Do you think they could literally smell the flak?

[SpecialCake]

On one of my particular early flight lessons, while doing touch and go's, I noticed that during one particular portion of the pattern, I noticed the distinct smell of a backyard barbeque. At first I thought I must be mistaken, but after several touch and go's, it was definitely there. The fourth time, after actively searching (and admittedly flying lower out of curiousity), there was indeed smoke rising above that particular spot in a residential area, with what certainly could have been a BBQ get-together (it is still hard to tell particulars even at a couple hundred feet.)

I asked my flight instructor about this and he agreed that this was indeed the case of simple physics - the smoke was rising and the smell along with it. He told me about a similiar instance when flying on the 4th of July.

So my question would be, do you think when flying among clouds of flak, that it has a distinct smell? I'm sure it makes a (usually faint) popping sound of some sort, but I would think that perhaps to the radio operator or navigator who isn't looking outside the entire time, the occurence of flak might initially make itself known by it's smell.


What do you think?

[SpecialCake]

Oh, and in case anyone is interested, my curiousity was aroused by this unusually interesting narrative written by a Stuka pilot -
http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/thefgmforum/showthread.php?25-Stukas-v-Soviet-Fleet

[Blackdog_kt]

I obviously don't have personal experience of it, but it seems possible under certain conditions. If you combine the distinct smell of chemicals they used back then (like cordite) with the volume of fire that was present in certain occasions, it could create a situation where invisible chemical particles covered entire cubic miles of the sky after being dispersed by thousands of flak shells bursting in the vicinity.

Whether one could smell the flak or not in such a case would depend on how high the concentration of these chemicals was in the air at the given time.

[Novotny]

I've read of bomber crew smelling it. God knows in what book, possibly 'Bomber Boys' by Patrick Bishop.

[Les]

Interesting read, swore out loud when he said how low he pulled out of that dive.

I have little doubt the flak could be smelled under the right conditions. It just makes sense that if air was getting into your plane, and the flak residue was in the air, there it'd be. If there was enough of it and you flew through it the only reason I can think why you wouldn't smell it is if there was some even stronger smell closer to you. As I imagine there often would have been. Poor buggers.

I too have a vague sense of having read or heard about bomber crews noting the smell of the flak they were flying through, but I can more clearly remember reading about or seeing a video in which a modern day A-10 (?) pilot mentioned the smell from his own guns he was firing on strafing runs. Admittedly those things spew out a lot of fire, but I think it's a good indication that if a pilot of a modern aircraft can smell that, pilots flying through flak barrages could probably smell what was outside in the air as well.

Anyway, thanks for the link to the story, it's not an aspect of the war that one's reminded of very often, especially not from the point of view of someone who was actually there taking part in it.

[Strike]

I read somewhere a Mustang pilot dipped down over berlin to pursue a german fighter towards the end of the war, he noted he could smell the stench of dead bodies from the devastated city. Can't find the reference, might have actually read it in a book.

I think it's quite obvious that if an aircraft uses ram-air or outside air it would be noteable. As long as the crew keeps their masks on, they should be fed by the oxygen tanks, which, unless someone at the re-fill station is doing a practical joke, should smell like air. If a bomber dropped to lower level, i still believe that the dominant smell would be of aviation gas or fuel. Distinguishing cordite smell from gas/fuel is hard. They don't smell the same at all, but the fuel sure dampens your smelling-sense, at least JP-8 does it :p

My jet once had a small electrical fire and I didn't smell it until after shutdown. Turned out some wires had short-circuited, arcing and caused the isolator to burn, releasing a smoke-puff of foul smelling burnt plastic.

[SpecialCake]

Oh but don't you become so addicted to that smell of aviation fuel?


YEAH OUR GAS HAS LEAD IN IT, SO WHAT? :rolleyes:

[Tree_UK]

I remember watching a documentary where bomber crew said that they could smell the cordite from the flak. How those young lads got into those aircraft every night is beyond belief.

[SQB]

Oh but don't you become so addicted to that smell of aviation fuel?


YEAH OUR GAS HAS LEAD IN IT, SO WHAT? :rolleyes:


mmm, mmm. Put it in a can and spray it around the house :grin:

[Feathered_IV]

A Typhoon pilot at Falaise mentioned that the smell of dead bodies was very distinct as he flew sorties in the area. An Il-2 pilot who strafed a troop column also said that his aircraft had large quantities of blood, flesh and bits of uniform stuck to it afterwards.

[SlipBall]

Oh but don't you become so addicted to that smell of aviation fuel?


YEAH OUR GAS HAS LEAD IN IT, SO WHAT? :rolleyes:



I am curious if your name has a connection to pipe tobacco, sometimes referred to as special cake.

[SpecialCake]

None. I used to be into drugs and having the initials KK, always went by SpecialK. Having grown out of that and not wanting to be identified as such, I found Special Cake to be an appropriately similiar, and hilarious replacement.


I have never heard of such a thing. To the Googlenator!

[Novotny]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8dBo-GcrXU

[mazex]

When I learnt to fly gliders many years ago there was a crematorium close to the field with a rather high smoke stack. The days when it was in use you cloud get a weak thermal close to the downwind sector flying at 200-400 meters and a distinctive smell of burnt hair could be noticed... Really unpleasant but I'm sure the stories from the pilots talking about the smell of corpses is true when flying low with mask off.

[BigPickle]

Thats a good point, at altitude I dont think they could smell the flak as they would be wearing oxygen masks. I know the germans used throat mic's so I guess they would have had a choice if they were at a lower altitude as to wether they wore them. But the RAF had the mic set in the oxygen mask so they would have to wear them if they wished to be able to communicate without using a hand to raise the mask to their mouth i presume.

[Sternjaeger]

yeah, it would be hard to smell odours from the outside when wearing an oxygen mask, not impossible, but hard. B-17 crews always talked about the pungent smell of cordite when in the thick of the battle, but then again they had some 20 .50 cals shooting, so you expect some of that acrid smell to come through the masks.

My humble experience is surely less glorious, but I happened to fly over areas with fires or more recently on fields covered in fresh manure, and trust me, you can smell that from up to 1000ft :shock: Smells tend to get more faint as u go higher, both for dispersion from winds and the rarefied air, but if the source is consistent you'd be surprised by what you can smell ;)

[SpecialCake]

That was my revelation as well. It is amazing how far up smells seem to travel. They certainly seem to disperse over a longer distance vertically than horizontally. You can smell things from altitudes that you just would not be able to were it the same distance from you across the ground.

[SpecialCake]

That bit about cake was awesome. I thought it was serious at first.

[Novotny]

Puking up your pelvic bone IS pretty serious.

[gflinch]

Maybe this isn't quit the same, but there are certain times in the summer when there is roadkill that you can smell for miles away (usually bloated dear), even when driving, so I don't know if it would be different in a plane with disbursement being larger..