Friday 2010-10-15 Dev. update and Discussion

[Oleg Maddox]

Today, as I told already in a topic of 2010-10-08 - small update on a previous build.
Just 5 screen shots.
Anyway I think someone will find interesting new details.

[Schallmoser]

GREAT!! Thanks very much Oleg,
I like the terrain very much, it seems as if we will be able to properly detect landmarks and ground targets very well!


PS: I'm the first!!!

[BP_Tailspin]

Thanks Oleg.

[Oleg Maddox]

GREAT!! Thanks very much

PS: I'm the first!!!

No, the first was me :)

[ECV56_LeChuck]

Oleg!! Thanks for the screens!! The IAs "bla bla" seems a lot better and much more informative!!

Question: New ground textures?

[Romanator21]

No, the first was me

You sly dog, you ;)

Nice update - the communications look out of this world!

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg!! Thanks for the screens!! The IAs "bla bla" seems a lot better and much more informative!!

Question: New ground textures?

The speech is totally different. The new generator.

textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC :):):)
And yes... still not final :):):):):)
You should wait for final looking ground :):):)

[1.JaVA_Jojo]

Dammit!

I don't even get bronze!

Fantastic screens and great! Now you can order individual attacks!

Never seen that:grin:

[Old_Canuck]

Fifth .. if we count Oleg :-)

edit: two got here before I could post. Do you people ever sleep?

[SlipBall]

Wow, great shot's, the coast line looks very nice as well... In my mind I was second reply 2...I'm in before all the whining has begun :grin:

[Hecke]

Good shots.

Am I right in believing that the machine on which the screens were taken was not that good?


Oleg, are you building a new build for special reason?

[Flying Pencil]

Today, as I told already in a topic of 2010-10-08 - small update on a previous build.
Just 5 screen shots.
Anyway I think someone will find interesting new details.

Still better then a cup of coffee! :D

[easytarget3]

hello, great detail!!! even in the radio chatter,it looks like we will have much greater interaction with AI during the flight.thanks

[Spi]

Every week the game looks better!

[Schallmoser]

:grin:

[julien673]

Oleg!! Thanks for the screens!! The IAs "bla bla" seems a lot better and much more informative!!

Question: New ground textures?

Terrain look great, and the fire from the first pics :) :) :)

DX11 ? ?? ? on some shoot

tks :)

[Oleg Maddox]

Good shots.

Am I right in believing that the machine on which the screens were taken was not that good?


Oleg, are you building a new build for special reason?

Yes, but I should or can't tell for which :):):)

[Biggs Su-2]

Oleg :)

From Pic one. In text did axis fighter pilots say also 'Tally ho'? I always thought it came from English aristocracy, from fox hunting element?

Towns looking great!

S

[Oleg Maddox]

terrain look great, and the fire from the first pics :) :) :)

dx11 ? ?? ? On some shoot

tks :)

dx10

[Schallmoser]

No, the first was me :)

:grin::grin::grin:

[mr71mb0]

The speech is totally different. The new generator.

textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC :):):)
And yes... still not final :):):):):)
You should wait for final looking ground :):):)

Thanks Oleg for taking the effort to post.

Which DX version were these shots from?

[julien673]

Yes, but I should or can't tell for which :):):)

but which colour ? ? .. Gold ? ;)

[Antoninus]

Finally sharp terrain textures from altitude! Cities and their background look excellent, neat little details like street lamps. For the best looking terrain screenshots so far.

[ECV56_LeChuck]

Thanks for the answer Oleg!! Have a nice Weekend!

[mr71mb0]

Thanks Oleg for taking the effort to post.

Which DX version were these shots from?

Sorry, quick posts while I was typing.

Forgot to say that it looks very good. Very high scenery density, loving the clouds too.

Thanks.

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg :)

From Pic one. In text did axis fighter pilots say also 'Tally ho'? I always thought it came from English aristocracy, from fox hunting element?

Towns looking great!

S

In German language they speaks other. Its a "traslation" of German speech

If you remember In Il-2 Germans ware saying sometime the word Scheise.... but it wasn't traslated directly in English or Russian, or any other language that were supporting later in Il-2 :):):)

[speculum jockey]

Oleg: Is it possible to land the aircraft in a typical field and then take off again like in IL-2, or are players going to be limited to airstrips and possibly roadways? Do different ground areas allow for different surface types? I remember a pic of a spitfire in a wheat field, but has that changed?

Another thing, that first picture got me thinking, can ordinance blow up due to the aircraft being on fire? Say your bomber is on fire, you do a landing that leaves it intact, can on-board bombs explode if the aircraft continues to burn? Or do all aircraft burn the IL-2 way? (burn->explode)

[Avimimus]

I really love the lighting and the hints at the advanced (formation level!!!) AI. I can't describe how impressed I am.

Will it be possible to edit AI? Or is that still a complete unknown?

P.S. Will it be possible to add some transparency to the edges of the smaller tree LoDs? This doesn't matter in the current shots, but under some lighting conditions it could make a big difference (keeping them from looking like cut outs with solid edges.

[Omphalos]

Wow terrain/buildings look awesome Oleg!

I see varying elevations in the terrain, looks a lot better!

Can't wait till next week!

Thanks Oleg! Have a good weekend. =)

[Flanker35M]

S!

Thank you for the update. Nice things to be seen..One of Hurricanes has chipped paint where the other looks new. Tear & Wear at work maybe?

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg: Is it possible to land the aircraft in a typical field and then take off again like in IL-2, or are players going to be limited to airstrips and possibly roadways? Do different ground areas allow for different surface types? I remember a pic of a spitfire in a wheat field, but has that changed?

Another thing, that first picture got me thinking, can ordinance blow up due to the aircraft being on fire? Say your bomber is on fire, you do a landing that leaves it intact, can on-board bombs explode if the aircraft continues to burn? Or do all aircraft burn the IL-2 way? (burn->explode)

Lets wait for these answers when I will know all details of release version (what is and what was removed temporary)

[Tte. Costa]

The speech is totally different. The new generator.

textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC :):):)
And yes... still not final :):):):):)
You should wait for final looking ground :):):)

Amazing!

[mr71mb0]

Shot 2 looks photo realistic to me. It almost could be a photo. :-)

[dduff442]

This game is going to be legendary.

[Dano]

Is that a golf course I see? :)

[mungee]

Oleg :)

From Pic one. In text did axis fighter pilots say also 'Tally ho'? I always thought it came from English aristocracy, from fox hunting element?

Towns looking great!

S

I'm pretty sure that "tally ho" was commonly used by RAF pilots in WWII when about to engage the enemy.

Oleg - brilliant shots - the sea textures are 100%!!! - I reckon the fire in the first screenshot (the Blenheim?) is fantastic/perfect! And of course, the sun reflecting off perspex etc is awesome! Thanks for the update!

[Affe]

wow nice!

[zakkandrachoff]

i hate so much that red arrows°!!!!
the screenshots is exacttly that i was expecting! very nice. is a shine the extra exported jpg. very pixelated!

nice small updaatee mr Mddx

[Biggs Su-2]

In German language they speaks other. Its a "traslation" of German speech

If you remember In Il-2 Germans ware saying sometime the word Scheise.... but it wasn't traslated directly in English or Russian, or any other language that were supporting later in Il-2 :):):)

Ah understand now :)

If you remember In Il-2 Germans ware saying sometime the word Scheise....

So that'd be the diplomatic translation, eh? ;) :)

New clouds look very good also!

S

[kedrednael]

verry nice.
Is this a different season?
the map looks less colourfull than in previous updates, espacially compared to the beautiful aircraft.
Maybe it's because of the altitude, or tod.
You can see more details in the ground. :)
I like the radio chatter from the AI, but I think I will go to the conf.ini and turn the subtitles of :-P
incredible little details like street lamps, and chimney smokes.

in late 2009 there was an update with traffic, but I haven't seen it in the in-game shots. Will it be in the initial release, or is it canceled?

[BadAim]

These shots really show how the "texture" of SOW is shaping up. The small details, the lighting, the rolling countryside with widely varying fields, the abso-freaking-lutely beautiful aircraft, are coming together nicely.

You must be pretty proud of your baby, Oleg.

[Bloblast]

Oleg,
Is the ground detail close to finished, or still polishing to do?

[first-things-first]

Looking great! Very hi res images in 2560 x 1600. Must be quite a beast of a machine to play at that resolution.

Is that a golf course in the second picture at the bottom?

lol @ Dano - beat me to it :)

Storm of War the final tee! :)

[Dano]

Oleg,
Is the ground detail close to finished, or still polishing to do?

It's always worth reading Olegs posts...

textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC
And yes... still not final
You should wait for final looking ground

[ECV56_Guevara]

Great screens thanks!
I already made my Santa Claus whish list!

BTW can we see your new office building??

[kendo65]

ok - I'll ask...

Oleg, will we have animated golfers teeing off, and will it be possible to get hit by golfballs if you do a low pass over the course? ;) :o

Great work.

Thanks.

nice spot to crash land - just try to avoid the bunker on the 14th...
I'll keep a 9-iron in my Spit just in case....

This weeks' theme - golfing jokes.....

[Listy]

Is that a golf course I see? :)

I think there's a also another one a bit closer to the town in the centre of the image! :)

I hope there's a few cricket grounds dotted about the place as well! :)

[genbrien]

Oleg: When we'll encounter enemy planes, will friendly AI tells us at 1st ''enemy plane''(not knowing what type it is) and only identifying them only when they'll get closer?

And nice work btw :)

[BadAim]

Looking great! Very hi res images in 2560 x 1600. Must be quite a beast of a machine to play at that resolution.

Is that a golf course in the second picture at the bottom?

lol @ Dano - beat me to it :)

Storm of War the final tee! :)

Finally! Golf made interesting:

"Bill Page is preparing to tee off on this difficult par 4 hole, but wait! A Messerschmidt is coming down the fairway on a strafing run!!"

[first-things-first]

@BadAim

Yes, only difference is the eagles are aiming at you - not the other way round!

[Flying Pencil]

Took a closer look at this image...

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/attachment.php?attachmentid=3660&d=1287150715

simply incredible!

The city looks like a real city, all it needs is some people and cars to make it complete. Their is enough variety in buildings one barely sees the repeated ones.

The Bf 110 name tags include unit codes, talk about detail!

Rolling hills in distance only make it more like real life.

Behind the puffy clouds looks like some cirrus types as well (high alt striped types).


The 2 items I do not like (even if other games have it)
1. Red and Blue arrows pointing to units. WW2 pilots had nothing like that, so it simply destroys all that beautiful world.

2. Range number (see the 3.7, 3.35) The high resolution monitors today offers a much better judge of distance. New players may benefit, but for full realism arenas can they be turned off?

BTW, Oleg.

THANKS! for your weekly posting!

[Oleg Maddox]

i hate so much that red arrows°!!!!

nice small updaatee mr Mddx

My 6 years son like it very much. From all flying games he found it the best solution (understood from the first try).
Next update I will sho photo of my sone playing fligth sims.

Its one of the tests :)

What was good in Il-2 shouldn't be ignored.

Also... You may play without them isn't it? For this pupose there is other settings of complexity. But we need to satisfy a lot of user's interests... from real novices to the hardcore fans.

[Avala]

Will we be able to choose between DX9, DX10 and DX11 in game?

I wonder is difference in performance between them big? I mean in frames per second and similar? Like 100 frames with DX9 and 10 with DX11.

[Oleg Maddox]

Took a closer look at this image...



2. Range number (see the 3.7, 3.35) The high resolution monitors today offers a much better judge of distance. New players may benefit, but for full realism arenas can they be turned off?

BTW, Oleg.

THANKS! for your weekly posting!

Probably I answered above for your question. ;)

[Oleg Maddox]

Will we be able to choose between DX9, DX10 and DX11 in game?

I wonder is difference in performance between them big? I mean in frames per second and similar? Like 100 frames with DX9 and 10 with DX11.

I think the game define what is better and run under proper DX :)

[mr71mb0]

My 6 years son like it very much. From all flying games he found it the best solution (understood from the first try).
Next update I will sho photo of my sone playing fligth sims.

Its one of the tests :)

What was good in Il-2 shouldn't be ignored.

Also... You may play without them isn't it? For this pupose there is other settings of complexity. But we need to satisfy a lot of user's interests... from real novices to the hardcore fans.

I think it's great Oleg that you have designed with broader audience in mind. It's always good to have the options, that can be turned off it you don't need / like them.

My Son is looking forward to playing this, but will need it simplified or he'll get bored quickly.

[Flying Pencil]

This game is going to be legendary.

Going??


Pffffff!

It ALREADY IS legendary!

[mr71mb0]

Oleg,

if you down an enemy over populated area such as you show in these shots, will the buildings show damage?

[Avala]

I think the game define what is better and run under proper DX :)

In other words, I must buy new computer :)

[jocko417]

Is that a golf course I see? :)

Yes it is, it's about 1/2 way between Dover and Deal on the east coast, just south of Kingsdown.

[Flying Pencil]

My 6 years son like it very much. From all flying games he found it the best solution (understood from the first try).
Next update I will sho photo of my sone playing fligth sims.

Its one of the tests :)

What was good in Il-2 shouldn't be ignored.

Also... You may play without them isn't it? For this pupose there is other settings of complexity. But we need to satisfy a lot of user's interests... from real novices to the hardcore fans.

Probably I answered above for your question. ;)

Yes you did.

I can understand you completely, and that is smart plan.

As long different servers/arenas exist for different skill levels, I will be joyous!! :)

S!

[mr71mb0]

Oleg,

another question you probably can't answer....

in DX11 mode do you use "instancing" to offload scenery processing or provide even more dense scenery at no extra cost? Perhaps even for multiple versions of same aircraft?

[JVM]

It is really excellent and very promising...thank you Oleg!

That would be nice to see a bit of the French side and German airfields...or big guns! I know I am dreaming a bit there...:-):-):-)

JVM

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg,

if you down an enemy over populated area such as you show in these shots, will the buildings show damage?

Yes

[ChrisDNT]

I really like the sea textures, but frankly the ground textures, the colors... all this looks so strange !!!

[kestrel79]

Oleg,

Wow. Great pictures! And these are from an OLD build. You can notice the terrain looks more crisp, more detailed in these shots over the others. Also the ground textures aren't as bright, very good coloring!

All I really want to see or should I say hear now is some sound! Would be nice to hear some flybys, or some guns firing. It will really add to the feel.

[Oleg Maddox]

Yes you did.

I can understand you completely, and that is smart plan.

As long different servers/arenas exist for different skill levels, I will be joyous!! :)

S!

Server is defining the settings for all connected.. doesn't matter what user tried to set on his own side.

Like with original Il-2 users will set own servers with what they like to set... and any groups of interests will be fairly satisfied.

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg,

Wow. Great pictures! And these are from an OLD build. You can notice the terrain looks more crisp, more detailed in these shots over the others. Also the ground textures aren't as bright, very good coloring!

All I really want to see or should I say hear now is some sound! Would be nice to hear some flybys, or some guns firing. It will really add to the feel.

I will ask our sound engineer to preprare maybe something for the next updates in time.

[Daniël]

WOW:o. There will be very chaotic and informative dogfights with all that information which is yelled on the radio! Just like in real life.

Question: Will you be able to hear the enemy on the radio when the radio's are on the same frequency?

Thank you!

[rakinroll]

Thanks Oleg, but without video shots, it is still bittersweet happiness.

[Jumo211]

Thank you guys so much for a wonderful update !! :grin:

[Oleg Maddox]

Thanks Oleg, but without video shots, it is still bittersweet happiness.

For any new thing is the right time. I told already.

[ATAG_Dutch]

I really like the sea textures, but frankly the ground textures, the colors... all this looks so strange !!!


textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC :):):)
And yes... still not final :):):):):)
You should wait for final looking ground :):):)

??

[mr71mb0]

Thanks Oleg, but without video shots, it is still bittersweet happiness.

Oleg already said they were very busy building a new version, just be grateful for what he has done and please keep those sort of comments to yourself.

[GBrutus]

I really like the last couple of shots, the towns are looking quite convincing now. Thanks for the update.

[steam]

I think the game define what is better and run under proper DX :)
This means that DX11 will be too?

[trumps]

the speech, and i am assuming the command system looks much more thorough, hopefully with the new system the Ai will spend more time doing as you command than trying to poach your hard won victories :) the reflectionsof the sun on the canopy of the Hurri look fantastic, it will be great if this is represented at range as well, from what i have read on many occasions the first telltail of enemy aircraft was the glint of sunlight off their canopies in the distance. great work Oleg and crew.

Cheers
Craig

[Oleg Maddox]

This means that DX11 will be too?

Yes of course

[BadAim]

This means that DX11 will be too?

I'll get this one, Ahem:

already said

LOL, I type too slow!

[chiefrr73]

Thanks for answering questions and for the update, Oleg.

[Zoom2136]

Very nice update as always!!!

As a player of online wars, I'm wondering if it would be possible to have an option to paint the rudders of our plan a certain color (could be server side activated). This would be great to spot your wingman in a battle.

It may not be historical... but in an online war... we a re-writing history...

[Splitter]

The thing I find most interesting is the radio chatter. Yes, the pictures are wonderful, but the chatter hints at some gameplay that is simply not available in IL-2. Wingmen are calling out which planes/flights they are going after...so that could mean that you could assign them to certain tasks.

It may take some time to figure out how to control your wingmen with that much control. VERY nice!

Splitter

[Oleg Maddox]

Very nice update as always!!!

As a player of online wars, I'm wondering if it would be possible to have an option to paint the rudders of our plan a certain color (could be server side activated). This would be great to spot your wingman in a battle.

It may not be historical... but in an online war... we a re-writing history...

This is possible in Il-2 original. And everybody will see you own skin. Why not in BoB?
Il-2 still has a lot of things that in many games simply absent. Why not in BoB?

[AndyJWest]

Looking better than ever, Oleg.

Some interesting details - lamp posts, chimney pots, balcony railings:
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae65/ajv00987k/LampPosts.jpg
If any horrible hun Heinkel tries to bomb this, I'll fill the bounder with lead!

[Flyby]

I see the screens are shot at 2560x1600 rez. I wonder if there will be an up-tick in the purchase of 30 inch monitors now? :D I better start playing the lottery again! :)
Nice screens for a WIP, btw.
Flyby out

[chiefrr73]

I will ask our sound engineer to preprare maybe something for the next updates in time.


This would be very nice, thanks a lot Oleg

[Oleg Maddox]

The thing I find most interesting is the radio chatter. Yes, the pictures are wonderful, but the chatter hints at some gameplay that is simply not available in IL-2. Wingmen are calling out which planes/flights they are going after...so that could mean that you could assign them to certain tasks.

It may take some time to figure out how to control your wingmen with that much control. VERY nice!

Splitter

Just one note. In this case the speech is neccessary to rewrite completely or use the same actors with the additions of new planes in game.... or use the place holders...
Say in Il-2 it was more universal thing and traslated withut problems in a lot of languages.
Here it will be more complex and expencive task....

[ChrisDNT]

I don't want to rain on your parade, but the towns don't look convincing, at least to me : too many repetitive buildings and difficult to imagine the final product without AA on these screenshots.
The ground textures look still very crude and the colors have changed from being too vivid to get too much pastel.
It it's said all this is just placeholder for the final textures, ok.
I'm waiting too for some DX11 pics, because these screens still look too much cartoonish. To say the truth, some of the latest maps for IL2 (which I still play with big pleasure) look better.
But I understand it's WIP.

[Oleg Maddox]

Looking better than ever, Oleg.

Some interesting details - lamp posts, chimney pots, balcony railings:
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae65/ajv00987k/LampPosts.jpg
If any horrible hun Heinkel tries to bomb this, I'll fill the bounder with lead!

Ok. After AI speech and ground it is other nice new detial that never shown before. Good findings! :)

[F19_lacrits]

Thanks for the update Oleg!
All is looking very good and it's exciting to follow development and reveal of new features.. No no, I'm not sucking up hoping to get a beta release early.. no no no! ;) :grin:

[Oleg Maddox]

I don't want to rain on your parade, but the towns don't look convincing, at least to me : too many repetitive buildings and difficult to imagine the final product without AA on these screenshots.
The ground textures look still very crude and the colors have changed from being too vivid to get too much pastel.
It it's said all this is just placeholder for the final textures, ok.
I'm waiting too for some DX11 pics, because these screens still look too much cartoonish. To say the truth, some of the latest maps for IL2 (which I still play with big pleasure) look better.
But I understand it's WIP.

Don't you think that representation of colors depending of lighting/shading? I don't think that even one other sim has such things modelled better if modelled at all.

Even it isn't final on our side, but can you show me better in WWII sim (or WWI), except the photo? And that will looks from all distances well? Say from zero to 25 Km altitude? The last feature you will be not able to find for a long enough time I think....

Repetative buildings are neccessary. Or we will have to do 5 years more or by other way - ask you to wait for the more power PC.
Anyway we have more types of buildings than in any other military sim for the current moment I think.
Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation.

[Triggaaar]

Great stuff, thanks for the update Oleg.

So then :roll:, when er, is it, erm, going to be released :smile:

[Pato Salvaje]

"Originally Posted by ChrisDNT
I don't want to rain on your parade, but the towns don't look convincing, at least to me : too many repetitive buildings and difficult to imagine the final product without AA on these screenshots.
The ground textures look still very crude and the colors have changed from being too vivid to get too much pastel.
It it's said all this is just placeholder for the final textures, ok.
I'm waiting too for some DX11 pics, because these screens still look too much cartoonish. To say the truth, some of the latest maps for IL2 (which I still play with big pleasure) look better.
But I understand it's WIP."

Dont worry about this people, Oleg. They don´t have idea what they are saying...
But...

Im leaving my eyes trying to find in this photo what you said!!!... please!! answer it or I´ll go to oculist!! ;-)

[PhilHL]

Thank you Oleg for this update :) It is really amazing to see it developing and later to see the final picture. I ll save my holidays for the release of SoW:BoB!

The hurricane exhauster looks really perfect :!:

I hope the clouds will be reworked in final version or future update. Just a few weeks ago I flew from london to germany in the early moring. I saw many different "layers" of clouds. Many looked so unnatural that I thought I am in game ;) I ll upload a vid of this flight later. Very nice colors I can promise.

[C_G]

Oleg,

about the voices for comms, have you considered asking the community (us) for contributions? I wouldn't be surprised if members from the UK (and Canada, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa) and Germany and Austria wouldn't be happy to contribute to providing their voices to SoW:BoB.

I realize that this might be difficult to organize (and do quality control), but I would imagine that there would be a lot of volunteers... Just a thought.


I *LOVE* the city shots! They are looking really great and I can't wait to see them populated with the models of buses and cars you've already shown...

Thanks again,
C_G

[Splitter]

Hey Olegg,

Want to get the community involved and get the voices you need on the cheap? Send out scripts to native speakers of the languages you need...you probably have them all represented here. No pay, strictly voluntary, recorded on MP3 format or such. Choose the ones you want to use and not have to pay the actors :).

BTW, I LOVE that you are paying so much attention to the communications in game. Such gameplay items are as important to many of us as the graphics. So thank you.

Splitter

[Pato Salvaje]

Ok. After AI speech and ground it is other nice new detial that never shown before. Good findings! :)

Humm!!
Trees in town??

What?:confused:

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg,

about the voices for comms, have you considered asking the community (us) for contributions? I wouldn't be surprised if members from the UK (and Canada, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa) and Germany and Austria wouldn't be happy to contribute to providing their voices to SoW:BoB.

I realize that this might be difficult to organize (and do quality control), but I would imagine that there would be a lot of volunteers... Just a thought.


I *LOVE* the city shots! They are looking really great and I can't wait to see them populated with the models of buses and cars you've already shown...

Thanks again,
C_G

I think when the sim will be reelased we may organize the flow of implementation for different languages speeches in the frame of speech model we are using. I mean user made.

If it will be good enough, why not to program New Zeeland or other contries in future.
Currently we are limited in resourses that to put from the beginning all the possible in BoB speeches.

[mr71mb0]

Don't you think that representation of colors depending of lighting/shading? I don't think that even one other sim has such things modelled better if modelled at all.

Even it isn't final on our side, but can you show me better in WWII sim (or WWI), except the photo? And that will looks from all distances well? Say from zero to 25 Km altitude? The last feature you will be not able to find for a long enough time I think....

Repetative buildings are neccessary. Or we will have to do 5 years more or by other way - ask you to wait for the more power PC.
Anyway we have more types of buildings than in any other military sim for the current moment I think.
Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation.

Oleg,

I think some people simply don't understand the trade-offs you have to make between graphical detail, frame rate, AI, physics, damage modelling, Sound processing, game environment etc.

[swiss]

Don't you think that representation of colors depending of lighting/shading? I don't think that even one other sim has such things modelled better if modelled at all.

Even it isn't final on our side, but can you show me better in WWII sim (or WWI), except the photo? And that will looks from all distances well? Say from zero to 25 Km altitude? The last feature you will be not able to find for a long enough time I think....

Repetative buildings are neccessary. Or we will have to do 5 years more or by other way - ask you to wait for the more power PC.
Anyway we have more types of buildings than in any other military sim for the current moment I think.
Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation.

:mrgreen: Toché!


In other words, dear chris: Stfu and be grateful.

[nearmiss]

Thanks Oleg for the update.

[JAMF]

Mr. Maddox, I don't know if these questions have passed here already, or if they have been answered, so here they are:

- Will we see raindrops on the windscreen, like in the original IL2 demo?
- Will we see rivets on the wing and would they be bump- or normal-mapped?
- Is surround gaming (3 screens) being taken into account in development? Flexible FoV? Or will there be an option for users wit 3 screens, to render the view through 3 viewports, like it was done in the racing simulation rFactor?
- Is the SoW engine ready for future 64Bit development, so it can use more than 2GB and load everything into memory on systems that have the memory? Like load all LoD models and all textures into memory to fill up 8GB?

[C_G]

I think when the sim will be reelased we may organize the flow of implementation for different languages speeches in the frame of speech model we are using. I mean user made.

If it will be good enough, why not to program New Zeeland or other contries in future.
Currently we are limited in resourses that to put from the beginning all the possible in BoB speeches.

Understood, thanks for the reply.

I'm sure that when the time comes the community will be happy to help expand the variety of voices on comms.

Really looking forward to this, it's obvious your team is making great progress these days... seems like things are mostly being "tweaked" now rather than being created for the first time.

Cheers,
C_G

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg,

I think some people simply don't understand the trade-offs you have to make between graphical detail, frame rate, AI, physics, damage modelling, Sound processing, game environment etc.

I was trying to explain with the sample for buildings. You said well about overal problem of compromisses. I would add also that all these things are happening on the great size visible surface and working simultaniosly...

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)

[swiss]

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)

:cool:

[Triggaaar]

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)If your son wants to kill you, make him do it in-game.

[Hunden]

Looks great , thanks for the update. I think my job perfomance will suffer after release me think.........:grin:

[ATAG_Dutch]

:mrgreen: Touché!

In other words, dear chris: Stfu and be grateful.

Agree 100%.

I've just spent an hour trying to imagine shot 2 in motion.

Then I spent another hour trying to think of a good enough descriptive.

Couldn't think of one.

Then I saw the individual shadows of the buildings, the details in Andy's post, and remembered the ground detail from the previous few weeks.

How anyone can criticise these update shots is beyond me.

Superb.

[julien673]

I was trying to explain with the sample for buildings. You said well about overal problem of compromisses. I would add also that all these things are happening on the great size visible surface and working simultaniosly...

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)

Cruel ... think about us ;)

Nice week end :) :)

[Abbeville-Boy]

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)



your son is beta tester? :grin:like father like son acorn stays close to the tree :-P
i like this update!!

[Sutts]

Very nice update, thanks Oleg.:grin:

The towns are great, such detail..railings, lights etc. I'm blown away.

Clouds look fantastic too, and the coast with golf courses etc. Simply amazing.

I can't believe how your small team produces such a detailed product.

Well done and thanks for taking the time to keep us informed.

[McHilt]

Looking better every friday...
Thx a lot as always Oleg, your dedication and willingness to post are very much appreciated!!!

Greetings

[AWL_Spinner]

Looking great Oleg, thank you!

Next week could we see some bad weather? Maybe rain, and breaking out on top of an overcast?

Cheers!

Spinner

[JG27CaptStubing]

Well I hope DX11 Offers Oleg's team some performance improvement but not at the cost of eye candy. The promise of DX10 fell flat to be honest. Tesselation could be really help out with cockpit frames guages wheels etc at no extra cost depending on your hardware.

I will also be interesting to see how well multithreading and multicore could help out the simulation. That's no easy feat to pull off correctly.

[Fafnir_6]

Oleg :)

From Pic one. In text did axis fighter pilots say also 'Tally ho'? I always thought it came from English aristocracy, from fox hunting element?

Towns looking great!

S

Hello,

I believe the German equivalent of "Tally Ho" is "Horrido". This too is an old aristocratic hunting term and was used by Luftwaffe pilots in WWII in a similar fashion to British "Tally Ho". This said, I humbly request that the German speech pack be change to reflect this (if there is time).

From the Combatsim forums:

posted 12-12-2002 01:28 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Horrido is a Latin word meaning frightful or frightening. Perhaps the Luftwaffe meant for it to mean "Fear me!" You know, in a Samuel L. Jackson Pulp Fiction sort of way.
Ah, but alas, I really don't know anything . . . found this in (of all places) the EAW newsgroup:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Horrido is a hunting expresion used in [G]ermany. It is a greeting like "good afternoon or howdy...." and it is also used in letting someone live up (I think you don't say that in [E]nglish).... anyway , like the [E]nglish speaking say: "Hip hip" and the answer is "Hooray". German hunters say "Horrido" and the cro[w]d answers "Yo".
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, there you go

--------------------

Douglas Helmer
Forum Administrator
publisher@combatsim.com



Cheers and thanks for an awesome update,

Fafnir_6

[mazex]

Today, as I told already in a topic of 2010-10-08 - small update on a previous build.
Just 5 screen shots.
Anyway I think someone will find interesting new details.

Are you crazy Oleg? This is the best update yet! The landscape really starts to look great now - even at altitude!

[WhoCares]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

[Baron]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.


How about comparing it with an actuall 2009 flight sim release instead of whats 2010 flight sim IN YOUR MIND.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrbrOt_HvLE


Feel free to compare ground details.


Edit: In a sence i understand what u mean but u cant compare flight sims with FPS like Modern Warfare for ex.

[winny]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

What are you comparing them to?

[Sutts]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

You're entitled to your opinion of course but personally I think you're dead wrong and/or need your eyes checking.

[slm]

Great pictures! It would be neat to see picture#3, but with some planes flying at low altitude. How visible are planes against the ground?

[Richie]

I thought the landscape looked nicer about 3 - 4 months ago.

[Osprey]

OMG A golf course!!!


edit: It's "Walmer & Kingsdown GC"
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=deal&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=25.497376,67.631836&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Deal,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.184723,1.39183&spn=0.052508,0.132093&t=h&z=14

It's not all bang on but frankly only a moron would expect it to be, but worth noting are the Dover Road (A258 ) and Deal railway line are positioned correctly :D

[brando]

Thanks Oleg for a delightful update. Have a good weekend.

A couple of replies to the thread.

Tally ho is indeed a fox-hunting term, and was used by the pilots to indicate visual recognition of enemy aircraft, as in "Tally ho, bandits at ten o'clock low" or whatever. It wasn't, however, an order to attack. That came after recognition, and came from the squadron leader, flight leader or section leader, with detail on what form the attack would take.
A little research will reveal that the make-up of the pre-war RAF contained many officers from the 'hunting, shooting and fishing' set, so it's really not surprising that they used a fox-hunting term.

As for similarities in the buildings, that's just how it was. The great Victorian expansion brought a systematic use of identical houses and roofs, aided by the use of the railway to import the materials. A trainload of slates from the Welsh mountains would mean hundreds or even thousands of similarly-toned roofs, so, if anything, there is still a little too much variation of colour rather than too little. Likewise for a trainload of bricks - all from the same brickworks - this would mean streets and streets of identically coloured houses. Of course there may be the occasional burst of orange, where some kind of tile has been used on a few houses; and one might expect to see cement rendering on the walls of more 'quality' dwellings. Occasional buildings might even still be thatched, though rarely in a town, and Welsh slate was the most common roofing.

These facts tend to dictate the colours and shades I guess. Slate roofs are a glossy dark grey when wet, but dry to a pastel grey when dry. They are sheets of stone after all, unlike tiles which are made of clay.
The average brick is generally matt too, with only 'engineering grade' bricks having a semi-glazed surface. These were most commomly used for tunnel openings, bridgeworks and railway buildings. Even after rain they are generally matt in appearance as towns and cities tended to be.

The one part that is not particularly noticeable, and I have no idea how it may be achieved, is the overall pall of coal smoke that was general at the time. I guess it may be argued that the BoB took place in summer when coal-burning was at its lowest and that's fair. It is still important to remember the effect of 50 to 100 years of coal burning, which left it's mark on every building.
It's probably something that most people born after the mid-Sixties (in England) cannot recall at all. In the time of the war it was a big factor as far as overall colouration is concerned.

Excuse me for rabbiting on. I'm over sixty and I have strong memories of the drabness that decades of coal use brought to the townscapes.

[Osprey]

In German language they speaks other. Its a "traslation" of German speech

If you remember In Il-2 Germans ware saying sometime the word Scheise.... but it wasn't traslated directly in English or Russian, or any other language that were supporting later in Il-2 :):):)


Could I humbly request that you don't go too politically correct and keep with language of the time? :) For example, I am also looking forward to the Peter Jackson remake of Dambusters but he's already had to change the name of Gibsons dog because some over sensitive pillocks can't handle the reality of life at the time.

thanks, it's all immersion.

[swiss]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

I suggest to delete this member, must be an alias of s.o.

[Richie]

We will see what happens in a few months Swiss ;)

[JG53Frankyboy]

very nice !

and the icons are telling us that SoW:BoB will have a C-4 variant of the Bf110 , that means it has mineshell firing MG-FF/M canons :)

so the hopes for a 109E-4 are not dead ;)

[albx]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

well, 1 post and your nick also says all...

[winny]

OMG A golf course!!!


edit: It's "Walmer & Kingsdown GC"
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=deal&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=25.497376,67.631836&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Deal,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.184723,1.39183&spn=0.052508,0.132093&t=h&z=14

It's not all bang on but frankly only a moron would expect it to be, but worth noting are the Dover Road (A258) and Deal railway line are positioned correctly :D

Theres another one (golf course) a little higer up the pic too.. maybe sandwich? but there's loads of courses out there..

[Osprey]

All these pictures would be, I´m sure, awesome three years ago but today they are normal, very nice but normal.Sorry but it´s a long time.

LMAO. What a mug.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Excuse me for rabbiting on. I'm over sixty and I have strong memories of the drabness that decades of coal use brought to the townscapes.

You don't have to be over sixty Brando! I remember it well. We didn't go 'smokeless' until the 70's. Many buildings still haven't been cleaned up.

I'm not sure if I'd want to see that kind of grime in a flight sim though, even if it did add 'realism'.
Having said that, the air pollution over cities would be a good addition.
Geoff Wellum called it 'Horrible, dirty yellow, curry-coloured smoggy smoke'.

Can't say I fancy the sound of what they passed off as curry back then though.:grin:

[peterwoods@supanet.com]

Well that's another two added to my ignore list. Some people will never be satisfied!

[Osprey]

Theres another one (golf course) a little higer up the pic too.. maybe sandwich? but there's loads of courses out there..

I had a good look but it's not there. This a definitely not a complaint or problem to me, indeed I'm delighted that detail like this is even considered but technically there are far more courses now than there were in 1940. The sport was pretty exclusive back then and only really played by the wealthy and posh like Doug Badar ;). These courses were mostly built when many sports and clubs formed up, late 19c and early 20c. I'm not convinced that a course would ever get turned over to the plough in 1940 given the wealth and power of the memberships.

[whatnot]

well, 1 post and your nick also says all...

One hook thrown by a troll with a brand new nick and we bite like crazy. Just like he wants us to do.

But fantastic update! The terrain now looks superb from high up too, thanks for tuning that Oleg!

[Osprey]

very nice !

and the icons are telling us that SoW:BoB will have a C-4 variant of the Bf110 , that means it has mineshell firing MG-FF/M canons :)

so the hopes for a 109E-4 are not dead ;)

They shouldn't be however I hope that the mission builders finally see sense and limit the LW to 30% ish E-1, 20% ish E-3 and the rest E-4. Same goes for the Spitfire/Hurricane mix too.

Your shouldn't be able to communicate with your bombers either ;)

[dduff442]

Thanks Oleg for a delightful update. Have a good weekend.

A couple of replies to the thread.

Tally ho is indeed a fox-hunting term, and was used by the pilots to indicate visual recognition of enemy aircraft, as in "Tally ho, bandits at ten o'clock low" or whatever. It wasn't, however, an order to attack. That came after recognition, and came from the squadron leader, flight leader or section leader, with detail on what form the attack would take.
A little research will reveal that the make-up of the pre-war RAF contained many officers from the 'hunting, shooting and fishing' set, so it's really not surprising that they used a fox-hunting term.

As for similarities in the buildings, that's just how it was. The great Victorian expansion brought a systematic use of identical houses and roofs, aided by the use of the railway to import the materials. A trainload of slates from the Welsh mountains would mean hundreds or even thousands of similarly-toned roofs, so, if anything, there is still a little too much variation of colour rather than too little. Likewise for a trainload of bricks - all from the same brickworks - this would mean streets and streets of identically coloured houses. Of course there may be the occasional burst of orange, where some kind of tile has been used on a few houses; and one might expect to see cement rendering on the walls of more 'quality' dwellings. Occasional buildings might even still be thatched, though rarely in a town, and Welsh slate was the most common roofing.

These facts tend to dictate the colours and shades I guess. Slate roofs are a glossy dark grey when wet, but dry to a pastel grey when dry. They are sheets of stone after all, unlike tiles which are made of clay.
The average brick is generally matt too, with only 'engineering grade' bricks having a semi-glazed surface. These were most commomly used for tunnel openings, bridgeworks and railway buildings. Even after rain they are generally matt in appearance as towns and cities tended to be.

The one part that is not particularly noticeable, and I have no idea how it may be achieved, is the overall pall of coal smoke that was general at the time. I guess it may be argued that the BoB took place in summer when coal-burning was at its lowest and that's fair. It is still important to remember the effect of 50 to 100 years of coal burning, which left it's mark on every building.
It's probably something that most people born after the mid-Sixties (in England) cannot recall at all. In the time of the war it was a big factor as far as overall colouration is concerned.

Excuse me for rabbiting on. I'm over sixty and I have strong memories of the drabness that decades of coal use brought to the townscapes.

These are great observations.

For years I thought Trinity College in Dublin was built of Limestone, until they cleaned the building -- a very painstaking and expensive chemical-leeching process so as not to destroy the stone. When the green-netted scaffolding came down I was astonished to see it was a very white granite.

dduff

[dduff442]

I thought the landscape looked nicer about 3 - 4 months ago.

Mostly its the difference between dull weather (today's update) and sunny.

[FG28_Kodiak]

Hello,

I believe the German equivalent of "Tally Ho" is "Horrido". This too is an old aristocratic hunting term and was used by Luftwaffe pilots in WWII in a similar fashion to British "Tally Ho". This said, I humbly request that the German speech pack be change to reflect this (if there is time).

From the Combatsim forums:

posted 12-12-2002 01:28 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Horrido is a Latin word meaning frightful or frightening. Perhaps the Luftwaffe meant for it to mean "Fear me!" You know, in a Samuel L. Jackson Pulp Fiction sort of way.
Ah, but alas, I really don't know anything . . . found this in (of all places) the EAW newsgroup:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Horrido is a hunting expresion used in [G]ermany. It is a greeting like "good afternoon or howdy...." and it is also used in letting someone live up (I think you don't say that in [E]nglish).... anyway , like the [E]nglish speaking say: "Hip hip" and the answer is "Hooray". German hunters say "Horrido" and the cro[w]d answers "Yo".

Fafnir_6

Horrido was the code for Abschuß (=Kill) in the Luftwaffe, for example "Pauke, Pauke" was the code for attack, "Indianer" was the code for enemy fighter, "dicke Autos" stands for 4mot. enemy Bombers etc.
It was forbidden to use other codes.

Page from Deckwortverzeichnis Jägersprechverkehr (German Luftwaffe Brevity Code Handbook):
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/2503/deckwortverzeichnisjaeg.th.jpg (http://img522.imageshack.us/i/deckwortverzeichnisjaeg.jpg/)

[ChrisDNT]

"Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation."


Of course, I know it, but I'm still playing IL-2 (even the latest maps, with settings just reduced a little) with an old Athlon3000 with only 1 giga of ram and an old Radeon 9700pro and the game still looks good and playable.

In the next months, I will have a pc which will be much more powerful (but not a "war machine", just a good current pc) and I think it's quite reasonable to expect that a 2011 game will, at least, support some more elements on it than its ten-years old, very good, predecessor.


P.S: note to the fanboys, I don't even read your posts, so no need to flak me, I'm totally indifferent to it.

[zakkandrachoff]

i hate so much that red arrows°!!!!
the screenshots is exacttly that i was expecting! very nice. is a shine the extra exported jpg. very pixelated!

nice small updaatee mr Mddx

My 6 years son like it very much. From all flying games he found it the best solution (understood from the first try).
Next update I will sho photo of my sone playing fligth sims.

Its one of the tests :)

What was good in Il-2 shouldn't be ignored.

Also... You may play without them isn't it? For this pupose there is other settings of complexity. But we need to satisfy a lot of user's interests... from real novices to the hardcore fans.

yes, i know, i never will use that red arrows or any screen market or labels. but i want see MY Fridays screenshots without that.

you son will play SOW before my?! that is not fair, not fair at all.

i need to tell you something, ... i am your another son, oleg, the lost son. i was keeping this for myself too much time.

yes, that is right, you now need to send me SOW beta.
not excuse !:-P


lie, i am descendent of Ukrainians, not Russian people.

[Fafnir_6]

Horrido was the code for Abschuß (=Kill) in the Luftwaffe, for example "Pauke, Pauke" was the code for attack, "Indianer" was the code for enemy fighter, "dicke Autos" stands for 4mot. enemy Bombers etc.
It was forbidden to use other codes.

Page from Deckwortverzeichnis Jägersprechverkehr (German Luftwaffe Brevity Code Handbook):
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/2503/deckwortverzeichnisjaeg.th.jpg (http://img522.imageshack.us/i/deckwortverzeichnisjaeg.jpg/)

Cool! Thanks for the more detailed information. Hopefully the devs have included these in the communications of the new game .

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[winny]

"Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation."


Of course, I know it, but I'm still playing IL-2 (even the latest maps, with settings just reduced a little) with an old Athlon3000 with only 1 giga of ram and an old Radeon 9700pro and the game still looks good and playable.

In the next months, I will have a pc which will be much more powerful (but not a "war machine", just a good current pc) and I think it's quite reasonable to expect that a 2011 game will, at least, support some more elements on it than its ten-years old, very good, predecessor.


P.S: note to the fanboys, I don't even read your posts, so no need to flak me, I'm totally indifferent to it.

Pointless.

What makes you think that it won't support more elements?
As for your last line.. is that the 'net version of sticking your fingers in your ears and la la-ing?

[Fafnir_6]

I thought the landscape looked nicer about 3 - 4 months ago.

Actually, if you take the first shot you have there and place it next to the third shot from today's update (I think they are of similar altitudes), you'll see that the landscape is MUCH higher resolution/detailed in the new screen. The older shot looks nicer because of the ambient lighting and the large number of trees in the picture. If you look closely at the grass fields in the old shot you'll see the low-detail textures similar to IL-2. This is why everyone is so excited by today's update. SoW has come a long way since those old pictures (especially if you have the machine to take advantage of it).

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[Jaguar]

Mr Maddox please be a good parent and forbid him from using the internet. If he does tell him he can only use Il2 1946 with no patches. How embarssing to our moral if we know it was Olegs son who just downed half of our bombers and all of the fighters. I hope you two have the best day possible. It is such a great feeling to be able to Sim with family and friends. Due to games like yours, my friends in my squadron are my best friends I have ever met.

[FlyingPapy]

The clouds, their shadows, the haze ... Amazing!

[Mango]

Having said that, the air pollution over cities would be a good addition.
Geoff Wellum called it 'Horrible, dirty yellow, curry-coloured smoggy smoke'.


Funny, I just read that line in his book last night. Thoroughly enjoying it in preparation for SoW!! :-)

[Robert]

Thank you Oleg!

What a pleasure to see the implementation of features in BoB from the beginning to this day. It's like watching Rodin take a block of stone and create a wonderful piece of art..... all the while we're privy to the process. Thanks for the privilege.

I have my 12 year old nephew anticipating BoB. He's been playing IL2 since he was six and while he never cottoned to dog fighting, he makes one hell of a ground-pounder in a Jug or Sturmovik.


Have a good day.

[Sutts]

The undulations in the ground in shot 2 are quite something. Subtle shadowing effects based on the angle of the sun. Can't get my head around the complexity of all this. I think those who complain just don't understand the technical achievements being presented in every subtle feature.

[SlipBall]

The undulations in the ground in shot 2 are quite something. Subtle shadowing effects based on the angle of the sun. Can't get my head around the complexity of all this. I think those who complain just don't understand the technical achievements being presented in every subtle feature.




Very true...some I think don't take the time to consider the complexity, give/take to achieve decent game play on today's average PC.:grin:

[Xilon_x]

Sorry Mr.OLEG MADDOX but real pilots of ww2 not have red or blue arrows for search enemy in the sky.

Real pilot use your eyes for search enemy in the sky.

I hope that those arrows are optional or the game simulation transform to arcade simulation.

il-2sturmovik 1946 not have arrows.
i remember CFS3 have the arrows.
http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/attachment.php?attachmentid=3660&d=1287150715

[Dano]

Sorry Mr.OLEG MADDOX but real pilots of ww2 not have red or blue arrows for search enemy in the sky.

Real pilot use your eyes for search enemy in the sky.

I hope that those arrows are optional or the game simulation transform to arcade simulation.

il-2sturmovik 1946 not have arrows.
i remember CFS3 have the arrows.


1946 DOES have arrows & Oleg has already stated they are optional as they are in 1946, in this very thread.

[Oleg Maddox]

"Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation."


Of course, I know it, but I'm still playing IL-2 (even the latest maps, with settings just reduced a little) with an old Athlon3000 with only 1 giga of ram and an old Radeon 9700pro and the game still looks good and playable.

In the next months, I will have a pc which will be much more powerful (but not a "war machine", just a good current pc) and I think it's quite reasonable to expect that a 2011 game will, at least, support some more elements on it than its ten-years old, very good, predecessor.




I think you don't take in account much more details that are in calculation to get just "a bit better" overal picture.

Lets begin from polygon count.

Compare details of tank in Il-2 and in BoB. This was cost several times increment of using power for each unit.
Now compare cars.
Now compare bridges.
Now compare roads
Now compare ships
Now compare planes. The last one is the most important in the fligth sim and here again like it was in Il-2 we have not compromisses for the ratio how it looks.. modelled functions and its damage model and modelled internals with all the listed above things alltogether...
Instead of some using our old models from Il-2 for their own sims with the little bit increment of polygons and size of textures (and repeating the same things that we did oursevlves with no info for details, some time even known for us wrong details(!) we are going with another goal - we try now to recreate planes outside and inside so close looking to real, that never was done before in any sim (even in add-ons for MS FS). And the masterpice is that its already used as a reference in some sources.... yes some time we are making non principal mistakes, but most are eliminated... or some tiome especiall make "mistakes" due to limits of technology
And we don't use some overdone effects that to represent them as used technology and show full illiteracy in some real laws....
And lets say that from the beginning we will offer more than others... its not just 2 or six planes flyable...
Did you count the amount of already shown ground units with its quality? Ah... maybe you don't like our wheels cars? Ok.... then just imagine Kursk Battle and its common polygon and textures count...
We think already now (or really much earlier) about future battles in a series. We think about common development in future of online gameplay together with thrid party....

Continue counting:

new more complex calcualtion for FM not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI for the ground units.... for the hundres visible at once. The war continues on the ground... massive war if to compare to any other sim... (however I still can say it about Il-2 as well)
New features of the ground units...
Special AI for the AA defence on the ground...

Ok, I'm tired... there is something more to count.... that maybe isn't going in final release but will be as addition in future.

All these things recall increment by exponent of power that we need to use.... Just think about it.

Il-2 inspired at least 3 other sims... with continues... more or less directly based on our Il-2 source code or learning our source code.... Il-2 created some amount of new teams and even new companies...

Should I say that we are thinking about future, about our experience with Il-2 (superb, good and sometime bad....)

Who remember how was developed Il-2 and its series I think understand what I would say now. Hint: we are not making one season game...






You like Il-2. Thats good. You like the amount of things that is done there by us and third party? Thats also good But please take in acount that all these things were developed after the first original Il-2....

Now will be the first new original sim that will be more open for increment....

This message isn't just for you... Its for all who doesn't see the difference now...

[LukeFF]

Very nice details there, thanks!

Luke

(He 162 Cockpit Modeler ;))

[Oleg Maddox]

[QUOTE=Xilon_x;189994]Sorry Mr.OLEG MADDOX but real pilots of ww2 not have red or blue arrows for search enemy in the sky.

Real pilot use your eyes for search enemy in the sky.

I hope that those arrows are optional or the game simulation transform to arcade simulation.

il-2sturmovik 1946 not have arrows.
i remember CFS3 have the arrows.
/QUOTE]

Like it was in original Il-2 of 2001, then in Forgotten Battles, Ace Expancion Pack, Pacific Fightes and 1946 - there always was these arrows. Please pay attention and use other difficulty settings.
And again... You may switch them off... using other than settings for novices for outside views

In CFS3 was just one arrow in the center if I recall right. And its working by other way. As well as "onscreen radar" , etc

[IceFire]

We've had optional arrows in IL-2 since 1.0 ..

[Oleg Maddox]

Very nice details there, thanks!

Luke

(He 162 Cockpit Modeler ;))

Hi, I was thinking that nickname is very known for me :)
You may write me on the old address and I will load the base from there and check it. Then you will know the new one.

And how about the new He 162 for the new sim? :):):):)

[IceFire]

It's definitely looking like it's coming together! Not just some technology thrown in.. it's now looking like it's getting closer to being finished and rolling along.

Spectacular images. Keep it up! :)

[Romanator21]

Don't waste your quality time with your son, getting wound-up about our dumb questions. We'll take care of that:http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/style_emoticons/default/shoot.gif

Some people just won't understand (chose not to understand?), even if you spell it out for them.

[IceFire]

And how about the new He 162 for the new sim? :):):):)

Now you're talking :D :D

[Dano]

Hi, I was thinking that nickname is very known for me :)
You may write me on the old address and I will load the base from there and check it. Then you will know the new one.

And how about the new He 162 for the new sim? :):):):)

Get cracking LukeFF :D

[KOM.Nausicaa]

Wonderful update Oleg. Especially love the ground textures and the overall colors. The true feel of atmospheric perspective (especially in certain weather conditions) was what hit me immediately when I first started up IL2 back in 2005. It was a true shock after years of CFS3 and FS sims, and a realization how much they had failed in that department. I am confident to find all this again, and even better.

[Oleg Maddox]

We will have probably two versions from the beginning of release.

[Xilon_x]

Ok OLEG MADDOX good the arrows are optional. tank you.

[Oleg Maddox]

Wonderful update Oleg. Especially love the ground textures and the overall colors. The true feel of atmospheric perspective (especially in certain weather conditions) was what hit me immediately when I first started up IL2 back in 2005. It was a true shock after years of CFS3 and FS sims, and a realization how much they had failed in that department. I am confident to find all this again, and even better.

Thanks!
Your words as the ARTman and photographer I accept considerably (hope you understand what I try to say in not native language.... )

But be sure we will have it better :)

[Qpassa]

the quality of this screenshots, have increased a lot, thanks

[Oleg Maddox]

Get cracking LukeFF :D

I symply understand how busy he is and how much he will need to spend for a new way better model of this plane in free of work and family time....
When it will be ready... hope we will be ready with the new sim again.... about 1945 in Poland where it was met really for the first time in air battle.

But I'm serious. This guy (hope I can say it :)) did real nice job in the past that we didn need to rework like with most others...
There were just several top modellers of aircraft from third party of that level...

[zakkandrachoff]

We will have probably two versions from the beginning of release.

The Daimler-Benz 601A engine arrived after nearly eighteen months in time to be incorporated into the Bf110C when delivery was made in January 1939. The first, which was the Bf110C-0 had very few differences to its earlier variant, but in late January-early February the rear machine gun was fitted with a flexible mount and DB601A-1 engines delivering 1,050hp each and was designated as the Bf110C-1. Other variants of the Bf110 were the C-2 which had modified radio equipment, the C-3 which had improved MG FF cannon, the C-4 which had greater protection for the pilot and gunner with the inclusion of armour plating and the C-4B which had improved DB601N power units with each developing 1,200hp giving the Bf110 a top speed of 349 mph.
Bf110 C-3 or C-4
and?...
Bf110 C-4B?


and i want to see that He162, omg!:-P

[furbs]

Oleg..first thanks for the update...i can see the landscape is getting better week by week, but can i ask about the colour of the fields in this weeks update.

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15

I live in England and some of the colour of the fields ive never seen before, and the mix of fields next to each other is also something ive never seen, if this is just testing, then thats fine, but to me it doesnt remind me of southen England.

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/2537/cabimageresizeraxd.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15
This is goodwood airfield at 2000ft in july, the landscape looks much darker with dark borders around the fields and much more green than the SOW landscape.
Are the colours of SOW going to finish looking more like this?

Thanks.

[Chivas]

Thanks Oleg. I'm very impressed with the city screenshots. These cities are by far the best I've seen in any flight sim. Is the new build to fix bugs or add/delete features or probably all of the above?

[LukeFF]

Hi, I was thinking that nickname is very known for me :)
You may write me on the old address and I will load the base from there and check it. Then you will know the new one.

And how about the new He 162 for the new sim? :):):):)

:)

I still have most of my resources from the project, including a copy of the original pilot's manual. Who knows, I may just have to make a new version for SoW. :)

Will e-mail you. :)

[matsher]

Here's a question to anyone who may know...

Do you guys think that there might be some sort of voice activation programmed?


With all the new complex & specific commands we can issue, do you guys reckon there might be some off-line voice activattion. Hmm?

This weeks shots are simply brilliant, this sim is going to be epic...
Go team Oleg...

[philip.ed]

Oleg, great update, probably for me the best for many weeks and that's saying something! It's great to see how the game's developing.
I do agree with Furbs though, the landscape here has a saturated look to it IMO which is not a bad thing, but for Summer it looks quite green and lush.
Having said that, I can't wait to see what your ground-modeller will show us next week.

Oleg, the clouds look nicer too. Can I ask if they are final? They look awesome, but IMO would look a lot better if they had flat bottoms. Sorry if I sound like an old-record.

Oleg, with the arrows, I think it's a great idea but I prefer the system in the game BoB2 which shows icons instead of arrows (in the case of BoB2, a roundel for British planes and a cross for Luftwaffe ones) I can see, though, that if Italians planes are modelled, they'd need an icon too.
I find this system much more aesthetic, but perhaps you disagree? Just a thought ;)

great update, I can't praise this game enough.

[LukeFF]

But I'm serious. This guy (hope I can say it :)) did real nice job in the past that we didn need to rework like with most others...
There were just several top modellers of aircraft from third party of that level...

:)

I owe a debt of gratitude to Ilya for being so patient with me. :-)

[Hatch]

Oleg..first thanks for the update...i can see the landscape is getting better week by week, but can i ask about the colour of the fields in this weeks update.

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15

I live in England and some of the colour of the fields ive never seen before, and the mix of fields next to each other is also something ive never seen, if this is just testing, then thats fine, but to me it doesnt remind me of southen England.

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/2537/cabimageresizeraxd.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15
This is goodwood airfield at 2000ft in july, the landscape looks much darker with dark borders around the fields and much more green than the SOW landscape.
Are the colours of SOW going to finish looking more like this?

Thanks.

Not too sure about the photograph.

On my monitor(admittedly not calibrated for some time) the colours are slightly off.

It's allways a bit difficult to quantify perception, most people don't even know what they're seeing.
But often timesthey do know if something doesn't look right.
Or not if you judge by how awful the colours are on most TV sets LOL

Might be the time of day?

[Oleg Maddox]

Oleg..first thanks for the update...i can see
I live in England and some of the colour of the fields ive never seen before, and the mix of fields next to each other is also something ive never seen, if this is just testing, then thats fine, but to me it doesnt remind me of southen England.

This is goodwood airfield at 2000ft in july, the landscape looks much darker with dark borders around the fields and much more green than the SOW landscape.
Are the colours of SOW going to finish looking more like this?

Thanks.

Look for the sample bellow. It was done from your sample using professiona photo tool Lightroom 3.2 which I trust very much.

By simple clicking of special White balance tool on the grey surface of this photo where it must be grey by definition of light laws we get more real picture that was when the camera did the shot.
I also can to restore contrast, but already this one action is enough to imagine...

The camera never get the right color. We may get it right only after we already did the shot by using some rules.
In the other hand the human eye never remember the right color...just close approxination... and when again we see the picture of the same place human thinking that it is right colors.... It is a nature of human eye to brain work.
I can't spend the time to teach for the laws in light and its representation from matrix of the modern camera (even professional). I would say only that thing: the shots that are done non in RAW format with using some rules that to restore later the right colors are always wrong. Be sure. JPEG opf cameras can't show right color in complex light conditions that are in the air on altitude comparing to the thing for which they are designed... (also even there are not right)

And answering your question I already told above - not final.

However looking for my sample how it was really (close to that sample) you should think about.... or take some tiome to search for the white balace and color/colorcontrast distortions in digital cameras (or film - some other sort but also with great distortions)

Only these developers that don't know these laws make the "right colors" of the world in their products :):):)... Hope you understand what I said.

[Splitter]

I think you don't take in account much more details that are in calculation to get just "a bit better" overal picture.

Lets begin from polygon count.

Compare details of tank in Il-2 and in BoB. This was cost several times increment of using power for each unit.
Now compare cars.
Now compare bridges.
Now compare roads
Now compare ships
Now compare planes. The last one is the most important in the fligth sim and here again like it was in Il-2 we have not compromisses for the ratio how it looks.. modelled functions and its damage model and modelled internals with all the listed above things alltogether...
Instead of some using our old models from Il-2 for their own sims with the little bit increment of polygons and size of textures (and repeating the same things that we did oursevlves with no info for details, some time even known for us wrong details(!) we are going with another goal - we try now to recreate planes outside and inside so close looking to real, that never was done before in any sim (even in add-ons for MS FS). And the masterpice is that its already used as a reference in some sources.... yes some time we are making non principal mistakes, but most are eliminated... or some tiome especiall make "mistakes" due to limits of technology
And we don't use some overdone effects that to represent them as used technology and show full illiteracy in some real laws....
And lets say that from the beginning we will offer more than others... its not just 2 or six planes flyable...
Did you count the amount of already shown ground units with its quality? Ah... maybe you don't like our wheels cars? Ok.... then just imagine Kursk Battle and its common polygon and textures count...
We think already now (or really much earlier) about future battles in a series. We think about common development in future of online gameplay together with thrid party....

Continue counting:

new more complex calcualtion for FM not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI for the ground units.... for the hundres visible at once. The war continues on the ground... massive war if to compare to any other sim... (however I still can say it about Il-2 as well)
New features of the ground units...
Special AI for the AA defence on the ground...

Ok, I'm tired... there is something more to count.... that maybe isn't going in final release but will be as addition in future.

All these things recall increment by exponent of power that we need to use.... Just think about it.

Il-2 inspired at least 3 other sims... with continues... more or less directly based on our Il-2 source code or learning our source code.... Il-2 created some amount of new teams and even new companies...

Should I say that we are thinking about future, about our experience with Il-2 (superb, good and sometime bad....)

Who remember how was developed Il-2 and its series I think understand what I would say now. Hint: we are not making one season game...






You like Il-2. Thats good. You like the amount of things that is done there by us and third party? Thats also good But please take in acount that all these things were developed after the first original Il-2....

Now will be the first new original sim that will be more open for increment....

This message isn't just for you... Its for all who doesn't see the difference now...

Man, some real gold nuggets in there I think, both from what was said and what "could" be extrapolated.

Oleg, I shall take a shot of vodka now in your honor (real Russian stuff too!). This posting of yours is every bit as much appreciated as the screen shots.

Ok....three vodka shots, just to be sociable of course.

Splitter

[Hatch]

Will we be able to adjust colour & whitebalance to adjust it our own particular distorted view of the world?

[furbs]

Thanks very much for the reply Oleg, i know the SOW screens are WIP and will be tuned until release, thats why im not too worried :)

Im just also thinking about the colours i see each day and when im out mountain biking through the countryside of southen England, to me it is much more green with dark colours.

Ive just never seen that mix of so many light and pastel colours of fields next to each other, the fields i see each day blend into each other more.

Anyway thanks again for the reply and looking forward very much to be flying over my home town.

[matsher]

Just one note. In this case the speech is neccessary to rewrite completely or use the same actors with the additions of new planes in game.... or use the place holders...
Say in Il-2 it was more universal thing and traslated withut problems in a lot of languages.
Here it will be more complex and expencive task....

Oleg,

about the voices for comms, have you considered asking the community (us) for contributions? I wouldn't be surprised if members from the UK (and Canada, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa) and Germany and Austria wouldn't be happy to contribute to providing their voices to SoW:BoB.

I realize that this might be difficult to organize (and do quality control), but I would imagine that there would be a lot of volunteers... Just a thought.


I *LOVE* the city shots! They are looking really great and I can't wait to see them populated with the models of buses and cars you've already shown...

Thanks again,
C_G

Hi Oleg

I totally agree with C_G and it would absolutely be a pleasure to do it. I have access to many professional recording studios and talented voice artists... If you send sample scripts or proposed reads, I can certainly make them happen...
We can also do multiple varients on theme or even some specialist reads.
(How about some Arnold Schwarzenegger chatter or maybe some Sean Connery... Or even Nelson Mandela)

I'm in South Africa - So any english dialect is simple to get done well (SA, Aus, English, irish, scots, American etc) are no problem at all... If you want I can even get you some radio chatter in Zulu or Xhosa... Its also no problem to get english reads in different ethnics accents (English in a German accent or English in a Japanese accent etc) Just say the word.

I could probably convince a couple of Professional voice artists to sign over usage rights... The offer is there.

[JG53Frankyboy]

We will have probably two versions from the beginning of release.

Bf110C-4 and C-7 ?! :)

[Oleg Maddox]

Will we be able to adjust colour & whitebalance to adjust it our own particular distorted view of the world?

There is the tool inside to adjust a lot of things in lighting and colors. The question is will be or not it fully accesible for end user. We will decide it after we will get all things in release of master.
On some of the early shots with the sky you may find the menu of this tool.

[Hatch]

There is the tool inside to adjust a lot of things in lighting and colors. The question is will be or not it fully accesible for end user. We will decide it after we will get all things in release of master.
On some of the early shots with the sky you may find the menu of this tool.

Ok thanks for answering.:)


Maybe a few presets like Real, Kodachrome or B&W

[PilotError]

Thanks for another great update Oleg.
It may have been a bit smaller, but it was full of amazing and interesting content.:cool:

I really like the communications. Much more information being given, with the possibility of AI kill stealing (hopefully) being a thing of the past.

It also looks like the Hurricane in shots 2 and 3 has a large round type spinner, while the Hurri in shot 5 seems to have the smaller pointy type spinner.
We may well be getting multiple variants of the Hurricane as well as the Bf110.:grin:

I'm really looking forward to buying this game, but every update is making the waiting all the harder.;)

Once again, thanks Oleg and team.

[d165w3ll]

Lovely screen-shots over east Kent. I just had a holiday there this July (grew up there too). All looking great - you can almost make out Walmer Castle, it seems. I wonder, is it actually modelled? A bit of a can of worms though, because there are dozens of castles in Kent. And ;) some amazing trees http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB0UEgW3Yfw

[=69.GIAP=TOOZ]

Perhaps this has been asked and answered before, but I was curious about the overall plan for the whole SOW series.

First release is Battle of Britain, mid-late 1940. What comes next? Perhaps the Mediterranean/N. Africa? Late 1940-mid/late 1941 with the release perhaps centred around Malta? Then maybe late 1941-mid 1942 centred on perhaps the desert campaign? Etc, etc.

Basically, is it the idea to release "Campaign Packs" or whatever you want to call them, with maps and aircraft, etc, directly related to those campaigns, or perhaps the releases will based on a timeline, with a 1941 expansion, 1942 expansion, etc?

And how far apart would these releases perhaps be? A year, two years?

I'm not looking for exact answers, I'm just curious what has been envisaged for the overall strategy of game expansion particularly when you consider the possibility of 3rd party contributions. Perhaps it would help to focus the efforts of those particular individuals who are capable and want to get their contributions included in the game on working on relevant projects that will help "complete" a given campaign set, or whatever. This would be better than what happened in the past where people would create models of random aircraft that they thought were cool rather than look at the overall game and figure out what was perhaps needed.

Of course, the fact that there are people who are willing to devote time and energy to these projects is a great thing, and certainly most people would want to create their dream fighter plane, or their favourite oddity, or whatever, but a little co-ordination in the future would be nice!

[Bolelas]

One question i have not yet seen the answer: can we program the keys to do other things than just press and realese, like we do on the keybord, have we options to add switches on-off, so cockpit builters dont have to use programs to map keys ?

Other question i was long looking was answered last week: if other pilots see our head turning as we change the direction to where we look. Oleg told game is prepared for that, but BOB will not have it for now.

Thanks all.

[Oleg Maddox]

Thanks for another great update Oleg.
It may have been a bit smaller, but it was full of amazing and interesting content.:cool:

I really like the communications. Much more information being given, with the possibility of AI kill stealing (hopefully) being a thing of the past.

It also looks like the Hurricane in shots 2 and 3 has a large round type spinner, while the Hurri in shot 5 seems to have the smaller pointy type spinner.
We may well be getting multiple variants of the Hurricane as well as the Bf110.:grin:

I'm really looking forward to buying this game, but every update is making the waiting all the harder.;)

Once again, thanks Oleg and team.

Yes, we model subtypes. Including types of props.

[d165w3ll]

Repetitive buildings are neccessary...

... and also realistic. There are some parts of England where housing consists od a large number of clones of a single design. I recall seeing a massive area of such in Preston, Lancs.

[JAMF]

Mr. Maddox, I don't know if these questions have passed here already, or if they have been answered, so here they are:

- Will we see raindrops on the windscreen, like in the original IL2 demo?
- Will we see rivets on the wing and would they be bump- or normal-mapped?
- Is surround gaming (3 screens) being taken into account in development? Flexible FoV? Or will there be an option for users wit 3 screens, to render the view through 3 viewports, like it was done in the racing simulation rFactor?
- Is the SoW engine ready for future 64Bit development, so it can use more than 2GB and load everything into memory on systems that have the memory? Like load all LoD models and all textures into memory to fill up 8GB?

[Insuber]

Hi Oleg,

Really nice screens. Love it.

Question: will you include a paper hardcopy manual, or just a pdf inside the DVD? A real book would be much appreciated ...

Cheers,
Insuber

[PilotError]

Yes, we model subtypes. Including types of props.

Thanks for the reply Oleg.

This just keeps on getting better and better.:grin:

[Oleg Maddox]

Perhaps this has been asked and answered before, but I was curious about the overall plan for the whole SOW series.

First release is Battle of Britain, mid-late 1940. What comes next? Perhaps the Mediterranean/N. Africa? Late 1940-mid/late 1941 with the release perhaps centred around Malta? Then maybe late 1941-mid 1942 centred on perhaps the desert campaign? Etc, etc.

Basically, is it the idea to release "Campaign Packs" or whatever you want to call them, with maps and aircraft, etc, directly related to those campaigns, or perhaps the releases will based on a timeline, with a 1941 expansion, 1942 expansion, etc?

And how far apart would these releases perhaps be? A year, two years?

I'm not looking for exact answers, I'm just curious what has been envisaged for the overall strategy of game expansion particularly when you consider the possibility of 3rd party contributions. Perhaps it would help to focus the efforts of those particular individuals who are capable and want to get their contributions included in the game on working on relevant projects that will help "complete" a given campaign set, or whatever. This would be better than what happened in the past where people would create models of random aircraft that they thought were cool rather than look at the overall game and figure out what was perhaps needed.

Of course, the fact that there are people who are willing to devote time and energy to these projects is a great thing, and certainly most people would want to create their dream fighter plane, or their favourite oddity, or whatever, but a little co-ordination in the future would be nice!

I can't tell exact things.
Even I wont tell it right now.
Everything will depends of success or not success of BoB... and income in both cases.

General: we plan next title that will use about half of the modelled units in BoB. It will be separate sim, self-sufficient sim, but with possibility to merge with BoB (Like it was with Pacific Fighters probably for the first time succesfull in the world practice of game development).
We also plan to expand by the same method in future with the third , etc... that to get then in future again large sim, that will play a lot of people opf different interest and some many years.

And, again, if all is Ok... then I should say that we already started together with third party team the third sim... and the name of this this probably will be anounced next month. Why the third will be anounced earlier than the second... for this is many reasons... One of them the team must be educated before they really will have output.

And again if all will be Ok... there was Korea in plan with dozens of things already modelled.

In parallel - promised tools for third party.
If success of BoB - then I expect third party teams making:
Aircraft
Ground and sea units
Online maps

in time - controlable by user ground units... including for the online gameplay.

Ok.... this is dreams and possible ways.
Everything is very complex and need great investments.

[Oleg Maddox]

Hi Oleg,

Really nice screens. Love it.

Question: will you include a paper hardcopy manual, or just a pdf inside the DVD? A real book would be much appreciated ...

Cheers,
Insuber

maybe no manual at all?
I don't think we will have paper manual... novadays it isn't real things in most cases... we are in the niche where we need economy very much that to be in profit and to develop the series.

[Insuber]

Roger Oleg tank you. No manual at all? I guess it is bit of late night humour, isn'it? :D

[Ctrl E]

oleg - have been looking at some old pics of the tanks and vehicles you have made. they are spectacular.

i'm curious about the opening hatches on the tanks. are we likely so see soldiers as well? will there be people on the ground or will the vehciles be empty?

keep up the great work. very excited about this game

[IceFire]

I can't tell exact things.
Even I wont tell it right now.
Everything will depends of success or not success of BoB... and income in both cases.

General: we plan next title that will use about half of the modelled units in BoB. It will be separate sim, self-sufficient sim, but with possibility to merge with BoB (Like it was with Pacific Fighters probably for the first time succesfull in the world practice of game development).
We also plan to expand by the same method in future with the third , etc... that to get then in future again large sim, that will play a lot of people opf different interest and some many years.

And, again, if all is Ok... then I should say that we already started together with third party team the third sim... and the name of this this probably will be anounced next month. Why the third will be anounced earlier than the second... for this is many reasons... One of them the team must be educated before they really will have output.

And again if all will be Ok... there was Korea in plan with dozens of things already modelled.

In parallel - promised tools for third party.
If success of BoB - then I expect third party teams making:
Aircraft
Ground and sea units
Online maps

in time - controlable by user ground units... including for the online gameplay.

Ok.... this is dreams and possible ways.
Everything is very complex and need great investments.

That all sounds very spectacular. Thank you for sharing what you can with us. I will have my fingers crossed for your success!

[=69.GIAP=TOOZ]

Thanks for the quick reply Oleg!! I'm very interested to hear the news of this 3rd title - is it perhaps Barbarossa?:grin:

[dflion]

Thanks Oleg, for another excellent update.

Quote: From Mason Hurricane Leader in pic
"Attention! Engage Fighters
Spread out!
Attack Scheme: Section by section
Mission Leader speaking. I'm going for the leader from the second element.
Forming up on your wing. Mason two!
I'll fly your wing, Mason three!
Mason four. Attack the leader from the first element
I've got your six. Mason five!
I'll fly your wing, Mason six!"

For me, this is an exciting new development for the BOB-SOW fight sim over the old IL2 order menu.
The Flight leader now obviously has more control of his individual pilots which will make the 'game play' much more interesting and immersive.

Some questions Oleg.
As Flight Leader will you be able to create your own commands, using a list of words the flight sim can be programmed to recognize.
For example: "Mason six. You are trailing heavy smoke - return to base"
Leader this is Mason two - I am out of ammo! Mason two this Mason Leader - return to base to re-arm. etc. etc.
Will the flight sim eventually have a voice recognition program - built in?
DFLion

[Ailantd]

Look for the sample bellow. It was done from your sample using professiona photo tool Lightroom 3.2 which I trust very much.

By simple clicking of special White balance tool on the grey surface of this photo where it must be grey by definition of light laws we get more real picture that was when the camera did the shot.
I also can to restore contrast, but already this one action is enough to imagine...

The camera never get the right color. We may get it right only after we already did the shot by using some rules.
In the other hand the human eye never remember the right color...just close approxination... and when again we see the picture of the same place human thinking that it is right colors.... It is a nature of human eye to brain work.
I can't spend the time to teach for the laws in light and its representation from matrix of the modern camera (even professional). I would say only that thing: the shots that are done non in RAW format with using some rules that to restore later the right colors are always wrong. Be sure. JPEG opf cameras can't show right color in complex light conditions that are in the air on altitude comparing to the thing for which they are designed... (also even there are not right)

And answering your question I already told above - not final.

However looking for my sample how it was really (close to that sample) you should think about.... or take some tiome to search for the white balace and color/colorcontrast distortions in digital cameras (or film - some other sort but also with great distortions)

Only these developers that don't know these laws make the "right colors" of the world in their products :):):)... Hope you understand what I said.

I think the problem is the "blue" and "violet" colors in some of the parcels.
I also live in a green land and that colors are never in the country here.

original:
http://test.ailantd.com/shots/BOBGroundColors_2.jpg

whit only green parcels
http://test.ailantd.com/shots/BOBGroundColors_1.jpg

[=69.GIAP=TOOZ]

Well, regarding the colour of the fields, they might be representative of lavender fields? And I'm sure I've seen crop fields of lettuces or cabbages or something that have that kind of blueish colour. But I'm no expert on the english countryside in 1940!

[Blackdog_kt]

Yay, i'm having reason to repeat myself again, like i do every week during the past month or two: this update is even better than the previous one which was better than the one before.
Also, what are you doing mr Maddox, revealing to the world your son is flying SoW? Hordes of flight sim fans are so jealous, the poor kid might get the evil eye. :-P

On more a serious note now. I read the entire thread and saw all the interesting and encouraging comments made by almost everyone, it's actually a very refreshing change to see it all come together and everyone voicing their opinions in a civil manner, even if we (naturally) can't all agree with eachother.

It also seems that mr. Maddox is on a good roll and feeling talkative today. Lot's of very good snippets worth their wheight in gold if you ask me, seems that whenever i think of a feature and go "nah, it's too complex or too small to do for the first release" the guy comes up and confirms it's already in the game engine :grin:

Some things that got my attention, based on previous posters and comments.

First of all, the terrain. Well, the thing is, we've seen so many variations over the past few updates that i'm sure they will be able to come up with the real deal, mix-and-matching the good points of each individual set of textures they've shown us thus far. I'm not worried, as colour and filters can probably be tuned ad infinitum during the life of the simulator. What i care about is having a robust foundation on which to build the terrain and it seems we have that.

The old terrain in the shots posted by Richie seemed right, maybe even a bit EAW-ish. Maybe that's why it seemed nice to me, i've been conditioned through years of flight simming to think that WWII Europe looked like this, so it could just be the familiarity factor kicking in. Apart from the obvious low resolution/WiP textures used, the colours seemed right, but the old terrain had one marked weakness: the trees didn't blend in right, maybe because the terrain was low-res and the trees were high res.

As for the new terrain, it now blends with the trees properly. Also as Sutts said, terrain undulations are visible from higher altitudes. I haven't lived in England, but from what i know the south of it is nowhere near an Alpine landscape, neither is it totally flat. In fact, this would make it harder to spot slight undulations or small rolling hills than it would be to distinguish boundaries between flat and mountainous terrain.
The fact that it's visible from moderate altitudes in the screenshots makes me believe they got it right.
As for colours they can always be tweaked. Heck, it could be a function of time of day and atmospheric conditions that creates such differences between the tilesets we see each week.

I think you don't take in account much more details that are in calculation to get just "a bit better" overal picture.

Lets begin from polygon count.

Compare details of tank in Il-2 and in BoB. This was cost several times increment of using power for each unit.
Now compare cars.
Now compare bridges.
Now compare roads
Now compare ships
Now compare planes. The last one is the most important in the fligth sim and here again like it was in Il-2 we have not compromisses for the ratio how it looks.. modelled functions and its damage model and modelled internals with all the listed above things alltogether...
Instead of some using our old models from Il-2 for their own sims with the little bit increment of polygons and size of textures (and repeating the same things that we did oursevlves with no info for details, some time even known for us wrong details(!) we are going with another goal - we try now to recreate planes outside and inside so close looking to real, that never was done before in any sim (even in add-ons for MS FS). And the masterpice is that its already used as a reference in some sources.... yes some time we are making non principal mistakes, but most are eliminated... or some tiome especiall make "mistakes" due to limits of technology
And we don't use some overdone effects that to represent them as used technology and show full illiteracy in some real laws....
And lets say that from the beginning we will offer more than others... its not just 2 or six planes flyable...
Did you count the amount of already shown ground units with its quality? Ah... maybe you don't like our wheels cars? Ok.... then just imagine Kursk Battle and its common polygon and textures count...
We think already now (or really much earlier) about future battles in a series. We think about common development in future of online gameplay together with thrid party....

Continue counting:

new more complex calcualtion for FM not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI for the ground units.... for the hundres visible at once. The war continues on the ground... massive war if to compare to any other sim... (however I still can say it about Il-2 as well)
New features of the ground units...
Special AI for the AA defence on the ground...

Ok, I'm tired... there is something more to count.... that maybe isn't going in final release but will be as addition in future.

All these things recall increment by exponent of power that we need to use.... Just think about it.

Il-2 inspired at least 3 other sims... with continues... more or less directly based on our Il-2 source code or learning our source code.... Il-2 created some amount of new teams and even new companies...

Should I say that we are thinking about future, about our experience with Il-2 (superb, good and sometime bad....)

Who remember how was developed Il-2 and its series I think understand what I would say now. Hint: we are not making one season game...






You like Il-2. Thats good. You like the amount of things that is done there by us and third party? Thats also good But please take in acount that all these things were developed after the first original Il-2....

Now will be the first new original sim that will be more open for increment....

This message isn't just for you... Its for all who doesn't see the difference now...

Tremendously encouraging message. Take note, this is the real meat of the update.

I know these guys can do pretty graphics, i'm not worried. Even if SoW released with 1990s vector graphics and they told us "you'll get your real graphics in a month with the first patch" i would still buy it, because i know they can do them right eventually ;)

It's the other things that i want to know more about and that's why i like this post. When they say the aircraft will be done with more complexity than 3rd party MSFS add-ons, it's music to my ears.

Also, i like how Oleg Maddox is so focused on the application of the laws of physics, not only with regards to the aircraft and the other units, but also the entire environment.
I think we won't be able to have 100% identical ingame and real life photo shots, because probably they are modelling this based on the way they average human eye sees it and not the average camera (as evidenced by his earlier reply with the attached photo comparison).
I guess it will become much more apparent if there are in-game filters that simulate different camera settings, so we could for example capture screenshots in natural view, 1940s kodak film view, modern digital camera view, etc.

There you go, the man pretty much confirmed there are plans to make it into a combined arms simulator later on,with the possibility of running massive online battles. Of course, all of this rests on how well BoB will sell, but the plans are there and the foundations have been confirmed to exist.

I'm guessing the first expansion will be mediterranean or an early battle (France or Poland), since he said the planeset will be very similar. When he mentioned the second expansion made by another company i thought he meant Korea, but later on he mentions it separately, so i really don't have any idea what the second expansion is going to be about.

The med should definitely be interesting. Maybe it's time to make some use of my contacts from the time i served my conscript duty in the air force and try to get access to some historical data...after my country was occupied, we had a few Squadrons operating in the desert under RAF command and taking part in all the major battles. Too bad i usually fly Axis planes and will be shooting my own countrymen down when the time comes to fly in that expansion :grin:

I hope the Over Flanders Fields team will switch to SoW and create a new WWI simulator. They have an enormous amount of research data stockpiled, which sadly the old CFS3 engine can't do justice.

Also, Korea would be a blast, especially if we had things like forward air controllers, dropping on smoke markers and such...but what i'm really hoping for that nobody has done to a high level of detail for years, is a Vietnam sim. There's such a great mix of different aircraft there, from late WWII to early jets, from Phantoms, Skyhawks, F-105s and helicopters down to C-47s, A-26 invaders, Skyraiders and even small, fragile Cessna O-1 Bird Dogs. Of course, i'd be flying the prop birds :grin:

Anyway, i'm getting ahead of myself here so let's get back into focus. Roll on SoW:BoB ;)

I also have some interface questions/suggestions. Mainly, will it be possible to assign complex functions to key presses or even have some of them hard-coded according to aircraft specifications?
An example of this is the landing gear mechanism. This also exists in IL2, where in aircraft with manual gear operation the pilot has to repeatedly press the key combination to extend/retract the gear.
In a similar fashion, some aircraft have gear that operate with a single lever. In that case, pressing "G" once would move the lever, again just like it happens already in IL2.

What i'm interested to know is if we could have a "send command until released" function, or a "command A on button press followed by command B on release" function.
This would be very good for simulating spring-loaded switches, or even for the player to be able to apply a continuous input without having to repeatedly tap the required key combination, but simply keeping it pressed and stopping the action by releasing it.

For example the Catalina used three way switches for the carburetor heaters, which were very prone to icing and needed constant monitoring. If you increased power they got too hot and you had to lower the heaters, if you decreased power they got too cold and you had to increase the heat, and so on. If we had these commands, i could map a key to function as "carb heat: switch to increase upon button press, switch to normal upon button release".

This could also work with things like the Cat's float retraction motors, or even the flaps on the P47 which also featured a 3-way control as far as i remember. This had 3 positions, up, down and neutral. There were no pre-sets to choose degrees of flaps, the pilot moved the lever aft to the "down" position and as long as he kept it there the flaps kept lowering. When he had dialed in the correct amount of flaps, he mover the lever back to the neutral position to stop them from extending further. For retraction, it was the same but this time moving the lever forward to the "up" position.

This is the reason the flaps on the P47 have clearly visible sencils near the wing root/fuselage, demarkating the amount of flap extension in degrees: the pilot would set the motor running, look out the canopy towards the wing roots and when he could read the correct amount of degrees on the flaps he would set the motor back to neutral.

Small details on the grand scale of things, sure, but it's these details that lend each aircraft its own particular feel and sense of character ;)

[pete410]

Ok So where do I pre-order this ? Steam ?

[He111]

OMG!! I'm IN LOVE!! :grin:

What super computer will I need to run this? Dell Alienware? i need to upgrade so give the command sire! :grin:


He111.

[LJ371]

This is awesome. As a Cinematographer I am fascinated with all the details, big and small, and especially with all the colors/lighting that will vary with the weather and time of day. I know how hard it is to understand colors and lighting, which is why I understand some people becoming so frustrated from week to week (but not all of them). However, I am very pleased with Oleg and team's evolution of gaming over the years. When I look at these screen shots, I am extremely impressed - especially because I am thinking of the big picture, the moving image.

From my good old memories of Dynamix's Aces over Europe (and Pacific), B-17 I and II, CFSs, Il2 onward, I'm more anxious than ever for BoB. And just when I get settled with the game i'm sure Oleg, his team, and 3rd party will be releasing ever more material. I cant wait to join everyone in the skies.

[AWL_Spinner]

Some interesting comments about tunable filters. For me I'd love to have the option of desaturating things from "real life" a bit.

That may sound a bit counter-intuitive but the WWII I know is the WWII from the movies, the Battle of Britain, Where Eagles Dare, guncams, old film stock, and that's the 1940s "world" I'd feel most familiar inhabiting. Just a tangental thought :)

I'm happy with whatever daytime palette Oleg serves up though, I watched First Light today and did note a couple of shots of Kent that looked very close to what we see in the SoW screenshots.

[swiss]

"Simply you should understand that more visible at once _different_ objects on the ground - more power we need for calculation."


Of course, I know it, but I'm still playing IL-2 (even the latest maps, with settings just reduced a little) with an old Athlon3000 with only 1 giga of ram and an old Radeon 9700pro and the game still looks good and playable.

In the next months, I will have a pc which will be much more powerful (but not a "war machine", just a good current pc) and I think it's quite reasonable to expect that a 2011 game will, at least, support some more elements on it than its ten-years old, very good, predecessor.



Huh?

You don't even know what IL2 looks like "all-out", yet you ask for more details in SoW, which again you won't even be able to enjoy, due to your future only midend PC?

Smart.

edit: haven't read OM's response when I posted.

[Spudkopf]

Ok, I must run immediatly at home.
My son will kill me... I promised to teach him today to attack the ships and how right to recover from a dive that to do not put his nose in water.... :)

So it seems to me everybody kind of missed out on the major point in of this update, so Oleg did you keep your promise and have a successful training session with your son and what was the aircraft in question? Also I’m quite curious to know your son's favourite plane?

By the way the He-162 is one of my all time favourite aircraft both in and out of the game and with Canon’s skins is a real joy to look at as well, although I must admit most of my in game play is dedicated to ground attack (with the odd bomber intercept thrown every now and again) and with a slight lean towards the aircraft of the axis, so I am now eagerly awaiting 4.10 so I can get my hands on the Hs-129 .

On that note it would be nice to see the Hs-123 and the Hs-126 in SOWBOB however I guess we may have to wait until the series heads east again for those two planes.

[swiss]

Hi Oleg,

Really nice screens. Love it.

Question: will you include a paper hardcopy manual, or just a pdf inside the DVD? A real book would be much appreciated ...

Cheers,
Insuber


A 500 pages book? Uh...

You know, there are some print shops who can turn a .pdf in real book. ;)

[swiss]

Dell Alienware? i need to upgrade so give the command sire! :grin:
He111.

Alienware?
You do know they suck? Especially form the price.
Never buy a branded system.

[Skoshi Tiger]

A 500 pages book? Uh...

You know, there are some print shops who can turn a .pdf in real book. ;)

Your right, but for the money I would be more inclined to pick up an ebook reader or IPad clone (I don't think I'ld be able to afford a real IPad, my money will going towards graphics upgrades I expect), then I'ld be able to look at the map pdf's as well!

By the time I got the SOW, A-10C and Rise of flight documents printed I'ld be up for some serious spoondoolies!

Cheers!

[zapatista]

oleg,

thank you for the update !

the cities look very good with dense housing/buildings, and i like the small fences placed around the front door gardens/courtyard that some english city houses do have in real life to. i suspect there will be similar (but much more) fences around some countryside houses ?

if you have a moment can you plz answer the questions this poster asked earlier ?
- i am particularly interested in the function of using 3 monitors and being able to set FoV's for them correctly (partic since the monitors might have to be DIFFERENT sizes, which requires a different FoV setting for each monitor)
- the 64 bit question and being able to use more ram is also important


Mr. Maddox, I don't know if these questions have passed here already, or if they have been answered, so here they are:

- Will we see raindrops on the windscreen, like in the original IL2 demo?
- Will we see rivets on the wing and would they be bump- or normal-mapped?
- Is surround gaming (3 screens) being taken into account in development? Flexible FoV? Or will there be an option for users wit 3 screens, to render the view through 3 viewports, like it was done in the racing simulation rFactor?
- Is the SoW engine ready for future 64Bit development, so it can use more than 2GB and load everything into memory on systems that have the memory? Like load all LoD models and all textures into memory to fill up 8GB?

[HFC_Dolphin]

Not much to say, these pictures are excellent and, along with previous updates, prove that game is almost finished.
I'm pretty confident that soon we'll be discussing about the release game :)

[Richie]

Well I hope DX11 Offers Oleg's team some performance improvement but not at the cost of eye candy. The promise of DX10 fell flat to be honest. Tesselation could be really help out with cockpit frames guages wheels etc at no extra cost depending on your hardware.

I will also be interesting to see how well multithreading and multicore could help out the simulation. That's no easy feat to pull off correctly.

I thought Dx 11 makes everything look better?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkWsVBpApOY

[furbs]

I think the problem is the "blue" and "violet" colors in some of the parcels.
I also live in a green land and that colors are never in the country here.

original:
http://test.ailantd.com/shots/BOBGroundColors_2.jpg

whit only green parcels
http://test.ailantd.com/shots/BOBGroundColors_1.jpg

To me that is much better...all it would need is dark hedgerows around the fields and it would be very good.

[Richie]

Roger Oleg tank you. No manual at all? I guess it is bit of late night humour, isn'it? :D

I still have my big original 2001 IL-2 box with it's thick manual. White pages with light gray lettering . After a couple of minutes my eyes were tearing up trying to read it. LOL Also on the Pacific Fighter box....That's the only product I've seen where the Axis fighter wins the fight in the art shown....Awesome!

[Flymo3000]

An excellent update, it's looking very good! A question about clouds:

We can see that clouds cast shadows onto the ground and buildings, and presumably onto planes, vehicles, etc... But will clouds also receive shadows? If there are multiple cloud layers the top layer should cast shadows onto the lower layer.

[major_setback]

.... we already started together with third party team the third sim... and the name of this this probably will be anounced next month. Why the third will be anounced earlier than the second... for this is many reasons... One of them the team must be educated before they really will have output.

And again if all will be Ok... there was Korea in plan with dozens of things already modelled.

....


Very interesting!!

[furbs]

Here is some pics i found of the english countryside...

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/9892/country4.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/2192/countryside3.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7969/countryside2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7623/countryside1.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

and here is a good one of the isle of wight...

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/8726/800pxrydeandbembridgeis.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

Now i know Oleg said the pic may not be a true image of the colours seen, we dont know time of day etc, but it is quite clear that the landscape should be alot darker with more green fields and dark hedgerows, and i dont see any lavender or bulish violet fields anyway....this is what i see everyday with my own eyes.

now compair it with this weeks shot...

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15


Now...i have to say this is the only problem ive seen with the SOW updates, everything else looks like it will set the new standard for flight sims.

[Osprey]

Here is some pics i found of the english countryside...

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/9892/country4.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/2192/countryside3.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7969/countryside2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7623/countryside1.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

and here is a good one of the isle of wight...

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/8726/800pxrydeandbembridgeis.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-16

Now i know Oleg said the pic may not be a true image of the colours seen, we dont know time of day etc, but it is quite clear that the landscape should be alot darker with more green fields and dark hedgerows, and i dont see any lavender or bulish violet fields anyway....this is what i see everyday with my own eyes.

now compair it with this weeks shot...

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg
By furbs9999 (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/furbs9999) at 2010-10-15


Now...i have to say this is the only problem ive seen with the SOW updates, everything else looks like it will set the new standard for flight sims.


So did you read Oleg's reply about this or did you just not understand a word of it?


It beggars belief. There are genuinely some people here that seem to be expecting real life with the imagery. I'm more interested in the FM and DM being accurate than whether or not the farmer has barley or potatoes in his fields.

As somebody already pointed out the real gems of information are not from the shots but Oleg's commentary this week, very exciting future but obviously dependent on finance. It makes me want to buy multiple copies just in case!!! ;)

[Tree_UK]

I understood what Oleg said perfectly well, he said we would have terrain far better than WOP/BOP and that the game would be cinematic. I believe him and i am certain that eventually we will start to see this. At the moment the terrain clearly still needs work and colour adjustment, Like Furby I live in England and spend every weekend mountain biking in the English country side, Olegs terrain is currently the wrong colours, see Furbs pics for the right colours. Other than that the update is excellent and thank you Oleg. Is it possible that we could have just one screenie in DX 11 in the near future.

[Osprey]

I don't think that any adjustment would bring about a positive comment from you

[Hatch]

wow guys, you really need to get you're monitors calibrated.
Nealy all of furbs photographs need some adjustments.
some even have a purple magenta cast LOL.

Certaily teh Isle of Wight one is all wrong

Reread oleg's comments about colours and perception.

[Spudkopf]

I only have the one problem with this shot.....

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg

.....and that is that sadly the Hurricane is partially cropped, or otherwise it would have made an excellent wall-paper ;)

By the way did any of those that are criticising take into account the distance haze effect at altitude that can turn what is brilliant contrast at low level into pastel blandness when higher up, I have seen it many a time when flying locally down-under and also when I’ve been over mainland Europe and the and the UK?

Just my thoughts!

[ChrisDNT]

"It beggars belief. There are genuinely some people here that seem to be expecting real life with the imagery."

Choosing the right color palette for the described area is not a matter of computer power, but a designer's choice.

"I'm more interested in the FM and DM being accurate than whether or not the farmer has barley or potatoes in his fields."

Good question, I've never heard anything until now about the energy model : has it be improved from Il-2, or said in another way will the energy fighters be able to be used in the sim as they were in real life against turn-and-burn fighters ?

[robtek]

...........
Good question, I've never heard anything until now about the energy model : has it be improved from Il-2, or said in another way will the energy fighters be able to be used in the sim as they were in real life against turn-and-burn fighters ?

Oh, you have the experience to tell the difference?
Or do you only have expectations fueled by reading and other, questionable sources?

[Sutts]

Look at all those little roads and lanes that have been modelled. Wouldn't it be great to take that little MG (we saw in a previous update) for a spin to the coast? Especially now we have all the undulations, woods, densely populated towns, breaking waves etc. Just exploring like this would be fantastic. Hope we have the use of a vehicle in one of the early releases.....:grin:

[ChrisDNT]

+++++++++++++++++++++++
wow guys, you really need to get you're monitors calibrated.
Nealy all of furbs photographs need some adjustments.
some even have a purple magenta cast LOL.

Certaily teh Isle of Wight one is all wrong

Reread oleg's comments about colours and perception.
+++++++++++++++++++++++

It's right, some of theses pictures have too vivid colors (but from the right shades of green), but on the other hand, the colors of the screenshots have become, this week, from too much vivid to too much pastel, and still with a wrong palette for the described area.

Btw, any medium capturing photons, either human eyes or a camera sensor, gives by definition its own rendering of reality (just compare for instance the differences between the Canon rendering and the Nikon rendering, or even more impressive the differences between the Bayer technology and the Foveon technology). At the times of the film technology, the rendering between Kodachrome 25 and Kodachrome 64 were different too, so were different the renderings between Velvia, Sensia and Provia.

That's to say that absolute veracity of a rendering is by definition a non-sense question (any medium is an aspect of the reality, not the reality), but what can be nevertheless attained is a common accurate probability of what is rendered. As an example, among photographers, it was commonly accepted that Provia gave a more realistic rendering of the reality than Velvia. But was Provia rendering the reality in an absolute exact way ? of course not.

[kendo65]

The colours certainly are changing and developing from week to week. I think with the complexity of the lighting model it is a difficult task to get things nailed down perfectly.

I'll preface what I'm about to say by observing that I'm really pleased with this week's update and the obvious progression that is apparent. I'm also confident that things will keep improving.

At the moment, I'd agree things are a little too pastel-shaded (though good point Spudkopf about the haze). Not so long ago it was looking over-saturated. With reference to the various photos posted (even bearing Oleg's caveats in mind), and from personal experience of the British countryside there is a certain 'vibrancy' to the greens in summer time that is hard to reproduce - it's all too easy to move into results that are too bright and over-saturated.

I'm looking forward to Oleg presenting us with the final version - judging by this post he seems confident:


textures the same. Simply more powerfull PC :):):)
And yes... still not final :):):):):)
You should wait for final looking ground :):):)

I don't have a problem personally with the lavender-shaded fields - I understand the effect they are going for.

Also noticed that the trees seem to be integrated into the rest of the terrain much better now - we're getting there!

[Hatch]

Of course but the brain behind it does all the interpretation.
And has to understand what it's seeing.

How many people just rely on postprocessing to get the right colour balance and only get the diff between a bayer sensor and a foveon when held side by side?

In most of the screenshots the woodland is rather sparse.
And the gamma a bit low (for my taste anyhow)

[Sutts]

Couple of questions if I may Oleg....

Will the waves move in the direction of the prevailing wind and will house smoke react to the wind too?

I love the densely populated towns you've shown us but I can't understand how it is possible with today's technology to model London in such a way. There are literally hundreds of thousands of homes spread over a huge area....
"Greater London stretched for a twenty-mile radius from Charing Cross".

Will you be making London smaller or less populated as you move away from the centre? Perhaps the suburbs will be a texture only??? Would be nice to know what we can expect.

Thanks

[swiss]

.

[swiss]

.

[swiss]

Will you be making London smaller or less populated as you move away from the centre? Perhaps the suburbs will be a texture only??? Would be nice to know what we can expect.

Thanks


Do you remember the game "Driver"?
They had a (quite small one) London map too.
And they also wanted to get it right.

They spent 1year and $1.000.000(or was it £?) just to get pictures for the textures of the houses along the road.

I jjust mention this so people understand the dimension of such a task.



Good question, I've never heard anything until now about the energy model : has it be improved from Il-2, or said in another way will the energy fighters be able to be used in the sim as they were in real life against turn-and-burn fighters ?

So what you say is, energy fighters can't be used against TnB fighters real-life like in IL2?

and that the game would be cinematic.

Ever thought about that your vision of cinematic is not coherent with his?

Strike commander for instance was also cinematic. ;)

[NLS61]

[QUOTE=Tree_UK;190135]the game would be cinematic.QUOTE]

In that case Oleg is both right and ready I still have to see one film that has all the colouring just right.
Further more when I’m flying my glider over Europe the sight (distance) is less than what I see in de screenshots.
But what I see I like a lot I'm somewhat of an illustrator and these pics while being rendered look fantastic it would be hard to get as good an result with an artist rendering.
So, Oleg, my hat of to you.
Niels

Just so that people have an idea what my reference is you can have a look at some of my work http://www.dbag.nl/pagina13.php

[Insuber]

I think you don't take in account much more details that are in calculation to get just "a bit better" overal picture.

Lets begin from polygon count.

Compare details of tank in Il-2 and in BoB. This was cost several times increment of using power for each unit.
Now compare cars.
Now compare bridges.
Now compare roads
Now compare ships
Now compare planes. The last one is the most important in the fligth sim and here again like it was in Il-2 we have not compromisses for the ratio how it looks.. modelled functions and its damage model and modelled internals with all the listed above things alltogether...
Instead of some using our old models from Il-2 for their own sims with the little bit increment of polygons and size of textures (and repeating the same things that we did oursevlves with no info for details, some time even known for us wrong details(!) we are going with another goal - we try now to recreate planes outside and inside so close looking to real, that never was done before in any sim (even in add-ons for MS FS). And the masterpice is that its already used as a reference in some sources.... yes some time we are making non principal mistakes, but most are eliminated... or some tiome especiall make "mistakes" due to limits of technology
And we don't use some overdone effects that to represent them as used technology and show full illiteracy in some real laws....
And lets say that from the beginning we will offer more than others... its not just 2 or six planes flyable...
Did you count the amount of already shown ground units with its quality? Ah... maybe you don't like our wheels cars? Ok.... then just imagine Kursk Battle and its common polygon and textures count...
We think already now (or really much earlier) about future battles in a series. We think about common development in future of online gameplay together with thrid party....

Continue counting:

new more complex calcualtion for FM not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI not just for several aircraft in air simultaneously
new way more complex AI for the ground units.... for the hundres visible at once. The war continues on the ground... massive war if to compare to any other sim... (however I still can say it about Il-2 as well)
New features of the ground units...
Special AI for the AA defence on the ground...

Ok, I'm tired... there is something more to count.... that maybe isn't going in final release but will be as addition in future.

All these things recall increment by exponent of power that we need to use.... Just think about it.

Il-2 inspired at least 3 other sims... with continues... more or less directly based on our Il-2 source code or learning our source code.... Il-2 created some amount of new teams and even new companies...

Should I say that we are thinking about future, about our experience with Il-2 (superb, good and sometime bad....)

Who remember how was developed Il-2 and its series I think understand what I would say now. Hint: we are not making one season game...






You like Il-2. Thats good. You like the amount of things that is done there by us and third party? Thats also good But please take in acount that all these things were developed after the first original Il-2....

Now will be the first new original sim that will be more open for increment....

This message isn't just for you... Its for all who doesn't see the difference now...

We see the difference, don't worry Mr. Oleg ... ;)

[Oleg Maddox]

+++++++++++++++++++++++
wow guys, you really need to get you're monitors calibrated.
Nealy all of furbs photographs need some adjustments.
some even have a purple magenta cast LOL.

Certaily teh Isle of Wight one is all wrong

Reread oleg's comments about colours and perception.
+++++++++++++++++++++++

It's right, some of theses pictures have too vivid colors (but from the right shades of green), but on the other hand, the colors of the screenshots have become, this week, from too much vivid to too much pastel, and still with a wrong palette for the described area.

Btw, any medium capturing photons, either human eyes or a camera sensor, gives by definition its own rendering of reality (just compare for instance the differences between the Canon rendering and the Nikon rendering, or even more impressive the differences between the Bayer technology and the Foveon technology). At the times of the film technology, the rendering between Kodachrome 25 and Kodachrome 64 were different too, so were different the renderings between Velvia, Sensia and Provia.

That's to say that absolute veracity of a rendering is by definition a non-sense question (any medium is an aspect of the reality, not the reality), but what can be nevertheless attained is a common accurate probability of what is rendered. As an example, among photographers, it was commonly accepted that Provia gave a more realistic rendering of the reality than Velvia. But was Provia rendering the reality in an absolute exact way ? of course not.

Nice comment. And right comment. I would add diffent compacts from which most of the shots we ussually see looking in exif of the shot :)

[Sutts]

>>Do you remember the game "Driver"?
>>They had a (quite small one) London map too.
>>And they also wanted to get it right.

>>They spent 1year and $1.000.000(or was it £?) just to get pictures for the >>textures of the houses along the road.

>>I jjust mention this so people understand the dimension of such a task.

I don't remember that one Swiss, I'll have to look it up. I agree it is a huge undertaking, even if the technology is capable of rendering such a large number of buildings.

I hope the city boundaries aren't shrunk since I like historical accuracy. I think I'd rather live with texture suburbs than an inaccurate map.

[Oleg Maddox]

[QUOTE=Tree_UK;190135]the game would be cinematic.QUOTE]

In that case Oleg is both right and ready I still have to see one film that has all the colouring just right.
Further more when I’m flying my glider over Europe the sight (distance) is less than what I see in de screenshots.
But what I see I like a lot I'm somewhat of an illustrator and these pics while being rendered look fantastic it would be hard to get as good an result with an artist rendering.
So, Oleg, my hat of to you.
Niels

Just so that people have an idea what my reference is you can have a look at some of my work http://www.dbag.nl/pagina13.php

Nice site! :)

[Oleg Maddox]

Couple of questions if I may Oleg....

Will the waves move in the direction of the prevailing wind and will house smoke react to the wind too?

I love the densely populated towns you've shown us but I can't understand how it is possible with today's technology to model London in such a way. There are literally hundreds of thousands of homes spread over a huge area....
"Greater London stretched for a twenty-mile radius from Charing Cross".

Will you be making London smaller or less populated as you move away from the centre? Perhaps the suburbs will be a texture only??? Would be nice to know what we can expect.

Thanks

No textures only.
The size of London is the same as it was in 1940

[rollnloop]

Dear Oleg, thanks very much for this update, i appreciate especially the insight on AI dialogues. I would appreciate a lot to have the ability to read subtitles on the lower part of the screen instead of the upper part, in order to still be able to see the world outside. The possibility to have these displayed white on a darkened back (a la EAW, FS) would be much appreciated too.


http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1146/land2.jpg

There are four things obvious to me in this screenshot:

1/I see pink/purple fields that look strange to my eyes. Maybe there are parts of england where they can be seen, but i hope it won't be the full landscape colored like this.

2/Edgerows are not there, there are highway wide roads instead, this does not look right either. If we can't have 3D trees on the edges, at least have green textures there, no grey highways.

3/Reflection on the cockpit (and other places) looks overbright and artificial, makes the whole aircraft look like a model kit with a big flashlight pointing it from a few feets behind the photographer. Is it HDR ?


4/Generally there seems to be many details on the ground, tweaking the bad won't as long or difficult as building the good of the whole scenery has been.

IL2 is my favorite simulator, and BoB will most certainly be too, but let's not repeat the colors problem from the former to the latter, for flight's sake. And please, please provide inside the game a gamma/brightness/color saturation setting, and the ability to turn HDR off.

Looking forward to seeing your next update, have fun with your son this week-end ! :)

[Sutts]

No textures only.
The size of London is the same as it was in 1940

Thanks for the quick reply Oleg! Sorry but just to be sure.....

Do you mean there will be no "texture only" areas?
If so then that would be quite an achievment.

Thanks

[Oleg Maddox]

oleg,

thank you for the update !

the cities look very good with dense housing/buildings, and i like the small fences placed around the front door gardens/courtyard that some english city houses do have in real life to. i suspect there will be similar (but much more) fences around some countryside houses ?

if you have a moment can you plz answer the questions this poster asked earlier ?
- i am particularly interested in the function of using 3 monitors and being able to set FoV's for them correctly (partic since the monitors might have to be DIFFERENT sizes, which requires a different FoV setting for each monitor)
- the 64 bit question and being able to use more ram is also important

64 bit supported in a separate EXE
3 monitors was possible. Didn't check it now... probably still works :)

[Skoshi Tiger]

Hmmm! Being Red-Green colour blind I don't know if I'm qualified to comment on this, but I cant see any real pinks and purples. Maybe they've got a touch of Patterson's Curse in their fields?

[Oleg Maddox]

Thanks for the quick reply Oleg! Sorry but just to be sure.....

Do you mean there will be no "texture only" areas?

Thanks

Yes I mean exatly what you like to know - no simple textures shown the city. No drawn cars by camera from above on the roads, no 2000 year sattelite maps with all its infrastructure drawn like it wasn't in 1940.....

Maybbe we will miss some historical objects, but I think creative users will make it exactly like it was in real life... read my posts above :)

[Sutts]

Yes I mean exatly what you like to know - no simple textures shown the city. No drawn cars by camera from above on the roads, no 2000 year sattelite maps with all its infrastructure drawn like it wasn't in 1940.....

Maybbe we will miss some historical objects, but I think creative users will make it exactly like it was in real life... read my posts above :)

Wow, this is great news Oleg. You guys are incredible.:grin:

[Oleg Maddox]

1. Reflection on the cockpit (and other places) looks overbright and artificial, makes the whole aircraft look like a model kit with a big flashlight pointing it from a few feets behind the photographer. Is it HDR ?


2. And please, please provide inside the game a gamma/brightness/color saturation setting, and the ability to turn HDR off.




1. Agree. This should read our programmer that all the times disagree with me and say me that all doing by this way then we must too.... For this statement I always try to explain that we are not like all... we should be better... :)
Don't worry. It will be tuned.

2... I hate called HDR compression.... But we must have it...
Tuned with HDR and then when you switch off the picture changes too much in colors. So probably toi switch this OFF is not the good idea. But maybe it will be saved in final.

[PeterPanPan]

Hi Oleg, thanks for the great update.

Not sure if this has been asked, but please can we have the option to display units in feet or metres? This would be in the speedbar, AI speech, gun convergence etc. In IL2, we are fixed with metres only?

Also, with the speech, it would be great if the term 'angels' was used, as it was in 1940 e.g. "climb to angels 10" = "climb to 10,000 feet"

Cheers

PPanPan

[Triggaaar]

This is all just too good, thanks Oleg3 monitors was possible. Didn't check it now... probably still works :)
I'm a bit surprised that no one where you're working has 3 monitors set-up, if it was planned to work on 3. I guess SOW on large monitor would be very nice, but 3 monitors just seems extra lovely.

[major_setback]

Look at all those little roads and lanes that have been modelled. Wouldn't it be great to take that little MG (we saw in a previous update) for a spin to the coast? Especially now we have all the undulations, woods, densely populated towns, breaking waves etc. Just exploring like this would be fantastic. Hope we have the use of a vehicle in one of the early releases.....:grin:


There will be no sign posts, they were taken down during the war. You will have to ask locals which road takes you back to the airfield.
Maybe this could be a future mod - selecting a message to ask the way and getting an answer from them ....Farmer: 'carry on for 3 miles, then turn left at the crossroads'.

We will need a compass in the car!