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View Full Version : Not able to see planes in SIMULATION Mode...you also???


MrHemlocks
11-02-2009, 07:03 PM
I love to play sim mode but for one major thing....not able to see a darn enemy plane when looking down for it from above. All the planes blend into the scene making them too hard to find...if not impossible.

I have a HDTV (ABOUT 36") so I do not feel it on account of my video settings.

Is the set pstch addressing this...if the patch actually arrives?

XBOX360

Doktorwzzerd
11-02-2009, 07:46 PM
don't know about the patch but yeah its tough. Is it realistically tough? After all the planes of the era were painted camo on top for just that purpose.

LostInSpace
11-03-2009, 12:06 AM
Well I guess it would be somewhat acceptable if only the enemy planes were just as handicapped but I find that they have super-duper vision and can ID me long before they are even specks on my screen.

BTW, I just popped in my ol' IL-2 1946 on me PC and holy crap is that game still awesome. It's not as polished and pretty as BOP but man it's got this gritty reality to it that BOP doesn't come close to. I even loaded up a P-51D with 100% fuel and took on 2 HE-111's and wouldn't you know that the P-51 handled like a beaut. Nothing like the model in BOP.

DannyBooze
11-03-2009, 12:15 AM
i used the d pad on 360 shows external view

HauptmannMolders
11-03-2009, 03:02 AM
Yeah I'm just starting to work on Sim, I prefer Realistic but it seems to be the forgotten middle child and Arcade is retarded. I had some matches with Edal86 and trk29 last night and found that the only way to seem them was to hug the deck. They will be very easy to see even at a distance because against sky in stead of ground they appear and big grey blobs far bigger than they should be, I'm talking like 5-6km's away. So hug the ground and look up. Seems to work and I noticed a lot of other guys hanging out on the deck, probably for the same reason...

SgtPappy
11-03-2009, 03:35 AM
Honestly, it REALLY makes you wonder how those WWII pilots saw e/a and on top of that, were able to BnZ them from above!

They must've had eagle vision or something because, I have a lot of trouble in this game spotting anything in sim unless I'm lower than the enemy, which is actually where you didn't want to be in real life.

philabong2
11-03-2009, 07:46 AM
Honestly, it REALLY makes you wonder how those WWII pilots saw e/a and on top of that, were able to BnZ them from above!

They must've had eagle vision or something because, I have a lot of trouble in this game spotting anything in sim unless I'm lower than the enemy, which is actually where you didn't want to be in real life.

quoted for truth

irrelevant
11-03-2009, 05:11 PM
honestly, it seems a lot harder to spot the planes in the game than it would be in real life (not that i would know). admittedly, it has to be really difficult to emulate the visual capabilities of a human being in a video game.

i think the problem i have with sim mode is that it can so difficult to spot enemies from a relatively short distance, thus causing players to dogfight below 1,000 feet. i honestly don't know that i have engaged in a dogfight at, say, 5,000 feet or above in this game.

it would be great if players had the ability to cruise at an alititude of 10,000 feet and spot an enemy 5,000 feet below. that would truly enable some bnz tactics in sim mode.

sim mode is still the best option in this game.

kozzm0
11-04-2009, 10:20 AM
honestly, it seems a lot harder to spot the planes in the game than it would be in real life (not that i would know). admittedly, it has to be really difficult to emulate the visual capabilities of a human being in a video game.

That's the reason, exactly. In real life you aren't limited to a narrow 90 to 120 degree FOV that you have to point in different clumsy directions with a thumbstick. I still sometimes lose track of what direction I'm looking, and it's hard to hold the view steady so I can spot little details in the background.

Also real life is actually much better resolution than 1080p, and the game engine only renders the planes when they're within a certain distance.

I eagerly await the day when there are globe-shaped tv screens that you can sit inside of so you can just use your normal vision instead. Maybe 10-20 years though the flexible LCD screen has already been invented.

If they make control mapping, I'll map buttons to different views instead, cause at least it holds the view steady

flynlion
11-04-2009, 04:47 PM
In real life, other planes are most often spotted with peripheral vision. Pilots are trained to keep their eyes moving, especially when scanning for traffic at night. Other planes are usually spotted from the corner of the eye as opposed to when looking directly at them. This is, of coarse, very difficult with a video game.

They also have eagle eyes and cool sunglasses :cool:

InfiniteStates
11-05-2009, 10:54 AM
They also have eagle eyes and cool sunglasses :cool:

And infinite poly limits :)

SEE
11-07-2009, 01:09 PM
MrHemlocks you see me better than I can see you having killed me several times the other night! Good news is my kill rate is improving on SIM, bad news is - often they are my team mates! Looks like its a session in the hangar and work on my plane recognition skills. :(

phlux
11-07-2009, 02:12 PM
Yep, Hemlocks had no trouble seeing me in his I153 last night, he was on me like white on rice :)

ChankyChank
11-07-2009, 04:50 PM
It's defintely not as hard to spot real airplanes. I spend hours looking for little cessnas and pipers every day without any trouble, and their usually painted white. These fighter aircraft were BIG (at least compared to most general aviation aircraft today. I think it's just hard to translate human vision capabilities into a video game. You have no peripherals on the game and due to the fact that everything seems animated it's harder to sight moving objects. As far as gameplay I just stay low and try to spot people on the horizon. During dogfights look for fires on the ground, I've noticed that most air battles happen over the same area and there will be a lot of crashes directly below the fight :)

HauptmannMolders
11-07-2009, 05:07 PM
During dogfights look for fires on the ground, I've noticed that most air battles happen over the same area and there will be a lot of crashes directly below the fight :)

Very good point I've noticed this as well. Funny how that happens that we have these huge maps and yet a furbal basically happens over about 1 square kilometer.

Robotic Pope
11-07-2009, 05:51 PM
It's defintely not as hard to spot real airplanes. I spend hours looking for little cessnas and pipers every day without any trouble, and their usually painted white. These fighter aircraft were BIG (at least compared to most general aviation aircraft today. I think it's just hard to translate human vision capabilities into a video game. You have no peripherals on the game and due to the fact that everything seems animated it's harder to sight moving objects. As far as gameplay I just stay low and try to spot people on the horizon. During dogfights look for fires on the ground, I've noticed that most air battles happen over the same area and there will be a lot of crashes directly below the fight :)

Yes, It is so much easier in real life. Our eyes have evolved like many other animals eyes to be very good at spotting movement, so looking down from a plane at the ground which seems to pass by slowly at high altitude, it is quite easy to notice another plane moving against the background even if it is a tiny dot. Also with two eyes and full neck mobility you have the 3D of your vison which even at this long distance can really help. Oh and infinate screen resolution :)

Now with a simulation you are really looking at a smooth stationary screen so light and movement has to also be simulated along with the 3D to trick your brain into believing you are looking out of a planes window but even with the highest posible screen resolution its nowhere near as efective as real life. And then if you have a LCD screen you will have at least a small amount of movement blur to deal with.

When playing in sim I usually stay high at first and inspect the map to find the right direction of the targets, then I usually point the plane so Im looking out the side of the cockpit towards the target and hold the camera as still as I can to avoid screen movement bluring, then I consentrate and look for the slight movements of planes and zoom in on them if nesesary with the left trigger. Then i dive in.

philabong2
11-07-2009, 06:32 PM
Yes, It is so much easier in real life. Our eyes have evolved like many other animals eyes to be very good at spotting movement, so looking down from a plane at the ground which seems to pass by slowly at high altitude, it is quite easy to notice another plane moving against the background even if it is a tiny dot. Also with two eyes and full neck mobility you have the 3D of your vison which even at this long distance can really help. Oh and infinate screen resolution :)

Now with a simulation you are really looking at a smooth stationary screen so light and movement has to also be simulated along with the 3D to trick your brain into believing you are looking out of a planes window but even with the highest posible screen resolution its nowhere near as efective as real life. And then if you have a LCD screen you will have at least a small amount of movement blur to deal with.

When playing in sim I usually stay high at first and inspect the map to find the right direction of the targets, then I usually point the plane so Im looking out the side of the cockpit towards the target and hold the camera as still as I can to avoid screen movement bluring, then I consentrate and look for the slight movements of planes and zoom in on them if nesesary with the left trigger. Then i dive in.

im usin the aviator layout here, so no zoom in for me unfortunatly:(
Still having a hard time seeing outhere but i feel like i'm slowly getting a hang of it, kinda getting the feel on where to look (distance, angle and altitude) depending on where the red dots appear on the map and what plane (and pilot) im flying against.
even when the patch arrives and we'll b able to remap controls, i dont kno how exacly ill configure to fit in the zoom, trim, map and flaps on the control pad and on the stick too. Seems like i'll either be 1 button short or having to do the cross-hand over and under dance on the av8r-03 stick... does the thrustmaster have more buttons on it?

SEE
11-08-2009, 01:27 AM
Hoping things will improve when I swap over to the Xbox HD VGA cable and access my PC monitors full resolution. Supposed to be far better than using the component video lead, hope so anyway!

As for the AV8R stick, I don't thimk the word 'ergonomics' appeared in the design spec! Better than a game pad though!

kozzm0
11-08-2009, 10:59 AM
...During dogfights look for fires on the ground, I've noticed that most air battles happen over the same area and there will be a lot of crashes directly below the fight :)

That's cause the winner is the one with the most kills, not the least deaths. If there's 3 planes, 2 of them good dogfighters and 1 built for speed instead, the 3rd plane has to attack, extend to distance, climb, turn and attack again, which eats up valuable time while the two slower planes are racking up kills against each other right above the ground, and respawning in the same exact area.

I don't think it's much of a simulation when the i-153 is getting the most points. How many pilots were really so gung-ho about jumping into tight furballs with I-153's? All they had to do was take their time. Like in the 1st Stalingrad mission where you have I-16 and can't catch the 109's till they run to the edge of the map and turn around and climb to 3,000m