Battle Of Britain: Storm Of War - Pilot's Lounge

[Moreno]

As Oleg's Room 2 has been opened exclusively for questions about the game, we shouldn't spam it with chit chat about everything and nothing. I thought it might be a good idea to open a new thread, where everything about ideas, speculations, etc. will be posted... Quintessentially all the stuff, that filled the numerous pages in Oleg's first room. Feel free to accept it or not!

[Feuerfalke]

The whole board consists of chit-chat, as there is little news on the one hand and a lot of people who use this board primarily to vent and whine. The facts are already summed up nicely in the new ORR-Thread, but you won't heal people from complaining, demanding and claiming to be able to do it better than Oleg.

It's a pitty, fully agreed, but trust me: You cannot change them.

Even the fact that they turn away other customers or potential interested people by their flaming and complaining doesn't interest them. It's just egocentric whaaa-whaaa-whaaa, I want, I need, I demand, where is, when, you promised. Like 4 year old children. Barely believable that some must be over 18 years old!

As much as I support your point, Moreno, there have been numerous threads like that, all with the same result.

It's not the game, not Oleg, no financial crisis or technical problems, which are so damaging for Storm of War and the future of our hobby, it is this community.

[Igo kyu]

The whole board consists of chit-chat, as there is little news on the one hand and a lot of people who use this board primarily to vent and whine. The facts are already summed up nicely in the new ORR-Thread, but you won't heal people from complaining, demanding and claiming to be able to do it better than Oleg.

It's a pitty, fully agreed, but trust me: You cannot change them.

Even the fact that they turn away other customers or potential interested people by their flaming and complaining doesn't interest them. It's just egocentric whaaa-whaaa-whaaa, I want, I need, I demand, where is, when, you promised. Like 4 year old children. Barely believable that some must be over 18 years old!

As much as I support your point, Moreno, there have been numerous threads like that, all with the same result.

It's not the game, not Oleg, no financial crisis or technical problems, which are so damaging for Storm of War and the future of our hobby, it is this community.
I agree with most of that, but I don't agree that the whiners do much damage, they are not that important. Annoying to read, yes, serious damage, no.

[nearmiss]

Oleg is gonna do what Oleg does.

He will persist regardless of all the ill-tempered remarks and negative jibe.

Since 2001, I've read all kinds of verbal tripe about the Il2 series and Oleg keeps going like the "energizer bunny". Even the dark side has no power. LOL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxafIhYFOr0

[SlipBall]

I was wondering if with the weather model in SOW, that we most likely will encounter simular stall condition's as that decribed below. It would seem to me, that we will most likely see this in game. This will most certainly add another thing that we must keep our eyes on. But I think that it will be a good thing to have, if only for the realism of the fm.


Downwind stall:
For instance, a powered plane flying north with airspeed of 30 knots against a
30 knots headwind has zero ground speed.
If you turn 90 deg. left (west), the plane's airspeed still is 30 knots but is now
drifting 30 knots to the south resulting in 42 knots ground speed to the southwest.
If the plane keeps turning south, the drift due to the wind is still 30 knots but now
the ground speed becomes 30+30 = 60 knots, while the airspeed still is 30 knots.

The pilot on the ground will see the ground speed but not the airspeed, and since
the plane seems to move much faster flying downwind, the pilot may instinctively
slow down the plane below the stall speed.
This results in a pilot-induced stall due to the optical illusion of the plane's higher
ground speed when flying downwind

[Skoshi Tiger]

I thought that this was already modeled in IL2? Hence out problems getting aircraft with combat loads off stationary carriers.

One of my first hairy missions in IL2 involved taking a plane off from Miline Bay in a thunder storm with a wicked cross wind component. (Before I found out about locking the tail wheel :( I'll have to search for the mission!)

When we can setup a mission and specify the Windspeed and Velecity in BoB we will be able to test this.

Cheers!




I was wondering if with the weather model in SOW, that we most likely will encounter simular stall condition's as that decribed below. It would seem to me, that we will most likely see this in game. This will most certainly add another thing that we must keep our eyes on. But I think that it will be a good thing to have, if only for the realism of the fm.


Downwind stall:
For instance, a powered plane flying north with airspeed of 30 knots against a
30 knots headwind has zero ground speed.
If you turn 90 deg. left (west), the plane's airspeed still is 30 knots but is now
drifting 30 knots to the south resulting in 42 knots ground speed to the southwest.
If the plane keeps turning south, the drift due to the wind is still 30 knots but now
the ground speed becomes 30+30 = 60 knots, while the airspeed still is 30 knots.

The pilot on the ground will see the ground speed but not the airspeed, and since
the plane seems to move much faster flying downwind, the pilot may instinctively
slow down the plane below the stall speed.
This results in a pilot-induced stall due to the optical illusion of the plane's higher
ground speed when flying downwind

[Tree_UK]

The whole board consists of chit-chat, as there is little news on the one hand and a lot of people who use this board primarily to vent and whine. The facts are already summed up nicely in the new ORR-Thread, but you won't heal people from complaining, demanding and claiming to be able to do it better than Oleg.

It's a pitty, fully agreed, but trust me: You cannot change them.

Even the fact that they turn away other customers or potential interested people by their flaming and complaining doesn't interest them. It's just egocentric whaaa-whaaa-whaaa, I want, I need, I demand, where is, when, you promised. Like 4 year old children. Barely believable that some must be over 18 years old!

As much as I support your point, Moreno, there have been numerous threads like that, all with the same result.

It's not the game, not Oleg, no financial crisis or technical problems, which are so damaging for Storm of War and the future of our hobby, it is this community.

Interesting comments Feuerfalke, can you explain in detail how exactly us 4 yr olds are are whining and complaining? I for one am only asking questions regarding posts made directly from 1C, i will give you a few examples, It was posted here that an SOW website should be completed by December 2008, i have asked questions regarding the status of that. It was also posted here in early February that an update would be coming soon in the next week or so. Again i have asked questions if the update is going to happen.
I have not dreamed these questions up i have asked because these statements were posted here as news. Maybe you should direct your disgust at those who originally posted and now have no answers.
Keep up the good work though who knows Oleg might even give you a free copy or mention you in the credits.


xxxx

[Bobb4]

Speaking as a four-year-old, Rise of Flight (ROF) have show everyone exactly how to interact with the community.
Despite heavy condemnation of their online login policy, they did not hide away, they faced their critics and moved forward.
They are now in closed beta with a scheduled May/June release.
While there is no way to compare the scope of SOW to that of ROF one can compare the dismal public relations excercise of SOW publishers/developers compared to the new kids on the block.
One should always remember once a successful engine is released, other developers who once may have been inclinde to use the SOW engine may change their mind.
A working engine is far more appealing than a theoretical abstract of what can be achieved when, if and how SOW is eventually released.
I will be spending my money of ROF when it hits the market, simply because their is nothing else new in the flight sim genre.
Make no mistake I will also rush to buy SOW when it is released.
I am closely following three projects and will purchase them all, they are HOI3, ROF and SOW. Of all the three, the most disappointing is SOW, not in features, function and wow factor, just the fact that they treat the community like...

[Igo kyu]

Interesting comments Feuerfalke, can you explain in detail how exactly us 4 yr olds are are whining and complaining? I for one am only asking questions regarding posts made directly from 1C
For me, It's about the informational contents of the posts _I_ am reading. When someone says there will be some news, there's some content in that. If and when they say they don't know when that news will arrive, there is a little content in that, even though not much. When someone who has already been told that it's not known when some news will arrive, asks for the tenth time when that news will arrive, then there is virtually no information in that post, which I find irritating. If you have nothing to say, why say anything?

[Tree_UK]

The question is asked several times because we simply get no answers.

[Igo kyu]

The question is asked several times because we simply get no answers.
Asking a question more than once has no positive influence on the likelyhood of any answer, let alone the hoped for answer.

[csThor]

Speaking as a four-year-old, Rise of Flight (ROF) have show everyone exactly how to interact with the community.
Despite heavy condemnation of their online login policy, they did not hide away, they faced their critics and moved forward.

With all due respect, but ...

1.) Oleg already tried the road of communicating with the community. He has done it for years, but it didn't do him any good. He was flamed, belittled, accused of cultivating various bias, swamped with demands of small-minded "I want! Now! Gimme! Whine!" folks and ultimately people accused him of having no idea how to run his business. Why should he bother with this narrow-minded, greedy, moronic and impolite community? Why should he post updates when all he gets is a load of flak?

And secondly (IMO, of course):

2.) neoQB are not any better in regards to direct answers to direct questions. Their online-nonsense has caused people to ask "Why?" and all we got (repeatedly) was pussyfooting around the issue and evasive BS about "user value" or "RoF is a service". If they were so "communicative" how come they didn't have the bollocks to say "This is our anti-piracy approach" straight away?


And lastly let me ask all of you who demand a release date one question: Is your life so awful, so empty and are you such sorry creatures that you have to make a computer game the center of your life? The behavior of some here makes me think so ... *shakes head*

[Bobb4]

And lastly let me ask all of you who demand a release date one question: Is your life so awful, so empty and are you such sorry creatures that you have to make a computer game the center of your life? The behavior of some here makes me think so ... *shakes head*
Actually no, I fly IL2, regularly for an online squadron, play empire total war (a really fun game dispite it's quirky ai), I have an active social life, I am married with two lovely children and very happy.
Because I choose to be critical of something does not make me social retarded or obsessed.
I enjoy the odd verbal battle on this forum which in some small way may achieve a desired result.
And my defense of ROF was not in their policy just in their community involvement.

[Skoshi Tiger]

For me, comming to the IL-2 forum is a bit like fishing.

I don't expect to actually find any new information about il2/Bob when I come here. But I thinks it's because of this, the excitement I get when I actually find something new is really big.

I am really looking forward to BoB being released, because of the good job Oleg and Co did with Il-2. Good things take time to develop and grow and I hope BoB doesn't get forced out the door before it's maker is ready to release it, just to make a quick buck.

So what if Rise of flight gets released first? (or any other sim/game for that matter) I'll more than likely have a look at it and if I like it more than IL-2 I probably be posting on a Rise of flight forum instead and pop in over here till BoB is released.

But in my opinion Oleg and the rest of his developers has earnt a good degree of respect for what they have already done and that leads to a certain amount of customer loyalty from me.

Cheers!

[csThor]

Quite frankly Bobb, being critical is not a bad thing. I am critical of several things regarding the BoB development (but this pertains to individual aspects or objects) and not the information policy. What I simply despise is the steady repetition of the same question for a release date again and again. First and foremost it's probably not known even to Oleg when the game will be done. And secondly behaving like a small kid in the back of the family car asking "Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet?" isn't going to help, either. It just makes one look anything but adult. Why bother with a release date? It'll come out when it's done. It's not like the world is stopped until SoW comes out ... ;)

And concerning the information policy. I have been following the Il-2 development ever since Oleg made his first steps into the spotlight a decade ago. Looking back at the turn of events I'd say development updates and Q&As were a major mistake, because - as I said in my first post - it simply created an unreal atmosphere of expectitions (which Maddox Games could never fulfill) and gave too many jerks a platform for their 5 minutes of Internet fame. Oleg was flamed, accused of bias, whined at, showered with ridiculous demands and even more ridiculous rumors and was all too often personally attacked ... and nothing can justify that behavior. I can fully understand why he is keeping his cards so close to his chest this time and I agree with him - no need to hold out your hand if you're getting your own words thrown back at you.

[Tree_UK]

I have no problem with Oleg keeping his cards close to his chest if thats what you want to call it, I'm just chasing up on news posted on here which has come directly from 1C, If they make a post saying 'such and such will be done by December' then surely it is to be expected that people will ask for news on it. That is not flaming Oleg in any shape or form.
Personally i dont think anyone at 1c have any problems with what questions are being asked here, its certain over protective fans of Oleg that are stomping their feet and getting all upset. You all need to calm down no-ones getting hurt they are just questions. We could always start a new thread where no one asks any questions just in case you guys get all over emotional, stop being drama queens and let Oleg or 1C speak for themselves.

[csThor]

So what? You didn't sign a contract with Oleg Maddox stating that you will get an update in December, did you? I mean I just don't understand the fuss about it. It's such a non-issue really, that rehashing the topic again and again is just not worth the time one needs to type. This is what I do not get ...

[Forgottenfighter]

you guys get all over emotional, stop being drama queens.

Hypocrisy be thy name, Tree_UK.

Oh no!, where is our update, you promised us an update and we want it now!... I think the SOW BOB project has been shut down, after years of work they just gave up....there is no chance that it will be finished before 2012. Does that sound familiar, because that is what I hear coming from your side of the fence.

I enjoy the odd verbal battle on this forum which in some small way may achieve a desired result
Me too :mrgreen:

[Tree_UK]

So what? You didn't sign a contract with Oleg Maddox stating that you will get an update in December, did you? I mean I just don't understand the fuss about it. It's such a non-issue really, that rehashing the topic again and again is just not worth the time one needs to type. This is what I do not get ...

lol, your funny, anyway you dont seem to understand its you and others unfounded anger at these questions that keeps rehashing them. Now please calm down.

[Tree_UK]

Hypocrisy be thy name, Tree_UK.

Oh no!, where is our update, you promised us an update and we want it now!... I think the SOW BOB project has been shut down, after years of work they just gave up....there is no chance that it will be finished before 2012. Does that sound familiar, because that is what I hear coming from your side of the fence.


Me too :mrgreen:

Do you know what Hypocrisy actually means?

1. I have never posted 'Where is our update you promised and we want it now' This is pure fiction on your part.
2. I have never posted that the SOW project has been shut down. Again pure fiction on your part.
3. I have never posted that the there's no chance the game will be released by 2012. Once more your over creative mind has been playing tricks on you.

[Forgottenfighter]

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/164025700_236f1f3b5c.jpg?v=0

That comment was not aimed at you in particular, it was aimed at "your side of the fence". By this I mean the side who are asking where is the website or whatever, as opposed to the side who are saying it will be done when it is done.

[Tree_UK]

Oh ok, so we have established that i am not an Hypocrite and i didn't post any of those comment you made reference to.

Thanks i accept your apology. :):)

[Forgottenfighter]

I don't know you personally, you probably still are a hypocrite among other things, but at least you know when to quit :) I too accept your apology :)

[Tree_UK]

I don't know you personally, you probably still are a hypocrite among other things, but at least you know when to quit :) I too accept your apology :)

Don't get all fluffy on me now or I may start to like you. :):)

[Forgottenfighter]

Don't get all fluffy on me now or I may start to like you.

Oh, I wouldn't worry about it too much if I were you ;)
Have a nice day Tree, although I assume it's night-time in the UK since it is in Ireland :grin:

[Tree_UK]

:):) I'm not biting on that one.

[SlipBall]

I thought that this was already modeled in IL2? Hence out problems getting aircraft with combat loads off stationary carriers.

One of my first hairy missions in IL2 involved taking a plane off from Miline Bay in a thunder storm with a wicked cross wind component. (Before I found out about locking the tail wheel :( I'll have to search for the mission!)

When we can setup a mission and specify the Windspeed and Velecity in BoB we will be able to test this.

Cheers!




I did not know that, I havent spent much time flying with tail hook aircraft. So are you saying that there is a noticable differance taking off on a moving vs non moving carrier in game?

[Baron]

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/164025700_236f1f3b5c.jpg?v=0

That comment was not aimed at you in particular, it was aimed at "your side of the fence". By this I mean the side who are asking where is the website or whatever, as opposed to the side who are saying it will be done when it is done.




And your "side of the fence" need 2 sides just to have someone to bicker (bich) with till BoB gets here, same decease differant symptom.



P.S. Anyone NOT wondering why no update in almost 4 (count them) months on a game soon to be released (so iv been told) really dont have a clue or they are simply sticking thire heads in the sand....imho of course. Do i expect an awnser as to why no updates? LoL, not really. :)



BTW. anyone STILL thinking it will be here before the end of 2009? LoL

[Skoshi Tiger]

I did not know that, I havent spent much time flying with tail hook aircraft. So are you saying that there is a noticable differance taking off on a moving vs non moving carrier in game?

Yep! To make sure I wasn't talking complete BS I set up a mission with myself in a F4U-D with full fuel, Tiny Timx2 and a 1000lb'er taking off from a moving Lexington traveling at 40Km/h and managed to take off.

On line I'm sure I would have ended up in the drink with this loadout.

Cheers

Here's the track I think?
http://mywebsite.bigpond.com/marina.grayden/quick0024.ntrk

Note that the dispayed airspeed starts off at 0 and as carrier builds up speed so does the airspeed to 40KM/H

If you want I can link to a track with a stationary carrier where I crash on takeoff but I don't think it will prove anything !)

[SlipBall]

Yep! To make sure I wasn't talking complete BS I set up a mission with myself in a F4U-D with full fuel, Tiny Timx2 and a 1000lb'er taking off from a moving Lexington traveling at 40Km/h and managed to take off.

On line I'm sure I would have ended up in the drink with this loadout.

Cheers

Here's the track I think?
http://mywebsite.bigpond.com/marina.grayden/quick0024.ntrk

Note that the dispayed airspeed starts off at 0 and as carrier builds up speed so does the airspeed to 40KM/H

If you want I can link to a track with a stationary carrier where I crash on takeoff but I don't think it will prove anything !)


All very good thank 's alot!

(quote)
If you want I can link to a track with a stationary carrier where I crash on takeoff but I don't think it will prove anything !)[/quote]


No it would prove alot!...It answers my original question regarding the down-wind stalls. I know that having the carrier moving into the wind is what the flight crew would hope for in real life, it helps alot for takeoff/landing, alot!. It is like your aircraft is going 20 knots faster, if the ship was heading into a 20 knot head wind. All aircraft on land and sea try to head into the wind for takeoff/landing. So again thank's to you, and good news that it is modeled...when I get some time I'm gonna do a carrier career

[zapatista]

With all due respect, but ...

1.) Oleg already tried the road of communicating with the community. He has done it for years, but it didn't do him any good. He was flamed, belittled, accused of cultivating various bias, swamped with demands of small-minded "I want! Now! Gimme! Whine!" folks and ultimately people accused him of having no idea how to run his business. Why should he bother with this narrow-minded, greedy, moronic and impolite community? Why should he post updates when all he gets is a load of flak? *

that is only partially true, and only giving that angle misrepresents the change in attitude that took place towards oleg in some of the bigger il2 forums over the years

first, yes oleg was active initially in il2 forums and that was an exception compared to other game creators. but a couple of years after the initial il2 release several il2/PF problems were not being addressed, and as more ww2 enthusiasts with reliable historical data became part of the il2 forum community, it gradually became more obvious that a one sided bias had crept in with some aircraft performances (the i-16 comparison with the me109 is a good example of this) and that various aircraft/munitions had some errors which were not being fixed or even acknowledged despite good evidence being available.

with olegs very high aim of making il2/BoB the most realistic ww2 aircraft sim it can be, he also needs to be more open about the data programmed into the game for aircraft and munition performances. most of us are way past the old excuse of "everything is programmed perfectly correct, its the pilot making the error not the plane/munition performance being wrong". if we have clear tables and graphs of the data being used for climb rate etc, then even if they are "wrong" compared to what we think they should be, we can decide how to fly a particular plane in certain situations and make the most of it. oleg thinks giving us that data would lead to more arguments, but it would resolve more important issues instead for his hard core fan base, and that will then reduce the wine factor from the lost teens that blow in with the wind on a regular basis because there would be more self regulation in the forums to control the whine factor..

it also turns out that on some of the issue where we repeatedly were told "trust me, trust me, it is perfect" this was not correct, a good example is the 50 cal belting where simply the wrong munitions were being used, this would have taken only a few minutes to identify and correct (it is now in one of the mod's). there are other glaring examples where we were given wrong information, and in the end with the files being hacked open it turns out many of our concerns were justified. as frustration mounted with some of those issues, and it turned out we had been given (deliberate ?) wrong information on repeated occasions, the tone in the forums gradually changed.

with some of the russian bias this can be partially explained by the mainly russian reference texts oleg has used for his sim, and yes after all it is a russian flightsim, but some of that data has been shown to be incorrect and lots of independent expert sources are now available to have a better overview of what is right and what was dated wartime propaganda. if oleg doesnt become more global in his perspective and data sources used, we will continue to have the exact same problem the next time around (get ready for the mig-sabre problem folks )

[csThor]

The problem, zapatista, is that for any data sheet on any possible topic you could find a contradicting set of data. In the end it would simply be a question of POV and/or a personal bias. I never understood the need to dissect the data base of a simulation as a whole, even though I agree with the question of being open to community input. However this input needs to be

a) done in a professional way (not the "You ain't no idea! You hate [insert nation here]!" way it was all too often done in the past)
b) contain plausible data with known origin (i.e. the famous british "620 kp/h for a Bf 109 G-6" test which claims this was achieved with a clean G-6 while the plane carried two gondola arms under its wings).

This is the greatest problem - the community is not a homogenous group, but a collection of various groups of interest, some of which would rather fight each other than get along. So how should Maddox Games be "open" for input when it would be misused for petty squabbling among board rivals (as it happened in the past)? It's easy to demand access to the basic data, but this also requires a certain level of maturity within the community and I am highly sceptical if this community could ever be this mature.

[mazex]

When people point out that the emperor has no clothes, they get bashed for beeing weak of mind...

Oleg goes completely silent for four months while the greatest recession in decades rage around us and Russia is one of the countries worst affected by it. You think that he brings no news because they are working around the clock coding? Does anyone of you "beleivers" work in some position that is even close to the real market economy that pays for projects like this? As there where recent indications about 60% of the work done, does the term "sunk cost" make any sense to you? Wake up, there is a serious risk that this project gets axed. The only reason I come here is to know that there is still funding, I really don't care when it gets released...

/Mazex

[SlipBall]

The sky is falling attitude is funny to read at time's. After awhile the dire speculation's and fear of the worst, becomes annoying. If in the future the project needs to be scraped, I'm sure that we will be told about that. Untill that happens, why not take them at their word that they are working towards completion.

[mazex]

The sky is falling attitude is funny to read at time's. After awhile the dire speculation's and fear of the worst, becomes annoying. If in the future the project needs to be scraped, I'm sure that we will be told about that. Untill that happens, why not take them at their word that they are working towards completion.

If you follow the RTS index I'd say that yes, the sky IS falling...

[IceFire]

Russia has gone through lots of economic turmoil over the last couple of decades (if not longer really). I doubt this has made things any different than when IL-2 was originally being developed.

Thor is right...Oleg was seriously lambasted by some notorious people in the community and I don't blame him for being more standoffish. On the other hand I really hope that Oleg does keep the lines of communication open. Many of us have had good conversations with the man via e-mail sending him data and looking to try and correct issues wherever they may be.

I sent him some data more than a few times. I was always courteous...I made my case, I presented what I had available, I noted the holes in knowledge, and I let Oleg and his team make a decision on what to update. On the whole thats actually worked out quite well. IL-2 had plenty of innacuracies that the community was able to have a hand in fixing...its not possible for Oleg and his team to have access to every piece of information but as a collective we have access to vast stores of historical documents that ultimately are useful one way or another.

Hopefully Storm of War will be open to some input where practical and useful.

[csThor]

Same here, Ice, but I think this time we (the players and Maddox Games) need to work out a standardized system for such data input which relieves Maddox Games from inaccurate, incomplete and/or "amateurish" input. It doesn't help to say "Plane X is off. Author Q quotes Ace K in his book Y saying ..." as this is anecdotal stuff and useless. We need to make sure Maddox Games gets this stuff as complete as it gets - including data which might contradict the other data. But if we exclude stuff we don't like for reasons of personal bias then how much of an accurate simulation do we really want?

[RCAF_FB_Orville]

Hehehe. Bottom line is, you are not going to please everybody all of the time, ever. Yeah, of course we all want as "realistic" a sim as possible, while we (lets face it) overgrown kids pretend to be WWII fighter aces sitting on our arses in front of a Monitor screen....wife/gf kids nagging in the background demanding you put up those shelves :grin:
Why do we do it? Because its FUN of course! Some people however seem to be intent on sucking the fun out of everything, treating a 5Kph perceived inaccuracy like a matter of life or death and of global importance, possibly even a threat to Civilization itself lol :rolleyes:. These people will never let go of their grievances, real or imagined. For the most part, despite its faults (programmers of course being HUMAN like everyone else) IL-2 does a good job in terms of general accuracy.......Yes its right to aim for perfection as I'm sure they will do, but it will never be attained. Thats all.....Oh and did I mention its "just a game" ? (TM) ;)

Carry on, you crazy kids!! :grin:

[SlipBall]

There in lies the problem, so many of you contacting him in the past. Telling him this is not right, or this should be this. I think just enjoy what is given, and try not to give advice on what you consider wrong. The early game really got f u, and dumbed down from peoples advice.

[KG26_Alpha]

The biggest factor most of the (my aircraft is porked "insert name here" whiners ) miss, is the fact that no two aircraft would ever fly the same as we have in the IL2 series, you get a perfectly matched unrelenting same data ac every time you fly.

Pilots have an envelope that their aircraft is to be flown within to keep the pilot safe and from damaging the aircraft, this allows them to familiarize themselves and get from A to B safely whilst gaining flying hours and competence with their plane.

The way we abuse these IL2 stock out of the factory set up aircraft, would seriously damage the airframes and engines from the first flight in them.

I'm sure none of you would drive your car full throttle everywhere at maximum speed, but we do in IL2 due to the "virtual" nature of the game, it allows you do do it, so we do.

So people who want "realistic/realism/as it was/full100%/actual FM & DM" then you should be prepared to fly in such a manner and not expect the game/sim be realistic but be realistic the way you fly yourselves.
I know though that they would not do this as its easier to whine about (my aircraft is porked "insert name here" ) rather than learn to fly correctly or historically.

Until 1c can explode your motherboard if you loose an aircraft its up to you to fly in a reasonable manner instead of blaming the FM etc etc etc etc.

Don't forget its really not real :)

No really its not !!!

[SlipBall]

The biggest factor most of the (my aircraft is porked "insert name here" whiners ) miss, is the fact that no two aircraft would ever fly the same as we have in the IL2 series, you get a perfectly matched unrelenting same data ac every time you fly.

Pilots have an envelope that their aircraft is to be flown within to keep the pilot safe and from damaging the aircraft, this allows them to familiarize themselves and get from A to B safely whilst gaining flying hours and competence with their plane.

The way we abuse these IL2 stock out of the factory set up aircraft, would seriously damage the airframes and engines from the first flight in them.

I'm sure none of you would drive your car full throttle everywhere at maximum speed, but we do in IL2 due to the "virtual" nature of the game, it allows you do do it, so we do.

So people who want "realistic/realism/as it was/full100%/actual FM & DM" then you should be prepared to fly in such a manner and not expect the game/sim be realistic but be realistic the way you fly yourselves.
I know though that they would not do this as its easier to whine about (my aircraft is porked "insert name here" ) rather than learn to fly correctly or historically.

Until 1c can explode your motherboard if you loose an aircraft its up to you to fly in a reasonable manner instead of blaming the FM etc etc etc etc.

Don't forget its really not real :)

No really its not !!!




Well put!...I would love to see this in SOW dm, then if you abuse the aircraft, your stuck with it somehow. I was tought the only time to use full power was for takeoff. Soon as reaching the safe altitude for the airport, had to level off, and throttle back.

[flyingbullseye]

Well put!...I would love to see this in SOW dm, then if you abuse the aircraft, your stuck with it somehow. I was tought the only time to use full power was for takeoff. Soon as reaching the safe altitude for the airport, had to level off, and throttle back.


That would be a pretty cool idea if implimented, that and patches over battle damage and how each could affect the performance of your ride could add some added immersion.

Flyingbullseye

[Insuber]

Fellow pilots,

I do not like this idea of having fences. What we would need here is a normal company developing a normal videogame and releasing normal official development news, screenshots, press releases etc on their game website (RoF?).

The strategy of having a forum for development updates and users' requests, denotes Oleg's intention to have a direct relationship with the user base, that is rather non orthodox but possibly more effective.

Well, if this type of communication doesn't work for users' fault, being us childish, whiners, aggressive, unaccurate, amateurish, as someone here seems to believe, then all is needed is just to go back to a more traditional way of communication = a game website and press releases.

Just my 2C ... lol.

Regards,
Ins

[Codex]

Try flying around with Capt Brown's settings:


Want to get the most realistic Il-2:FB experience possible? After testing,
Captain Brown managed to help define what he considers the most
realistic joystick sensitivity settings. If you have a copy of Il-2:FB and
would like to emulate this go into Hardware setup, then ‘Input’ then
‘Controls’ — when you will find a range of sliders. Adjust these to:
Pitch 0, 1, 3, 7, 9, 14, 18, 23, 27, 33
Roll 0, 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 10, 12, 17
Yaw 0, 0, 1, 2, 5, 6, 8, 11, 14, 16
Bringing these down to the values listed in the different axes should
make for a much more realistic and true-to-life experience — in what is
already a highly realistic warbird sim. Experienced Il-2 flyers may find
that these seem to make the aircraft feel more sluggish and less
responsive, but these settings will make take-off and landings easier, as
well as manoeuvres requiring small corrections like lining up behind an
enemy aircraft or precision dive bombing. It also has to be remembered
that vintage warbirds are considerably less agile then modern jet
fighters — so that a ‘slow roll’ seen performed at airshows is very often
a WW2 aircraft’s max rate of roll — rather than the twinkling roll rate
that an F-16 may have. These settings bring the handling of aircraft in
Il-2:FB more in line with Captain Brown’s experience of the real thing
and, of course, users can tweak these settings to their heart’s content,
perhaps adding more sensitivity at 100% deflection so that in extreme
dogfights there is still full control authority there at the end of the
scale.

[KG26_Alpha]

Try flying around with Capt Brown's settings:

If only everyone's sticks were the same and this could be enforced server side :)

I fighters and bombers axis and allied, these settings work well for single engine aircraft but not so good on twin engined.

SOW needs to have multiple pilot profiles selectable when choosing different aircraft online.
This can be done off line by making different pilots profiles and then different stick settings.
Unless you know exactly what plane your going to be flying before joining a mission in the Hyperlobby.

[Abbeville-Boy]

i saw this thread title and was good, finally some bob news but no news found here :(

[Skoshi Tiger]

That would be a pretty cool idea if implimented, that and patches over battle damage and how each could affect the performance of your ride could add some added immersion.

Flyingbullseye

Way back when, I used to like the campaign mode in Janes USNF series. During the campaign you had a fixed ammount of aircraft available that had to be maintained and only a certain number of maintenance time.

At the end of a mission you had to allocate the maintenance time to the aircraft. A lot of the time you ended up flying older aircraft or ones with existing damage so you could get your good planes flying again.

It worked for me!

Cheers

P.S. Hope everyone had a good Easter!