft that haven't come up in the screenshots or trailers. Hopefully there will be some more German bombers and ground attack planes because a total of three doesn't leave much choice, even if the Fw190A can double as a very effective strike plane. I would like to see a late model Ju87, and the Ju88 is conspicuous by its absence. Other points are the P51B is listed on the website but the plane shown is the older Allison engined P51A, so the P51B may be in the game and they have just mixed up the screenshots or it may have been a typo. More Italian aircraft would be nice, and I'm still holding out hope for a Spitfire XIV.

[manintrees]

Are you saying that you can visually ID those planes with enough confidence to post a list without fear of being corrected?
If so, I am in awe of your knowledge.

[irrelevant]

I thought the P-51B was in the game, not the P-51A. Nice list and thank you very much for posting! :cool:

[manintrees]

I thought the P-51B was in the game, not the P-51A. Nice list and thank you very much for posting! :cool:

What model of the P-51 is is your sig pic?

[irrelevant]

what model of the p-51 is is your sig pic?

p-51d ;)

[Danny M NL]

that's a P51D if I am correct...

edit: dang, too slow...

[SleepTrgt]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3SpB16qnK4

Wich plane is that on 1 min 6 after the AR234?

[David603]

Are you saying that you can visually ID those planes with enough confidence to post a list without fear of being corrected?
If so, I am in awe of your knowledge.
Years of playing Il2 on the PC :)

The only plane I couldn't identify off the top of my head was the U2VS recon biplane, but as far as I know the list is accurate if not entirely complete. If anyone can add to it or make corrections feel free (I'm looking at you, Anton:)).

[Danny M NL]

Wich plane is that on 1 min 6 after the AR234?Me163...

It could be possible that instead of the P51A they included the P51B, since to my knowledge the only difference were the engine and different bomb racks...

[David603]

Wich plane is that on 1 min 6 after the AR234?
Me 163. Its a rocket powered interceptor armed with a pair of 30mm cannon and an absolutely unmatchable climb rate.

EDIT: I was too slow ^

[manintrees]

p-51d ;) What is the scoop under the fuselage for? is it part if the cooling system?

[SleepTrgt]

Yea found out myself aswell, looked alot less fat in the video and i saw a prop on it, wich made me think it wassent a Jet.

[David603]

Me163...

It could be possible that instead of the P51A they included the P51B, since to my knowledge the only difference were the engine and different bomb racks...
The P51B had a rebuild radiator and a completely different gun armament as well as the new engine compared to the older P51A, but it would be pretty easy to combine elements of the P51A and P51D models to make a B or C model. However the plane shown on the website is clearly the Allison engined A, so its probably just a typo and the person putting it up meant to write P51A instead of P51B.

[irrelevant]

The P51B had a rebuild radiator and a completely different gun armament as well as the new engine compared to the older P51A, but it would be pretty easy to combine elements of the P51A and P51D models to make a B or C model. However the plane shown on the website is clearly the Allison engined A, so its probably just a typo and the person putting it up meant to write P51A instead of P51B.

David, I think you need to offer classroom lecture via the forums. LOL. ;)

[David603]

David, I think you need to offer classroom lecture via the forums. LOL. ;)
I'll bear that in mind if anyone starts offering degree courses in WWII aviation. :)

[The Doctor B]

I wish they would!

[Soviet Ace]

Nice list, David. I agree we need some more Italian planes :D and maybe add a LaGG-3 for kicks??

[David603]

Nice list, David. I agree we need some more Italian planes :D and maybe add a LaGG-3 for kicks??
I would like to see more Italian planes, there are some very interesting aircraft such as the SM.79 bomber and the Fiat Cr.42 biplane, but I think the Yak 1 and I-16 have the early war Russian fighter angle covered, and there isn't really any reason to pick a LaGG-3 over a Yak 1.

[Soviet Ace]

True, but I've always wanted to fly in a "Laminated Coffin" LOL Maybe they could get a Fiat Br.20. That was a cool looking Italian bomber? The SM.79 is cool too, but was mostly converted to be a torpedo bomber. Still cool though :D

[xNikex]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3SpB16qnK4

Wich plane is that on 1 min 6 after the AR234?

It is the jet right before 1:06.

The Me-163 Komet was pretty much rocket propelled and had a tiny prop on the front to keep it stable. Also, it only has like 7-8 minutes of fuel, so watch your gauges.

BTW, does anyone know if jet engines can also explode in BoP if we throttle up too fast like in IL2?

[butterfield]

It is the jet right before 1:06.

The Me-163 Komet was pretty much rocket propelled and had a tiny prop on the front to keep it stable. Also, it only has like 7-8 minutes of fuel, so watch your gauges.


BTW, does anyone know if jet engines can also explode in BoP if we throttle up too fast like in IL2?

That would be a big negative. If the testers thought blackouts and redouts were glitches....imagine the look on their faces when they exploded for no apparent reason haha!

[xNikex]

That would be a big negative. If the testers thought blackouts and redouts were glitches....imagine the look on their faces when they exploded for no apparent reason haha!

Haha lol. I guess that goes in the list of Simulation DLC ideas.:-P

[Soviet Ace]

I wonder how the Komet will handle on Sim? Wonder if there will be ALOT of vibration in the controls when you got to shoot off the ground?

[David603]

I hope the fuel for them is limited, even when the setting on the server is for unlimited fuel and ammunition. At the very least they should have something where you can't run the engine for too long or it will overheat.

[BadByte]

As you can see, that is only 35 planes when Anton has promised over 40

If the pc game is an indication then I would put money on that theres more bf109 models, as a mate jokingly said, IL2 Sturmovik: 1946 should be called Messersmith 109: 1946.

[Soviet Ace]

They should add a Rumanian I.A.R. 80 (Like in my sig). That would be AWESOME!!! Then I could reenact my sig :cool:

[David603]

If the pc game is an indication then I would put money on that theres more bf109 models, as a mate jokingly said, IL2 Sturmovik: 1946 should be called Messersmith 109: 1946.
As a dedicated 109 pilot I'm not complaining.
They should add a Rumanian I.A.R. 80 (Like in my sig). That would be AWESOME!!! Then I could reenact my sig :cool:
You want a plane to be put in the game just so you can shoot it down? Okay, in that case I want the B24, B25, B26, Lancaster, Mosquito, more versions of the P51 and P47..........:)

[Soviet Ace]

Well don't we all want a plane to be put in just so we can shoot it down? I mean it would be fun to fly also, but I'm not a big Rumanian WW2 fighter buff like I am with others. And I totally agree that a Lancaster, and Mosquito should be put in BoP. :d

[David603]

True, just because I've never seriously flown at least half the planes in Il2 1946 doesn't mean I don't appreciate their availability as targets.

[Soviet Ace]

I just think that it would be interesting to have more diverse planes of nations. I know you need the classics, but maybe some unknown or not very well known planes would be interesting to fly. But I know what your saying. :D

[The_Goalie_94]

I only need a LANCASTER...then i will buy this game FOR SURE!!!!

[Swagger7]

Isn't it possible that both the P51A and the P51D are in the game? Perhaps they needed both of them for the campaign modes? Also, I'm missing the P-38 & P-40 :( Didn't Anton specifically say that the P-38 wasn't in the game? A Hawker Tempest would be neat as well. OH well, hopefully there will be a bunch of DLC planes!

[Buggins]

It is the jet right before 1:06.

The Me-163 Komet was pretty much rocket propelled and had a tiny prop on the front to keep it stable. Also, it only has like 7-8 minutes of fuel, so watch your gauges.

BTW, does anyone know if jet engines can also explode in BoP if we throttle up too fast like in IL2?

The 'tiny prop' was not to keep it stable. It was to power the onboard generator.

[Swagger7]

The A-26 also should be in the game, in order to balance out the Axis' AR234!

[Soviet Ace]

I think they need a FW 200 Condor!!!

[David603]

Isn't it possible that both the P51A and the P51D are in the game? Perhaps they needed both of them for the campaign modes? Also, I'm missing the P-38 & P-40 :( Didn't Anton specifically say that the P-38 wasn't in the game? A Hawker Tempest would be neat as well. OH well, hopefully there will be a bunch of DLC planes!
Both the P51A and P51D are ingame, but you are right in that the P38 has been confirmed absent, and I haven't seen a P40 or Tempest either.

[haitch40]

tempest was nice but id like a spit mkV my favourite spitfire

[Tally-Ho]

I would pay for DLC if it included the Mosquito and Stringbag.

[cydno]

tempest was nice but id like a spit mkV my favourite spitfire

I think I saw one in a trailer (the one with shorter wings)... This version of the spitfire was called by some of the RAF pilots as "clipped", "clapped" and "cropped" and was definitively not the pilot's choice.

[haitch40]

I think I saw one in a trailer (the one with shorter wings)... This version of the spitfire was called by some of the RAF pilots as "clipped", "clapped" and "cropped" and was definitively not the pilot's choice.

r u talking bout the spitfire with flat wing tips? thats a spitfire IX

[Graham85]

I only need a LANCASTER...then i will buy this game FOR SURE!!!!

That would be nice:grin:

[David603]

I think I saw one in a trailer (the one with shorter wings)... This version of the spitfire was called by some of the RAF pilots as "clipped", "clapped" and "cropped" and was definitively not the pilot's choice.
The only Spitfires we know about in game are the IIb, the IXc and the XVIe. The IIb is the one in the demo, the IXc is the version with a pointed tail and the XVIe has the bubble canopy. I think the IX and XVI have an option for the wing type because I have see the IX with and without clipped tips.

[xNikex]

The 'tiny prop' was not to keep it stable. It was to power the onboard generator.

You are right. I totally confused it with something else.

[mondo]

I think I saw one in a trailer (the one with shorter wings)... This version of the spitfire was called by some of the RAF pilots as "clipped", "clapped" and "cropped" and was definitively not the pilot's choice.

That refers to the MkVB when they were still in service in 1944 and were all approaching the end of both the airframe lives and engine lives i.e. clapped.

They had Merlin 45M with a cropped (the cropped bit )supercharger and a higher boost/octane fuel an to give them more power at lower altitudes so they could be used in the 2nd TAF. The lack of wing tips was to give a better roll rate at lower altitudes (clipped).

It was very much the pilots choice in 1941 but by 1944 it was scraping the barrel. Although they were just as good performers as the Spit IX at very low altitude where the 2nd TAF operated most of its aircraft. They only had 60 round drums for the Hispano MkII though.

[cydno]

That refers to the MkVB when they were still in service in 1944 and were all approaching the end of both the airframe lives and engine lives i.e. clapped.

They had Merlin 45M with a cropped (the cropped bit )supercharger and a higher boost/octane fuel an to give them more power at lower altitudes so they could be used in the 2nd TAF. The lack of wing tips was to give a better roll rate at lower altitudes (clipped).

It was very much the pilots choice in 1941 but by 1944 it was scraping the barrel. Although they were just as good performers as the Spit IX at very low altitude where the 2nd TAF operated most of its aircraft. They only had 60 round drums for the Hispano MkII though.

Good and interesting speech mondo...;-)
You are of course right in all this and I said this was not the pilots choice because of differents sets of RAF pilots memories from 1943 to 1945 that I have read.

[Almighty Blighty]

As a dedicated 109 pilot I'm not complaining.

You want a plane to be put in the game just so you can shoot it down? Okay, in that case I want the B24, B25, B26, Lancaster, Mosquito, more versions of the P51 and P47..........:)

You think that the mossie was easy to shoot down?

The germans were so annoyed by it they started to design a plane to specifically catch the mossie because no other planes could - the Heinkel HE 219.

Mossie=best plane of WW2 becasue of its speed and versitility

[David603]

You think that the mossie was easy to shoot down?

The germans were so annoyed by it they started to design a plane to specifically catch the mossie because no other planes could - the Heinkel HE 219.

Mossie=best plane of WW2 becasue of its speed and versitility
Its good, and it will give most mid and even some late war fighters a challenge just catching it, but when you can have a Bf109 with 50mph more top speed than a Mosquito the catching bit is considerably less of a problem.

Not that I want to detract from its WWII record, and its huge versatility and success in the fighter-bomber, bomber, night fighter and shipping strike roles, but against a faster single engined fighter the Mosquito just can't cut it.

[Soviet Ace]

That's why you need a Yak-3! :D Maybe a Yak-9 to deal with the higher altitude fighters (Me-109s).

[David603]

Better, but still 35mph slower and about 1000ft per min worse off in climb rate than a 109K.

[Soviet Ace]

Better, but still 35mph slower and about 1000ft per min worse off in climb rate than a 109K.

Your just to biased against small nimble planes :P Always needing to get cheap shots at your opponent, rather than turn and burn with him LOL

[Almighty Blighty]

Not that I want to detract from its WWII record, and its huge versatility and success in the fighter-bomber, bomber, night fighter and shipping strike roles, but against a faster single engined fighter the Mosquito just can't cut it.

...and pathfinder, strike, target tug, recon, bomber recon, fighter (mainly the de-hav hornet,) mine laying, ground attack and inteceptor... all in all over 50 variants. Don't forget this little two man wooden plane could carry 2/3rds the bomb load of the b-17 heavy bomber (4000lbs) And in the fighter variant it is surprisingly manouverable because of its light weight plus it has 4X20mm cannon, so even your little FW 190 has a thing or two to answer for when it comes up agains the 400mph fighter variants. (The hornet could do 407mph)

[mondo]

(The hornet could do 407mph) The Hornet had much more pokey engines (and handed so no torque)and much less weight but it could exceed 480mph. It didn't see service though.

[mondo]

Better, but still 35mph slower and about 1000ft per min worse off in climb rate than a 109K.

And will break apart in a 500mph dive!

[David603]

The Fw190A8 has 4 20mm cannon and a pair of 13mm MGs, which equates very well with a fighter Mosquito armed with 4 20mm and 4 .303 MGs, and is about 10mph faster and climbs better. It also rolls much better and its instantaneous turn is better, although sustained turn rate is about equal. The older A5 which is in Birds of Prey is more nimble than the A8, just as fast, climbs better, and still has a reasonable armament of 2 20mm cannon (2 more optional) and 2 7.9mm MGs. Therefore I wouldn't call the Mosquito a serious rival to a Fw190 as a fighter, but the ability to double as a reasonable fighter is impressive in a strike plane.

[David603]

Your just to biased against small nimble planes :P Always needing to get cheap shots at your opponent, rather than turn and burn with him LOL
Now thats a cheap shot;)

I like flying the Bf109, but I know better than to turn and burn with a Yak-3 flying that. Still, if you want, I will take you on 1v1 with a Bf109K4 or G10 vs a Yak-3 or La7, and I'll show you how an energy fighter can win even a prolonged fight against an angles fighter :mrgreen:

[Soviet Ace]

Now thats a cheap shot;)

I like flying the Bf109, but I know better than to turn and burn with a Yak-3 flying that. Still, if you want, I will take you on 1v1 with a Bf109K4 or G10 vs a Yak-3 or La7, and I'll show you how an energy fighter can win even a prolonged fight against an angles fighter :mrgreen:

That's why we need a YAK-9!!!! So then I could battle you up higher. Though I could just drag you down to my high??? *Soviet Ace Ponders this*:-P

[David603]

That's why we need a YAK-9!!!! So then I could battle you up higher. Though I could just drag you down to my high??? *Soviet Ace Ponders this*:-P
*sceptical noise*. You can't drag an energy fighter down to your level unless the pilot starts trying to turn with you, unless you mean just trying to mess up my shots and gradually working the fight downwards. That is if I'm not driving you down myself. Even so, with a K4 or G10 if I don't like the way the fight is going I can just break out, get some separation and climb back above you to start over.

[Soviet Ace]

We'll just have to wait and see, David :cool:

[David603]

Roll on September :)

BTW, whereabouts are you (concerning release date)?

[juz1]

Not that I want to detract from its WWII record, and its huge versatility and success in the fighter-bomber, bomber, night fighter and shipping strike roles, but against a faster single engined fighter the Mosquito just can't cut it.


Big Generalisation...4 hispanos and 4 brownings makes for quite a big bounce..

as for the luftwaffe

"Special Luftwaffe units (Jagdgeschwader 25 and Jagdgeschwader 50) were formed to combat the Mosquito attacks, though they were rather unsuccessful." .....

just saying...:grin:
________
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[mondo]

Therefore I wouldn't call the Mosquito a serious rival to a Fw190 as a fighter, but the ability to double as a reasonable fighter is impressive in a strike plane.

I agree and I think we need to remember the context that the Mossie was used in.

As a bomber either high or low level it was extremely fast, its cruise was faster than most other twins were capable of at combat power.

Once spotted information had to be relayed back to a fighter station, the fighter had to get of the ground and be vectored to the target. With most bombers flying at 180-200mph that was easy, with a Mosquito cruising at 320mph it could be 50 miles away from the point it was spotted and therefor getting a fighter to that plane was very hard. Especially since they would change course often to avoid being vectored into.

Even for a 190A4/A5/6 which were the fastest common Luftwaffe fighters the Mosquito would face it (by the time of the A8 it was religated to defence of the reich from high level bombers) would be extremely hard for them to make up that 50 mile gap as well as find those planes, especially of they are below or avoiding radar (the British knew of the locations of the German radar stations in Europe).

It wasn't perfect though and they did get shot down. Although there safety record is one of the best of the war.

[David603]

Big Generalisation...4 hispanos and 4 brownings makes for quite a big bounce..

as for the luftwaffe

"Special Luftwaffe units (Jagdgeschwader 25 and Jagdgeschwader 50) were formed to combat the Mosquito attacks, though they were rather unsuccessful." .....

just saying...:grin:
Just saying, I wouldn't pick this for a dogfighter. 4 Hispanos are indeed a lot of firepower though, so if you were flying a strike mission and saw a fighter that hadn't seen you.........

I read about those two units, weren't they formed on Gorings direct orders after Mosquitos bombed a parade he was addressing? And then disbanded after not scoring a single kill against Mosquitos.

Still, I'm thinking in context of the game when it comes to intercepting Mosquitos, because there is a lot less choice of routes and usually only a couple of targets, which makes the intercepting fighters role much easier. Still, if aircraft choice can be locked to a particular timeframe on any one map they might be rather good for playing Strike on a mid war map.

[juz1]

granted in a game environment 1v1 if a 109 or 190 gets into position on a mozzie it wouldn't be pretty...in fact it would probably be quite clinical..:(
________
F800S (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/BMW_F800S)

[Almighty Blighty]

Number one: It was the quickest craft to ever fly until 1943, so stuff that up your pipe and smoke it with your single seat fighters and inteceptors. ;)
German plane designers must have been fuming, having their purpose built interceptors being beaten by a wooden plane built in a shed.

Number two: It was originally designed as a bomber, so to be able to double up as the complete opposite is a massively handy thing- as i don't think that the FW190 could carry a 4000lb bomb load while it's sister mark carrys 4 20mm cannon and 4 303 rifle calliber guns. EDIT: And another sister mark carrying a 57mm cannon blowing ships out of the sea.

Number three: It was designed so it could be built by people with lincences to build chairs... so the military factories could carry on with making the spit and the lanc..etc.

Number four: How many other planes, especially WWII planes, could do 50 different tasks with only minor changes done to the aircraft?

[Soviet Ace]

That's why you need to just stick with the good ol' Yak-3. Fast, reliable, nimble, and all around just a good looking plane.

EDIT: Plus the Yak-3 was made out of wood and tubes.

[Almighty Blighty]

could it do more than just 1 job... preferably 50?

[Soviet Ace]

It could do three: Dogfight, Tank destroyer (Later models), and bomber. The mosquito is a nice plane and all, but really I think it's to overrated, and a hassle. Really a plane should only have 2-3 jobs that it can preform.

[The Doctor B]

But the Mossie is absolutely gorgeous!

If you have ever seen one in real life you will never forget it. Fast, agile, purposeful and my god does it sound good!!;)

[Almighty Blighty]

It could do three: Dogfight, Tank destroyer (Later models), and bomber. The mosquito is a nice plane and all, but really I think it's to overrated, and a hassle. Really a plane should only have 2-3 jobs that it can preform.

So you would rather spend one hell of alot of money designing many new planes, then buying them- instead of just develpoing existing ones for alot cheaper and just as effactive. then when it is designed you can convery existing planes instead of having to waste money on buildin new ones

[Almighty Blighty]

But the Mossie is absolutely gorgeous!

If you have ever seen one in real life you will never forget it. Fast, agile, purposeful and my god does it sound good!!;)

Agreed, people believe that the merlin is one of/ if not THE best sounding engine ever...but two... mmmmmmmmmmm

[The Doctor B]

For sure. the greatest sound on the planet is a merlin powered aircraft performing a half cuban!:cool:

[bird of bait]

The mustang has the best sound accompanied with the dark sound of the c-47

[juz1]

Agreed, people believe that the merlin is one of/ if not THE best sounding engine ever...but two... mmmmmmmmmmm


doesn't sound so nice in a centurion tank:(
________
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[Danny M NL]

pfff, you guys obviously never heard a Messerschmitt before....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dO9mEv5Ve54&feature=related

;)


edit: for you merlin lovers out there, some nice footage, I blieve near dover:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2nlGN6aS8g

[Soviet Ace]

So you would rather spend one hell of alot of money designing many new planes, then buying them- instead of just develpoing existing ones for alot cheaper and just as effactive. then when it is designed you can convery existing planes instead of having to waste money on buildin new ones

Seems to work fine for every major nation that does it: US, Britain, France etc. They all seem to have several planes rather than just one.

But just because the Mosquito could do all these wonderful things, doesn't mean that it was good at all of them. That's why planes should only have 2-3 jobs. That's why I like the Yak-3, is because it could do 2-3 things, but it was only really good at the most important thing: Dogfighting.

[P-51]

doesn't sound so nice in a centurion tank:(

That my friend is the Meteor not the Merlin xD

[juz1]

That my friend is the Meteor not the Merlin xD

now tell our fine readers from which engine was the meteor developed...?:| mmmmmmmmm?

(ie almost entirely the same just with heavier/scrap Merlin(hint) bits stuck on and the supercharger removed)
________
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[mondo]

Yeah, a Meteor is a Merlin derivative, its still the same basic 26ltr V12 but has no supercharger or reduction gear and runs on a different fuel type.

[David603]

Seems to work fine for every major nation that does it: US, Britain, France etc. They all seem to have several planes rather than just one.
The US wanted the Mosquito, but by the time they got round to putting it into production the war was over.
But just because the Mosquito could do all these wonderful things, doesn't mean that it was good at all of them. That's why planes should only have 2-3 jobs. That's why I like the Yak-3, is because it could do 2-3 things, but it was only really good at the most important thing: Dogfighting.
Well, that's the point. The Mosquito was good at everything it was used for. Even though it was designed as a light bomber. Just don't expect it to be a brilliant dogfighter too. The Yak-3 was certainly a good fighter, but that was the only thing it could do.

[Almighty Blighty]

pipped me to it, thanks

[P-51]

now tell our fine readers from which engine was the meteor developed...?:| mmmmmmmmm?

(ie almost entirely the same just with heavier/scrap Merlin(hint) bits stuck on and the supercharger removed)

But its not a Merlin though is it? Its a Meteor.

[Almighty Blighty]

The mustang has the best sound accompanied with the dark sound of the c-47

dude, the mustang used a merlin. as u are sayin that the mustang, spitfire, lancaster, hurricane, mossie, P 40, a 1955 chevy bel air, and many more..... not just the mustang thank you

EDIT:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIj2GVfua84

[Swagger7]

Wow. :shock: Someone actually shoehorned a Merlin into a car. I'm seriously impressed! It does seem like kind of a waste, though. With that much work you could probably build a brand new P-51 for the engine! (OK, so it'd take a little longer ;) I do like the paint job, though.

[juz1]

But its not a Merlin though is it? Its a Meteor.

a pig in a dress is still a pig :rolleyes:

I should know...I've dated a few...
________
VOLCANO CLASSIC (http://www.vaporshop.com/volcano-vaporizer.html)

[Soviet Ace]

a pig in a dress is still a pig :rolleyes:

I should know...I've dated a few...

Oh damn...

[juz1]

Oh damn...

pretty much my words on waking,..... before chewing my arm off....





Beer- helping ugly people achieve sexual congress sice 1444...
________
Herbal Vaporizer (http://herbalvaporizers.info)

[Soviet Ace]

pretty much my words on waking,..... before chewing my arm off....




Beer- helping ugly people achieve sexual congress sice 1444...

;-)

[mattd27]

I'd like to see a Lancaster in there, if anything they would be great fun to shoot down, B-25's would be cool too.:)

EDIT: Or a B-29, but they were only used in the Pacific. :(