Watch out Oleg, you've got competition...

[TheGrunch]

I think it's the competition. (http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2885753/Coming_Soon.html) If it's as buggy as Rise of Flight, though...

[Tree_UK]

Jeez, that looks stunning, what the hell is it??

[|ZUTI|]

Birds of Prey for PC.

[TheGrunch]

Birds of Prey for PC.
Ahaaaa, I seeee...interesting. It's not exactly brimming with offline replay value, though. Can't see it succeeding too well on the PC compared to most other sims.

[David603]

Birds of Prey doesn't have cockpits for the Bf109 family yet, so this announcement could be the patch that is supposed to include the Bf109 and Fw190 cockpits. Not completely sure though, but it does look very much like Birds of Prey, especially the top picture which has a little inset of the outside of the cockpit, which is something Birds of Prey uses a lot.

I haven't heard about any PC release of Birds of Prey yet, but Anton Yudintsev was talking about his studio working on PC as well as console titles, so maybe this is it.

[Feuerfalke]

BoP for PC would be interesting, too.

Just like LockOn and DCS: One with rather easy FM, DM, but a couple of planes, the other a study-simulation concentrating on just one aircraft at a time.

Definitely could be the stepstone for some people coming from tactical shooters like ArmA2, OFP2 or BF who seek a bit more realism, but don't want to get to close to full real just now.

[Tree_UK]

You mean like a Warbirds or Air Attack but with better graphics. Yeah i could see that doing well.

[Feuerfalke]

Exactly - well, and a little less arcade I hope ;)

Love the soft selfshadowing in the cockpits - that will really add a lot to immersion.

[Feathered_IV]

Interesting, the devs stated when the title was announced that they had no intention of releasing a PC version. It will be good if they have changed their minds. It might introduce some more people to the FS fraternity.

I wouldn't want to play such an arcade title myself, but if it is moddable or possible to cross breed with the Il-2 series, I would certainly buy a copy.

[Avimimus]

I always suspected that part of the agreement for obtaining Il-2's code was that they wouldn't produce a PC derivative.

[ChrisDNT]

The snow landscape is amazingly good, beautiful sad grey light !

[nearmiss]

The cockpits are dark and mysterious like a pre-teen gamer will love.

All the dark shadows are too much

The rain on windshield is too much

I'd say it looks pretty good otherwise.

[fuzzychickens]

Clearly this is a continuation of assets from Birds of Prey - a port.

Given that, they have a long way to go. The console version has nowhere near the attention to detail as 1946, it's buggy, the flight models were somehow messed up on a quite a few planes (ta-152, fw190, p51, p47).

You can't change weapon convergence, fuel load, or weapon loadouts. In fact, some versions (K4) of the 109 forced you to fly with gun pods - no option to remove them.

They used one cockpit for every plane type and even subbed the p47 cockpit for the p51.

No selectable difficulty menu like 1946 - just 3 set in stone settings.

The damage model (while looking graphically nice) was simplified, for instance if you tried to belly land - the game was programmed to just make you blow up if you don't land: 1. on a runway, 2. with gear down. Belly landings were impossible.

Online play even in sim did not require you to RTB and land to collect max points for kills. Also the multiplayer system did not have a dedicated server - you played a match with the people who joined intially, if they left, no one can join in middle of match to even teams - poorly done.

They have a LONG way to go to get this as fun as IL2 1946 is, even longer to get this where SOW will be.

[hiro]

If you look at the cockpits in the sim hq thread vs the SOW updated spitfire cockpit , there is no comparison.

http://files.games.1c.ru/il2pict/grab0100.jpg

And the BOB SOW update is stated to be a WIP . . . so its going to be better when SOW BOB comes out.



Now that others have said it is birds of prey, the graphics in SIM HQ do look console-ish. They look like IL-2 1946 modded graphics cockpits, nothing near the SOW spitfire

Nothing to worry about.

[jermin]

I am 99% sure that the 109 cockpit is dumped form IL2.

[zakkandrachoff]

and what about Jet Thunder??? is not a little competition? Harrier and Sea Harrier against Skyhawk and Mirage III/V/ Superetendars in dogfights whit crappy old missils and cannons?
look this graphics of thunderworks...
http://www.thunder-works.com/SUE_and_A-4QAboveClouds.jpg

http://www.thunder-works.com/render_HMSArdent.jpg

is not a bad job, at all

[flyingbullseye]

I'd love to see the requirements to run that with all the bells and whistles with playable frames with graphics like that. ;)

Flyingbullseye

[airmalik]

is not a bad job, at all

Hey Zakk, those overcast clouds look better than anything I've seen in a flight sim before. Where are these pics from? The ones I came up with by googling for Jet Thunder aren't nearly as nice.

[RomBinDaHouse]

...
is not a bad job, at all

i think it's fake screens, maybe offline renders by History Channel?
http://www.thunder-works.com/news.htm

[Romanator21]

is not a bad job, at all


This isn't even the game lol!

Try these instead. Still not bad, but not quite SoW. There isn't even self-shader:
http://www.thunder-works.com/media/losestados1.jpg
http://www.thunder-works.com/media/shoreline1.jpg
http://www.thunder-works.com/media/JET_THUNDER_DEMO2006-08-28%2008-36-37-85.jpg

Looks more like LOMAC. It's very interesting though, and thanks for pointing our attention to it.

[Lucas_From_Hell]

"Two short clips of the upcoming The History Channel's documentary about the Falklands air war which uses (under agreement) Jet Thunder models and textures, as well as in-game cockpit scenes."

Taken from Thunderworks website. So, these shots were probably taken from the documentary.

[zakkandrachoff]

the planes are not have YEThe bloor or the finally lights in the wings that have the bf110 of oleg, buth is in work progress. Will be similar to the other pic of A4 and superetendard. (in falklands is not so much planes on a raid. They gonna put more graphics details i thing)
http://www.thunder-works.com/media/super_etendard_highdetail.jpg
this is the ship in progress, not so bad and not different that other ship pic. nice,. buth i dont like the finally terraint of jet thunder. The Oleg maddox terrain is much better

http://www.thunder-works.com/media/type42destroyers.jpg

[Oleg Maddox]

I think it's the competition. (http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2885753/Coming_Soon.html)


I really don't think so. It is competition inside the Il-2 series only.
First of all - if it is just ported from X-Box, then it is arcade. Currently I personally don't know, because when we gave source code, allmost all models, etc - then other people are in contact with them. Not me. I'm busy with my own development that maybe in future also will be ported say on X-Box 1600 and PSP23 :).
Second, compare cockpit i posted.. then imagine all things that we will have in final.
They are comparable only in the ground surface (earth, not the water, etc), but they haven't photorealistic colors (we haven't yet too, but we will have), clouds, modeling of airstreems near different surfaces and near/in/over/under clouds....

Probably I would be right, that target audience of BoP for PC would be other than SoW.
In short words BoP for PC is other niche, maybe more greater, but other.

In my opinion the relase of PC version Birds of Prey is good for my team at least with one thing: These who will play PC BoP then will be ready to move on SoW when its out. And I don't count Il-2 original series users who will play SoW 100%.

[philip.ed]

I really don't think so. It is competition inside the Il-2 series only.
First of all - if it is just ported from X-Box, then it is arcade. Currently I personally don't know, because when we gave source code, allmost all models, etc - then other people are in contact with them. Not me. I'm busy with my own development that maybe in future also will be ported say on X-Box 1600 and PSP23 :).
Second, compare cockpit i posted.. then imagine all things that we will have in final.
They are comparable only in the ground surface (earth, not the water, etc), but they haven't photorealistic colors (we haven't yet too, but we will have), clouds, modeling of airstreems near different surfaces and near/in/over/under clouds....

Probably I would be right, that target audience of BoP for PC would be other than SoW.
In short words BoP for PC is other niche, maybe more greater, but other.

In my opinion the relase of PC version Birds of Prey is good for my team at least with one thing: These who will play PC BoP then will be ready to move on SoW when its out. And I don't count Il-2 original series users who will play SoW 100%.

I love the way you are so brutally honest oleg ;) Does this mean now that from this time, up until release, we have more regular updates than before? Also; will we have the chance to BETA test? ;)

[TheGrunch]

I really don't think so. It is competition inside the Il-2 series only.
Oh no, I agree, I just didn't know what it was when I posted the shots, I haven't spent that much time looking at screenshots of BoP, so I didn't recognise it. I'm quite surprised that 777 Studios are publishing BoP, actually, I thought it might be something to do with neoqb at first.
BoP is toylike in comparison to IL-2 1946, never mind SoW. :)

[fuzzychickens]

Well, if the publisher does a "dump and run" like the BOP publisher is currently doing right now, I don't see how the PC version could ever compete with SOW.

BOP had a nice start with decent amounts of players online at first, but now that it seems the publisher is sitting on the patch to fix some major issues that kill the gameplay, the online numbers are next to nothing now. The game is dying. The publisher doesn't respond to emails either.

This is typical of console games in general. It's the business model, they get your money upfront and support beyond that is a matter of luck. So I guess it may be possible that the PC game is supported better, but I sure as hell won't buy it until the publisher of BOP or the developer finds a way to own up and fix the console version - even if the publishers are different.

[hiro]

Its going to be interesting . . .

PC will have IL-2 1946 and Birds of Prey . . .


IL-2 1946 is very much supported . . . If BOP came out on PC, and has alot of support it couldn't compete with IL-2 unless it has the sim style elements.
And BOP probably won't have the support IL-2 1946 currently enjoys . . .

Arcade-y type WW 2 sims like blazing angels / crimson skies are cool yet they don't hold interests like IL-2 does.

If its just a console ported out to PC, how it competes with IL-2 will be dependent on what features it includes. TO make it on the PC, they'll have to make it like Il-2 1946.

Many PC players will be expecting something along the lines of IL-2 and if its not delivered . . . will stick with IL-2. Even if BOP has improved graphics and more IL-2 players can turn to mods for graphics.

Alot of the console players are gamers so they think BOP is hardcore (on full settings) but 1946 fans will shrug BOP's full settings as IL-2's arcade settings.


I think BOP for PC will be a tough sell, because IL-2 1946 is the standard for the PC. BOP is trying to break in a market well entrenched. If BOP broke in with features that are compatible with, but aren't in IL-2 (essentally a game where modders can take whats in BOP and put in 1946) they might have something.

Or features / capabilities that IL-2 1946 doesn't have, maybe a special campaign, rpg pilot / RTS style squadron management, vastly improved AI (compared to 1946), or more than a 100 planes in a map . . .

Maybe even a FPS approach with different online gameplay modes like two sides have a AI army marches across and how many objectives the pilots can pull off (like denying movement by bombing bridges, or disrupting supplies) depends on how much territory the army conquers and % of territory decides who is the winner. Or protect a moving VIP type target, the other side is supposed to destroy it etc . . . Il-2 does this with coops, but stock gameplay modes would make it easier to enforce / set up servers . . .



But as for direct competition, BOP will have to have major changes made . . .


What's interesting is that most Il-2 fans would probably buy it and check it out. And then there will be mods out that take the best of both games and meld into a IL-2 1946 mod . . .


Yes, if BOB SOW is what I think it is, Oleg is right, BOP won't be competing in that braket, BOP and IL-2 are amateur ranks, and BOB SOW is the pros.

And once BOB SOW is out and people see how it eclipses IL-2 1946 AND BOP, they'll jump on board the SOW wagon.

[Oleg Maddox]

Its going to be interesting . . .

PC will have IL-2 1946 and Birds of Prey . . .


IL-2 1946 is very much supported . . . If BOP came out on PC, and has alot of support it couldn't compete with IL-2 unless it has the sim style elements.
And BOP probably won't have the support IL-2 1946 currently enjoys . . .

Arcade-y type WW 2 sims like blazing angels / crimson skies are cool yet they don't hold interests like IL-2 does.

If its just a console ported out to PC, how it competes with IL-2 will be dependent on what features it includes. TO make it on the PC, they'll have to make it like Il-2 1946.

Many PC players will be expecting something along the lines of IL-2 and if its not delivered . . . will stick with IL-2. Even if BOP has improved graphics and more IL-2 players can turn to mods for graphics.

Alot of the console players are gamers so they think BOP is hardcore (on full settings) but 1946 fans will shrug BOP's full settings as IL-2's arcade settings.


I think BOP for PC will be a tough sell, because IL-2 1946 is the standard for the PC. BOP is trying to break in a market well entrenched. If BOP broke in with features that are compatible with, but aren't in IL-2 (essentally a game where modders can take whats in BOP and put in 1946) they might have something.

Or features / capabilities that IL-2 1946 doesn't have, maybe a special campaign, rpg pilot / RTS style squadron management, vastly improved AI (compared to 1946), or more than a 100 planes in a map . . .

Maybe even a FPS approach with different online gameplay modes like two sides have a AI army marches across and how many objectives the pilots can pull off (like denying movement by bombing bridges, or disrupting supplies) depends on how much territory the army conquers and % of territory decides who is the winner. Or protect a moving VIP type target, the other side is supposed to destroy it etc . . . Il-2 does this with coops, but stock gameplay modes would make it easier to enforce / set up servers . . .



But as for direct competition, BOP will have to have major changes made . . .


What's interesting is that most Il-2 fans would probably buy it and check it out. And then there will be mods out that take the best of both games and meld into a IL-2 1946 mod . . .


Yes, if BOB SOW is what I think it is, Oleg is right, BOP won't be competing in that braket, BOP and IL-2 are amateur ranks, and BOB SOW is the pros.

And once BOB SOW is out and people see how it eclipses IL-2 1946 AND BOP, they'll jump on board the SOW wagon.

Probably I'm agree to all your thoughs.

[dazz1971]

well if bop for pc is anything like the xbox360 version then it will have broken plane flight models etc

sorry to say oleg but the ppl you gave the source code too butchered it mate if anything the ppl that buy will prolly play it then decide to go back to 1946 as its much better :grin:

i and a few other 360 users are doing just this now !!

i brought bop thinking it would be like the il2 i brought years ago for my old pc i thought great a proper flight sim for the consoles at last also it had the IL2 name the minute i saw it on the shelf i picked it up but the flight models are all messed up and it has many many bugs mainly multiplayer that might not even get patched there is a massive uproar on the bop forum about it

hopfully all the ppl leaving bop will do like i did and buy a copy of 1946 and turn to playing that instead :grin:

the only good thing for me in buying bop was i met a lot of good guys that play with sportmanship and honour and it reignited my love of ww2 flight sims

im looking forward to playing 1946 online and trying out some sabers too :grin::grin:

[TheGrunch]

Alot of the console players are gamers so they think BOP is hardcore (on full settings) but 1946 fans will shrug BOP's full settings as IL-2's arcade settings.
Too true. (http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/dor/objects/14258704/il-2-sturmovik-birds-of-prey/videos/IL2Sturmovik_gmp_pilotseat_072009.html) :grin:

[fuzzychickens]

Its going to be interesting . . .

PC will have IL-2 1946 and Birds of Prey . . .


IL-2 1946 is very much supported . . . If BOP came out on PC, and has alot of support it couldn't compete with IL-2 unless it has the sim style elements.
And BOP probably won't have the support IL-2 1946 currently enjoys . . .

Arcade-y type WW 2 sims like blazing angels / crimson skies are cool yet they don't hold interests like IL-2 does.

If its just a console ported out to PC, how it competes with IL-2 will be dependent on what features it includes. TO make it on the PC, they'll have to make it like Il-2 1946.

Many PC players will be expecting something along the lines of IL-2 and if its not delivered . . . will stick with IL-2. Even if BOP has improved graphics and more IL-2 players can turn to mods for graphics.

Alot of the console players are gamers so they think BOP is hardcore (on full settings) but 1946 fans will shrug BOP's full settings as IL-2's arcade settings.


I think BOP for PC will be a tough sell, because IL-2 1946 is the standard for the PC. BOP is trying to break in a market well entrenched. If BOP broke in with features that are compatible with, but aren't in IL-2 (essentally a game where modders can take whats in BOP and put in 1946) they might have something.

Or features / capabilities that IL-2 1946 doesn't have, maybe a special campaign, rpg pilot / RTS style squadron management, vastly improved AI (compared to 1946), or more than a 100 planes in a map . . .

Maybe even a FPS approach with different online gameplay modes like two sides have a AI army marches across and how many objectives the pilots can pull off (like denying movement by bombing bridges, or disrupting supplies) depends on how much territory the army conquers and % of territory decides who is the winner. Or protect a moving VIP type target, the other side is supposed to destroy it etc . . . Il-2 does this with coops, but stock gameplay modes would make it easier to enforce / set up servers . . .



But as for direct competition, BOP will have to have major changes made . . .


What's interesting is that most Il-2 fans would probably buy it and check it out. And then there will be mods out that take the best of both games and meld into a IL-2 1946 mod . . .


Yes, if BOB SOW is what I think it is, Oleg is right, BOP won't be competing in that braket, BOP and IL-2 are amateur ranks, and BOB SOW is the pros.

And once BOB SOW is out and people see how it eclipses IL-2 1946 AND BOP, they'll jump on board the SOW wagon.

So far they have made one good change it appears. Using a different publisher. So hopefully this publisher won't CRIPPLE the game like 505 did to BOP.

I'm sorry, but not having assignable buttons so we could use some of the cheaper PC flight sticks (for example my TM16000 registers all buttons/axis on BOP, just not where they need to be assigned) with BOP is a clear indication the publishers were probably pushing for gamepad only support (clearly showing that in some cases publishers are MORONS and need to let the developer decide some things).

The whole BOP mess is about as dumb as letting Gran Turismo 5 ship with only gamepad support (no wheels). Seriously - GT5 NEEDS wheel support and ANY game with the IL2 NAME on it NEEDS decent flight stick support.

After purchasing BOP for 50 bucks and quickly realizing the control interface SUCKED, I went back to my 10 dollar 1946. I won't be picking up the PC version of BOP until I know full well what the control options are.

[fuzzychickens]

Latest for the "former" publisher of this game.

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2891061/Re_Coming_Soon_Sweet.html#Post2891061

Seems the deal fell through for whatever reason.

If for some reason the original publisher is doing it now - forget it. I would encourage everyone to not buy this game if the original publisher does this also.

Their track record is poor with BOP.