Need a help: British awards in period of BoB.

[Oleg Maddox]

Need good images and precise system of awards

The Russian guy who is doing for us such thing is in development "trouble" due to bad research (he don't speak in English...)

If you can help - we would be very glad!
Let me know please here.

[PeterPanPan]

Hi Oleg

Presumably you mean honours such as the DFM (Distinguished Flying Medal), DFC (Distinguished Flying Cross) etc?

PPanPan

[KG26_Alpha]

http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/DefenceFor/Veterans/Medals/WorldWarIiMedalSummary.htm

http://www.bomber-command.info/medals.htm

http://www.worldmedals.co.uk/Rib/Britrib/britribb.htm

[Omphalos]

Oleg, have you tried wikipedia?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_awards_of_World_War_II#United_Kingdom

go down to the UK medals, they have them all. I can put a list together if you would like.

[Igo kyu]

Oleg, have you tried wikipedia?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_awards_of_World_War_II#United_Kingdom

go down to the UK medals, they have them all. I can put a list together if you would like.
No, they don't have all british awards, particularly the Order of the British Empire links to a page that says:

The Order includes five classes in civil and military divisions. In decreasing order of seniority, these are:

* Knight Grand Cross (GBE) or Dame Grand Cross (GBE)
* Knight Commander (KBE) or Dame Commander (DBE)
* Commander (CBE)
* Officer (OBE)
* Member (MBE)

Only the highest two ranks admit an individual into knighthood automatically, an honour allowing the recipient to use the title "Sir" (male) or "Dame" (female) before his or her first name (though one can be knighted separately from the Orders of Chivalry).

It may not even be all british medals, where are any naval medals?

They themseves say the list is incomplete.

[Omphalos]

Yes, they have most of the major medals though, and I would think that is where Oleg wants to start, not the obscure ones.

[PeterPanPan]

I have compiled a full list of RAF medals/awards as at 1940, with further information about eligibility and images of ribbons and medals. I have not included awards for civilians or for other branches of the armed services, nor awards that came into existence post 1940.

You can download my list from here (http://www.360vision.co.uk/uploads/il2/medals_adapted.doc).

It is correct to the best of my knowledge but if anyone knows more, please post any corrections here - thanks.

Hope this helps.

PPanPan

[ECV56_LeChuck]

I think that Oleg may need some BOOK information, I´m not saying that the web information is wrong, but.. you know, if you make a work you want the most precise information

[Igo kyu]

Yes, they have most of the major medals though, and I would think that is where Oleg wants to start, not the obscure ones.
Are we only talking about starting though? If it's a matter of setting up a variable or array to deal with all possible awards, then it's necessary to know how many there were, if there were 33 possible awards, a variable that only allows 32 just doesn't work.

There were also british service personal awarded eg French medals. British carrier operations means the fleet air arm, they'd get naval medals or nothing, no RAF medals for the fleet.

[Icewolf]

Hello Oleg
if you are looking for a book reference try the "Illustrated World War II Encylopedia"

H.S.Stuttman inc. Publishers printed 1966,1972,1978
a colaboration of writers
-lieutenant colonel Eddy Bauer
-Brigader Peter Young
-Brigadier General james L. collins
-Correlli Barnett
-Brain Innes

this is a collection of 24 books which I am lucky to have but I am sure some libraries can source this collection.
the book you would want in particular is # 21 starting at page 2885 'titled the medals'
from there you will find the entire collection "Illustrated" for all the major participants of WW2 and in color.
further on is a section that includes Insignia and markings of WW2 unfortunately many are in black and white.
Sadly unlike "Peterpanpan's" document there is no concise explanation of the medals or the Criteria for each award nor are there any ribbons shown.
A good online source even though it is based on world war one is http://www.theaerodrome.com/ the medals are there and a Criteria description for each one is given.
I can scan some pages of the encylopedia for you if that does not break any copyright laws.

[Icewolf]

here is a scan ,sorry ,best that I can do

[Tanimbar]

Oleg,

PPRUNE, Professional Pilots Rumour Network, is a UK forum and has a section called Aviation History and Nostalgia. It is frequented by very knowledgeable people with a keen interest in military aviation. There may be a difficulty concerning your commercial aims - the forum is wary of commerce - but I expect that a carefully worded request for information, that would ensure your accurate portrayal of medals, would receive a kindly response.

http://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia-86/

Good hunting, Tanimbar

[PeterPanPan]

Further to my earlier post, there is a very useful pdf file with pictures of all medals issued by the UK. Not all will be relevant, but this is an official MOD document which you can download here (http://www.360vision.co.uk/uploads/il2/Medals_Booklet.pdf).

I am also waiting on confirmation from the Joint Personnel Administration Centre at the MOD for the exact medal position in 1940 for RAF personnel.

PPanPan

[*Buzzsaw*]

Need good images and precise system of awards

The Russian guy who is doing for us such thing is in development "trouble" due to bad research (he don't speak in English...)

If you can help - we would be very glad!
Let me know please here.

Hello Oleg

You may remember me from our other discussions... ;o)

I am in India enjoying a vacation travelling on a motorcycle, but I cannot resist looking at the advancement of my favorite game.

Here is the answer to your question. It is simple, but also complicated.

The British Army, Navy and Airforce had a class system, that is, they differentiated between Officers and ordinary soldiers. This applied to the awarding of medals, except in the lowest case, "Mentioned in Despatches", and the highest case, the Victoria Cross.

The British did not like to give out many medals, they gave out less than other nations, and had less types.

Below are the ONLY awards for bravery. All other awards were for non combat service or ordinary service.

Here are the awards for those pilots who are of rank below Officer, ie. Sergeant or Flight Sergeant.

These awards are in order of importance, from lowest to highest.

Mentioned in Despatches: This is a low level award, when a pilot has done favourably, his success can be mentioned in the Official British Military Despatch for the day in the London Gazette newspaper. (which is written every day) The award is an Oak Leaf, and can be seen at this link where one is being sold on Ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200350019726

Wiki Page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mentioned_in_Despatches

Distinguished Flying Medal

This is the first real medal, only awarded to ordinary pilots. A pilot can be awarded many of these, if he gains a second award, the original medal has a 'Bar' added, which is a silver bar across the ribbon.

Wiki Page is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distinguished_Flying_Medal

Distinguished Conduct Medal

This is the second most important medal an ordinary pilot can win, showing extreme bravery, equivalent to an Officer winning a Distinguished Service Order. Again, there can be several of these medals awarded to the same person, again, if this happens, the original medal is shown with a 'Bar' for each additional award.

Wiki page is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distinguished_Conduct_Medal

And finally, there is the Victoria Cross, which can be awarded to either ordinary pilots, or Officers, the very highest award, normally only awarded for extreme personal bravery in the face of the highest challenge. There can also be more than one VC awarded, again, additional are shown by 'Bar', but this is EXTREMELY rare.

Wiki Page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Cross


Officer's medals

Mentioned in Despatchs (same as above)

Distinguished Flying Cross

This is the same importance as the Distinguished Flying Medal, except it is only given to Officers. A pilot could win a Distinguished Flying Medal when he was a Sergeant, then win a Distinguished Flying Cross when he became an Officer. Multiple awards are show with a "Bar".

Wiki Page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distinguished_Flying_Cross_%28UK%29


Distinguished Service Order

This is the second most important medal an Officer can be awarded, usually only awarded to Squadron Leader or higher rank. Additional awards are shown with a 'Bar'.

Wiki Page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distinguished_Service_Order

Victoria Cross

Same as for ordinary pilots, only awarded for extreme personal bravery, very rare.

Wiki page same as above.

>>>

There were also Campaign medals, awarded to pilots who just participated in fighting on a front.

For example a pilot fighting in the Battle of Britain, even if he had no success, would be awarded the 1939-1945 Star with Battle of Britain clasp:

Wiki Page here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1939-1945_Star


Hope this is useful information. :)

[jaqbovsky]

Hi!

It's my first post here and i must say: "You forgot Poland"! :-P

In BoB period many polish RAF sqadrons pilots and foregin pilots too, awarded from Polish Government in Exile (I mean Polish Commander-in-Chief gen. W. Sikorski).

I'm not history expert but I know few military awards that, i post here few wiki links... sorry bout' that...:rolleyes:

Polish Military Awards given in 1940r:

Nice page: http://home.golden.net/~medals/exile.html

Virtuti Militari Cross
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtuti_Militari
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c8/VirMilPoland.gif

Here is translate page(from polish) about this award in Polish Air Force during WW II:
http://translate.google.pl/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=pl&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http://www.polishairforce.pl/virtuti.html&sl=pl&tl=en
Cross have 5 classes and Star(in I class).
Dimensions:

I class = Grand Cross with Star (Wielki)– 62 x 62 mm; crown 30 x 36 mm,
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/78/Virtuti_Militari_Grand_Cross.jpg/250px-Virtuti_Militari_Grand_Cross.jpg
http://home.golden.net/~medals/0267.jpg
Star
http://home.golden.net/~medals/0269.jpg

II class - Commander's Cross (Komandorski) – 54 x 54 mm; crown 23 x 33 mm,
http://home.golden.net/~medals/00272a00.jpg
http://home.golden.net/~medals/00272r00.jpg

III class - Knight's Cross (Kawalerski) - 44 x 44 mm,
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/krzyz-virtuti-militari-3-klasy-krupski-i-matulewicz_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_3875

IV class - Golden Cross – 39 x 39 mm,
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1a/Golden_Cross_of_Virtuti_Militari_Order_from_1813.p ng/445px-Golden_Cross_of_Virtuti_Militari_Order_from_1813.p ng

V class - Silver Cross – 38 x 38 mm.
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/krzyz-virtuti-militari-francja-sygnowany_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_3803
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/krzyz-virtuti-militari-5-klasy-wtornik-okres-miedzywojenny_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_3802

I think in game would be only IV and V class... and maybe III... II and I class cross is very important award so i think there was imposslible to award normal pilot, not commander,

Cross of Valour
The medal was introduced at the height of the Polish-Soviet War.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_Valour_(Poland)
It is most 'common' military award in BoB period, similar to Silver Star, Croix de Guerre and Iron Cross.
In January 1940 the Polish Commander-in-Chief, Władysław Sikorski, issued an order reintroducing the Cross of Valour.
Important is the date 1920 at the bottom of cross.
Photos:
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/krzyz-walecznych-knedler-nienumerowany_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_2608
http://historia.wiszowaty.pl/wiszowaty_krzyz_walecznych.jpg
http://www.muzeum-ak.krakow.pl/odznaczenia/zdjecia2/0801311753walecznychn.jpg

Cross of Merit
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_Merit_(Poland)
It is civil medal but it was given to militarymen too. But When gov ordered Cross of Merit with Swords in 1942 it is back to civil nature :P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_Merit_with_Swords.

Wound Badge
Similar to Purple Heart Medal.
Injured 1 time
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/73/POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_3_gwiazdki_BAR.png/100px-POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_3_gwiazdki_BAR.png
Injured 2 times
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_2_gwiazdki_BAR.png/100px-POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_2_gwiazdki_BAR.png
Injured 3 times
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_1_gwiazdka_BAR.png/100px-POL_Odznaka_za_rany_i_kontuzje_1_gwiazdka_BAR.png

Medal za Ratowanie Ginących(rescue of "dying people")
Civil and military award for rescue of "dying people" (Ginących). For saveing polish peoples in Poland and in other countries.
Polish wiki source: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_za_Ratowanie_Gin%C4%85cych

Air Force Service Medal 1939-1945
After war award for a 6 months in front service and 12 months out of front.
http://www.ww2awards.com/award/168
Polish: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_Lotniczy

Order for a long duty:
Here is orginal order for infantrymen from 1938'
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/medal-x-lat-sluzby-1938-rok-kapitan_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_2556

Insignia Flying Personnel:
I think it's similar in 1940. But if someone hv better knowledge about that, i would agree with...
Translate from polish:
http://translate.google.pl/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=pl&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odznaki_Personelu_Lataj%25C4%2585cego_1919-1939&sl=pl&tl=en
Photos:
http://forum.valka.cz/attachments/6967/skalski8.jpg
http://www.numizmatyka.waw.pl/sklep/odznaka-pilota-obserwatora_odznaczenia-do-1939-roku_275

I think when in Battle of Britain Polish RAF 303sq was one of the best RAF squadron (if not the Best of all RAF squadrons in BoB period of course..) would be nice to see that kind of military awards. :grin:

Example:
Josef František was awarded:
czech War cross 1939
czech Medal for Bravery
czech War Medal "Za Zasługi" II class
pol Silver cross War Award Virtuti Militarii
pol Cross of Valour - 3 times
British Distinguished Flying Medal - 2 times (DFM with Bar) - as a first no british
British 1939-1945 Star with (klamrą?) "Battle of Britain"
Fr War Cross (Croix de Guerre)


Sorry for my very bad EN.:cool:

[deadmeat313]

The Victoria Cross should only VERY rarely be awarded. Actually, you'd be better off not including it as a possible award at all, than to have it awarded too easily.

I'd hate to finish a sortie, read the debrief and think "Oh, I've won a VC. That's nice." The vast majority of British servicemen and women would never see such an award, and to have one pop up mid-campaign would be incongruous to say the least.

I like the sound of "Mentioned in Despatches" though. That has a nice ring to it. :)

T

[Icewolf]

only one Victoria Cross was awarded during the Battle of Britain that involved 3,000 pilots
"Flight Lieutenant J.B. Nicolson of 249 Squadron"

[KG26_Alpha]

only one Victoria Cross was awarded during the Battle of Britain that involved 3,000 pilots
"Flight Lieutenant J.B. Nicolson of 249 Squadron"

I think he deserves a full write up :)

On August 16th 1940, 23-year-old Flight Lieutenant James Nicolson of No. 249 Squadron was scrambled from Boscombe Down, Wiltshire, flying Hurricane P3576 of Red Section with Squadron Leader Eric King and Pilot Officer Martyn King

The pilots were to intercept and attack BF110's approaching Southampton from Gosport where a large raid was building up. The invaders had been sighted and Red Section dived towards the BF110's when, suddenly, a Staffel of BF109's jumped them from above. All three Hurricanes were hit.

Squadron Leader King, the least badly damaged, broke off his attack and returned to Boscombe Down. Pilot Officer King abandoned his burning Hurricane and baled out.

Four cannon shells hit Flight Lieutenant Nicolson's aircraft. One destroyed the perspex hood subsequently damaging his left eye and temporarily blinding him with blood. The reserve petrol tank was also struck along with his left leg. The Hurricane was now ablaze with the instrument panel melting, his hands blistering from the heat and his trousers on fire
Whilst preparing to bale out, a BF110 appeared in front of him. He slid back into his burning cockpit and continued flying the Hurricane after the enemy. Closing in, Nicolson opened fire and although the BF110 took evasive action to avoid the bullets, it was sent crashing into the sea
Finally baling out of his stricken aircraft, Nicolson had sustained severe burns to his hands, parts of his face, his eyelid was torn and his foot badly wounded. His ordeal however, was not quite over.

While descending towards the ground some Local Defence Volunteers (LVD), under orders, opened fire with rifles at what they believed to be enemy parachutists. Pilot Officer King had his parachute badly damaged and plummeted to his death. Flight Lieutenant Nicolson, in great pain, landed alive with further wounds received from shotgun pellets
He was rushed to The Royal Southampton Hospital where he made a full recovery and returned to active duty during late 1941.

His bravery and disregard for his own life in defence of his country earned him the Victoria Cross, which was awarded on 15th November 1940.

Tragically, he went missing while flying as a passenger in Liberator over the Bay of Bengal on 2nd May 1945.

------------------------------

[Icewolf]

Hello
Oleg

here is the WEB SITE where you can find all the information that you need.
it has all of the awards and the critera needed ( incomplete)

in some case of course like the George Cross/medal which you would not use because it was instituted June 24th, 1941.
there is no reason why you couldn't use the Military Cross normally given for ground action but there are pilots who were awared this honor


http://www.ww2awards.com/ EDIT : after further research there are some errors on this web site

I have done a lot more research and have found a very credible web source,I am in the process of gathering this information and will post shortly

BUZZSAW is only partially correct in his post but he got me started in doing a much more through research

[Icewolf]

www.wauchope.ca/~flanders/British awards up to and including.doc

I believe this document is accurate up to OCTOBER 1940.... if anyone finds errors ...please post corrections for Oleg
I left Buzzsaws description of dispatches out of this DOC file ,he describes it much better than I

as you look through this document you will see, as Buzzsaw described, that rank played an important part in what awards a person recieved

[brando]

Please note that no-one would be awarded the 1939-45 medal or star until AFTER the war! In fact it's worth noting that many of the medals listed were not presented until after hostilities had ceased. Medals for acts of gallantry are the exception here - being awarded while the war was ongoing - but there was usually a gap of months between the act and the investiture.

[*Buzzsaw*]

in some case of course like the George Cross/medal which you would not use because it was instituted June 24th, 1941.
there is no reason why you couldn't use the Military Cross normally given for ground action but there are pilots who were awared this honor


The George Cross is only awarded to civilians, not to Military Pilots. It is the equivalent of the VC for a civilian.

The Military Cross was not awarded to any RAF pilots in WWII. It was a British Army award, and was only awarded to Royal Flying Corps pilots in WWI, during the period when the RFC was still part of the British Army. When the Royal Airforce was created in 1918, a new set of Airforce awards were created. The Military Cross was replaced with the Distinguished Flying Cross and the Miltary Medal for noncoms was replaced with the Distinguished Flying Medal.

[Icewolf]

the George Cross and Military cross could be awarded to military personnel.
Pilots from both Canada and New Zealand recieved these awards but again there are circumstances different from the other awards than action in the sky

[Oleg Maddox]

Hi,

I read all posts, be sure. Simply had not time to replay fro each post.

Help is very good. Sure.

I simply personally know if not all then most of German awards...
Nothing yet about Italian and just partially about British.

And we will have different to Il-2 system of awards.... it was easy to make for German strong system.....

[csThor]

Oleg pls check work email. Thx.

[Friendly_flyer]

Medals for acts of gallantry are the exception here - being awarded while the war was ongoing - but there was usually a gap of months between the act and the investiture.

Actually, it would be nice to have a system where you were awarded medals for flying you did several missions previously. It would really add to the feeling!

[Acid]

Oleg besides the awards, will the game keep track of all the types of Aircraft you've shot down? .

[NikToo]

Don't know what all the confusion is about over this. The British medal system is quite clear. For the Royal Air Force in 1940 the awards would simply have been:

VC: Officers and ORs. Obviously very rare.
DSO: Officers, for "distinguished service".
DFC: Officers and WOs, for "valor in [...] active operations.
DFM: NCOs and ORs for "active operations".
MID: Mention in Dispatches, which wouldn't lead to an award per se until the end of the war.

Quotes are from the Medal Yearbook, 2007 edition.

Bars would be added for additional awards. Note that DSOs, DFCs, and DFMs could also be given out at the end of operational tours, noting basically the bravery it took to do a large number of missions rather than just a single act.

No Campaign Stars were awarded until after the war. However, it was possible to wear the ribbon for the 1939-43 Star along with the Africa Star ribbon after 1943. Only the ribbon was awarded, not the Stars. Of course, this was later amended to the 1939-45 Star.

So in the terms of a game do really well in a mission on an easy setting and you get the DFM, finish a campaign and get a bar. On a difficult setting the DFC for a mission and the DSO for a campaign or a bar. One thing to remember is that you can't exactly mimic life here. After all, it only takes about five kills to become an "ace", but it would be a pretty boring game if you really had to struggle to just shoot down five aircraft. Most people probably approach Marseille-like numbers quite easily.

[Avimimus]

If I recall correctly there were often considerable delays between the decision to give the award and actually receiving it.

I remember one case where the commanding officer and some other staff were killed in a plane wreck shortly before this was to take place. A number of aircrew had been told that they were being recommended for awards but the entire squadron lost its chance to get the recognition when this tragic crash occurred.

[HB252]

Hi!!

There is a book that name is:

British Army Collar Badges 1881 to the Present - An Illustrated Reference Guide for Collectors

I got it in pdf, if you like send you, say me your e-mail.

Thx

[WTE_Galway]

Australian medal info:

From here:

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-medals/00-medals-cat-index.htm

BARS and CLASPS

* There is a difference between "bars" and "clasps" although sometimes the two get mixed up. Supporting "bars" are another thing altogether.

* A bar represents the award of another medal of the same type. As wearing 2 or more identical medals would look silly a bar is worn on the riband of the medal to indicate the second award.

* Bars are appropriate only on gallantry or distinguished service medals.

* A clasp is a metal bar across the riband that carries a date or campaign or battle name. It was in the past common to issue only 1 medal for a war but to issue clasps for each significant action.

* Clasps are appropriate on campaign medals.

* Clasps are sometimes used on long service medals to indicate a further period of service, after the original qualifying period.

* None of the above refers to the supporting "bar" that is used to hang the medal and that sometimes carries a date, campaign or battle name.

Campaign medals - note Battle of Britain - these were issued AFTER the war so basically in a game issued at the end of a career.

http://www.diggerhistory.info/images/medals-post-1930/docs-ww2.jpg


The following link is gallantry medals which in general are identical to the British ones .. Victoria Cross, George Cross down to the medal for mention in Dispatches:

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-medals/gallantry.htm



If I understand correctly it was considered inappropriate to award bars to a Victoria Cross.

This is an amazing Victoria Cross reference website:

http://www.victoriacross.org.uk/vcross.htm



It tracks every Victoria Cross ever awarded.

[bolox]

Australian medal info:



If I understand correctly it was considered inappropriate to award bars to a Victoria Cross.

.

not inappropriate- just very unusual

"There is provision made in the event that a holder of the Victoria Cross is awarded a Bar to his medal. In the same manner as other awards it is possible to be awarded a Victoria Cross more than once, but this has happened 3 times only. Such awards have an "abbreviated" version of the suspender bar attached to the ribbon above the original and the details of the "new" award are engraved on the reverse of this Bar."

from the makers website
http://www.hancocks-london.com/vc_medal.htm

WWII VC and bar
http://www.nzedge.com/heroes/upham.html

[Icewolf]

http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/remembers/sub.cfm?source=collections/cmdp/mainmenu/group01

a good source for those interested

[Pursuivant]

If you want realism, remember that British decorations weren't just given for X number of aerial victories or bombing sorties and that you could get a lesser medal after receiving a more prestigious one. So the medals shouldn't just progress from "mention in despatches" > DFC > DSO/M > VC as you score points.

Instead, consider a career track more like Wing Commander Douglas Bader's - DSO & Bar, DFC & Bar, plus numerous mentions in despatches. Meaning two decorations for extreme heroism given on two different occasions, and two awards for heroism given on different occasions.

The game should track your overall performance in the campaign and your "single mission" performance when deciding which decoration to give you, as well as the difficulty, damage and injury you suffered while achieving your goal. Also, as with any decoration, your chance of being decorated depends on whether anyone else saw you performing the deed.

For example, shooting down a single Bf-110 might merit a mention in despatches if it was an ordinary kill on a fighter sweep over enemy territory. On the other hand, if you attack a superior formation on your own, just as it is attacking a target over your home territory, then refuse to bail out of your burning aircraft, suffering severe wounds in the process, in order to shoot down a single Bf-110 you might perhaps get the Victoria Cross.

If you must use a simple linear, point-based score system to assign awards, at least use the language "you have been RECOMMENDED for"; [Decoration] for every decoration other than mention in despatches.

[Xilon_x]

DEAR 1C this is the Britisch Military MEDALS:

http://www.controltowers.co.uk/Books/British_Military_Medals,_Pen_&_Sword_books.htm

[Fltlt_HardBall]

There's one other award that hasn't been mentioned, although it was unofficial.

RAF pilots who successfully baled out of an aircraft would become members of the "Caterpillar Club". A pin was awarded to the pilots by The Irvin Air Chute company- a gold caterpillar with ruby eyes. (This is because the parachutes were made from silk produced by silk worms - i.e. caterpillars). Later in the war, after much protest from the many pilots who received such pins, the RAF reluctantly agreed that pilots would be able to wear these pins on their uniform - under their jacket lapels!

This might be a fun unofficial award to include in a campaign. What do you think?

Here's a link: http://www.caterpillarclub.org/irvin/irvin.htm

[battleofbritaintv]

Follow in post-real time the true life exploits of a Battle of Britain Spitfire pilot - His Logbook being published online week by week as the Battle progresses:


No medal photos here, just the real story of One of the Few:


http://www.battleofbritain.tv/Logbook.html

[Tbag]

Not for the BoB but probably for later: The Goldfish club badge:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldfish_Club
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.303rdbg.com/goldfish.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.303rdbg.com/goldfish.html&usg=___VFNbVoOMBE398NrFWTs6oRpysw=&h=194&w=130&sz=9&hl=en&start=4&sig2=E-rx2mo3yEIbLCuSb0QhgQ&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=Mp47mTdpBto5tM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=69&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dgoldfish%2Bclub%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26 client%3Dfirefox-a%26sa%3DN%26rlz%3D1R1GGGL_en-GB___GB356%26tbs%3Disch:1&ei=LHoXTL72MtvAsgbeqZTGCQ

[PeterPanPan]

There's one other award that hasn't been mentioned, although it was unofficial.

RAF pilots who successfully baled out of an aircraft would become members of the "Caterpillar Club"...

Love this! How very correct this was awarded. Would be great if this could be included. Thanks for the post Fltlt_HardBall - really interesting.

PPanPan

[peterwoods@supanet.com]

One other award I've not seen so far mentioned in this thread is the Air Force Cross and the Air Force Medal.

http://i646.photobucket.com/albums/uu181/2_Puff_Pete/Miscellaneous/AFCAF.jpg

The Air Force Cross is a military decoration awarded to personnel of the United Kingdom Armed Forces, and formerly also to officers of the other Commonwealth countries, for "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy". A bar is added to the ribbon for holders who are awarded a second AFC.

History
The award was established on 3 June 1918. It was originally awarded to Air Force commissioned officers and Warrant Officers, but this was expanded after World War II to include Army and Navy aviation officers, and again in 1993 to enlisted personnel after the discontinuation of the Air Force Medal. [2]

During World War II, 2,001 medals were awarded, with 26 bars awarded. One unique second bar was awarded to Wing Commander H J Wilson in 1944.

58 honorary awards were made to aircrew from other non-Commonwealth countries.

Post-nominal letters
Recipients of the Air Force Cross are entitled to use the post-nominal letters "AFC". A bar is added to the ribbon for holders of the AFC who received a second award.

Description
The medal is a silver cross 60 mm high and 54 mm wide, representing aircraft propeller blades, with wings between the arms. The obverse depicts Hermes riding on the wings of a hawk holding a laurel wreath. At the top of the upper arm is the royal crown while the other three arms bear the Royal Cypher of the reigning monarch at the time of issue. [2]
The suspender is straight and decorated with laurel wreaths. [2]
The ribbon was originally white with red broad horizontal stripes, but changed in 1919 to the current white with red broad diagonal stripes at a 45-degree angle.

The Air Force Medal was (until 1993) a military decoration awarded to personnel of the Royal Air Force (United Kingdom) and other services, and formerly also to personnel of other Commonwealth countries, below commissioned rank, for "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy".

The medal was established on 3 June 1918. It was the other ranks' equivalent to the Air Force Cross, which was awarded to commissioned officers and Warrant Officers (although WOs could also be awarded the AFM), but ranked below it in order of precedence, between the Distinguished Flying Medal and the Queen's Gallantry Medal.

The AFM was awarded 259 times during WW2.

Recipients of the Air Force Medal are entitled to use the post-nominal letters "AFM". In 1993, the AFM was discontinued, and since then the Air Force Cross has been awarded to personnel of all ranks.
Herewith some details:

he Air Force Cross is a military decoration awarded to personnel of the United Kingdom Armed Forces, and formerly also to officers of the other Commonwealth countries, for "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy". A bar is added to the ribbon for holders who are awarded a second AFC.

History
The award was established on 3 June 1918. It was originally awarded to Air Force commissioned officers and Warrant Officers, but this was expanded after World War II to include Army and Navy aviation officers, and again in 1993 to enlisted personnel after the discontinuation of the Air Force Medal. [2]

During World War II, 2,001 medals were awarded, with 26 bars awarded. One unique second bar was awarded to Wing Commander H J Wilson in 1944.

58 honorary awards were made to aircrew from other non-Commonwealth countries.

Post-nominal letters
Recipients of the Air Force Cross are entitled to use the post-nominal letters "AFC". A bar is added to the ribbon for holders of the AFC who received a second award.

Description
The medal is a silver cross 60 mm high and 54 mm wide, representing aircraft propeller blades, with wings between the arms. The obverse depicts Hermes riding on the wings of a hawk holding a laurel wreath. At the top of the upper arm is the royal crown while the other three arms bear the Royal Cypher of the reigning monarch at the time of issue. [2]
The suspender is straight and decorated with laurel wreaths. [2]
The ribbon was originally white with red broad horizontal stripes, but changed in 1919 to the current white with red broad diagonal stripes at a 45-degree angle.

The Air Force Medal was (until 1993) a military decoration awarded to personnel of the Royal Air Force (United Kingdom) and other services, and formerly also to personnel of other Commonwealth countries, below commissioned rank, for "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy".

The medal was established on 3 June 1918. It was the other ranks' equivalent to the Air Force Cross, which was awarded to commissioned officers and Warrant Officers (although WOs could also be awarded the AFM), but ranked below it in order of precedence, between the Distinguished Flying Medal and the Queen's Gallantry Medal.

The AFM was awarded 259 times during WW2.

Recipients of the Air Force Medal are entitled to use the post-nominal letters "AFM". In 1993, the AFM was discontinued, and since then the Air Force Cross has been awarded to personnel of all ranks.

Also worthy of explanation, and applicable to all British medals, when ribbons only worn, ie everyday working dress, the award of a bar, eg AFC and bar, was signified by a silver rosette sewn to the ribbon. See picture above for example.

Pete

Edit: Apologies to PeterPanPan. AFC included in your post of 03/03/10. But AFM for other ranks also valid so not all in vain.
Pete

[PeterPanPan]

Edit: Apologies to PeterPanPan. AFC included in your post of 03/03/10. But AFM for other ranks also valid so not all in vain.
Pete

No problem Pete - nice post ... would have replied sooner but I was otherwise engaged in the cooler!
PPanPan

[LukeFF]

The Air Force Medal was (until 1993) a military decoration awarded to personnel of the Royal Air Force (United Kingdom) and other services, and formerly also to personnel of other Commonwealth countries, below commissioned rank, for "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy".

That would make it irrelevant to SoW.

[LukeFF]

If I was in charge of the British award system, it would look something like this:

-Mentioned in Despatches
-Distinguished Flying Medal
-Conspicuous Gallantry Medal (though, it apparently didn't become an RAF award until 1943)
-Air Force Cross
-Distinguished Flying Cross
-Distinguished Service Cross
-Victoria Cross

[PeterPanPan]

That would make it irrelevant to SoW.

Hopefully you are wrong. Hopefully SOW will allow other types of missions e.g. providing air cover for downed pilots, recon flights etc. that could require great skill and courage but are not directly in the face of the enemy.

PPanPan

[*Buzzsaw*]

Salute

The Airforce Cross and Airforce Medal were non-combat awards.

They were awarded for administrative performance, for creation of aids to flight, as for example Miss Shillings Orifice.

They were never given for combat performance.

[PeterPanPan]

S!

Not quite right Buzzsaw. The AFC/AFM were "issued for acts of gallantry while flying on non-active operations" [1]. This could mean a wide variety of things so long as gallantry was involved but not in the face of the enemy.

[1] http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/DefenceFor/Veterans/Medals/AirForceCross.htm

PPanPan

[Icewolf]

I provided this link in a previous post

http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/remembers/sub.cfm?source=collections/cmdp/mainmenu/group01

even though it is a canadian link the awards are all shown and is factually correct with photos

[PeterPanPan]

Nice link icewolf, but this shows many awards not relevant for SoW. For example, some are for Military Nursing or Civilians and some are not for the RAF (unless for RAF personnel on the ground/sea - again not relevant here.)

I compiled what I think is a complete and relevant list as at 1940 in an earlier post ... see, http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showpost.php?p=147541&postcount=7

Cheers

PPanPan

[Icewolf]

of course not all medals shown are valid for sow but the link is important in that they will be factually correct in picture as well as description.I am not a fan of Wikipedia or some other web sites that may lay claim to the truth.
I had made a doc file that shows the valid ones which is available for download a few pages back

[LukeFF]

Need good images and precise system of awards

The Russian guy who is doing for us such thing is in development "trouble" due to bad research (he don't speak in English...)

If you can help - we would be very glad!
Let me know please here.

Pierre Clostermann gives some good information about the British award system in his autobiography:

A Distinguished Flying Cross was awarded after five kills in around one hundred missions. A Bar to the D.F.C. was given between the tenth and twentieth kill and finally, the Distinguished Service Order was given to Wing Commanders or Squadron Commanders after twenty kills or three hundred missions.

A footnote to the above notes the following about Clostermann:

The author received his first D.F.C. after 8 confirmed kills and almost 300 missions, his second D.F.C. after 370 missions and 20 kills and finally a D.S.O. after 420 missions, 33 kills and the successful command of a Squadron and a Wing.

[baronWastelan]

That would make it irrelevant to SoW.

Wrong again, but thanks for playing.

[LukeFF]

Wrong again, but thanks for playing.

Until Oleg states otherwise (that we can be awarded medals for non-combat actions), I stand by my statement.

Care to tell me why I'm wrong, BTW? :rolleyes:

[LukeFF]

Moving right along...

It seems that something like this should be the criteria for RAF medals:

DFC: 5 kills
Bar to the DFC: ~15 kills
DSO: ~20 kills

Where would that leave other historically relevant medals?

[Balkenkruez JG27 Farber]

Interesting but irrelevant, the VC can not be taken away from its recipitant even if he is convicted of treason!

[bolox]

Interesting but irrelevant, the VC can not be taken away from its recipitant even if he is convicted of treason!


not strictly true- the power to forfeit the award is still extant, though since 1920 none have been;)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Cross#Forfeited_awards