Battle of Britain - Memorial Thread

[nearmiss]

Battle of Britain



Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNOKXfZTEAE&feature=related
Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t43w9oFIXcU&feature=related
Part 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzGuO9-Ssd4&feature=related
Part 4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfR35QCr-Oo&feature=related
Part 5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urx6HuoSPFU&feature=related
Part 6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmUTc82sG2s&feature=related
Part 7
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXs0-cFMERo&feature=related
Part 8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu38XSMwGPs&feature=related
Part 9
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-BJ2EKtbUA&feature=related
Part 10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yVOSTO9D_0&feature=related
Part 11
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ-2X609LRE&feature=related
Part 12
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rx7RtBNsoU&feature=related
Part 13
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7anOmDl6Bc&feature=related
Part 13
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXvEXxxx9KM&feature=related

[rakinroll]

Nearmiss, do you think that this movie is not realistic on dogfight scenes? No bullets and tracers, damaging on planes, Buchóns instead of Emils etc... I think major film companies can do.

[Blackdog_kt]

It's quite an old movie to be honest. I think that for what they had available at the time, it's reasonably well done.

It's interesting to note that while today we have computer graphics and it would be possible to make better movies, most of the times what happens is that the CGI is used to create unrealistic sequences.

The Pearl Harbor movie for example. On one hand you marvel at how nice the planes look, on the other hand you can't help but notice that the protagonist's squad are flying Spit Mk.Vs in Battle of Britain as he takes on the entire luftwaffe on his own, while his squadmates crash all around him :-P
It's not that we don't have the means, it's the fact that they're taking shortcuts with their research resulting in inaccuracies and altering things to make it more of a "show".

However, i think the remake of the Dambusters movie will be good as it's being developed by Peter Jackson (the guy who directed the lord of the rings). In the final LOTR movie they decided to make a 1/72 scale of Minas Tirith (the white city shaped like a tower) instead of making it all in computer graphics. According to Jackson with computers you must place everything by hand. Miniatures are extra work initially, but you have the chance of getting some really good shots when rotating the light sources around it and playing with ambient lighting and backdrops. In a computer generated scene, you'd have to specify it all manually in the rendering software.

Furthermore, apart from being a director who knows how to optimally blend CGI and scale models for his special effects, Jackson is well known for his interest in history and aviation. He also made a small film for the WWI Anzac museum, using special cameras. Visitors of the museum sit in a recreation of a WWI trench and the film is projected on the wall, giving the impression that they are on an actual battlefield as the troops go over the top to assault enemy trenches. I think he was also involved in a project to build a replica of a WWI FE2b reconnaisance two-seater biplane, built 100% according to the original and actually powered by a restored, original WWI engine. You can see it flying, as well as the build process, on the vintage aviator website, along with other WWI planes like an Albatross and an Se5a: http://thevintageaviator.co.nz/

Sorry if i'm going off topic, but i got a sudden memory flashback and i thought people who don't know about the dambusters remake might be interested. I think it's encouraging that a person with such a background is doing it.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Sorry if i'm going off topic, but i got a sudden memory flashback and i thought people who don't know about the dambusters remake might be interested. I think it's encouraging that a person with such a background is doing it.

I've heard a rumour that the Dambusters project is on hold as he was basing it on a book written by someone who's had their credibility blown out of the water, but correct me if I'm wrong coz I may well be.

I watched the BoB film again last week for the umpteenth time.
My Dad took me to the pictures to see it on release in 1969. I was 7.
I still think it's a goodish representation of the events of the Battle.
Sure, some of the scenes are out of synch, like when the 109 strafes the airfield, but the 'bullet strikes' only occur after the plane has gone, but like Blackdog says, at least they were real planes in a real sky.
Apart from all the models they blew up that is!

'So don't threaten or dictate terms until you're marching up Whitehall, and even then we won't listen!' - Absolutely Classic.

[nearmiss]

Bumped this thread for some of you that might want to see the film Battle of Britain.

[WTE_Galway]

Buchóns instead of Emils .

Actually not just the Emils.

The Heinkels are also Hispano licenced Merlin powered variants of the he111.

You can clearly see this at 0:37 of part 2 above. The German he111 had exhausts along the dividing line between top and bottom camo rather than at the top of the cowl like the ones in the movie.




Regardless. personally I think the old Battle of Britain film with actual flights of real aircraft (albeit post war variants) is more authentic than any Hollywood/CGI mock-up can ever be.

[dflion]

It's quite an old movie to be honest. I think that for what they had available at the time, it's reasonably well done.

It's interesting to note that while today we have computer graphics and it would be possible to make better movies, most of the times what happens is that the CGI is used to create unrealistic sequences.

The Pearl Harbor movie for example. On one hand you marvel at how nice the planes look, on the other hand you can't help but notice that the protagonist's squad are flying Spit Mk.Vs in Battle of Britain as he takes on the entire luftwaffe on his own, while his squadmates crash all around him :-P
It's not that we don't have the means, it's the fact that they're taking shortcuts with their research resulting in inaccuracies and altering things to make it more of a "show".

However, i think the remake of the Dambusters movie will be good as it's being developed by Peter Jackson (the guy who directed the lord of the rings). In the final LOTR movie they decided to make a 1/72 scale of Minas Tirith (the white city shaped like a tower) instead of making it all in computer graphics. According to Jackson with computers you must place everything by hand. Miniatures are extra work initially, but you have the chance of getting some really good shots when rotating the light sources around it and playing with ambient lighting and backdrops. In a computer generated scene, you'd have to specify it all manually in the rendering software.

Furthermore, apart from being a director who knows how to optimally blend CGI and scale models for his special effects, Jackson is well known for his interest in history and aviation. He also made a small film for the WWI Anzac museum, using special cameras. Visitors of the museum sit in a recreation of a WWI trench and the film is projected on the wall, giving the impression that they are on an actual battlefield as the troops go over the top to assault enemy trenches. I think he was also involved in a project to build a replica of a WWI FE2b reconnaisance two-seater biplane, built 100% according to the original and actually powered by a restored, original WWI engine. You can see it flying, as well as the build process, on the vintage aviator website, along with other WWI planes like an Albatross and an Se5a: http://thevintageaviator.co.nz/

Sorry if i'm going off topic, but i got a sudden memory flashback and i thought people who don't know about the dambusters remake might be interested. I think it's encouraging that a person with such a background is doing it.

Thanks for this post Blackdog_kt.
I have been down to the Australian War Memorial 5 times in the last 4 years and was just completely 'over-awed' by Peter Jackson's WW1 aerial combat recreation. When you see people walk away from the presentation (who are not aviation enthusiasts) completely 'over-awed' by the reality of the presentation and what those WW1 pilots endured (from both sides), you know Peter Jackson is a real aviation enthusiast.

I am sure his recreation of the 'Dam Busters' will be a masterpiece in aviation historical films. I often thought he should be talking to Oleg to get the CGI graphics just right (hopefully he is?).

You are right about the film 'Pearl Harbour' - the CGI graphics were very well done, though not by an aviation entusiast/historian and thats where the film fell down.

Wouldn't it be fantastic if Peter Jackson and Oleg Maddox co-produced a new 'Battle of Britain' film with well known current English and German actors and of course an excellent written script, fair to both sides and the best musical score that could be written.

DFLion

[furbs]

This thread(the movie part) should be a sticky :)

[Wutz]

Also in this movie all the mentioned German squadrons are fakes.
KG726 or those wacky squadron emblems on the German planes....that could have been done better. But all in all a nice movie. I just don´t like the part where that silly blonde tyke appears, that is so ugh especially with her sixties hairdo.

[JG52Uther]

My favourite film ever,watched it countless times.
And a very apt posting Nearmiss! ;)

[Qpassa]

I loved when I watch it, better in DVD!

[mazex]

Actually not just the Emils.

The Heinkels are also Hispano licenced Merlin powered variants of the he111.

You can clearly see this at 0:37 of part 2 above. The German he111 had exhausts along the dividing line between top and bottom camo rather than at the top of the cowl like the ones in the movie.




Regardless. personally I think the old Battle of Britain film with actual flights of real aircraft (albeit post war variants) is more authentic than any Hollywood/CGI mock-up can ever be.

I have no problem with the spanish Buchons and Casas either as they really shot the scenes with tons of them! The production team actually had the 35:th largest airforce in the world in 1969 during the shooting of this movie - and the scenes where shot from a B-25. Cool ;)

From IMDB:

"27 Spitfires in various degrees of repair were found for the film, 12 of which could be made airworthy. Only six Hurricanes where found, three of which were made flyable. The Messerschmitt 109 where all retired from the Spanish Air Force. The production company bought them all, about 50 of them, and put 17 of them back in flying condition. They are in the movie flown by Spanish Air Force pilots, and members of the Confederate Air Force. The 32 Heinkels, with crews, were on loan for free from the Spanish Air Force, where they still were used for transport and target towing. Two of them were eventually bought by the production company and flown together with the 17 Messerschmitts to England for further shooting. The two Junkers 52 were also on loan from the Spanish Air Force. "

There is a lot of more fun trivia at IMDB:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064072/trivia

PS - I have a hard time criticizing a BoB movie that had Adolf Galland as technical advisor ;)

[Feathered_IV]

Nearmiss, are you a Mod here?

[nearmiss]

This thread(the movie part) should be a sticky :)

I love the film. I've seen it a dozen times and still enjoy it.

I posted this link last night in a discussion. Watching the Spits just got my juices flowing.

The music is kinda moody, but those roaring spits push the envelope for excitement... for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUx3MU9iM6c

The BOB film ws made over 40 years ago(1969), when they still had some of the WW2 aircraft flyable or that could be made flyable.

I just enjoy seeing all the aircraft, even if there is quite abit of actor staging kinda junk going on.

It will go up sticky for a while and we'll see what the interest is.

Actually, it might be a valuable thread, if other members share things that are memorable to them about the Battle of Britain.

There might be a better higher resolution version out there on the web. Post the links, if so in this thread.

I can always edit this thread and point to a better version.

[Neil Lowe]

I love this movie, and dig the DVD out from time to time. Even if they did "tape a few cats together" It's still a great movie :)

Cheers, Neil :)

[nearmiss]

I agree with the excited passenger... what a ride!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3b8NOlqCDhc&feature=related

[major_setback]

Nearmiss, are you a Mod here?
He is.

Moderators are shown on the bottom right of the main Il2 page.

[RCAF_FB_Orville]

I love the film. I've seen it a dozen times and still enjoy it.

I posted this link last night in a discussion. Watching the Spits just got my juices flowing.

The music is kinda moody, but those roaring spits push the envelope for excitement... for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUx3MU9iM6c

The BOB film ws made over 40 years ago(1969), when they still had some of the WW2 aircraft flyable or that could be made flyable.

I just enjoy seeing all the aircraft, even if there is quite abit of actor staging kinda junk going on.

It will go up sticky for a while and we'll see what the interest is.

Actually, it might be a valuable thread, if other members share things that are memorable to them about the Battle of Britain.

There might be a better higher resolution version out there on the web. Post the links, if so in this thread.

I can always edit this thread and point to a better version.



Love that Spit show vid Nearmiss, its in my YT faves too. Brings a proud tear to me eye, so it does *sniffle.....lol* :) Fantastic flying with the synchronised looping at 2.40+ too. :)

[Trumper]

No-one should knock this film.It couldn't be made today and it saved a huge amount of airframes for the future.
Piece of Cake was the nearest thing to it and that only mustered a few Spits and a Buchon or 3.
Modern variants still lean heavily on footage from this 1969 film.

[1.JaVA_Sharp]

RIP section officer Maggy Harvey


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1347558/Susannah-York-dies-aged-72-cancer-battle.html

[JG52Uther]

:(

[nearmiss]

Sad for sure. Just the other night after posting on this thread I went to Wikipedia and IMdb to look up on her. She was still alive then. I thought, how great that was.

Now just a couple days later she is gone.

Robert Shaw, Trevor Howard - great actors gone too.

Robert Shaw an awesome actor. I can't tell you how many time I've seen his films and didn't realize it was him. That to me is a sign of an excellent actor.

[RCAF_FB_Orville]

Rest in Peace Sweet heart, one of the best.

[kristorf]

Indeed R.I.P to a beautiful (in her day) woman

[Flying Pencil]

Actually not just the Emils.

The Heinkels are also Hispano licenced Merlin powered variants of the he111.

You can clearly see this at 0:37 of part 2 above. The German he111 had exhausts along the dividing line between top and bottom camo rather than at the top of the cowl like the ones in the movie.




Regardless. personally I think the old Battle of Britain film with actual flights of real aircraft (albeit post war variants) is more authentic than any Hollywood/CGI mock-up can ever be.

CASA 111's

A good movie 15 min shy of greatness.

I hope they do a remake.

[Flying Pencil]

No-one should knock this film.It couldn't be made today and it saved a huge amount of airframes for the future.
Piece of Cake was the nearest thing to it and that only mustered a few Spits and a Buchon or 3.
Modern variants still lean heavily on footage from this 1969 film.

"Dark Blue World" (Czech: Tmavomodrý svět) used some BoB footage, but also some new Spit footage.

[Wutz]

"Dark Blue World" (Czech: Tmavomodrý svět) used some BoB footage, but also some new Spit footage.

Hmm I find the series "Foyles war" more interesting than "Dark Blue World" that film feels uncomplete. I mean they show how their country is invaded, then they are all of a sudden in Britain, they do their training, into the Battle of Britain, the oblegatory love affair not to be missed by any movie, the battle carries on, with flashes forward where they are imprisioned, and how they are released finally.......but what happens in between. It is just Battle of Britain and then early fifties....except for individual scenes I found that movie a bit disappointing.