How to win a no loss impossible game?

[Alexanderqtk]

I'm a newbie and I've just finished hard difficulty with Paladin class.Now I want to win a no loss impossble with class Warrior.I need some guides please.Would anybody help me?

[Minecontrol]

Use level 4 and 5 units if possible (though early on use inquisitors), get the Royal Thorns ASAP. Ranged creatures + one support unit (Archmages are nice for magic shield + they can do massive ranged damage when in Trance), 1 or 2 resurrectors (Inquisitors early then highmages, Paladins) and your tank who would ideally be a dragon :grin:, but you may have to use Royal Griffons or something instead... This is a good system.

On Dragon, get treasure search and Crushing blow ASAP and keep them balanced so you will have enough rage to use them.

If you really must then kite (run around dangerous monsters) to thieve treasure and flags.

In Mage tree aim for Order and Distortion as soon as possible, keep an eye out for phantom, heal, stoneskin and resurrection.

That's just a little general advice, it's hard to know how to advise because you are vague on specifics. Every battle has a way in the game (though in general many find the first island one of the most challenging phases of the game).

[Alexanderqtk]

Thanks.I've just run around and got lv10 now.I've 2 Emeral DR and some paladins.Should i use both for tanker?Should i use orcs or elves for ranged attackers.I don't find out a lot of Archmages,so what units can be replaced?

[Minecontrol]

Thanks.I've just run around and got lv10 now.I've 2 Emeral DR and some paladins.Should i use both for tanker?Should i use orcs or elves for ranged attackers.I don't find out a lot of Archmages,so what units can be replaced?

Stoneskinned Emeralds make excellent tanks (but reds do even better if u can get them), use those. You almost never have to use your paladins to do damage, they are for resurrection.

There should be archmages sold at the lighthouse like mage academy on the first island, also on the tiny graveyard island in the pirate place.

I would probably stick with orcs (adrenaline) but to be honest, i don't know... Never used either of those much.

[Alexanderqtk]

There are 4 archmages only!!!What should i do with them ?

[atlatea]

There are 2 major ways, one is map kiting, the other is no map kiting.

With map kiting, just kite all the way to elon/nameless. Pick all leadership, altars, etc. And do quests that doesn't require fighting. From this point, it is up to you (which unit/artifacts/spells/etc you want to use), no loss impossible should be piece of cake.

The other one, no map kiting, this one is harder. Though the hardest part is the first four island (debir, scarlet, bolo, rusty). After you finish those four islands, you arrive at verona, from this point, things are much much easier, and it is up to you.

But i'd give you the easiest way to pass the four island without map kiting. As for unit setup and spells to use, try looking on other threads, i believe many peoples already post their advice.

But the main goal for easiest way to pass the first four islands is getting call of colosus scroll by the time you arrive at scarlet or if that is not possible, by the time you arrive at bolo. Then try to reach 2k leadership for mage, and 2500 leadership for warrior and paladin, keep use that scroll till you get red dragon (for mage) or black dragon (for warrior and paladin).

Then dump all your units, except repair droids and guard droids. With that unit, the four island should be very easy to clear.

And for that 4 archmage, just buy 1, trust me, buying more than 1 is harder to resurect, and there is no difference beetwen 1 or bilions of archmage in case of magic shield, and you need archmage mainly for its magic shield.

[Alexanderqtk]

I couldn't find any "Call of colosus" scrolls.It's very very hard to fight in the first two islands: no money,no leadeship...and the monters is too crowded especially the horseman hero.
I started a new game with kiting and got lv 15 but in Verona the monters are very strong.I use bowmen,inquisitors,paladins and Emeral GD but can't win any no loss fights.Plz tell me which units should i use?( Elehnel is may companion)

[atlatea]

Well, you need to replay some of your battles if not most untill your dragon dig a call of colosus.

Not all enemies must be killed asap by the time you arrive on an island. Some enemies are meant to be left untill you reach much higher lv.

Example is the horsemen hero you mentioned, you need at least a red dragon to succesfully kill him without loses if you want to kill him before you advance to rusty anchor or bolo.

If you don't mind traveling forth and back beetwen island, i mean you don't care about the days you spent to finish the game which affect your final score, the faster you finish the game, the higher the score, just use 1 emerald dragon you acquired from rusty anchor and have adrenalin 3 skill (Paladin skill tree), as for spells you must have stone skin 3 or divine armor 3 or both, healing 3, fear 1 or fear 2, oil mist 2 or oil mist 3

Another easy way is to use 1 emerald green dragon, repair droids split to 2 stacks, guard droids. As for spells, it is the same as above, but add target 3, slow 2, haste 2 or 3 to that list of spells. You already use 4 of your 5 slots, 4 slots is usually enough, but if you want to use full slots the final slot is up to you, though i suggest a lv 5 unit especially another dragons (red or black).

After you unlock montero, things will become much much easier, so from this point it's up to you .

[Metathron]

Well, you need to replay some of your battles if not most untill your dragon dig a call of colosus.

These kind of dull, repetitive techniques are the reason why kiting for me is by far the more preferable option than going from island to island in a linear order as the developers had intended. Difficulty is badly scaled and it's no wonder many players have found even the Normal difficulty to be anything but. Something for Katauri to mull over for the next KB game, if ever there is one.

I can understand why some players refuse to kite - it feels like cheating. But there's a thin line between that and reloading xx times to get a level 5 creature of your choice.

[ckdamascus]

These kind of dull, repetitive techniques are the reason why kiting for me is by far the more preferable option than going from island to island in a linear order as the developers had intended. Difficulty is badly scaled and it's no wonder many players have found even the Normal difficulty to be anything but. Something for Katauri to mull over for the next KB game, if ever there is one.

I can understand why some players refuse to kite - it feels like cheating. But there's a thin line between that and reloading xx times to get a level 5 creature of your choice.

I am fairly sure kiting to some degree was FULLY intended.

If not, why do they offer boats for sale so you can bail yourself out of a bad situation?

[Zechnophobe]

There is another route, that involves just making correct and good use of troops and strategy. I recently just walked a friend through a no loss impossible victory over the Verona Map guardian on Scarlet Wind, for example.

A few Points:

1) No Loss really is the hardest for the first 4 islands in general, and then boss fights and/or hero fights. You should be able to handle most monsters after about level 20 or so without losses, and without lots of reloading.
2) You will need to generate SOME insurmountable game advantage. These can take the form of an over-leveled army, early level 5 units, a very strong unit combination, or a lucky item combination.
3) To keep units alive in the 'tough' fight you either need an invulnerability plan (Stone Skin + Divine armor + target, or something) or a resurrection strategy (Droids, inquisitors + Phantom + Mana Accel)

None of this REQUIRES that you map kite, or that you replay battles until you can Call Colossus. Those are simply very 'easy' ways to get there. Some good strategy will also work.

For example, look at the big bad armies in the game. I recently defeated the Lethal stack on Scarlet Wind to get the Verona map, with no losses. The enemy forces consisted of: 1 stack of Assassins, two stacks of pirates, one stack of Sea Dogs, 1 stack of Fire Spiders.

My Army was Beholders, 1 Green Dragon (from rusty), Cyclops, Paladins, and Royal Snakes. Playing a Mage, and substantially outnumbered. So what did I do?

First, I chugged a rage potion before combat. This added to the little bit I had left over from a previous fight.
Second, I made liberal use of a tier 2 mystic Egg (level 1 to 4 units). Mystic Egg creates stacks of decent size and utility, and when they die, they generate substantial rage, allowing you to keep rage going.
Third, I used Trap to trick the enemy Assassin's into getting stuck on my side of the battlefield. Combined with Slow on the next turn, and a little careful unit placement, and I kept the enemy off of me for the first two turns, only taking one hit from the assassin's against the cyclops.
Fourth, Liberal use of 'slow' at level 1 or 2, depending.

Overall though, what was the strategy used? Control. Determine which stacks you need to 'hold' or weaken, and do so. Use summons to keep hits of your stacks, simplify the board (slow, eggs, etc) to make placement of units easier. Then never give the enemy a chance to fight.

Know what is good against what else. Cast target at level 1 on your cyclopse to get enemy bowmen to shoot it. Since they must attack it, they will ignore their special abilities, and the high physical resistance of the Cyclops will keep it alive for the turn you get. Then near end of turn, drop an egg (two if you are a mage with dragon call) near them to keep them busy the following turn, and unable to shoot.

Anyhow, hope this helps, and good luck.

[atlatea]

Zechnophobe pretty much cover all of it.

Yeah generally KB is knowing what you have (units, spells, pet dragon, items at your disposal) and what enemy have, then figure a way to defeat them.


As for kiting, i do kiting but not map kiting.

My reason for no map kiting is not because i feel cheating, to me it's because map kiting=more days to finish the game. I care about the final score :), and map kiting=more wasting time due island jump. The best time waster is the island jump.

Anyway, not all enemy must be killed in an island after you unlock that island, in fact most invincible enemies are to be left untill you go to that island again in your next loop(s), yeah the key to no map kiting is knowing the right island loops, right island loop is all that matters for no map kiting fast game run/walkthrough.

There are no downside for no map kiting especially if that is a blind game run (no KBScaner used) unless you do no loss no map kiting, in this, your unit choices are very very limited.

[ckdamascus]

There is another route, that involves just making correct and good use of troops and strategy. I recently just walked a friend through a no loss impossible victory over the Verona Map guardian on Scarlet Wind, for example.

A few Points:

2) You will need to generate SOME insurmountable game advantage. These can take the form of an over-leveled army, early level 5 units, a very strong unit combination, or a lucky item combination.
3) To keep units alive in the 'tough' fight you either need an invulnerability plan (Stone Skin + Divine armor + target, or something) or a resurrection strategy (Droids, inquisitors + Phantom + Mana Accel)

None of this REQUIRES that you map kite, or that you replay battles until you can Call Colossus. Those are simply very 'easy' ways to get there. Some good strategy will also work.


Mostly true, but not always true. You said it didn't require a map kite, but what if the Rusty Map was not out in the open?

Would you consider the "juking" (or kiting as you guys call it), of Zug zag or whatever to get the emerald dragon unfair?

It can sometimes be hard to get enough leadership at times to control the Emerald Dragon.

You might not have ANY of the good control spells you speak of at that point in time. What if trap doesn't spawn? What if stone skin doesn't spawn? Restart the entire game or kite a map?

What if you don't get a + rage fountain so you need to use up points in might tree to raise the maximum rage instead of Anger?

What if you don't get a good unit mixture to help you achieve this due to bad luck? About the only guaranteed units are Rune Mages, Cyclops, and Emerald Dragon.

Perhaps most people do not exhaust all of the options as your strategy is sound.

I've pulled victory from the jaws of defeat a few times just by retrying different strategies.

However, there are definitely times where especially for a mage, you CAN end up stuck. (well, for no-loss).

[Alexanderqtk]

Thanks for all of your advice!!! I myself think carefulll that i will finish this game with kiting once first.Next time i'll do as you said.Thanks again!

[atlatea]

To make it clear, getting call of colosus by replaying battle is for no map kiting no loss 7 days run. You desperately need red dragon or black dragon for 7 days run. If you just do no map kiting no loss, there is no need for early call of colosus. And it is very possible with non random element of the game.

Basically it's like this (crap i'm writing this over and over again):
1. Debir: use 4 stack of 1 inquisitor untill this doesn't work anymore. Then switch to royal thorn, royal snake, orc tracker, 2 stack of inquisitor. Then clear all debir except the hero at old castle.

2. Scarlet: Unit setup is the same, possible to clear most of enemies there except some of them, unless you have red dragon (not possible to have black dragon because it's impossible to reach 2500 leadership by the end of scarlet, even as a warrior, unless you're very very lucky to have 2 or 3 leadership items). Left all enemies that is too impossible to kill. Buy 1 rune mage as this will be your main tank in bolo, left all your unit except 1 archmage and probably inquisitor.

3. Bolo: Buy droids and kill most of enemies there, hardest to clear: A barbarian hero next to chieft house and verona guard, but it's possible. And easily possible if you have red or black dragon.

4. Rusty: if you have black dragons, easily possible to kill all except perhaps the hardest map guardian (probably dersu or umkas or tekron map, i forgot about this).

5. Verona: up to you

All of the above are done without relying on random element of the game, all the units i mentioned always spawn. The only thing you need that probably won't spawn is stone skin and healing spell which spawn most of the time.


@ckdamascus
Yeah, i agree with you mostly.

But, you can get rust map from bolo, possible to be done with no loss using droids, rune mage, 1 archmage, stone skin and heal.

As for stone skin and heal not spawn, that's the most problematic problem, but most of the time they spawn.

I think you need at least 15 rage and 15 mana to survive early 4 islands. Sometimes you are indeed forced to lv up the rage increase skill, though indeed anger is better.

Yeah, there is a possibility of stuck. But that rarely happens, except for blind game. In blind game, you'll often stuck if you don't do scouting to see what's available in the next island.


None of this REQUIRES that you map kite, or that you replay battles until you can Call Colossus. Those are simply very 'easy' ways to get there. Some good strategy will also work.

For example, look at the big bad armies in the game. I recently defeated the Lethal stack on Scarlet Wind to get the Verona map, with no losses. The enemy forces consisted of: 1 stack of Assassins, two stacks of pirates, one stack of Sea Dogs, 1 stack of Fire Spiders.

My Army was Beholders, 1 Green Dragon (from rusty), Cyclops, Paladins, and Royal Snakes. Playing a Mage, and substantially outnumbered

There is 1 EGD in scarlet wind battle. Either you got unguarded rusty anchor map or do map kite or you left the verona map guard at scarlet untill you have enough lvs, skills, etc and get EGD in rusty then back to scarlet.

But then again, the fact remain the same, all of those require several island jumps which is super waste of time for 7 days run. So you're stuck to call of colosus spell. Call of colosus is for 7 days run, otherwise, forget it.

[ckdamascus]

To make it clear, getting call of colosus by replaying battle is for no map kiting no loss 7 days run. You desperately need red dragon or black dragon for 7 days run. If you just do no map kiting no loss, there is no need for early call of colosus. And it is very possible with non random element of the game.

@ckdamascus
Yeah, i agree with you mostly.

But, you can get rust map from bolo, possible to be done with no loss using droids, rune mage, 1 archmage, stone skin and heal.

As for stone skin and heal not spawn, that's the most problematic problem, but most of the time they spawn.

I think you need at least 15 rage and 15 mana to survive early 4 islands. Sometimes you are indeed forced to lv up the rage increase skill, though indeed anger is better.

Yeah, there is a possibility of stuck. But that rarely happens, except for blind game. In blind game, you'll often stuck if you don't do scouting to see what's available in the next island.


But then again, the fact remain the same, all of those require several island jumps which is super waste of time for 7 days run. So you're stuck to call of colosus spell. Call of colosus is for 7 days run, otherwise, forget it.

You are right. That's another thing that is annoying, that for me to win with the rag-tag army, I have to jump around quite a bit.

Yes, getting stuck is a bit more rare as most people probably don't try all the combinations out. And as you said, sometimes to try all the combinations, will take up a lot of valuable "game time" and proper planning. Oops, you over did Mana Acceleration, now you can't cast it once. Oh you thought you'd be doing a damage mage? Oops, you really should have pushed for Order instead for healing level 3. <grumbles>

Oooh the best part was when I had such a gung-ho army idea with a great saved game that had the items I wanted, that I just went guns blazing, until I realized one horrible thing.

Stoneskin was not available. Scanner says ZERO Stoneskin. I was like.... uh.... you got to be kidding me. I mean, who checks for freakin Stoneskin?

I DID dig one up mid-game though, but wow, that made for some interesting times before I got it. Haha.

[Metathron]

I am fairly sure kiting to some degree was FULLY intended.

If not, why do they offer boats for sale so you can bail yourself out of a bad situation?

That's what running away is for. :) And of course kiting is in there on purpose, it's not made possible (though seemingly unmovable guards) by accident.

[Zechnophobe]

That's what running away is for. :) And of course kiting is in there on purpose, it's not made possible (though seemingly unmovable guards) by accident.

I would say there is a huge difference between luring away 'immovable' guards, and simply dodging past people. The latter is a pretty normal part of the game, no matter how you cut it. Some just do it to a greater extent than others. I'd say it is a good skill to have under your belt.

[Minecontrol]

That's what running away is for. :) And of course kiting is in there on purpose, it's not made possible (though seemingly unmovable guards) by accident.

Is kiting simply going around monsters that are blocking your way (leading them up the garden path, so to speak) or is it specifically just getting map guardians to move so you can take the map?

[Minecontrol]

3. Bolo: Buy droids and kill most of enemies there, hardest to clear: A barbarian hero next to chieft house and verona guard, but it's possible. And easily possible if you have red or black dragon.

I just cleared that on imposs, no loss with 4k leadership (and only a weak stoneskin as my only spell asset).

I must admit i am pretty proud because one of the enemies had around 3x my leadership (the map guardian).

This is the first time i used droids and they're are amazing, it's like an inbuilt resurrection thing going on, combined with engineers.

I found an excellent combination, using Shamans and Engineers, Engineer's bomb attack is terrific, and the use of totems makes it better - suppose you have a group of enemies near each other but not touching, plank a totem between them and get your engineer to target it which connects the group allowing you to blind more of them.

[atlatea]

Is kiting simply going around monsters that are blocking your way (leading them up the garden path, so to speak) or is it specifically just getting map guardians to move so you can take the map?

Generally kiting= map kiting.

Non map kiting is a pretty normal part of the game, just like Zechnophobe said above.

Most people that doesn't do map kiting usually aim for the fastest run, days affect final score.

If you ask whether map kiting is illegal or not, it is relative (up to individual perception). I personally aim for the fastest run, so i don't do map kiting.

[jake21]

Well I just finished my no-loss mage impossible game; sadly i'm still only finding 92 quests so somewhere there is one quest I've not seen. I'd post it but the game time was not impressive. The only real pia fight was for the stone in Reha. The only kitting was grabbing the amulet early for the first stone and leadership boost early.

pops were rather awful this game so I mostly used royal thorns which turned out to work well. The mage tower was a bit of a pia because the only level 4+ troup that was available was black unicorn (not sure if the troops there are random). My strategy was to use fear on priest/inquistor so I only had two stacks (paladin and unicorns) for fighting but it turned out ok.