Hurricane panel lines?

[Tree_UK]

Hi guys Ive been admiring Olegs hurricanes but something just didn't look right to me, and after a while I realised it was the panel lines on the cowling, there is just simply too many of them. Obviously these are only WIP's but i thought i would point it out so it can be resolved later. I know that the Mk11 Hurricane showed these panel lines but these only appeared in September 1940 and in small numbers.

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/2687/hurri.jpg (http://img843.imageshack.us/i/hurri.jpg/)

http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/4585/bb2a601.jpg (http://img828.imageshack.us/i/bb2a601.jpg/)


http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/7872/mk1hurri.jpg (http://img85.imageshack.us/i/mk1hurri.jpg/)

http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/8325/1754654.jpg (http://img245.imageshack.us/i/1754654.jpg/)

[furbs]

Well ive been looking all over the net at wartime pics of mk1 hurricanes and i cant find one pic of a hurri with that many panel lines on the cowling...so you might have something here Tree.

[Feathered_IV]

Those are shadow lines representing the lines of rivets that secure the metal skin to the structural ribs underneath. Slightly heavy handed compared to the real thing, but certainly not representing panel lines as such. Two of the seven lines you indicated (number 3 and 7) are panel edges. The rest are rivet shadows.

Not so sure about the 'aluminium' showing around bullet holes in the fabric though...

[furbs]

Do we know if we are getting both Mk1 and Mk2 types in SOW?

[Tree_UK]

You could be right buddy but i cannot find any images of Mk1 Hurri's that replicate those shadow lines. :confused:

[Feathered_IV]

Here's a pic showing the position of the rivets as an example. I think they were puttied over normally though, but it gives an indication of the position of framework under the cowl panels. The in-game shot is just heavy handed skinning I think.

http://data3.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/hurricane_iia/images/hurricane_iia_11_of_31.jpg

[Tree_UK]

Here's a pic showing the position of the rivets as an example. I think they were puttied over normally though, but it gives an indication of the position of framework under the cowl panels. The in-game shot is just heavy handed skinning I think.

http://data3.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/hurricane_iia/images/hurricane_iia_11_of_31.jpg

Yeah definately see it on the first part of the cowling there Feathered but nothing on the second part that goes towards the cockpit. :grin:

[Sturm_Williger]

Looking really closely at the pic that Richie linked in the other thread, you can make out the faintest of shadow lines that correspond to the "panel lines" you mention.

Also the wip pic of the Hurricane parked by the hanger, you can actually see that the central line IS a panel line and the others are more shadowed. So I'm inclined to agree with Feathered that it is heavy handed skinning.

[IceFire]

Do we know if we are getting both Mk1 and Mk2 types in SOW?

So far we've only seen the Mark I but it wouldn't take much to see a Mark II show up. They came into service in November or December 1940 if I remember correctly. Not sure when the Mark IIb specifically arrived.

[speculum jockey]

Are we going to get a different nose cone for the hurricane? Looking at photos on the net from then and now, usually only 1 in 5-8 have the spitfire nose cone.

[Blackdog_kt]

This has been discussed a few updates back and some people came up with reliable references describing the situation. It turned out that it's accurate as hurricanes had 2-3 different spinner arrangements, sometimes depending on the type of propeller used.

If i remember correctly, IL-2 models one kind of spinner while the screenshots we've seen of SoW tend to model the other one.
Bottom line is that both arrangements are accurate, plus the missing spinner design could perhaps be added at a later date in a patch.

If we wanted to get really pedantic about it i'm sure someone could come up with reliable data from the 40s, giving us the statistics about what percentage of Hurricanes used each spinner type so that the sim could model them in such a fashion. For example when the player's squadron spawns upon mission start, we could have 60% of the Hurricanes sporting one type of spinner and the other 40% having the other one.

To be honest, i think it's a modest detailing issue and since the type of spinner modelled in SoW was in fact used at the time and is not wrong historically speaking, i tend to consider the addition of the second spinner type a cosmetic detail that can be added at a later date.

Mind you i'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I'm just trying to say that while your observation is correct, it's not exclusive as the type of spinner we've seen in SoW screenshots was in fact also used during the battle of Britain. Just trying to be careful with my wording here, as i'm just back home from a night out with friends and my system is "fueled" by a few vodkas and various other beverages. I hope this helps, cheers :grin:

[Spudkopf]

Here's are some images that show evidence of rivits and their high-lighting and shaddowing effects on the forward cowling of JU-E.

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/4/2/0/1026024.jpg

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/1/0/4/0747401.jpg

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/4/9/3/0816394.jpg

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/1/0/4/0747401.jpg

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/4/0/0/0935004.jpg

However there appears to be no such evidence of these effects on the rear cowling.

Of note is that this example of the Huricane is an ex Soviet aircraft, so could it be possible that this is a feature of Soviet Hurricanes?

[Friendly_flyer]

Here's a Hurri showing the rivet lines bout on the forward and aft engine housing plates. Contrary to the other pictures posted, this one is still in it's wartime paint:

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/puolustusjaturvallisuus2005/static_images/22.jpg

[Friendly_flyer]

This has been discussed a few updates back and some people came up with reliable references describing the situation. It turned out that it's accurate as hurricanes had 2-3 different spinner arrangements, sometimes depending on the type of propeller used.

If i remember correctly, IL-2 models one kind of spinner while the screenshots we've seen of SoW tend to model the other one.

The Hurricane went through 4 types of spinners in it's career:

- A small, pointy spinner for the Watts 2-bladed non-variable propeller, pre-war and very early war only.

- A slightly larger, pointy spinner for the DeHaviland three-bladed propeller, early Mk.Is only. This is what we see in the IL2 version of the Mk.I.

- A blunt, somewhat oversized Rotol spinner really made for the Spitfire, but fitted to most medium- to late model Mk.Is. This is the type of spinner we see in Oleg's SoW screenshots.

- A semi-pointed long spinner for the Mk.II marks and later. This is well represented in IL2.

[WTE_Galway]

Those lines are almost certainly painted on as a skin texture rather than part of the 3D model.