SOW sound

[furbs]

Do we have any idea how the sounds in SOW are being done?
For me, the sounds in a flight sim are very important, almost as important as the visuals.
Has Oleg talked about the sound engine in SOW? ive had a quick look about but couldnt find much info.

would be great to hear some SOW sounds in one of the weekly updates(hint Oleg) :grin:

[PeterPanPan]

ahh, the sound of silence!!

I agree though, sound is soooo important. Let's hope the same care has been taken with this as with the visuals, gameplay etc.

PPanPan

[diveplane]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TK6uNQoBAGY this is what we want ingame nothing less.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYLyrEsTZ60&feature=related

eax audio and doppler effects reverbs. :-)

[Oleg Maddox]

Do we have any idea how the sounds in SOW are being done?
For me, the sounds in a flight sim are very important, almost as important as the visuals.
Has Oleg talked about the sound engine in SOW? ive had a quick look about but couldnt find much info.

would be great to hear some SOW sounds in one of the weekly updates(hint Oleg) :grin:

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.

[Rodolphe]

...


That 109 spiraling spinner is a real hypnotic induction. :shock:

:grin:

...

[Sven]

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.

:grin: That 'sounds' damn good! I hope the rear gunner machine guns will sound an act like back in the days, that would make being a gunner Far more enjoyable! I always found the dull MG sounds annoying in Il2:(

[diveplane]

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.

love to hear some footage ingame oleg of the audio in progress .

mind its the flyby sounds you want to get right like the footage i added in this thread.

[Pablo]

Are you the Diveplane that made the awsome sound mod for Flaming Cliffs 2.0? If so i cant think of a single mod that has made more of an impact.

[Fafnir_6]

An update with sound would be greatly appreciated. PLEASE let the sounds in SOW be light years better than IL-2. There are other, older games that sound better than stock IL-2 does.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[Thunderbolt56]

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.


That's interesting, but will it negatively effect the depth and richness of the sounds by making them more ...for masses?.

I know for me personally, I want the sounds to be as complex and rich as possible and needing a high-end card to get that is not a big deal. So, hopefully, in an effort to market to the majority, those in the minority won't feel their sound card investment a waste.

[furbs]

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.


Thanks Oleg...looking forward to hearing the new sounds...is there a chance of having a listen to something this friday?

[Flanker35M]

S!

Can't wait either to hear them. Il-2 has good 3D sound if you got a very good sound card with good drivers..and properly setup. I do not think Oleg meant SoW sound engine is for masses or "derated", just better than in IL-2 working on broader selection of audio devices, giving the best possible audio experience. Now you do not need a hi-end card to get good results..or that is how I read Oleg's answer.

[philip.ed]

I read his answer as saying that the sound in SoW is unique to the game engine. So it doesn't matter too much on what type of sound card you have, as it won't really affect the unique sounds in SoW...
Either way, I can't wait to hear the SoW sounds ;)

[furbs]

I think the one thing we want to know is...will a spitfire sound like a spitfire :)

[Azimech]

It will probably sound like a Hurricane :-P

[philip.ed]

LOL. It should do. It can always be developed in patches. I think we're all expecting a 1946 out of the box. Well, Il-2 1946 wasn't like that on release, and 8-10 years down the line I think we'll be able to say the exact same about SoW.

[Fafnir_6]

I think the one thing we want to know is...will a spitfire sound like a spitfire :)

+1 This aspect of IL-2 can be improved upon SOOOOO much.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[WTE_Galway]

That's interesting, but will it negatively effect the depth and richness of the sounds by making them more ...for masses?.

I know for me personally, I want the sounds to be as complex and rich as possible and needing a high-end card to get that is not a big deal. So, hopefully, in an effort to market to the majority, those in the minority won't feel their sound card investment a waste.


Sorry but Win 7 and Vista do not support the audio features of the high end sound cards anyway.

[AA_Absolute]

The sound feature i wait in SOW, is disable radar sound (sneak attacks impossible now), and none could modify panning, hw or sw to hear external engines at 100 m and more.

Oleg say previously this exploit is lost in SOW Hurra!!!

"This was possible only on some types of sound cards - because of their simplified drivers.
In BoB it is impossible".

[diveplane]

Are you the Diveplane that made the awsome sound mod for Flaming Cliffs 2.0? If so i cant think of a single mod that has made more of an impact.

yes and thx

[LukeFF]

That's interesting, but will it negatively effect the depth and richness of the sounds by making them more ...for masses?.

I know for me personally, I want the sounds to be as complex and rich as possible and needing a high-end card to get that is not a big deal. So, hopefully, in an effort to market to the majority, those in the minority won't feel their sound card investment a waste.

TBH, unless one is a professional audio developer, today's high-end sound cards don't really offer all that much more than onboard sound. I pulled out my Creative Audigy 2 about a year ago in favor of my onboard Realtek sound hardware and have never noticed any difference in audio quality.

[Thunderbolt56]

I'm certainly not a Professional sound developer, but I notice a difference from on board sound to my X-Fi (with the X-Fi sounding better). Maybe I'm just hypersensitive to the sounds at this point, but I don't think so.

I've got a squad mate that actually has on board X-Fi with HD sound which would be fine with me. My only desire is to have as complex and rich sounds as possible.

[T}{OR]

TBH, unless one is a professional audio developer, today's high-end sound cards don't really offer all that much more than onboard sound. I pulled out my Creative Audigy 2 about a year ago in favor of my onboard Realtek sound hardware and have never noticed any difference in audio quality.

Honestly, CL Audigy 2 isn't much of a card anyway. :) I do agree, nowadays MBO sound cards are much better than few years back and if you're going to invest into a sound card you need to spend more money than before. That is of course, if you have the equipment to hear the difference, and I am not talking about any PC speakers - they are all toys.


Then there are Win Vista and Win 7 - no hardware support or acceleration other than OpenAL. Which renders EAX 5.0 and similar cards useless (for gaming). This is a bigger problem than the quality of the sound card itself.

[MoHaX]

Sound engine is uniquie. Way morte advanced than in Il-2. Again, like in Il-2 there is absolutely new features on the market in the sound engine.

And it will run undependant of sound car type. Sound engine of Il-2 was developed for high eng cards. And only using such card user was able to get all effects of realistic 3D sound. That is good but not for masses.

Does it mean that SOW will not benefit from powerfull soundcards such as Creative X-Fi and all sound processing will be done in software?
I mean does it worth to buy good sound card, will performance be better?

[Feuerfalke]

TBH, unless one is a professional audio developer, today's high-end sound cards don't really offer all that much more than onboard sound. I pulled out my Creative Audigy 2 about a year ago in favor of my onboard Realtek sound hardware and have never noticed any difference in audio quality.


I always got to LOL a bit, when reading such comments.

It's the same as playing a modern game with onboard graphics and claiming there is no difference between an onboard gfx-chip and a PCIe DX11 card.

And you know what? I would believe you! Modern onboard graphics play modern games, just at lowest detail settings and crappy FPS. But of course, if you play the game on a 15" TFT with 50ms and 640x480 pixels monochrome, you won't notice a difference, if you have a DX11 PCIe card or an onboard chip.

And you know what's the only difference between both examples?
1. Soundsettings are adapted automatically. If you don't have the hardware, you can't use these features. You'll never know the difference.

2. If you'd record an IL2-track in your high-end machine and sent it to me with above machine, your track would look the same crap as always, while it's great for you. I'd never know the difference and think my above rig is top-notch.
The same way, if I send you a soundrecord from my PC with a 200$ soundcard + 120$ hifi-headphones, you'll never know the difference, because the sound is rendered on your chip and displayed on your 10$ skype-headset.

3. It's not only about the rendering, it's about the periphery. If you have a 3$ headset, a 200$ soundcard won't help you and vice versa.

[blades96]

The sound is one of the few areas where gaming can very closely match real life, so i hope some care is taken. It was one of the few aspects of Il2 that was a letdown. In the cockpit the engine would have drowned out everything except the radio.

Also, it would be nice to get some contemporary lingo for the pilot chatter as well, to help with the pilot characterisation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rKYL0tW-Ek

[brando]

....... If you have a 3$ headset, a 200$ soundcard won't help you and vice versa.

Your comments hit the bull's-eye there FF. I think this is one of the game-developers' biggest challenges - making sure that the game will look and sound good enough to satisfy those who own low and mid-range (modern) PCs, rather than just the overclocked, bleeding-edge, top-of-the-range-gaming-rigs' owners.

If the IL-2 series is a good comparison, then that challenge will be met for SoW-BoB. Of course it will look and sound better on a high-end machine (provided the headphones match the soundcard of course) and that is why we pay that premium. But we should spare a thought for the people who can't afford to reach those heights. If the game captivates them they will help to support the new product which can only be a good thing for all of us. We all know how it goes - once you're under the spell then you start upgrading to see what you're missing! ;)

Sorry to go off topic - I just wanted to give another view on the tech debate.

[LegTaste]

2. If you'd record an IL2-track in your high-end machine and sent it to me with above machine, your track would look the same crap as always, while it's great for you. I'd never know the difference and think my above rig is top-notch.
The same way, if I send you a soundrecord from my PC with a 200$ soundcard + 120$ hifi-headphones, you'll never know the difference, because the sound is rendered on your chip and displayed on your 10$ skype-headset.


I doubt it would make any difference what sound card you are using to make the recording, as long as it fully supports the sound engine of the game, it stays in an untouched digital format.

The main area where cheap soundcards fail/show their cheapness is with the DAC and output section of the card, which only concerns itself with putting a voltage out to the speakers or headphones.


The only reason to make use of soundcard hardware would be to free up the cpu, and its the same with graphics cards, theres nothing your GPU can do that your cpu couldn't in software, the problem is you would be playing your games at 1fps or less.

[fireflyerz]

I think were all just hoping that a merlin sounds like a merlin , a db sounds like a db and so on and that when heard in a flyby the doppler is on the money and all the rest, how cheap or expensive your audio setup is has little to do with the above.

[T}{OR]

i think were all just hoping that a merlin sounds like a merlin , a db sounds like a db and so on and that when heard in a flyby the doppler is on the money and all the rest, how cheap or expensive your audio setup is has little to do with the above.

+1000

[LukeFF]

I always got to LOL a bit, when reading such comments.

It's the same as playing a modern game with onboard graphics and claiming there is no difference between an onboard gfx-chip and a PCIe DX11 card.

And you know what? I would believe you! Modern onboard graphics play modern games, just at lowest detail settings and crappy FPS. But of course, if you play the game on a 15" TFT with 50ms and 640x480 pixels monochrome, you won't notice a difference, if you have a DX11 PCIe card or an onboard chip.

Laugh all you want. I use Sony MDR-7506 headphones and the Logitech Z-5500 5.1 surround sound system. It doesn't matter the game I play - ROF, Arma2, DCS BS - I noticed no difference in audio quality going from my Creative card (it was an X-Fi, not an Audigy) to my mobo Realtek audio system.

That, and now I don't have to deal with all the bloatware and multiple audio control panels that come with Creative cards. Realtek's audio control panel is a hundred times easier to manipulate.

[Fafnir_6]

I think were all just hoping that a merlin sounds like a merlin , a db sounds like a db and so on and that when heard in a flyby the doppler is on the money and all the rest, how cheap or expensive your audio setup is has little to do with the above.

+1,000,000

Well put.

Fafnir_6

[Feuerfalke]

Laugh all you want. I use Sony MDR-7506 headphones and the Logitech Z-5500 5.1 surround sound system. It doesn't matter the game I play - ROF, Arma2, DCS BS - I noticed no difference in audio quality going from my Creative card (it was an X-Fi, not an Audigy) to my mobo Realtek audio system.

That, and now I don't have to deal with all the bloatware and multiple audio control panels that come with Creative cards. Realtek's audio control panel is a hundred times easier to manipulate.

I could ask you a few technical questions and which settings you made in Creative and Alchemy or why you chose three games without native EAX/5.1-support, but I think the last two sentences answered all these questions already.

[Feuerfalke]

I doubt it would make any difference what sound card you are using to make the recording, as long as it fully supports the sound engine of the game, it stays in an untouched digital format.

You missed the point.

If I sent you my professional record and you replay it with your cellphone, be sure it won't sound the same for me and you, though the digital format remains untouched either.

[Tree_UK]

You missed the point.

If I sent you my professional record and you replay it with your cellphone, be sure it won't sound the same for me and you, though the digital format remains untouched either.

When i was a professional musician, whenever we made records we would always try to master the final cut version so it sounded good on all media, be it TV, radio or hi-end audio systems but mainly aimed at radio because this is where most people will first hear your track, this was far more difficult than you can imagine, how many times have you heard a track on the radio, then go and buy the cd to play it on your high end audio equipment only to be amazed at the difference. what sometimes sounds great on the radio can have a lot more 'top end' when played on high quality gear. Whenever i used to play the records i'd recorded to my mother and farther I used to wish that they had better equipment so they could hear it as it was supposed to sound.
I guess this is the difficulty Oleg will face in trying to make the sounds work on all sound card formats, but generally if you have quality amp/soundcard and quality speakers/headphones you should hear it in all its glory.

[LukeFF]

I could ask you a few technical questions and which settings you made in Creative and Alchemy or why you chose three games without native EAX/5.1-support, but I think the last two sentences answered all these questions already.

Arma2 supports 5.1, and I believe ROF does as well:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showpost.php?p=1447386&postcount=3

As for EAX, it's nothing but a gimmick.

[amirite]

You missed the point.

If I sent you my professional record and you replay it with your cellphone, be sure it won't sound the same for me and you, though the digital format remains untouched either.

But if your cellphone had a digital out to a good stereo system then it would sound as good as the record... thats exactly the whole point everyone is trying to make.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Laugh all you want. I use Sony MDR-7506 headphones and the Logitech Z-5500 5.1 surround sound system. It doesn't matter the game I play - ROF, Arma2, DCS BS - I noticed no difference in audio quality going from my Creative card (it was an X-Fi, not an Audigy) to my mobo Realtek audio system.

That, and now I don't have to deal with all the bloatware and multiple audio control panels that come with Creative cards. Realtek's audio control panel is a hundred times easier to manipulate.

I tend to use my ears.

[LukeFF]

I tend to use my ears.

Exactly. :)

[T}{OR]

But if your cellphone had a digital out to a good stereo system then it would sound as good as the record... thats exactly the whole point everyone is trying to make.


That is one of the most absurd remarks I have heard so far. Cellphones producing quality audio?! :D

Please do read before you post stuff like that. ;)

[swiss]

That is one of the most absurd remarks I have heard so far. Cellphones producing quality audio?! :D

Please do read before you post stuff like that. ;)

Well he's right, if the cellphone in this case is reduced to a SSD, and the stero system has it's own sound processing unit.

Don't think he got it though.

[T}{OR]

Yes. Any musician and especially an audiophile will tell you that the requirements for a good sound system and sound by itself - are all components of an equal quality. Just like the chain - the weakest link is the problem here. Or in this case the cell phone.

If however, you could just read the data of the cell phone like from an SSD or HDD like you say, and then leave it for a stereo system to process and reproduce it, then we're talking about a different thing.

However, I doubt this is what amirite meant. ;)