4.11: Some Missions Locking-Up

[Aviar]

I have a folder with 5 coop missions I built in 4.10 using the new Solomons map(s). I built, tested and hosted these missions with no problems in the past.

I just now became aware of a problem in 4.11 with 3 of these missions (the other 2 'good' missions do not have this issue). Basically, the 3 'bad' missions load and play perfectly fine, but at some point in the mission my screen just locks up (not CTD). The screen does not go black...there is no crash to desktop...there are no error messages...the screen just freezes. This happens every time with these 3 missions.

I then have to CTL-ESC to get back to my desktop, bring up Windows Task Manager and shut down the game from there.

Since I am not getting any actual CTD's, I am also not getting any error messages or hs_err error files from these lock-ups. So, I'm not really sure what is causing the problem.

Until these 3 missions, I have not had any other problems with CTD or lock-ups in 4.11....even before the hotfix.

My guess is that this is some kind of memory issue. The Solomons map is one of the biggest maps we have and we all know that the map size affects memory usage. When I was testing to try and figure out the problem, I realized that the 3 'bad' missions were 'bigger' (more objects, ships, planes, etc.) than the 2 'good' missions.

But remember, I never had any problems with these missions in 4.10, so I was wondering if maybe it was a computer problem on my end. So, since I still have a seperate install of 4.10.1 on my computer, I decided to run the 3 missions from there, just as a test.

Well, the missions ran fine. I had no lock-ups in 4.10.1. So what does this tell me? I'm not sure.

I assume that with all the new features and improvements in 4.11, there are more 'calculations' running in the background now. Because the Solomons map is so big, combined with these 3 'larger' missions and now the added calculations in 4.11, my computer has reached it's limit? I don't know what else to think.

The 2 'smaller' missions run fine. All of the other missions I have played/hosted since 4.11 was released also play fine. (However, none of the maps on those other missions is as large as the Solomons maps.)

Just for fun I also tested the 3 'bad' missions on UP3 RC4, which is of course modded and (generally) more resource-intensive than stock IL-2. The missions played fine with no lock-ups.

So, what conclusions can be reached here? I'm not sure. The missions play fine in 4.10.1 and UP3 RC4 but they lock up when played in 4.11.

PS.- I did not report this as a bug because I'm not sure there is actually any 'bug' involved. It could be specific to my computer or possibly a limitation in IL-2 itself.

**I decided to attach one of the 'bad' coop missions. The easiest and quickest way to test it is to load it into the FMB and let it run. I usually run it at 4x speed (it then usually locks up within 5 minutes).
If you decide to actually fly the mission yourself, I find that it usually locks up within the first 20 minutes.

Aviar

[KG26_Alpha]

I have a folder with 5 coop missions I built in 4.10 using the new Solomons map(s). I built, tested and hosted these missions with no problems in the past.

I just now became aware of a problem in 4.11 with 3 of these missions (the other 2 'good' missions do not have this issue). Basically, the 3 'bad' missions load and play perfectly fine, but at some point in the mission my screen just locks up (not CTD). The screen does not go black...there is no crash to desktop...there are no error messages...the screen just freezes. This happens every time with these 3 missions.

I then have to CTL-ESC to get back to my desktop, bring up Windows Task Manager and shut down the game from there.

Since I am not getting any actual CTD's, I am also not getting any error messages or hs_err error files from these lock-ups. So, I'm not really sure what is causing the problem.

Until these 3 missions, I have not had any other problems with CTD or lock-ups in 4.11....even before the hotfix.

My guess is that this is some kind of memory issue. The Solomons map is one of the biggest maps we have and we all know that the map size affects memory usage. When I was testing to try and figure out the problem, I realized that the 3 'bad' missions were 'bigger' (more objects, ships, planes, etc.) than the 2 'good' missions.

But remember, I never had any problems with these missions in 4.10, so I was wondering if maybe it was a computer problem on my end. So, since I still have a seperate install of 4.10.1 on my computer, I decided to run the 3 missions from there, just as a test.

Well, the missions ran fine. I had no lock-ups in 4.10.1. So what does this tell me? I'm not sure.

I assume that with all the new features and improvements in 4.11, there are more 'calculations' running in the background now. Because the Solomons map is so big, combined with these 3 'larger' missions and now the added calculations in 4.11, my computer has reached it's limit? I don't know what else to think.

The 2 'smaller' missions run fine. All of the other missions I have played/hosted since 4.11 was released also play fine. (However, none of the maps on those other missions is as large as the Solomons maps.)

Just for fun I also tested the 3 'bad' missions on UP3 RC4, which is of course modded and (generally) more resource-intensive than stock IL-2. The missions played fine with no lock-ups.

So, what conclusions can be reached here? I'm not sure. The missions play fine in 4.10.1 and UP3 RC4 but they lock up when played in 4.11.

PS.- I did not report this as a bug because I'm not sure there is actually any 'bug' involved. It could be specific to my computer or possibly a limitation in IL-2 itself.

**I decided to attach one of the 'bad' coop missions. The easiest and quickest way to test it is to load it into the FMB and let it run. I usually run it at 4x speed (it then usually locks up within 5 minutes).
If you decide to actually fly the mission yourself, I find that it usually locks up within the first 20 minutes.

Aviar

Tested the attached mission 4 times and it runs OK no lock ups in 4x 8x and normal speed.

Some lag pauses from delay spawning ac especially Blue base patrol flight @ 10:00

[HundertneunGustav]

RAM check for hardware failure? OS environment? GC temps? stuff like that, hardware oriented?

[Aviar]

RAM check for hardware failure? OS environment? GC temps? stuff like that, hardware oriented?

Thank you for replying. However, did you read my entire post?

I did state that I have run (and re-tested) the 'bad' missions in 4.10.1 and UP3 RC4 without any lock-ups at all. I'm only getting lock-ups in 4.11.


*As an update, I have found another 'big' mission (Slovakia map) that locked up on me. Again, this mission has never locked-up in 4.10.1. So I'm kind of stumped, as the problem seems to be connected to 4.11....not my computer. Has anyone had the chance to see if there might be some sort of memory leak in 4.11?

Aviar

[MicroWave]

I can get the lock-up in 4.11 with the mission you posted.
We'll see what can be done about that.

[Aviar]

I can get the lock-up in 4.11 with the mission you posted.
We'll see what can be done about that.


Ok, that's interesting. What would be more interesting is if you could try what I did and run the same mission in 4.10.1. On my computer, all of the 'bad' missions ran perfectly fine in 4.10.1.

Aviar

[KG26_Alpha]

I can get the lock-up in 4.11 with the mission you posted.
We'll see what can be done about that.

What point did the mission lock up.

I have run that mission over 10 times now and it never locks up ?

Only a lag pause as mentioned in my above post.

[Aviar]

Still, there seems to be something strange in my 4.11. As I play more IL-2, I am finding more missions that are locking up. Just today I hosted a coop that locked up about 5 minutes into the mission.

Even right from the start I could see something was wrong. I was getting a slight freeze about every 10 seconds. This is unusual and never happened in 4.10. As I mentioned, it eventially just locked up. Now, this is a mission I have hosted dozens of times over the years with no problems at all.

I immediately fired up 4.10.1 and played the same mission. It was as smooth as ever and did not lock up at all. I completed the mission without any issues.

I don't know what it is, but there is some sort of paging or memory issue with my 4.11 install. Another thing that is happening is with the screenshot feature. In 4.11, sometimes when I press the key for a screenshot, the game will lock up. Again, this does not happen in 4.10.

Aviar

[IceFire]

That's really weird Aviar... before and after release I went through all kinds of missions testing them out with a variety of different sequences, scenes, and other scenarios and never did I have that happen.

Does this only happen when it's being hosted as a coop or does it happen if run through the FMB or a single mission as well? I skimmed through all of the posts and I didn't see that mentioned. My apologies if you did mention it. I'm going to test the mission in a few!

[Aviar]

That's really weird Aviar... before and after release I went through all kinds of missions testing them out with a variety of different sequences, scenes, and other scenarios and never did I have that happen.

Does this only happen when it's being hosted as a coop or does it happen if run through the FMB or a single mission as well? I skimmed through all of the posts and I didn't see that mentioned. My apologies if you did mention it. I'm going to test the mission in a few!

Thanks for being concerned. I know my first post was a little long, but the answer to your question at the bottom of that post.

In short, it happens basically all the time. Online coops, offline coop testing and then simply running the mission straight from the FMB. The latter is the quickest way to test it. Just accelerate it to 2x or 4x and let it run. Changing views and scrolling through the different flights sometimes seems to accelerate the lock-up time. This is why it seems like some sort of paging or memory issue. Many times it will lock up as I am moving my mouse or zooming the view in/out.

I want to thank you for giving of your personal time in the testing of the beta. I know it's not easy. However, I played the heck out of 4.11 for weeks before I found the first lock-up. It was simply because I had not played one of these 'bigger' missions in my folder. It's just like a bug that gets by all the testers and gets released in the final. It happens....we all know that.

But even now I'm still not comfortable calling it a 'bug'. Maybe there is something unique to my computer and eventually I can resolve the issue.

Aviar

[IceFire]

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

[Aviar]

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

Just to clarify, I did not say this happens 'often' to me.

As I mentioned earlier, I pretty much detailed everything in my first post. I know it is a little long but if it is read closely, the info is in there.

As I stated, these seem to be a combination of 'big' maps and 'big' missions. The Solomons map(s) are just about the biggest maps in IL-2. So when you load even the blank map, your computer is already being taxed. If you combine that with a very busy (big) mission.....well you see that could eventually be an issue. (Again, I stated that I have 'smaller' missions on the Solomons map that work just fine in 4.11.)

Over the years, I have seen many posts that a certain individual could not load a particular map or mission....usually because of RAM issues. This is not unusual. Even the best and fastest computers have a physical limit.

***The strange part of my issue is that the same missions that are locking up in 4.11 are playing perfectly fine in 4.10.1....on the same computer.***

So, my common sense is telling me that my computer is fine and there may be an issue with 4.11. Does that make sense to you?

* Maybe all the new calculations for FM, AI, head tracking, moving plane parts online, etc. are stressing the IL-2 code? Too much info?

Aviar

[IceFire]

Definitely makes sense.

Yes the Solomons map does appear to be quite taxing. We tried to use it for a scenario on Battlefields1 and while the map ran fine for most players we had to pull it because some players weren't able to load past 90-92% and others would load but had missing textures on the ground or on planes. It's too bad because it's a beautiful map but some machines I guess are not quite up to the task.

I would agree with you that it is some sort of game related issue. In particular because the lockup does not affect the hardware. The game does lock up but you can alt-tab out and shut down the IL2 process without difficulty or loss of stability... and given that it happens on more than one system it's not likely to be a system specific problem either.

So big map and big missions...I'll have to have a look. See if I can recreate the same issues on other mission examples.

[Aviar]

Just for fun, I decided to create a '4.11 Stress Test' mission. I thought it might be a good idea if we were going to do some more testing on this issue.

So of course I used the Solomoms 1944 map. Then I placed a lot more planes than I had in the mission I posted here earlier...the one that was locking up.

In this mission, I currently have:

64 B-29

32 B-25

16 P-38

48 Ki-61

16 H8k1

Now that's a lot of planes. Also, all the gunners in the bombers have their own AI and so that puts a lot of additional stress in terms of calculations into the mission.

So I tried one of the more simple tests. I loaded the mission into the FMB and chose Play. I then set the Autopilot on the Player aircraft. Then I accelerated the game to 4x and just watched.

Nothing happened. The mission did not lock up. So what might we learn from this? Some thoughts:

1. The first thing that came to mind was....the first mission was created in 4.10 and this stress mission was created in 4.11. Now, on the surface, that should not make a difference. One reason being is that I made the stress mission very 'generic', meaning that I could easily install it in 4.10 and it would play. (This is because I did not use any of the new 4.11 features or planes.)

So, could this be a possible answer? (Certain missions created BEFORE 4.11 may cause the game to lock up during the mission, if played in 4.11.)

That's an interesting thought. The first thing that then comes to mind is....why not go into 4.10.1 and rebuild the stress mission from scratch. Then take THAT mission and test it in 4.11. If the 4.10.1 stress test mission were to lock up in 4.11, that certainly would be interesting information.

What do you think?


2.Ok, the second thought was that although the stress mission was 'bigger' than the coop mision (we'll call it the Torikina mission from now on), it was different in that in many ways it was 'simplier'.

What I mean is this. The stress mission was made as a test, so I just had all the planes start in mid-air. They all had just 2 waypoints. So basically they all just flew from point A to point B. This will still stress a computer, but remember, we are trying to find some differences. (I later added 16 Ki-61's which attacked certain bomber flights, so there WAS a good amount of combat action...which increases the stress factor.)

The Torikina coop was a 'real' mission. It had takeoffs, landings, more waypoints, attack waypoints, flights with delayed spawning, etc.

Could some of these differences be the answer to why the 4.11 stress mission did not lock up? I don't know.

The obvious answer is to try and build a brand new big 'real' mission on the Solomons map and see what happens. I mean, if that mission would still lock up then that question would be answered.

Does that make sense?

So there are 2 points of thought right there. Does anyone have more?

**I have also attached the 4.11 Stress Test mission in case somebody wants to mess around with it.

EDIT: One interesting fact I forgot to mention. I tested the Stress Mission in both 4.11 and 4.10.1. Although the mission played fine in both versions, there was a difference between the two.

After I played the mission from the 4.11 FMB at 4x speed, after about 30 minutes (in-game time) I decided to end the mission. After I hit Escape, clicked Quit Mission and then clicked on Done, the game locked up. It would not reload the mission back into the FMB. So again, does this seem to indicate some sort of memory-type issue in 4.11?

When I did the same test in 4.10.1, there was no lock-up at all. I tested the mission, quit the mission and then the mission reloaded right back into the FMB. So again, there seems to be a reproducable difference between 4.11 and 4.10.1.


Aviar

[IceFire]

Total conjecture... you had one or two vehicles (groups?) traveling between one side of the island and the other. There were a significant number of way points. I'm not sure if vehicle AI has been altered in any way but it's worth factoring in.

[Aviar]

Total conjecture... you had one or two vehicles (groups?) traveling between one side of the island and the other. There were a significant number of way points. I'm not sure if vehicle AI has been altered in any way but it's worth factoring in.

It's only 2 vehicles....one Red and one Blue. If 2 vehicles can cause a mission to lock up something is horribly wrong.

However, I just went in and deleted those 2 vehicles. I then ran my usual test. The mission still locked up about 2 minutes into it at 4x speed.

Aviar

[Robert]

Just for confirmation, the mission locked up after several minutes of 4X playback. I'm using 4.11, and I didn't occupy a cockpit - strictly play back.

[Aviar]

Just for confirmation, the mission locked up after several minutes of 4X playback. I'm using 4.11, and I didn't occupy a cockpit - strictly play back.

Thank you so much for testing. I assume you are talking about the Torikina mission and not the Stress Test mission.

If you still have a working version of 4.10.1 to test it in that would be great. You see, the main issue we are trying to resolve is why these missions work fine in 4.10.1 but lock up in 4.11.

That means we now have 5 people (including myself) who have reported testing the mission and 4 of them had the mission lock up in 4.11.

Aviar

[Robert]

Yes Aviar, it was the Torikina mission. I don't have 4101 on my machine ATM so I can't be of service there. Nor do I run mods when I did run 4.101 (which is of no concern regarding 4.11, obviously).

I ALSO tried running the mission while occupying a Japanese fighter and it froze on loading. Never got past the flash screen.

I subsequently went back to flying my WSBS mission. It's an old campaign based on the AVG fighter squadron in Burma made by " the former Chuck Older." I'm about 16 - 18 missions into it an haven't had a single freeze, slow down or crash. The first time I tried flying post installation of the Torikina mission it did just that until it froze completely and I had to CTRL/ALT/DELETE to exit out of the program.

I deleted the Torikina mission and plan on trying the campaign again, probably tomorrow. It's late here. I will post back and let you know if I still have issues. What this means I have no idea. I am posting so you or others may have a wider group and that hopefully a common thread can be seen amongst the reports so the issue can be narrowed down and corrected.

WSBS was created for 4.09. BTW.

[Robert]

UPDATE Aviar:

I reflew the last mission that froze in White Star /Blue Skies, and had no issues - no freezes, no jitters, nada. This was after deleting the Torikina mission you posted last night.

Again, WSBS is a 4.09 created mission, and I'm flying it in IL2 1946 4.11.

[IceFire]

I think it would be a matter of coincidence that having a mission present in the IL-2 game directory would have any affect on any other mission. The "nice" thing about IL-2 missions is that they are just text files with waypoint coordinates and other properties written out in plain text. The only time they interact is when the game loads the file...everything else happens in the game engine itself. If it's not loaded it wouldn't be doing anything.

I guess the vehicles have nothing to do with it. I wonder about taking out elements of that mission until it does play through and not lock up.

[Aviar]

Icefire is correct. You don't have to be 'afraid' of the mission. It can't harm anything.

Today, I couldn't even load the Solomons map into the FMB (4.11, of course), so something is up. I could play the mission itself from the Multiplayer screen, but of course it froze up about 10 minutes into it.

Hosted a bunch of coops today in HL...had no problems at all. Obviously I did not attempt to play any of the 'bad' missions.

Aviar

[IceFire]

I've been playing a bunch of missions tonight. All are larger scale, they have bombers, some of them are on the Finnish Gulf, some are at Kiev, about the only place I haven't been is Solomons.

If it is specific to the Solomons... or this is where it exposes some sort of underlying issue. I wonder if it's on all versions of the Solomons map or just some of them. You're using a later version of the map in your example mission than the one I'm using for a RNZAF/Blacksheep adventure that I'm working on. I wonder if that has anything to do with it or not...

[Robert]

Icefire is correct. You don't have to be 'afraid' of the mission. It can't harm anything.

Today, I couldn't even load the Solomons map into the FMB (4.11, of course), so something is up. I could play the mission itself from the Multiplayer screen, but of course it froze up about 10 minutes into it.

Hosted a bunch of coops today in HL...had no problems at all. Obviously I did not attempt to play any of the 'bad' missions.

Aviar


Good... I just wanted to rule out anything that may be causing the freezes. WSBS also uses the Kuban map. That's rather large if I recall. Most missions have been bomber intercepts with 40 or so bombers. Defenses have obligatory AA, ships and my squadron has been meeting up with several allies - making up a group of 12 - 16 fighters en-mass. The bombers also have escort on some of the missions.

I'm going to create a small bomber intercept on the Solomon map and see if that's an issue..

I wish I was more helpful on the ins and outs of things, but hopefully at least building a small mission will help narrow down the problem..

[IceFire]

Good... I just wanted to rule out anything that may be causing the freezes. WSBS also uses the Kuban map. That's rather large if I recall. Most missions have been bomber intercepts with 40 or so bombers. Defenses have obligatory AA, ships and my squadron has been meeting up with several allies - making up a group of 12 - 16 fighters en-mass. The bombers also have escort on some of the missions.

I'm going to create a small bomber intercept on the Solomon map and see if that's an issue..

I wish I was more helpful on the ins and outs of things, but hopefully at least building a small mission will help narrow down the problem..

Kuban is a lightweight compared to the more modern maps :) Gulf of Finland and the full fat versions of the Slovakia map are the heavier ones. Solomons is also not due to object density but by the sheer geographical size of the map.

[Aviar]

There's no need to be building 'smaller' missions. I already mentioned that I have 2 smaller missions that work perfectly fine on the Solomons map (4.11). I also have a big mission on the Slovakia (Summer lite) map that locks up (4.11).

At this time I want to say something. I really don't think we will find anything. I have spent a lot of my personal time trying to find something.

Assuming this is not something specific to my computer, we have to admit that it is an issue with 4.11. In that case it is some sort of code/programming issue.

There is one thing that cannot be disputed. I have played/hosted these 'bad' missions many times in 4.10 without a single problem. When I play/host these same missions in 4.11, they lock up. On the same computer.

So I'm not comfortable 'blaming' these missions for being too big or having too many waypoints or too many vehicles, etc. If there is something 'strange' with these missions, why do they work fine in 4.10?

By now, I think we are looking in the wrong place. If it's a code/programming issue in 4.11, there is not much 'we' can do about it.

What I'm trying to say is that at this point, in my opinion, the ball is in Daidalos Team's court. They know about the issue and one of the team members has even confirmed a lock-up on the mission I posted.

Certainly, if they needed any help at all, I would always be willing to assist in any way that I could. I have a lot of respect for all the team members.

Personally, I'm also getting uncomfortable about this thread getting so long. I don't want to be looked at like some whining fan boy crying "...FIX THIS PROBLEM...". I've been playing IL-2 for 10 years and I just want it to be the best flight sim possible so that we can all enjoy playing it.

So, at this point I'm probably going to lay a little low and let the Daidalos Team do what they do best.

Aviar

[IceFire]

Avair, check your e-mail :D

[Robert]

Understood Aviar and Icefire. Thinking about it more I believe you are right. I hadn't played IL2 since August of '10 so I never had 4.10 and therefore have nothing to compare it to.

If it is a memory leak it is in DT's court. At least it's confirmed that your mission did freeze up on several members and that shows there is something.

[Nicholaiovitch]

I just saw this thread after experiencing identical lock-ups on our DF missions. (net/dogfight....no server software...peer to peer connection)

The first mission this happened with was when our squad first started using 4.11 after applying the "Hotfix".

It was a mission created on the "Islands" map in 4.10.1 and then flown again in 4.11 with the first freeze happening over an airfield with several flights of AI attacking 6 "real" online flyer's.

We tried three times to run the mission again and the same thing happened. Following week we tried another DF mission with the same results.

All these missions are fairly heavy on objects and AI but all run perfectly in 4.10.1 and UP3 RC4. The freezes occurred during interception/attack of AI by players overhead/near one of the airfields with bombs exploding and multiple fire from players and AI.

I can post the "Islands" mission if it helps.

Unfortunately, we have now stopped using 4.11 until we can isolate the issue or get TD to look into what clearly may be an issue with memory overload even on one of the simpler maps....or possibly another AI related problem?

I'm sorry it has taken so long to reply to this.....I felt the same way as Aviar in thinking that we could have a hardware issue here.....but I think not now.

Nicholaiovitch:-|

[Aviar]

Be patient. DT is working on it.

Aviar

[CzechTexan]

Maybe it has something to do with Water settings?
The same problem happened to me a couple times. I'm making missions on Solomons map.

The first time this happened I adjusted the water settings to 0 and it helped.
The second time it has happened was after a couple hours of building and testing missions (usually larger dogfighting missions). Maybe my computer was stressed from testing missions over and over? i dunno.

If this happened on other maps with lots of water then that could be the culprit.

[IceFire]

Maybe it has something to do with Water settings?
The same problem happened to me a couple times. I'm making missions on Solomons map.

The first time this happened I adjusted the water settings to 0 and it helped.
The second time it has happened was after a couple hours of building and testing missions (usually larger dogfighting missions). Maybe my computer was stressed from testing missions over and over? i dunno.

If this happened on other maps with lots of water then that could be the culprit.
Could be computer specific...

The issue that we ran into has been identified by TD. I'm actually not that sure on the specifics but Aviar and I were able to send some debug information in and they have identified what causes it.

[CzechTexan]

Has TD discovered what is causing this problem? any idea when it will be fixed? Hopefully soon. I am in the process of finishing up a new guadalcanal campaign. Some of the larger and longer-lasting dogfights is when I get the problem. i'm afraid many users will become discouraged.

[IceFire]

Has TD discovered what is causing this problem? any idea when it will be fixed? Hopefully soon. I am in the process of finishing up a new guadalcanal campaign. Some of the larger and longer-lasting dogfights is when I get the problem. i'm afraid many users will become discouraged.

To the best of my knowledge... yes it's been discovered and incorporated into an update. Details to be released later.

[CzechTexan]

Thanks for the update Icefire. I was just hoping it'd be in a hotfix but will just have to wait til whenever it comes out.

[yeikov]

Hello,

Is there any progress on fixing these lock-ups? I also had 3 of them lately, 2 in the Solomons map and 1 in Normandy. One of them was with 4.11.1, so I guess the fix was not included in the latest patch?
Thanks!

[JtD]

The lock ups were too difficult to fix in the what was meant to be a quick fix patch, so it was left for a later patch, hopefully 4.12.

[yeikov]

Ok, thanks for the quick reply! :)

[Aviar]

The lock ups were too difficult to fix in the what was meant to be a quick fix patch, so it was left for a later patch, hopefully 4.12.


Are you sure NOTHING was done regarding this issue? After applying the 4.11.1 patch, I can now play my 'bad' missions in coop mode without any lockups.

The only problem I still have is loading these big maps into the FMB. For instance, the Solomon maps refuse to load most of the time. Once in a while they will load but I haven't figured out the 'trick' (if there is one) to getting them to load every time.

However, I'm happy that now my Solomon map missions are actually playable without locking up.

Aviar

[JtD]

No, I'm sure SOMETHING was done, but I have no idea how much. I'm also sure that the problem wasn't solved completely, but I'm really glad that your problem is gone for now. :)

[MicroWave]

Are you sure NOTHING was done regarding this issue? After applying the 4.11.1 patch, I can now play my 'bad' missions in coop mode without any lockups.

The only problem I still have is loading these big maps into the FMB. For instance, the Solomon maps refuse to load most of the time. Once in a while they will load but I haven't figured out the 'trick' (if there is one) to getting them to load every time.

However, I'm happy that now my Solomon map missions are actually playable without locking up.

Aviar

You've been very helpful in providing missions to test, so we did manage to fix some stuff. But for example 'Stress test mission' still causes lock up after some time.
I'm not sure what's going on with DCG missions lockups that I see reported.
I guess I'm off to play some DCG campaigns.

[yeikov]

In case it helps, I've attached the mission that caused my lock ups in 4.11.1 (generated by DCG 3.47 beta6).
I've run it 3 times now, 2 times it locked up after ~30 min flying, the other time I tried the workaround explained by Jameson here (http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=31884) and it did not.

Thanks for the support, and for the great work you're doing!

[Aviar]

In case it helps, I've attached the mission that caused my lock ups in 4.11.1 (generated by DCG 3.47 beta6).
I've run it 3 times now, 2 times it locked up after ~30 min flying, the other time I tried the workaround explained by Jameson here (http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=31884) and it did not.

Thanks for the support, and for the great work you're doing!


That 'workaround' may or may not work for offline play but obviously could not be used with an online mission or a mission played offline in Coop mode.

On another note and just out of curiosity, what does this part of the 'workaround' mean? ---->

"The only thing I've found that works is to pause when it starts to lock up..."

In particular, what does "...when it starts to lock up..." mean? When I was experiencing lockups (in 4.11), the mission would simply lock up out of the blue. There was no 'start' or warning. So, once the mission was locked up, are you saying that following this 'workaround' would unlock the mission?

*Could it be that the person who wrote the 'workaround' instructions MEANT to say '...The only thing I've found that works is to pause BEFORE the mission usually locks up..."....?

Aviar

[yeikov]

Hi Aviar,

Yes, you're right, it's just a temporary (I hope :grin:) "fix" just for offline missions.
I also did not understand the part "when it starts to lock up", for me it happens suddenly too. So the time I tried I just did it at the start of the mission, and as I said I had no lock up.
Maybe just luck, 3 tries are not a very thorough testing... But for my part, I'll include that in my engine start and warm up procedures from now on :)

Y.

[jameson]

Aviar, problem is like when in some missions planes spawn and there is a slight lock up, but it reoccurs at ever decreasing time periods until "applications tried to read memory at xxxxxxxx, memory could not be read" message appears. Thus I pause the game to stop it fully locking up. I have not had the problem onine but then it's been a while since I been online, I did not think this affected online play, but will stand corrected if this is the case. Regards.

[Aviar]

Aviar, problem is like when in some missions planes spawn and there is a slight lock up, but it reoccurs at ever decreasing time periods until "applications tried to read memory at xxxxxxxx, memory could not be read" message appears. Thus I pause the game to stop it fully locking up. I have not had the problem onine but then it's been a while since I been online, I did not think this affected online play, but will stand corrected if this is the case. Regards.

It looks like you are having a different issue than I was having. I never had anything like "...ever decreasing time periods..." or any kind of error messages once my game locked up.

Also, my lockups were occurring online as well as offline, as I host a lot of coop missions.

Aviar

[fabianfred]

Since I recently restarted playing Il2 after a couple of years rest I had to start from scratch. I have two installs. One is 4.11.1 with HSFX 6 and the other is 4.10 with SAS DBW.
I have several of my old favourite missions...all of which are large and what you would call stressfull. They either will not run or get the lock-ups after about 8 minutes into the mission.
This happens on both installs.
I am now using Win7 but previously when they ran OK I was on WinXP and that was with 4.09 and 4.10 and HSFX 5.

[352nd Persecutor]

Well, well, well. I don't spend much time on these forums any more and just ran across this thread; one of our squad members discovered it, probably while researching the lock-up issues we are experiencing. Our squad has a custom build of 4.11.1 and HSFX 6, flies in the AKA on-line war scenarios twice weekly, and experiences what seem to be random lock-ups in the game *all simultaneously", meaning that five or six of us will experience a game freeze at precisely the same moment.

It's maddening, and nothing we've done in trouble-shooting the issue has found the cause. I thought the problem was squad-specific and hence a problem with our game build, but that isn't correct; others in the campaign not in our squad also suffered the freezes and now I see that the problem is more wide-spread. At least I can stop chasing my tail.

I can affirm that 4.11.1 did not fix the problem.

[Freelansir]

Being an old machine code programmer from the early 60's the words that jump out for me are:

"This is why it seems like some sort of paging or memory issue."

With only 8k of memory on a IBM 1401 we experienced a lot of memory constipation.

Its worth looking in this aspect, no matter how much memory, real or virtual paging you have.

[Aviar]

It's been over 7 months since anyone has posted to this thread so I have pretty much forgotten about it. Since it has been 'revised', I'll add just a little bit more info.

Since it was released, I have been playing HSFX-6 pretty much non-stop. HSFX-6 is based on 4.11.1 and it is interesting to note that I have not had any lock-ups at all. I can also load all of the maps in the FMB with no problem.

This is unlike 4.11.1 stock, where I still get the previously mentioned problem of not being able to load some of the bigger maps into the FMB.

I sometimes wondered if possibly the problem might be with my computer...maybe the memory, or something like that. But since HSFX-6 is running flawlessly, I'm inclined to think the issue is with the stock version.

I'm curious as to why the problems arise in the stock game and not in HSFX-6. They are both running version 4.11.1 and in theory should be very similar. Is there something in HSFX-6 that has fixed the issues that I (and others) are having in stock 4.11.1?

Let's see what 4.12 brings to the table.

Aviar

[352nd Persecutor]

Aviar,

No, HSFX 6 hasn't fixed the problem; we experience it using 6. We flew on the vol_Italy_Africa_Greece map without any lockups with the same game build, but when switching to the Western Front maps (native to HSFX 6) we are experiencing the lockups. So one might be tempted to blame the map. However, flying the same mission on the same map off-line = no lockups.

So it's the server? Some folks lock up, others don't, on the same evening. Some lock up simultaneously, others apparently randomly. Were it the server, all would lock up or none would, I would think.

So it's the client machine? Five or six pilots flying in the mission each lock up at precisely the same moment. No, not the client machine.

Beats me, it really does. Like you, we'll wait for 4.12 and hope that whatever is causing this (not in 4.10) doesn't end up migrating to 4.12 also.

[Aviar]

It's been over 7 months since anyone has posted to this thread so I have pretty much forgotten about it. Since it has been 'revised', I'll add just a little bit more info.

Since it was released, I have been playing HSFX-6 pretty much non-stop. HSFX-6 is based on 4.11.1 and it is interesting to note that I have not had any lock-ups at all. I can also load all of the maps in the FMB with no problem.

This is unlike 4.11.1 stock, where I still get the previously mentioned problem of not being able to load some of the bigger maps into the FMB.

I sometimes wondered if possibly the problem might be with my computer...maybe the memory, or something like that. But since HSFX-6 is running flawlessly, I'm inclined to think the issue is with the stock version.

I'm curious as to why the problems arise in the stock game and not in HSFX-6. They are both running version 4.11.1 and in theory should be very similar. Is there something in HSFX-6 that has fixed the issues that I (and others) are having in stock 4.11.1?

Let's see what 4.12 brings to the table.

Aviar


4.12 is finally out so I can post an update. I installed the 4.12 patch and there were no major problems. However, when I tried to load one of the Solomons maps from the FMB, my game froze right there, without even loading the map (see the screenshot). This is what it was doing in 4.11 so I guess the problem is still there for me.

I can play the Solomons map in the QMB with no problems and I can play/host Solomons missions with no problem, but I can't open any Solomons maps from the FMB anymore. As I stated earlier, I have no such problems in HSFX 6, which is based right off of 4.11, so that is something unusual.

Anyway, I do have something else interesting to report. After I realized the same problem was present in 4.12, I decided to try something. I re-installed a clean version of IL-2. I even downloaded 'fresh' patches From Mission4Today, just to be sure.

Everything went smoothly and I patched it up to 4.12. I opened the FMB and tried loading a Solomons map.....and it loaded! I started converting one of my missions to 4.12 and everything looked fine.

All of a sudden, after a couple of days, I again could not load any of the Solomons maps, so I could not resume editing my mission(s). It's been a few days now and I keep trying but no luck. My game freezes up every time I try and load a Solomons map. It's just interesting that it worked fine for a couple of days after a fresh intall of IL-2.

Maybe this info can be of some help to TD, who knows.

Aviar

[JtD]

That's really odd. On the software side, what changed over these couple of days?

FWIW, I just loaded the Solomons maps into my FMB no problem.

[majorfailure]

Problem still present here, too.

Coop on Iasi Map, there are long breaks (10-30 secs), where the game seems to freeze, then most of the time the game continues, but sometimes it crashes altogether. The Il2fb.exe process in Windows Task Manger at these points decreases its memory usage by ~100meg and reduces cpu percentage. If it crashes cpu percentage stays low(0-10%).

Seems to be related to Iasi Map, had a very similar campagin on the Krim map for ~20 missions with no crash and very little breaks ever.
And the load of the Map seems a factor, too, if I add enough flights of planes (40+planes), to get the whole mission stuttering all the time I can get the game to crash almost reliably within ~60 minutes. If I do load the same mission twice, then the game does not crash at the same mission time twice.

[KG26_Alpha]

FWIW, I just loaded the Solomons maps into my FMB no problem.


Same here, even on an old laptop I use solely for editing in FMB, all Solomon maps are fine.

All of my updates are through torrent so the check sums are ok.

[Aviar]

Hold your horses....I may have found the answer to my problem. I still need to do some testing before I post anything.

Stay tuned for developments!

Aviar

[Aviar]

Well, for now, I seemed to have found a workaround for my problem. This is what I did.

I took my Missions folder, which has grown quite large after 12 years of missions (254MB) and replaced it with a 'clean' Missions folder from 4.12. That one is only 142MB. As soon as I did that, I could open any Solomons map in the FMB.

I'm not sure why that was an issue, but I tried it on a hunch and it worked...for now anyway. It's an easy workaround for when when I need it. I even tried adding back my more important missions and it's still working (at 203MB now).

Possibly it's some kind of memory issue. As I stated earlier, I don't have this problem with HSFX 6 and for one thing, I know they have made some core changes to IL-2. For instance, the HSFX il2fb.exe is only 156kb, while the stock 4.12 is 4.33MB.

In any event, I think I have it under control for now so we'll see what happens.

Aviar

[KG26_Alpha]

Well, for now, I seemed to have found a workaround for my problem. This is what I did.

I took my Missions folder, which has grown quite large after 12 years of missions (254MB) and replaced it with a 'clean' Missions folder from 4.12. That one is only 142MB. As soon as I did that, I could open any Solomons map in the FMB.

I'm not sure why that was an issue, but I tried it on a hunch and it worked...for now anyway. It's an easy workaround for when when I need it. I even tried adding back my more important missions and it's still working (at 203MB now).

Possibly it's some kind of memory issue. As I stated earlier, I don't have this problem with HSFX 6 and for one thing, I know they have made some core changes to IL-2. For instance, the HSFX il2fb.exe is only 156kb, while the stock 4.12 is 4.33MB.

In any event, I think I have it under control for now so we'll see what happens.

Aviar


I don't see that as being an issue unless you have other problems as mines nearly a 1 gig in size.


The only people I know online who have problems with the Solomons map, joining a CooP,
were those who had messed up installations or problematic PC's and that's with HSFX 6


If there were any memory leaks there would be more reports of problems with the map IMHO, unless you meant on your PC.
.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v119/alpha1/missionspics_zpse797f74a.png (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/alpha1/media/missionspics_zpse797f74a.png.html)



I wonder if some investigation into performance of your system when it locks up to find the root cause of the problem,
it's strange the HSFX v Stock comparison though as it makes no sense removing a few mission files allows the map to open !!


Good luck.





.

[Aviar]

Alpha,

Yea, it's a strange situation. I really shouldn't make any speculations at all because I have no clue what could be causing my issue.

As I stated before, I don't have any 'problems' with Solomons maps/missions. I can play/host any Solomons mission as well as use the Solomons map in the QMB. The only issue I have (had) is actually LOADING a Solomons map/mission into the FMB. This is where my game would freeze before the map would even load. I would need to exit to my desktop and shut down the game from there.

As far as having a 'problematic' computer, I guess that's always a possibility. However, consider the fact that I have no such issues loading Solomoms maps/missions in HSFX 6. As you know, To create a working version of HSFX 6, you need a clean install of 4.11 and then add your HSFX mods/files on top of that. So basically, HSFX 6 is just a souped-up version of 4.11.

Yet, my 'Solomons' issue started with stock 4.11 (and now continues with stock 4.12). Common sense may tell you that a 'problematic' computer would cause this issue to be present in both stock and HSFX versions. However, that is not the case. This is why I keep reporting any findings I come across. Maybe someone can one day come up with an answer.

In my own little world, I'm happy that I have at least found a workaround. A 'workaround' does not mean that the problem has been identified. It's simply a temporary solution to sidestep the problem until it gets correctly identified.

I know I was kind of pointing to the fact that MY Missions folder was so large and maybe that might be a clue. That seemed like a logical assumption, but after looking at YOUR missions folder (which is almost 4 times larger), maybe size can be ruled out. However, maybe there is something in MY Missions folder (but not in YOUR Missions folder) that may be the culprit. Then again, I used the same Missions folder with my HSFX 6 and I had no problems there.....so confusing.

I've run out of things to say, but thanks for at least being concerned.

Aviar

[KG26_Alpha]

One test would be to move the problematic mission folder to another stable IL2 v4.12 machine and try to break the FMB that way.







.

[Aviar]

One test would be to move the problematic mission folder to another stable IL2 v4.12 machine and try to break the FMB that way.

Nothing wrong with that test except I really think one greater question needs to be answered first: Why do I have the issue in 4.11 and 4.12 stock and not in HSFX 6 (which is based on 4.11). This is using the same Missions folder on the same computer.

To me, that is where the real answer lies, don't you think?

EDIT: Since I had some time I tried what you suggested. I have an available laptop so I transferred a copy of IL-2 onto that. I ran the game and I have the exact same issue there. I can't load a Solomons map with the FMB using my 'big' Missions folder. When I try loading from a 'clean' 4.12 Missions folder, I can load any Solomons map.

Comments?

Aviar

[KG26_Alpha]

Nothing wrong with that test except I really think one greater question needs to be answered first: Why do I have the issue in 4.11 and 4.12 stock and not in HSFX 6 (which is based on 4.11). This is using the same Missions folder on the same computer.

To me, that is where the real answer lies, don't you think?

EDIT: Since I had some time I tried what you suggested. I have an available laptop so I transferred a copy of IL-2 onto that. I ran the game and I have the exact same issue there. I can't load a Solomons map with the FMB using my 'big' Missions folder. When I try loading from a 'clean' 4.12 Missions folder, I can load any Solomons map.

Comments?

Aviar

The question to ask your self is why is it only you having this FMB specific problem ?

Process of elimination would be adding missions from the 250 mb missions folder to the v4.12 directory untill FMB locks up send me the folders to see if it locks up mine also ?

Also

When was
Recent Missions
Introduced to the FMB ?

Maybe some things checking the missions list and getting confused with folder file name extensions in there.

[JtD]

But why does it matter when you load a clean map? And is it only Solomons, do all others work fine?

[Extreme_One]

In the interest of finding the cause of this I have a proposal for finding the cause.

Open Missions folder and rename all the folders inside by adding _TEST to the end of the folder name

Start IL2 4.12 and load Solomon Map in FMB - presumably the map will load and the test can continue.

Then Close IL2 and rename the Campaign_TEST folder back to Campaign and Start IL2 4.12 and load Solomon Map in FMB

If all is well, stop IL2 and rename the Net_TEST folder back to Net and Start IL2 4.12 and load Solomon Map in FMB


ETC. ETC. You get the drift.

Once your game locks up you will know which folder contains the rogue file(s) and the process of elimination can begin inside that folder.

I'll be interested to know any outcome.

[Aviar]

It's ok guys. I found a workaround and I'm fine with that. I'm enjoying 4.12 and that's what is important.

Aviar

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

And what did you do then exactly?

[Aviar]

And what did you do then exactly?

I already posted that information a couple of days ago so I won't put people to sleep repeating myself.

Aviar

[KU_Rigamortis]

I get the same IL-2 failure to respond with the Solomon's map. Running a rather large (126kb) dogfight mission and testing in FMB using 2x, 4x, and 8x acceleration to verify sequencing of AI.

I can exit out of FMB and back to the main IL-2 screen, but when I then click any other screen button, I get a second mouse pointer and a blue spinning circle. IL-2 never responds beyond this point and I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL to exit.